Wildlife on the airfield

[MonkeyPilot]

Hello, me again.

I know this is a non-aviation question, but am sure someone will know the answer. While doing the pre-flight check on Saturday morning, there was a small green frog sitting under the nose wheel of G-DB. I managed to make it jump out of the way, so we didn't squash it when taxiing out to the runway. It's not unusual to see wildlife around the airfield, but Jimmy, my instructor, had not seen a frog under the wheel before.

Anyway, to get to the point of my long rambling message, we talked for some time after the lesson about the wildlife on the airfield and how most animals seem unbothered by the aircraft moving around. But, of all things, we couldn't agree on how long a frog lives for! I know all frogs seem to be pretty much the same, but I reckon they must have a fairly long life expectancy. Jimmy disagreed. Anyone out there know the answer? Need to try and find an answer before my next flying lesson on Saturday... :)

MP

[FlyingForFun]

No idea at all...

...But it seems like a good excuse to tell a story about my airfield - no idea if this is true or not. We have our fair share of wildlife, most of which keeps out of our way. The airfield has been there longer than any of the animals, so they're all quite used to it. Besides which, they don't want to be hit by a 2-tonne aircraft any more than we want to fly into them, so it's in their interests to stay off the runways.

Because of this, we never bothered writing a bird-scaring policy.

Until recently - when the CAA realised that we didn't have a bird-scaring policy, and told us that we had to have one.

The airfield ground-staff went away and scratched their collective heads trying to figure out what to put in the bird-scaring policy.

Eventually, they wrote: "The airfield does not have a bird-scaring policy" This was enough to keep the beaurocrats happy, and is now our official bird-scaring policy.

Apparently.

(But it's a good story even if it's not true!)

FFF
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[big.al]

Also unrelated to frogs (sorry - can't help with frog life-expectancy); when I was learning to fly in Florida there were a few pairs of huge sand cranes wandering around the field. These birds must be around 2ft tall. For the majority of the time they kept well clear, until the day they decided to saunter across the numbers just as I was approaching the threshold on final. I landed well beyond them but in hindsight know I should have gone-around.

I've no idea if sand cranes can fly or if they are a flight-less bird, but if they suddenly became airbourne and entered the mincing machine, I dread to think what mess it would have made....

I would say that the life expectancy of a frog sheltering under the nosewheel of an a/c all depends on the weather; in good weather, the a/c is likely to be going somewhere sooner rather than later... Well done for having seen it and rescuing the poor blighter!

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

No idea about the froggy, but airfields do seem to be a haven for certain types of wildlife. In particular, skylarks, with their inspiring call, abound at many airfields, including Barton. Even Hatfield disused had them until the building work started :~(

And hares - many large airfields have loads, hopping around among the taxying airliners. I remember when flying from Hawarden many years ago in the Chippy, we sometimes landed on the long grass if both runways were significantly out of wind. I well remember the sight of hares bounding away from the aeroplane in all directions.

SSD

[Rote 8]

Last year I was a member of the Midland Gliding Club (I have not renewed this year as I am going to be busy with my commercial). The airfield is on top of the Long Mynd, a ridge of hills in Shropshire. It really is the kind of place that you would not look at twice if you were performing a PFL in a powered aircraft and looking to pick a field. Anyway the field is covered in local farmers sheep, to the extent that they have to be chased away in a Land Rover regularly to keep them out of the way and in the past sheep have even been picked up by the cable and launched skywards.

That beats all your frogs, cranes, hares, skylarks etc!

[Tinstaafl]

Apart from the thousands of birds that nest at the islands I fly into, at various places I've also had the pleasure of competing for runway use with sheep, ponies & horses, kangaroos/wallabies & cattle.


Last year a pilot here managed to collect a lamb with his nosewheel while landing. Cost over 20,000 quid to repair.

[topcat450]

I had to go around once after ATC informed me a dog had obstructed 27 without clearance.

