Bristol Vacancy

[x-border]

I hear there's a job going at Bristol. Can somebody give more info on what it's like to work there. Ta. :ok:

[SevernTMA]

And any idea about the money????;)

[flower]

Severn TMA you only just got back , not going again are we :p

[niknak]

Very well equipped place, lots of money been spent on the place recently, new ATC complex etc.

Very busy from an ATC viewpoint, hours are H24, a complex environment, but most of the ATC staff are relatively human. :p, and the ATSM seems to run a tight but well run ship.

Money is good, above the average regional airport wage, but take account that the pension scheme is non contributary, so this could equate to between 4 and 7 % of what you presently earn.
I'm pretty sure that at least ** of Filton's atcos will be applying for the post, (one will be automatically disqualified for being too ugly:} ), obviously they have an advantage over others.

On the downside, Bristol is expensive and a crap city to live in, the surrounding countryside takes a lot of beating, but is very very expensive from a housing viewpoint, if you're moving from a cheaper area, make the most of the relocation package offered.

[Burns the Bread]

:confused:

- Bristol a busy ATC environment?? Gotta be kidding - The Welsh boyos do most of their work. And their pay is low average. The only thing worth going there for is the Butcombe Bitter........
From what I hear there may be quite a few jobs coming up soon????
:ok:

[Spitoon]

Burns my old mate, I'm guessing you base your comments on the number of aeroplanes that you see taking off and landing. ATC is a bit more than that.

Bristol is a rather challenging environment for the controllers - not much protected airspace, surrounded by other airports and their traffic, lots of other planes flying through the area and I could go on. If you're not a controller it's something that you simply won't and can't appreciate.

And, by the way, the Welsh boyos (most of whom aren't Welsh) certainly get to talk to some aeroplanes that fly around there but I don't think it's fair to imaging that they do all the work. But maybe it just sounds like it on a spotter's scanner. :bored: :bored: :bored:

[ATCO1987]

Hi All, Im a newbie:D
This is what bristolairport.com says:
Air Traffic Control Officer

Highly Competitive

Working from our new £3.5 million control tower, the Air Traffic Control Officers handle an average of 70,000 aircraft movements a year plus 22,000 LARS transits using some of the latest ATC systems. The position offers an outstanding working environment in a beautiful part of the West Country. Quality of life is high, with a wide range of rural and city housing, excellent schools and universities and easy access to the rest of the UK by road, rail and air. A UK CAA ATC licence, including an Aerodrome Rating and an Approach Radar rating is essential. Possession of a MET Observer’s certificate and experience of working at an aerodrome within a similar type of airspace is desirable. In return, we offer a highly competitive salary, non-contributory pension scheme, private medical insurance and a generous relocation package. Previous applicants may re-apply but only those holding the above qualifications will be selected for interview. Please send your CV and covering letter to Paul Howlett, Human Resources Manager, Bristol International Airport, Bristol BS48 3DY or email [email protected] Closing date: 3rd June 2003.

Paul Howlett
[email protected]

[Cosmic Wind]

It sounds like the typical non NATS regional dilema. Package offered can't tempt anyone without any real experience and usually the self-improver ATCO simply can't hack it. Cardiff may work a fair bit of sky in that part of the world but they do nowhere near the amount of LARS and co-ordination that Bristol does, they simply seem to have a good contact in 'airspace allocation'. Bit of a jump from Filton to Lulsgate in traffic levels, not a good move....

[flower]

cosmic wind ,
you may think you know about Cardiff but your post suggests differently. I would love to know what sort of co-ordination you think we do bearing in mind the number of units we deal with, on top of that we have a large expanse of area in which we operate our LARS service.
Cardiff and Bristol have a good working relationship and I don't think people should be trying to make up inter unit rivalries which in reality don't exist. Bristol have more ATMs at their airfield , we have a large chunk of the airway system . On top of that we have a very busy LARS and are also the approach unit for RAF St Athan.
I prefer working for NATS but if Bristol were in NATS im sure there would be a rush of people wishing to work there from within the company.
Its an expanding airfield with good facilities to work in I would say go for it to anyone looking for an interesting job in ATC.

[Burns the Bread]

:confused:
Putting 2 and 3 together - Cardiff seem to work a big chunk of Bristol traffic and they also seem to work traffic up and down Amber 25 or whatever its called now. On another post TBI (owners of Cardiff) are complaining that they are paying too much for their ATC services from NATS. Is that because TBI are subsidising the local ATC services in that area? And are the controllers at Cardiff airways controllers as well, therefore more expensive to employ?

