Hot News...............
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Hot News...............
So it's true!................, or so I'm told by an unnamed source.
ATC at Norwich is being contracted out and various suppliers of said atco's are making presentations to airport management to sell their pitch.
NATS have already made their presentation, SERCO and VT Aerospace soon.
Alledgedly, NATS are the MD's preffered bidder, but all interested parties must be allowed to give their presentations,
Whoever wins the contract will be in place by April 01 2002.
The staff await the outcome with baited breath.......
Oh yes - nearly forgot to mention it, Safeskys are also bidding,
ATC at Norwich is being contracted out and various suppliers of said atco's are making presentations to airport management to sell their pitch.
NATS have already made their presentation, SERCO and VT Aerospace soon.
Alledgedly, NATS are the MD's preffered bidder, but all interested parties must be allowed to give their presentations,
Whoever wins the contract will be in place by April 01 2002.
The staff await the outcome with baited breath.......
Oh yes - nearly forgot to mention it, Safeskys are also bidding,
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Not exactly 'Hot' news, more on the simmering side really.
We (the mere workforce), accept that the NATS bid will almost be too expensive for the board, so it's almost certainly going to be SERCO, we think, possibly........maybe.
VT Aerospace are an unknown quantity to any of us, (anyone care to enlighten the great unwashed?).
I'm sure that SafeSky's presentation will be absolutely riveting, but that's on wash day
We (the mere workforce), accept that the NATS bid will almost be too expensive for the board, so it's almost certainly going to be SERCO, we think, possibly........maybe.
VT Aerospace are an unknown quantity to any of us, (anyone care to enlighten the great unwashed?).
I'm sure that SafeSky's presentation will be absolutely riveting, but that's on wash day
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SERCo was the first choice for Luton airport management. The troops there rebelled. Luton is now a NATS unit, radar went into TC in Feb this year.
Got a union at Norwich, then use them and stand up to the local decision makers. Cheap does not always mean safe?
Got a union at Norwich, then use them and stand up to the local decision makers. Cheap does not always mean safe?
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Here we go again, it's that old anti-serco chestnut.
Cheap does not always mean safe
Orson, unsafe does not always mean cheap!!
VT is a reworking of Airwork, after a number of buy-outs and renamings, they operate Woodvale and Wyton and are in the process of taking the ATC back inhouse at those airfields.
Spoonbill, I hope that helps a little.
You never know, we may get to meet up soon
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Spoonbill, further to my last post, this may be of some use to you... 
Farnborough debut for VT Aerospace
27 July 2000
The Farnborough Air Show is the official launch platform for a new name in the aerospace industry, and in particular military support services - VT Aerospace.
Although the name is new, the organisation has been providing support services for over seventy years, most recently as part of Bombardier Aerospace, from which it was acquired last month by leading tri-service support services company Vosper Thornycroft (VT).
VT is already a major player in training and support activities for the British Army and Royal Navy but the creation of a new Aerospace arm marks its full advance to tri-service status.
VT Aerospace's connections with the Services also extend to supporting adventurous endeavours, especially those that demand close teamwork. Typical of VT Aerospace's support is their sponsorship of the British Bobsleigh Association. Pictured left are two team members of the British Bobsleigh Squad with staff members of VT Aerospace.
VT's new division, which includes Bombardier's wholly owned subsidiary Airwork Ltd, is a provider of aircraft and equipment maintenance, repair and rectification, flying training, and technical and logistics support services to the RAF and overseas Air Forces, particularly in the Middle East.
George Cameron, Managing Director of VT International Services, explained: "We are confident that the support services sector will increasingly hear the name VT Aerospace. We are in the process of bidding for some prestigious contracts linked to the RAF and other customers.
"VT is already a leading provider of support services to the Army and Royal Navy. In these sectors, our expertise is well recognised and we will bring that considerable experience to the aerospace sector. We can now offer the UK Ministry of Defence and overseas customers a truly tri-service approach to their support requirements."
Last year, the organisation as part of Bombardier was awarded the Light Aircraft Flying Task - the RAF's pathfinder PFI project. This is a £110 million, ten-year contract in support of the RAFs elementary flying training. In the Middle East, VT Aerospace, through Airwork, provides services to the Royal Air Force Oman and to the Kuwait Air Force.
27 July 2000
The Farnborough Air Show is the official launch platform for a new name in the aerospace industry, and in particular military support services - VT Aerospace.