[FlyingForFun]

I have a book at home (which I can not remember the details of....) in which the author tells of a farmstrip that he knows of. The farmer has trained his dog to clear the sheep off the runway before he goes flying. But no matter how hard he tries, he can not get the dog to understand that when he does a low pass over the runway, that means he's ready to land, and he needs the sheep to be cleared. As a result, he can't take his wife flying, because he needs his wife to get the dog to clear the runway for him :D

Anyway, to answer the question, this website (http://www.klsnet.com/frogs.html) lists the lifespan of several common species of frogs as anything from 5 to 30 years.

FFF
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[Rallye Driver]

When I was still a humble student pilot, my instructor and I flew up to Norwich before I did my QXC there.

When we taxied onto the apron and parked there was a small turboprop airliner parked next to us. A group of blokes were staring at the port main undercarriage leg.

We strolled off to the local caff for a steak sandwich. When we came back they were still at it, but by now they had a large cardboard box.

We strolled over and enquired what they were doing and they said a large snake had wrapped itself round the undercarriage and they were trying to entice it into the box.

The aircraft had come from France, and they weren't sure whether the snake had come all the way across from there, or simply sneaked in from the long grass at the edge of the apron.

We left them to it.

********

I can also remember during the foot and mouth epidemic when Headcorn were offering a frozen lamb instead of a landing fee. (I think they might still do so.)

We called in there about a week before we went to the Oldtimers Fly-in at Schaffen Diest. The Belgians required a form to be signed saying that we hadn't come from anywhere with F&M, which we got signed by the Government Veterinary Service in Chelmsford.

Fortunately we didn't go for the lamb option, as it would have been a bit difficult to explain to the Belgians how the bloodstains in the back were from a dead sheep!

RD

[singaporegirl]

FFF,

The frogs on your website are all rather exotic and unlikely to be found hanging around British airfields. MP's specimen is most likely to have been a common frog, which has a life span of up to eight years.

Unless it has the misfortune to be served up as part of a frog and tofu dish (have I mentioned this before??!) :rolleyes:

[Maarten]

Midden Zeeland in the Netherlands often has squadron of swans on the runway that have occasionally made my landings and take-offs even more entertaining than they would have been without them!

[Genghis the Engineer]

I seem to remember from my youth (parents had a pond full of the things) that frogs live 3-5 years. I think that they prefer living in undergrowth or long grass and tend only to go near to water to breed. Winter was spent hibernating in mud, often on the bottom of a pond which meant that if we had a really long freeze they died and cleaning the pond out in spring was rather unpleasant - the pond mud was full of dead frogs.

And have you ever watched them swim - nothing like the breast stroke that swimming teachers always tell you is based upon a frog when you are a kid, frogs do one leg then the other, not both together.

G

[pilotwolf]

Don't know how long they live but seem to recall they mate for up to 24 hours at a time!

Oh to be a frog!

:E

[witchdoctor]

Can't add anything to the great frog mystery (other than those who smoke Gauloise probably die sooner!!!), but Rallye Driver, a large snake in the UK? We only have 3, and the largest is very rarely more than 3 feet long at best.

Most interesting wildlife experience was a coyote on the runway in Arizona (apparently she had a litter of cubs in a hole just behind the edge lights), and a swarm of bees whilst taxying that made things a little exciting for a few moments. Glad all doors/windows had been closed.

[FlyingForFun]

Unless it has the misfortune to be served up as part of a frog and tofu dish (have I mentioned this before??!)Yes, I believe you may have, just once or twice :D

I can only apologise for supplying duff information. But, not being an expert on frogs, whether alive or in one of Singaporegirl's delicacies (have you+AerBabe had a chance to get into a kitchen together yet?) I just went with the first page which Google returned!

FFF
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[Kolibear]

Airfields are great places for wildlife, for the simple reason that people aren't allowed on them. No people = no disturbance.

Wildlife (http://www.gaac.co.uk/environment.htm)

Most airfields have extensive undisturbed grass areas (apart from the runways) which is a surprising scarce habitat, so quite often there is a higher density of wildlife on an airfield than on neighbouring farmland.

