Synchronising emails in Outlook Express

[Ausatco]

I hope someone can help me.

I have a notebook and a desktop each running WinXP, IE6, OE6 etc, all fully updated so program versions on both computers are the same. I use Outlook Express for my email on both, about equally. When they're both at home they are networked.

How can I synchronise my emails so that OE looks the same on both - folders, folder contents, address book, etc? There's a synchronise item in the Tools menu - it connects to the internet, goes too fast for me to see what it does and does I don't know what.

I have Office 97 on the desktop but not on the laptop as I don't need it there and don't want to waste hard drive space. BUT, would the Office 97 Briefcase on both computers be what I need?

Your help greatly appreciated.

AA

[spannersatcx]

you can export/import messages and address books, one is under tools - accounts the other is under file - export. I know it works as I just transferred all messages etc from my old pc to my new one.

[BOAC]

To make the laptop 'look like' the desktop, try copying your OE folder

(xxx : \ WINDOWS\(?PROFILES?\?fred?\Application Data\Identities\{qwerty999etc etc}

to the laptop and then ask OE there to use that folder. That should load up the same folders and emails at least. As for keeping them up to date, I don't know, other than leaving them on the server and downloading again?

[IFollowRoads]

What you can use is the Client Side Caching feature - this is definately part of XPPro, not sure about XPHome.
1 - get the file on the non-laptop to the state you want it, and delete the one on the laptop
2 -On your laptop, select the .pst file (or whatever it is you use to save the mail gubbins) on the other system , right click it, and select 'Make Available Offline'. If the option isn't there, control panel/folder options/Offline files/Enable Offline files, & enable the times you want to sync when the machines are connected.

You are always going to have a problem with this method if you download mails on both systems without syncing between downloads

hth

[Ausatco]

Thank you all, unfortunately no joy.

IFR, it appears the option you proposed is not available in XP Home. B u m m e r, it looked promising.

BOAC, your method would make OE contents on both computers identical, but would inevitably overwrite info rather than merge it. One could make the laptop use the OE folder on the desktop 'puter via the network, but that would only work if both were on and the network was up. If the laptop was off roaming somewhere it would have to use its own OE folder and then the emails, address book etc would be out of synch and hence back to the original problem. I might explore your suggestion of leaving messages on the server until both 'puters have them, but it's a bit manual and it wouldn't keep the address books synched - I'm trying to find something automatic and elegant, if you know what I mean. (No offence intended :O )

Spanners, the import and export options in tools-accounts only moves the account info, like servers, usernames, passwords, etc, not the folders, messages, etc. And the options under the File menu seem only to work if you are moving data between OE and Outlook on the same machine. ie OE on my laptop won't export across the network to Outlook on my other machine.

I suppose that's another option, install the full Outlook (I have an oldie, '97) on both machines - it's network ready, but it hogs disk space and resources and I'm trying to minimise the bloat factor, especially on the laptop and I'm not sure I wouldn't have the same problem anyway. Bit like driving a thumbtack with a sledgehammer, but if one must ... it might be worth a go.

Off to google for third party utilities - if you know of any I'd appreciate some pointers. Thanks again.

AA

[fobotcso]

Make sure all e-mails are left on the server for, say, at least 14 days so that you can receive all incoming on both computers.

Copy ALL outgoing e-mails that you send on either computer to yourself. Either to your own e-mail address or to another dedicated address. They'll come in when you receive them wherever you are.

Been doing it this way for years for the same reasons that you state. Works a treat.

[Ausatco]

I think I've figured it out, but it's neither automatic nor elegant - BOAC, take note :D

Spanners, you put me on the right track, I just didn't delve far enough into the import and export options to get past the first problem which is when you click on File|export|messages it will only export to a MAPI client on the same machine - Outlook or Microsoft Exchange. If you don't have one of those on that machine it won't work.

However, if you go to the other machine and select File|import|messages it is far more flexible and you can import from an OE6 store directory anywhere on the network. BOAC, you put me on the right track there, I would never have found the store location without the example in your post.