Although the name is new, the organisation has been providing support services for over seventy years, most recently as part of Bombardier Aerospace, from which it was acquired last month by leading tri-service support services company Vosper Thornycroft (VT).
VT is already a major player in training and support activities for the British Army and Royal Navy but the creation of a new Aerospace arm marks its full advance to tri-service status.
VT Aerospace's connections with the Services also extend to supporting adventurous endeavours, especially those that demand close teamwork. Typical of VT Aerospace's support is their sponsorship of the British Bobsleigh Association. Pictured left are two team members of the British Bobsleigh Squad with staff members of VT Aerospace.
VT's new division, which includes Bombardier's wholly owned subsidiary Airwork Ltd, is a provider of aircraft and equipment maintenance, repair and rectification, flying training, and technical and logistics support services to the RAF and overseas Air Forces, particularly in the Middle East.
George Cameron, Managing Director of VT International Services, explained: "We are confident that the support services sector will increasingly hear the name VT Aerospace. We are in the process of bidding for some prestigious contracts linked to the RAF and other customers.
"VT is already a leading provider of support services to the Army and Royal Navy. In these sectors, our expertise is well recognised and we will bring that considerable experience to the aerospace sector. We can now offer the UK Ministry of Defence and overseas customers a truly tri-service approach to their support requirements."
Last year, the organisation as part of Bombardier was awarded the Light Aircraft Flying Task - the RAF's pathfinder PFI project. This is a £110 million, ten-year contract in support of the RAFs elementary flying training. In the Middle East, VT Aerospace, through Airwork, provides services to the Royal Air Force Oman and to the Kuwait Air Force.
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Safe does not always mean cheap
Cheap does not always mean safe
Expensive does not always mean dangerous
Does cheap not sometimes mean unsafe ?
I think I'll stick to SERCO chestnuts... Abuse is simple.
Cheap does not always mean safe
Expensive does not always mean dangerous
Does cheap not sometimes mean unsafe ?
I think I'll stick to SERCO chestnuts... Abuse is simple.
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I think to a man (And woman) all the staff at Luton wanted to work for NATS. (Terms and conditions) when given the choice!
From memory, no one wanted to work for SIR CO. I wonder why, I personally have no idea?
If SIR CO is so good why then did the ATC staff rebel when this service provider was the recommendation of the consultants (On price alone) to operate the Luton based unit?
As an aside, if one of the two contesting the bid had been sucessful, there would have been redundancies! I leave you to guess which one.
From memory, no one wanted to work for SIR CO. I wonder why, I personally have no idea?
If SIR CO is so good why then did the ATC staff rebel when this service provider was the recommendation of the consultants (On price alone) to operate the Luton based unit?
As an aside, if one of the two contesting the bid had been sucessful, there would have been redundancies! I leave you to guess which one.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooo!
Please someone tell me it's not true? Please someone tell me that everyone at Nch who wants to will keep their jobs? The loud shorted one? The smaller one who buys lots of Summer Ball tickets and goes on holiday leaving mayhem in his wake? The cycling one? The boss one who always looks so darn smart? The speedy one who always ends up in arguments with people but laughs afterwards (well, sometimes)? It just won't feel right knowing you're not there. I'm a military ATCO, I can't cope with change!!!
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh!
Things are always worse than they seem!
Please someone tell me it's not true? Please someone tell me that everyone at Nch who wants to will keep their jobs? The loud shorted one? The smaller one who buys lots of Summer Ball tickets and goes on holiday leaving mayhem in his wake? The cycling one? The boss one who always looks so darn smart? The speedy one who always ends up in arguments with people but laughs afterwards (well, sometimes)? It just won't feel right knowing you're not there. I'm a military ATCO, I can't cope with change!!!
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh!
Things are always worse than they seem!
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:o Undercover that was a cheapshot. Nothing constructive to say? then sod off
(your right, abuse is simple)
Oh come on Orson,
, of course everyone would want to work for NATS. At the time, it was a cushy number. Nice civil service terms and conditions, no real world reality and a good public/industry image.
It's all a little bit different now though isn't it, you just have to read these pages to see how good a company they are to work for .
Redundancies can no longer be thrown like sh!t at serco's door alone .
How happy were the Luton radar team when they were forced to chose between reduced pay at a tower only unit or move to LATCC, have travel nightmares on the M1/25, and face an eventual move to the south coast. Why did so many of them leave and go to East Midlands and the like.
I THINK NOT!!
So lets get back to Norwich, Spoonbill, do you know when a decision is likely, is it looking like a long drawn out affair?