Most birds and animals take no notice of aircraft and vehicles as they don't associated them with man, which is why you can quite often drive of taxi up to something that you could approach on foot.

An airfield in the west country was threatened with closure. At the hearing, the prosecution claimed that it was deterimental to wildlife. It was conclusively shown that that the presence of the airfield had a positive benefit to the local wildlife.

[skydriller]

These :mad: :mad: :mad: animals dug up half our runway last year, such that last summer we had to declare only 2/3s of it available for use. The most annoying thing is that hunting them is strictly regulated here, so we cant just shoot the ******s and have them for lunch Asterix & Oblix style, even though the local ‘Club de Chasse’ would dearly love to help in eradicating them for us. So we have had to buy miles of electric fence to try to keep them out. Luckily this year, after alot of care, the runway is now fully servicable for this summer and we seem to be keeping the Wild Boar at bay.

Regards, SD..

BTW, if you get the chance to try it, roast wild boar is fantasticly tasty...as I discovered last year...:E :E

[tyro]

MP

It wasn't a mild-mannered little green frog at all. Did you see the line it was attaching to G-DB? It wanted to be aerotoad.

[expedite_climb]

Had haremiss (or should that be hareprox these days ?) a few times....

[hasell]

The rabbits at my local airfield (EGLM) seem pretty well behaved.
I like to think of them as Airfield Security.
Its kinda nice having them tracking with you on the ground ...(at a safe distance) when taxing back to Line 1 after a flight:-)

[G SXTY]

Alright then, how about a pair of alligators basking in the undershoot at Marco Island? :ooh:

Makes the hares & pheasants at Stapleford seem quite boring . . .

[singaporegirl]

Don't know how long they live but seem to recall they mate for up to 24 hours at a time!

The frogs in our pond seem to mate for about three weeks at a time - at least, that's the period they spend paired up clinging to each other and the period over which all the frogspawn seems to be laid! Though I suppose this may be different combinations; I suspect frogs aren't monogamous. ;)

And they do seem to live in the pond all year round, although there were frogs in the garden before there was any water. I remember when we dug the hole for the pond: we put the liner in and then left it, intending to fill it with water the next day. When we went out to admire our handiwork in the evening, there was this frog, sitting at the bottom of this hole, looking up as if to say, 'So when's the water going to arrive?'

[redbar1]

Hi,
As this excellent, relaxing, refreshing and long overdue thread seems a bit biased towards warmer climates (crocodiles et al), I will dare add my pennys worth of experiences in colder climates, just to keep up the geographical balance of the forum:

Up in Scandinavia I've had the educating opportunity to be delayed by stray dogs, horses ( :zzz: not too special, I admit), foxes, snowfoxes (a tad tricky on snowcovered rwys!), deer, harts and moose/elk, but the winner was the reindeer!

....and reindeer tastes lovely as well... :ok:

Oh, almost forgot.. I know absolutely nothing about frogs lifespan, sorry!

Cheers, and bon apetit
RedBar1

[Maxflyer]

It turns out that very little is known at all about the natural lifespan of frogs. Partially, this is because it's pretty hard to track a frog all its life! (I guess they havent figured out a good way to put little tiny collars around their necks!)

However,some records show that in captivity, many species of frogs and toads can live for surprisingly long times. They seem generally average somewhere between 4 and 15 years!

Recently I ran across a page where people were posting data about how long their species of frogs had lived in captivity.
The longest lifespan entered was a European Common Toad (Bufo bufo ssp.) at 40 years!!!!!

[Genghis the Engineer]

Well thats a longer career catching flies than must of us can rely upon.

G

[Cusco]

Last year while on final approach under the hood into Fort Myers, Fla.,on my last practice NDB approach before the FAA/IR test, the tower announced 'a dozen turkey buzzards' circling in the undershoot to my runway

Rightly or wrongly the instructor continued us down to decision height and we landed safely though a certain part of my anatomy was twittering furiously waiting for the bang.

Never saw a single turkey buzzard and it wasn't until I got back to the UK and looked 'em up in my birdie book that the hairs really stood up on the back of my neck.