You have to decide on a machine to be the "master", the other will be the slave. There are no boxes to tick, this is in your head. I chose the desktop as master, notebook as slave. On the master machine import the messages (choose All Folders - it's one of the options in the dialogue) from the slave. On the slave, delete all folders and contents (some folders won't delete, so delete their contents.) Empty the Deleted Items folder. Now import all folders and messages from the master. Done!

You have to empty the slave after importing from it because if you don't, all its documents will be duplicated as copies come back from the master. The import process is not smart enough to recognise duplicates and deal with them.

Then you have to import and export the address book. Funnily enough, address book import is smart enough to recognise duplicate entries and asks you how to deal with them. First, on either machine export to a CSV file, then import on the other one. Then do it again, but swap the order of machines.

Like I said, not automatic, not elegant, but it works - nothing is simply overwritten, it is all merged and ends up the same on both machines.

fobotsco, I think your method would keep the Inboxes in synch, but I don't think it would deal with folders and folder contents that are different between machines, f'rinstance those that might have been created or changed on the notebook while it travelled.

Thanks for the tips, folks, you all helped get the grey matter churning.

AA

[BOAC]

neither automatic nor elegant - BOAC, take note

'Pleased to be of service', as the door in THHGTTG said.

Just didn't realise you had seen me walking around :ok:

Incidentally, when I am travelling, I do what fobotcso does, and forward to another email address from where I can pick-up at leisure, which avoids any getting inadvertently lost in the process you describe.

[Ausatco]

Yairsss ... welll ... ummmm.... There's a hole in my logic. And in my $%^^&* head :{

I have now discovered that my solution worked only because of a certain set of circumstances that existed when I did it, but no longer exist now - I won't bore you with another long post to explain.

It looks like fobotsco's method is the go - should have listened to an expert rather than try to reinvent the wheel.

If little Billy's boys 'n' girls would build some smarts into OE's import messages function so that existing messages were not duplicated (as per the import address book function), all would be well.

I will invite him to cocktails and suggest same.

Hope springs eternal in the human breast. :*

AA

[fobotcso]

I'll pass on being an expert but thanks anyway!

I set out to achieve exactly what Ausatco wanted some time ago but ran into all the difficulties that have been aired here. That's why I settled for the low-level agricultural method I now use.

Then I gave up trying to improve it. Isn't it always the case that we stop refining a system as soon as it becomes acceptable?!

The more sophisticated and automated a system, the more fragile, inflexible, and error prone it becomes. If you knew how, you could write a script to do all this, but there has to be a good measure of operator involvement to avoid the risk of over-writing new address books and folders with old ones.

So, it's easy to synchronise messages on the fly as we have agreed. It's actually not difficult to synchronise folders too using File Management techniques with Windows Explorer.

When both (or All) PCs are home on the Network do the following.

In Win 2000 and XP on the Master Machine go to:
C: \Documents and Settings\Administrator\Local Settings\Application Data\Identities\{.........}\Microsoft\Outlook Express; where the 32-bit string in the curly brackets is your Main Identity. The file "Folders.dbx" contains the info you need.
Copy this to the equivalent location on your "Slave" or Client (after backing up the existing one!). You'll over-write the existing Folders.dbx.

The next curious step is mandatory. Open OE; you'll see any new folders added to the list but the the corresponing files won't exist until you open them quickly and close them again.

So now you can do a bulk copy of all the files in your Master folder above to over-write any new empty files in the Slave(s).

Rules

If you make extensive use of Rules you can synchronise where all incoming messages go in normal use. But typing more than a few Rules into a succession of machines is very boring indeed.

Rules are held in two places in the Registry (Current User and Users). But you can't simply export the Rules keys from the Master Registry and import them directly into the Slave's Registry because the 32-bit identity strings will be different.