[flower]

Contract details and finances are confidential and the likes of us common and garden ATCOs are not privy to them, if we were we certainly wouldn't be posting them here.

The ATCOs at Cardiff are not the more expensive ones either we are ATCO 3s but thats another story :hmm:

[Gypsy Queen]

Please excuse my ignorance but when they say non-contributory pension scheme what exactly do they mean...:=

niknak you refer to this could equate to between 4 and 7 % of what you presently earn., could you elaborate please?? :confused:

thank you.:O

[1261]

We used to have a "non-contributory" pension when I worked for Shell. What this meant in practice was that the scheme was fully funded by the company and you had to make no contributions at all yourself (there was an upper limit on this but it was up in the stratosphere, £75k if I remember correctly). The company position was that the scheme was massively in surplus and it would be good for morale if they were seen not to be ripping anyone off.

NATS take note!

[niknak]

Gypsy Queen.

Most of us who pay into a company pension scheme pay between 4% and 7%, some pay more than that.
At most local government airports, which is what Bristol used to be, the going rate for the local government pension scheme, is 6%.

As 1261 explained, the employees do not presently contribute towards the scheme, so you get the money you would have put into the pension, as your salary. Bristols owners are predominantly investment bankers, and in terms of pension benefits, are giving the airport employees exactly what they give to their own.

Being totally cynical, I could argue that this would make the salary offered very attractive, up to 6% more than comparable airports. If I were to be offered a post on those terms, I'd think very seriously about investing that sum long term, be in a pension, building society or whatever, (anything to stop Mrs Niknak getting her spending paws on it:{ ).

However, should the pension fund stop operating at a surplus, the employees would have to start making fairly hefty contributions for quite a long time to bring it back into line, additionally, it's very unlikely they'd ever get the non - contributary pension scheme back.

Get my drift?

It would be interesting to know if the Bristol Airport pension scheme is a "Final Salary" one.

[LN-ATC]

Will UK CAA ever approve applicants not holding an UK CAA licence? Or isn't UK CAA taking part in the Eurocontrol/EU licence program that is supposed to be in force after 2004?

Norway says good morning

[360BakTrak]

Does anyone know for definite how many vacancies there are? :confused: I heard from someone that there were 4 vacancies and then from someone else only 1 !! :p

[Legs11]

360BT, with one new guy started last month, I believe this ad will recruit one more, with further vacancies arising in the not too distant future.:ok:

Hope that helps.:cool:

[SOEFOATC]

I have just started out in my ATC career:O It seems to me there is a beasting period you have to go through befor you are accepted. I also think it is very hard to find your first job. Also it's not what you know, it's who you know a lot of the time.
As to some places being too buisy for certain people, well this is true as you get used to the enviroment you work in. However everyone who has passed and aerodrome coarse must somewhere up in the noggin have the aptitude to "up their game" as it were.
I am currently looking for other jobs around the Uk if any one knows of any please let me know. I only have an aerodrome rating with a validated ticket. ( Yes thats right I am a young pup with not a lot of experiance:bored: but everyone has to start somewhere:O ) Any ideas then please post them.


Ta ta peeps.;)

[Legs11]

Totally off the beaten track SOEFOATC - is that a little chip you've got there? Yes it can be hard to find a job, and some of 'who you know' can be a help....it's a hard tough world.:{ but we all have to learn to cope :sad: .





everyone who has passed and aerodrome coarse must somewhere up in the noggin have the aptitude to "up their game" :ugh: sorry to disappoint you := , but no they don't. We all have our limit. I have personal experience of training several previously valid controllers, at units which were busier than their previous ones - and they have just not been up to it.:( It's the same as in any other walk of life there are always going to be those who are more able than others.

Looking for jobs you need to accept this and work your way up slowly. Try serco, try the self providers for a chance of self improvement or further training, but don't go in thinking your the bee knees. At least not yet anyway.:ok:

[Serco Air Tragic]

Yup you want a beasting try serco, alternately Maccy D's are hiring with competitive pay and benefits. If you can say "clear to land" then im sure you can say "would you like frys with that":yuk:

[SOEFOATC]

There is no chip on my sholder, I would say more like a small French fry. ( one on strike as well!!)
As for Serco..............?
I suppose I am a little impatiant but there we go.
By the way whoever air Tragic is, he or she seems to be a little Disheartened with our friend the big "S" But arn't they trying to make the world a safer place where evreyone holds hands and sing "ging gang gooly" until the sun rises!?:ugh:

Ta ta peeps.