We had flown through a flock of seriously big beasts.

Safe flying

Cusco

[Keef]

Yea, Cusco, those turkey buzzards are seriously large birds. Had a similar encounter, likewise with no airprox to report.

The alligators at Marco were much inconvenienced by me doing PFLs there - fortunately we didn't get TOO close.

Last week at Knettishall, something large loped across the runway when I was on short final (I pulled up over it). Larger than a hare, similar gait. Vintage ATCO reckoned it was a muntjak.

[Circuit Basher]

Sorry - bit of thread drift, but it just reminded me of a few old jokes that I collected some time ago:
Leaving Palo Alto on Friday. A Citabria had just landed: PAO: 85 Uniform, Taxi to position and hold.
Me: Position and hold, 85 Uniform.
Citabria: Umm, Tower, there's a dead seagull on the right side of the runway near the windsock.
PAO: Roger. 85 Uniform, cleared for takeoff. Watch for a dead seagull on the right side of the runway.
Me: 85 Uniform, Dead seagull traffic in sight.
A little later, the Citabria was downwind when I heard:
PAO: Citabria 123, cleared to land 30. Caution - there's a buzzard trying to eat the seagull on the runway.
_________________________

Pilot: We've just sucked a seagull into one of our engines.
Tower: Which one?
Pilot: Dunno, you've seen one seagull, you've seen 'em all.
_________________________

...pilots are seagulls - all they do is squawk and sh+t, and you have to throw rocks at them to get them to fly....

The similarity between pilots and seagulls: "They both fly, squawk, sh!t and screw".

The difference between a pilot and a pig?
"Pigs do not hang around bars, trying to pick up pilots"
;)

[stiknruda]

Can't remember exactly which dirt strip in the Krugger national Park in NE South Africa - (so long ago and I have been to so many:ugh: ) but I do recall buzzing the dirt strip twice to scare away the lions and hyena that were scrapping over a dead antelope.

The first pass at about 50 feet and 150 knots in a Chieftain just deflected their attention for about 15 secs then they returned to the affray/dinner table. The second pass a litle lower, a little slower and a lot louder did the trick!

I have had two birdstrikes - I hit a guineau fowl just as I was about to touch down in a Citabria I hit it with the wing strut and although there was no damage to the aeroplane the bird felt no pain when I plucked it later!

And about a year ago I hit a French partidge with the leading edge of the top wing in the Pitts - it did no damage but was very, very messy :yuk:
cetainly wasn't enough left to eat!

Stik

[singaporegirl]

Never mind Stik, (English) grey leg partridges taste much better (more succulent) than (French) red leg partridges. :p

When I went on a postie trip delivering mail to ranches out in Far North Queensland last year, there were several strips where termite mounds were seriously encroaching on the runway thresholds. Not to mention the wild cattle running all over the place...

[Kolibear]

Stik said:-

I hit a French partridge with the leading edge of the top wing in the Pitts

Now all partridges are reluctant to fly, preferring to run from danger. When they do fly, they don't fly very high.

So stik, what exactly were you doing?? :)

[stiknruda]

Kolibear - I was in the process of landing, looking out the side when I caught a movement dead ahead in my peripheral vision.

When I pushed the aircraft into the hangar I found that there was gooey feathery bits over bits of it. The colour of the feathers somewhat gave it away. Many of my neighbours put birds down each year.

Singaporegirl - I agree with you re the quality of the English (blue/grey leg) but they are quite rare over here and with the more predatory/terratorial nature of the French bird have seen quite a decline in their numbers over the years. As the French partride is both hardier and less costly to rear than its English counterpart, it is understandable why most game keepers in these parts rear them. The decline of the indigenous bird is rather a shame in my opinion - however that does not stop me from eating the French variety!

Just this morning I saw 3 pairs of French partridges on the strip - looks like they have paired off quite early and in just a few weeks I'm sure to see the chicks on the strip - quite an attraction for my puppy I'm sure!

Stik - pilot and BASC member!