Have a look at the safeskys website, it'll fill you with trepidation.....now that
is a company with a dodgy image problem!!
(your right, abuse is simple)
Oh come on Orson,
, of course everyone would want to work for NATS. At the time, it was a cushy number. Nice civil service terms and conditions, no real world reality and a good public/industry image. It's all a little bit different now though isn't it, you just have to read these pages to see how good a company they are to work for
.Redundancies can no longer be thrown like sh!t at serco's door alone
.How happy were the Luton radar team when they were forced to chose between reduced pay at a tower only unit or move to LATCC, have travel nightmares on the M1/25, and face an eventual move to the south coast. Why did so many of them leave and go to East Midlands and the like.
I think to a man (And woman) all the staff at Luton wanted to work for NATS. (Terms and conditions) when given the choice!
So lets get back to Norwich, Spoonbill, do you know when a decision is likely, is it looking like a long drawn out affair?
Have a look at the safeskys website, it'll fill you with trepidation.....now that
is a company with a dodgy image problem!!
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Constructive eh... okay.
Well the Luton staff couldn't all have been delighted to be under NATS' wing as many of them refused the option to switch on to NATS terms.
Not being operational I can't criticise SERCO from personal experience - but I'm sure there's two sides to this (as there is with everything else)
Well the Luton staff couldn't all have been delighted to be under NATS' wing as many of them refused the option to switch on to NATS terms.
Not being operational I can't criticise SERCO from personal experience - but I'm sure there's two sides to this (as there is with everything else)
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WWW - Dont worry, there are so few of us anyway there will be no staff reductions, present staff numbers are to be written into the contract. You mentioned a smart boss , did you mean that sartorialy or otherwise?
Legs - Sod Off is such a wonderful phrase, succinct and to the point, no ambiguity, gets the message across straight away.
We'll know in the near future, all parties will have made their presentations by the end of this month, and the MD will make his recommendations to the board in Jan 2002.
It seems that the MD's preffered bidder is still NATS, quite how he'll explain the extra annual cost to the board I don't know. The only thing which may tip the balance is the fact that we have a disproportionate number of our clan who are over 50, have been here since year dot, and also want to go as early as they can afford to do so. The MD sees this as potential major problem, as if we lose 2 at once, we cannot maintain the 24 hour ops and will lose collosall wads of cash. Consequently NATS are the only party who (allegedly) can guarantee full staffing of the contract at all times.
TUPE will apply to all members of staff, and the unions (IPMS/PROSPECT) are in on all the meetings, so at least we're being kept up to date.
The major assurance from NATS was that the approach radar function will not be moved to Aberdeen or LATCC, too many headaches when coordinating with the doughnut scoffers at Colt.
As for who actually gets the contract in the end - who knows I dare say we'll find out 2 days into it
Just looked at the Safeskys web site............. - Larf? I nearly cried
, did you mean that sartorialy or otherwise? Legs - Sod Off is such a wonderful phrase, succinct and to the point, no ambiguity, gets the message across straight away.
We'll know in the near future, all parties will have made their presentations by the end of this month, and the MD will make his recommendations to the board in Jan 2002.
It seems that the MD's preffered bidder is still NATS, quite how he'll explain the extra annual cost to the board I don't know. The only thing which may tip the balance is the fact that we have a disproportionate number of our clan who are over 50, have been here since year dot, and also want to go as early as they can afford to do so. The MD sees this as potential major problem, as if we lose 2 at once, we cannot maintain the 24 hour ops and will lose collosall wads of cash. Consequently NATS are the only party who (allegedly) can guarantee full staffing of the contract at all times.
TUPE will apply to all members of staff, and the unions (IPMS/PROSPECT) are in on all the meetings, so at least we're being kept up to date.
The major assurance from NATS was that the approach radar function will not be moved to Aberdeen or LATCC, too many headaches when coordinating with the doughnut scoffers at Colt.
As for who actually gets the contract in the end - who knows
I dare say we'll find out 2 days into it Just looked at the Safeskys web site............. - Larf? I nearly cried
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I think I'll stick to SERCO chestnuts... Abuse is simple
Not being operational I can't criticise SERCO from personal experience
Spoonbill,
Major assurances from NATS
and you believed them !!!They say Aberdeen's nice this time of year
Now try www.vtae.co.uk
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A tiny minority of staff members decided not to take a NATS T’s and C’s contract and invoked TUPE. Remember employment law, I suggest you examine in finite detail just what you are entitled to. Your union should be on the case as we speak or are you to shy to ask?