[360BakTrak]

Somebody new started there last month? Didn't see the advert for that!!!:ooh:

[Cosmic Wind]

As with most things it's who you know not what! Nothing is as it seems on the surface and the biggest challenge is fitting in with all types of personality, the jobs probably a piece of cake.

[Razors Edge]

So somewhere in the region of a dozen applicants (surprising - I thought there would be more) and interviews early July - if you haven't heard then the news probably isn't good :{

[Hitchin a ride]

As it wasn't mentioned in the ad, anyone got any idea what the starting salary is likely to be and what kind of pay scale they use?

:confused:

[360BakTrak]

Well I've got an interview in early july, anyone else?
I'm not too confident though as it seems they like huge amounts of experience. I've got all 3 ratings valid but only a couple of years experience and its mostly in class G.
Better do some genning up and cross my fingers!!!

Good Luck to any other interviewee's! :ok:

[Legs11]

360BT...East Mids, Leeds and now Bristol, is it really so bad at Bournemouth?:D
I'd heard they were a funny bunch, but you're starting to appear desparate:eek:

Good luck with interview though, maybe you'll find lasting happiness and fulfillment:ok:

[Serco Air Tragic]

SOEFOATC

Displeased with the Big S, dont be silly. Im a company man through and through. I mean theres no large corporate entity i'd rather receive the shaft from in the form of a totaly whacked out pay scale than our dear dear Serco. Now time to sing the company song..............

(P.S. if any1 can think of a company song then lets hear it) :ok:

[Gypsy Queen]

From what I've heard, 360BakTrak, you might not be the only one from EGHH who has applied - look around you my friend for your competition:} God it must be awful down there:{

[360BakTrak]

Legs11....Leeds?? Who said anything about Leeds?!?! Never been there let alone applied!!
As for Bournemouth?... Didn't know they had an airport down there!!:D

[Razors Edge]

360BT, I gather your SATCO's been snooping around at Bristol in the last week, you might want to hang around at Bournemouth - promotion might be on it's way;)

How did the interview go, by the way:cool:

[360BakTrak]

Who knows..............should find out in the next couple of days.:(

[Legs11]

Letters went out yesterday I gather, but don't know who the lucky one(s?) is. :ok:

[360BakTrak]

Anybody know who 'The One' is yet???!!!:confused:

[Razors Edge]

it wasn't you then 360?:( sorry to hear that.

[BMIne]

If Bournemouth SATCO's snooping with intent........
who'se going to protect "the troops" at Bournemouth?

:ooh:

[360BakTrak]

Anyone fancy applying?!?!?:eek:

[BMIne]

I have a "nicely" paid job at the moment 360,
but thank you very much for asking.

I guess its going to be more last minute roster changes
til any vacancies are filled.:suspect:

[niknak]

Damn! another rejection.......:{

Hang on a minute, that's why I didn't get it, I didn't apply.. :ok:

[Gypsy Queen]

So Mr Stockley got the job then. When will we see the vacancy notice for Bournemouth SATCO I wonder?

[360BakTrak]

Already out allegedly! Not the only vacancy either apparently!! Who's next to jump the sinking ship?!?!?
:{

[LondonRadar]

360,

Where is the vacancy advertised? Just curious.Cheers.

[360BakTrak]

Internally, it seems, throughout the Manchester Group of Airports (EGNX, EGNJ).

[Legs11]

Excuse my ignorance, but who from East Mids is going to apply to Bournemouth? Or Humberside come to think of it, they're all waiting for Finningley:ooh:

[360BakTrak]

I never said people from those units WOULD apply, thats just where the vacancies are being advertised. Management are obviously too tight to fork out for a Flight Int'l advert!!:eek:

[360BakTrak]

The plot thickens!
Apparently said HH SATCO is off to the tropical climes of Canada! Better dust off those CV's again!!!!!!!!:hmm:

[Razors Edge]

OOh, another advert! But now they want class 'A' experience!!!:confused:

[360BakTrak]

Well they are getting picky!.............:}

[Standard Noise]

Yes, we are picky, but nowt wrong with that.:p

[ebenezer]

Anybody thinking of applying to Bristol should ask at their interview what the future will look like in five years time IF the ATC contract goes to NATS because....Bristol could find itself as another NATS 'stand-alone' tower should radar move across the Severn, which for anybody seeking the challenge of approach radar, might be mind-blowingly boring....

:confused:

[Spitoon]

Approach radar all day, every day sounds pretty mind numbing too! I rather like a bit of variety.