What you can do - and I think you only need to do this once to the "Current User" key is export the Master's Mail Rules keys and use Notepad (Wordwrap must be OFF) to substitute the foreign (Master Machine) identity string with the slave identity string. That only takes a moment. Then import the amended Registry key to the slave machine and the Rules are now identical to the Master's.

I know this is a bit geekish but it does get you what you wanted. Oh, and do back up all Registry Stuff before altering it!

After this, synchronising Address Books will be a doddle; just use Windows Explorer to over-write the Slaves' with the Master's. Its in "C: \Documents and Settings\Administrator\Application Data\Microsoft\Address Book".

[Ausatco]

fobotcso, you are too modest!

A further query ...

When you copy folders.dbx from master to slave, I can understand how blank documents in the slave's folder are filled from the master. But what about documents that already exist in both the slave and master from previous synchronisations - when you copy the folders.dbx file as above, are those existing documents duplicated? or overwritten? or ignored because they already exist?

Cheers

AA

[fobotcso]

:ok: from a :8 , Ausatco!

Transferring "folders.dbx" from Master to Slave doesn't copy any documents or data, only the names of folders that may contain data now or later. Remember that what looks like a folder in OE is, in reality, a file on your HD.

Specifically, my "folders.dbx" is 73KB in size and contains the names of over 200 folders. Some of these are sub-folders of other folders. This file never seems to change in size no matter how many other folders exist. (Win 2K and OE6)

F'rinstance, on my PC the "Computing.dbx" file is 260KB big. The "Microsoft.dbx" file is a "child" of this Computing file and is 4.5MB big! The presence and relationship of these files (seen as folders in OE) is recorded in the folders.dbx, so if you move folders around or create new ones they are remembered.

You'll never lose data by copying the folders.dbx file around. (But you could lose data by over-writing a data file with a file of the same name.) But, if the folders.dbx you copy from Master to Slave does not include the name of a file already on the Slave you will no longer see the data Folder in OE but it will still be safe on the Hard Disk.

Getting at it requires some more work in the engine room.

Open OE on the Slave and recreate the missing folder exactly as it was before. Let's say its called Microsoft. Open it (it'll be empty) and shut down OE. With Windows Explorer navigate to the Identity folder. You will now find Microsoft.dbx (which is the old data folder and it will be large). There will also be Microsoft (1).dbx and it'll be small. This is the new data file just created and the file that OE will look for when you open the Microsoft folder.

Make careful note of the exact name and delete it!

Rename the old Microsoft.dbx to be Microsoft (1).dbx.

Open OE and you will find all the e-mails you had in the Microsoft folder before on the slave.

Laborious, isn't it? And only suitable as a recover procedure, not on a regular basis.

Synchronising E-mails (or any databases) will always be a problem unless you are rigorous about which is Master and which is Slave or unless you are happy to tolerate duplicates for manual editing.

I wonder if I answered the question? Why not create a Test identity in OE on both PCs using copies of the files from Main Identity, create a few Test folders and play "what if"? No harm can come as long as you make a few notes as you go along and don't mix up the identities on the two PCs. You wouldn't wan't to delete important stuff now, would you?

Cheers, fob. :D

[Mac the Knife]

This http://www.pumatech.com/is_desktop_main.html will also synch different OL folders as well as PDA's. $70 please Sir.

[Ausatco]

and others. Thanks for all your help. My needs, while relatively pressing for me, are, in the great scheme of things, pretty simple. Now that I have my folders copied across both computers I think I'll use fobotcso's simple method of keeping the inboxes in synch - ie leave messages on the server until both computers have picked them all up. A bit manual but it suits my purposes.

I liked the look of that prog, Mac, but $70 dollars in SPP (South Pacific Peso) terms is too much for this koala to bear. I did a bit of a search for a shareware or free mail synchroniser, but no luck.

Sorry for the tardy reply. About a week ago this list of things to do just appeared, stuck on the fridge door ...

AA

[fobotcso]

Ausatco, you're welcome.

When you get to the bottom of that list on your fridge door, there's one on mine that needs looking into. :(