Yes they all wanted to still work for Luton, but this was not a choice. NATS or SIR CO was the alternative.
As to the commute, they earn £$0K+ and got a paid move if they so wanted one?
Luton did not lose a single ATCO to EGNX, apart from those that left in 1989, is that what you mean? I suggest LEGS that you GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT!
F’in brilliant unit, decimated by cost cutting. No one was made redundant, lost money voluntarily, or had to commute against his or her will. Pretty good I would say?
SIR CO, what did they offer the staff? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Undercover. You are non-op and have no idea about the detail surrounding the Luton contract.
Legs. Show me a single operational redundancy within NATS and then show me a single aviation related company that is not cutting back. Agreed PPP is evil, but they have not yet shafted operational posts, movements at the London airports are not down much. Luton is of course a London airport and not a rural field! Get yourself a job with NATS. If their T’s and C’s fall, so will all the other non-NATS units in the UK!
I suggest you seek the truth!
[ 14 November 2001: Message edited by: OrsonCart ]
Yes they all wanted to still work for Luton, but this was not a choice. NATS or SIR CO was the alternative.
As to the commute, they earn £$0K+ and got a paid move if they so wanted one?
Luton did not lose a single ATCO to EGNX, apart from those that left in 1989, is that what you mean? I suggest LEGS that you GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT!
F’in brilliant unit, decimated by cost cutting. No one was made redundant, lost money voluntarily, or had to commute against his or her will. Pretty good I would say?
SIR CO, what did they offer the staff? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Undercover. You are non-op and have no idea about the detail surrounding the Luton contract.
Legs. Show me a single operational redundancy within NATS and then show me a single aviation related company that is not cutting back. Agreed PPP is evil, but they have not yet shafted operational posts, movements at the London airports are not down much. Luton is of course a London airport and not a rural field! Get yourself a job with NATS. If their T’s and C’s fall, so will all the other non-NATS units in the UK!
I suggest you seek the truth!
[ 14 November 2001: Message edited by: OrsonCart ]
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Am non-op, true. Although this has no effect on my knowledge of NATS or Luton's T&C's or employment law for that matter.
Totally agree with earlier point about making sure the T&C's are protected. No matter who takes over the union and staff should push for the best possible deal.
Totally agree with earlier point about making sure the T&C's are protected. No matter who takes over the union and staff should push for the best possible deal.
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Buzz - whadya reckon then to moving Norwich APR up to our neck of the woods?
There is plenty of space down by Anglia to spare and we have still got the two empty suites down that end of the room!!
All we would need to do then would be to persuade Scottish to relinquish control of W5D and/or traffic around the Ice Station outside of CAS and we really would have an interesting offshore couple of sectors.
But then again, maybe not!!
There is plenty of space down by Anglia to spare and we have still got the two empty suites down that end of the room!!
All we would need to do then would be to persuade Scottish to relinquish control of W5D and/or traffic around the Ice Station outside of CAS and we really would have an interesting offshore couple of sectors.
But then again, maybe not!!
Spoonbill, not an ounce of sartorial behaviour on my part. Just think it's always nice to see people pitching up for work nice and smart, taking their job seriously (well as seriously as we all can). Obviously not all the team take quite such time on their appearance.......
Things are always worse than they seem!
Things are always worse than they seem!
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WWW I can't believe you're creeping so much and you're not even in the App room with them Next thing you'll be bringing in apples for the underdressed NCH controllers. Saying that, the Legs have not made an appearance recently
Have you noticed how Nch threads are like North Sea Heli's. You spend days without seeing them and suddenly they all want to go through the Overhead.
[ 16 November 2001: Message edited by: Jay Foe ]
Next thing you'll be bringing in apples for the underdressed NCH controllers. Saying that, the Legs have not made an appearance recently Have you noticed how Nch threads are like North Sea Heli's. You spend days without seeing them and suddenly they all want to go through the Overhead.
[ 16 November 2001: Message edited by: Jay Foe ]
Like I said J, MPA is a very mellowing experience. But hey, at least I spell correctly on my posts!
I know what you mean about those SNSH's as well, laugh I almost died! Hey, do you think we could hijack this thread as well? Then again, wouldn't want to divert resources from keeping the other thread at the top!
Things are always worse than they seem!
I know what you mean about those SNSH's as well, laugh I almost died! Hey, do you think we could hijack this thread as well? Then again, wouldn't want to divert resources from keeping the other thread at the top!
Things are always worse than they seem!