[Standard Noise]

Although we could all be down on the south coast in ten years time.;)

[ebenezer]

Although we could all be down on the south coast in ten years time


Not on a NATS Area ATCO's (i.e. Band 5 ATCO 2) salary.

NATS commercial contracts with non-BAA airports are actually cost-driven and price-sensitive as London City, Farnborough, Luton, Cardiff and Belfast can testify.

Try checking out the real ATC world; Bristol Radar from Swanwick?

Dream on Sunshine...

:hmm:

[slotbuster]

Try checking out the real ATC world; Bristol Radar from Swanwick?

So where do they do Luton Approach Radar from?

[Stupendous Man]

...and Thames Radar....

But then thats a whole other kettle of worms.

[CAP670]

So where do they do Luton Approach Radar from? And Thames Radar

You're right that both are provided from TC West Drayton, but this is because both Luton and City interact closely with other London TMA routes.

This is not the case with Bristol.

The provision of Luton and Thames radars is via a subcontract arrangement between NATS En-route (NERL) and NATS Airports (NSL) whereby NATS Airports pays NERL for service provision.

TC is a Band 5 ATCO 2 unit because the requirement is for all operational ATCOs there to hold at least two sector 'validations'; the fact that some of those who transferred in from Luton when approach radar relocated do not hold more than one sector competence is an anomaly.

If any further approach radar functions were to be transferred to TC (and ultimately to Swanwick) and it's a big IF...then the ATCOs would most probably now be required to comply with the unit competency requirement and hold two 'validations'. Or it's possible that they might instead, be employed as ATCO 3s with single competency, thereby reducing the cost of the contracted service to the aiport.

Thus, Ebenezer's comment isn't that wide of the mark.

:uhoh:

[Standard Noise]

Just for the record, when they visited us, the NATS team said they wouldn't rule out anything as regards where the 'Severn TMA' radar function would be in the long term. No one mentioned "band 5 ATCO2 salary", that's something ebenezer read that wasn't in my post.

Anyway, I didn't move back here from Belfast to end up working down at Swanwick, god forbid I'd have to work with the same miserable tw@ts I saw at West Drayton every day, many moons ago. Nope, I'm happy up here in Ziderland, you can keep yer south coast sink hole.:p

[PPRuNe Radar]

TC is a Band 5 ATCO 2 unit because the requirement is for all operational ATCOs there to hold at least two sector 'validations';

PROSPECT reps ... stand by to be killed in the rush as units where it is necessary to hold more than 'two sector validations' clamour for Band 5 status based on these new rules ;)

What Band should I be on with the 10 'sector validations' (5 1/2 sector groupings) I hold ?? :}

[ebenezer]

What Band should I be on with the 10 'sector validations' (5 1/2 sector groupings) I hold ??

Well, how's about the same salary as an ACC controller working for AENA at Madrid!!??!!

Didn't think that the 'more than one validation' requirement at TC was a 'new rule' though. Maybe someone can clarify????

:confused:

[PPRuNe Radar]

Well, how's about the same salary as an ACC controller working for AENA at Madrid!!??!!

Muy aceptable. ¿Dónde firmo por favor? :ok: Pero el jefe de la gerencia del flujo en Barcelona es mejor :}

[Legs11]

anyone gone for it this time?

[Gypsy Queen]

...well they can probably expect two applicants from Filton, it might have been a third if one wasn't already leaving:p

[vfrflyer]

anyone got interview??

[360BakTrak]

Does that mean you applied vfrflyer?:)

[Sector Who]

In the advert it says that they're looking for people with experience in working in class A/D airspace. That seems to limit the scope somewhat to other larger non-NATS units.

I take it that the class D bit is their CTR/CTZ and the class A is their delegated airspace on L9 unless they've been given more recently that we haven't heard about?

[vfrflyer]

Does that mean you applied vfrflyer?


Take a pay cut, lower pension...........No thanks:ok:

[Legs11]

Well if the closing date was the 8th, at least give them till the end of this week to invite interviewees:rolleyes:

[ifaxu]

Chopped were we standard noise!!:}

[Standard Noise]

As the big fat jolly man says, 'ho, ho, ho!":p

[Razors Edge]

...anyone with any news?:ugh:

[Legs11]

...well I gather that applications have reached double figures, but I know no more than that:)

[TCAS FAN]

If there ever was a case for a centralised approach unit (after London), the Bristol-Filton-Cardiff triangle is one. After a visit to Bristol many years ago it was an ATC coordination nightmare. Noboby dare fart unless it was coordinated with the other two parties!

Where is the new part privatised NATS when all this is going on? An ideal chance for them to show Bristol and Filton how much money they could save them by running the combined approach function from Cardiff, or relocating it at Bristol.

[flower]

TCAS,
things have improved greatly since then with the units working very closely together.
Combining the units, yep Bristol/Cardiff combined radar would be ideal, watch this space.

[Sector Who]

NATS feasibility study already done, infrastructure already mainly in place at Bristol, NATS ATC contract at Bristol in the bag (with concessions to BIA management re siting of radar unit), new airspace set for next year (SIDS and STARS), growth at Bristol rocketing, BIA parent company favourite bidder for Exeter, Filton ATC limited by BAe/AMS investment, indeed "watch this space"...

However, not much money to be saved at all by combining radar units (ask the accountants), other reasons and factors would drive such a change

[Standard Noise]

Oooh, someone with inside knowledge, the soup thickens!:ooh:

[Standard Noise]

Makes no difference, no one's getting in the door, cos no ones good enough!:}

[Legs11]

I thought that Bristol had come up against added complications involving the NATS bid on this? Has anyone heard anything?

[Standard Noise]

You know what they say, a nod's as good as a wink to a blind horse.;)

[Razors Edge]

...interviews this week, with possibly more than one to be recruited:ok:

[Standard Noise]

Oh, looks like we've lowered our standards for these interviews (with one poss exception, of course.)
Hope the interviewees aren't dead set on getting into NATS via Bristol.;)

[Sector Who]

So is the NATS issue on the back-burner now? Last thing I heard it was almost a dead cert with NATS making some long term plans for you guys.

[Standard Noise]

NATS can plan til the cows come home. S'not a done deal til the airport agrees to it. And they haven't yet.:hmm:

[Sector Who]

So not as straightforward as NATS management tried to make us believe - they thought that it was in the bag months ago. What sticking points are there or have you got a really tough negotiating team?

[Standard Noise]

I think the main sticking point is their heads are stuck up their own 4rses. They seem to think they will just walk in and the airport will swoon and say yes.
Oh and the contract is a tad too expensive, so the rumour goes.

[terry1261]

Oh, looks like we've lowered our standards

I don't think so, you've always had a 'good mix'!!

[ILS 119.5]

Sorry bit late reading this post, but why class A? Class A airspace is the easiest to work, I used to work it. Class D combining LARS is the most difficult, I used to work it. Bristol (if they have not found anybody already) should be looking for an experienced atco with at least 5 years fully validated (unlikely) ratings. Good look to them.

[2 sheds]

Quote...

"Class D combining LARS is the most difficult,..."

...and Class G combined with LARS?

This obsession with Class A/D experience seems very strange logic.

[Standard Noise]

Indeed 2sheds, I agree.

[robbie d]

How did the interviews go? When were they?

Does anyone know who the lucky winner (or winners) are?

Just curious.:D

[Legs11]

Just how low have the standards dropped SN? Where were your interviewees from?

robbie d, the interviews were towards the end of last week:ok:

[Standard Noise]

Just my little joke Legs11.
The interviewees were of a good standard so I'm told, however, I've no idea who has been chosen as I've been on leave. Suppose I'll find out on Sat when I go back in. Suffice to say, the units they all currently work at were of the standard we would want and in one case, even I was a little surprised!

[robbie d]

So, what unit has the new person come from?

Just trying to work out which airport will be recruiting next!

[Razors Edge]

probably from one of the following robbie - Bournemouth, Exeter, Jersey, East Mids or NATS TC!;)

[Gypsy Queen]

What? No-one from Cardiff?:hmm:

[Legs11]

that would be telling wouldn't it :ok:

[matspart3]

Surely not Legs? You'll get a reputation flitting around the Southwest like that....you'll be up here next!!:D

[Razors Edge]

Did anyone ever hear who got taken on?

[Standard Noise]

Yep, sure have.;)

[Gypsy Queen]

I think someone from Jersey:ok:

[Standard Noise]

You might well be correct. And he/she might well be starting in September.

[360BakTrak]

Jersey........quite fancy a stint down there!:}

[TCAS FAN]

LN-ATC

It appears that you were ignored. In answer to your question, at the moment you would need to hold a UK ATCO licence. Your Norwegian licence may exempt you from some of the experience requirements, but you would probably need to sit the written and practical exams.

If you go onto the Safety Regulation Group website www.srg.caa.co.uk you should be able to find link to ATSSD, which is the regulator and they will be able to advise you on exactly what is required.

[Legs11]

You might well be correct. And he/she might well be starting in September

...'bout the same time as NATS then:ok: