cheapest way to become a JAR flight instructor

[733driver]

Hi everyone,

could anyone help me with the following:

I am looking for the least expensive way to become a JAR flight instructor (PPL).

I do have a german ATPL (soon JAR).

What are the requirements, training and costs?

Any help would be much appreciated. JARs have just come in efffect in Germany a few days ago and the FTOs I have asked couldn´t come up with satisfactory answers.

Thanks and Cheers

[mad_jock]

The current going rate in the UK is about 5K sterling. But it is a long course, 4 weeks plus

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/175/Lasors_Section_H.pdf

The link above contains the info in a book called LASOR's which is the CAA's prefered method of talking to its customers.

MJ

[jamup]

Hey guys does anybody know whI have a NZ CPL/TWIN IR how can convert this to JAR and Work as an Instrcutor in Uk , the cheapest way , I have 150 PIC and the Twin rating ,, Do I have to do the JAR CPL or the JAR ATPL

Please let me know

Thanks
#JAM

[733driver]

mad_jock,

thank you! Very good link, much better than what I could find on the lba website (german CAA).

5K sterling is quite expensive though, I think.

Used to be around 3000 Euros in Germany before JAR.

Thanks again and safe flying

[BEagle]

jamup - the words 'cheap' and 'JAR' rarely appear together!

First you'll need a JAR-FCL CPL(A) if you want to be paid as a Flight Instructor. That will be quite expensive and you'll have to sit a fair few exams as well; most people don't bother with the CPL level exams, they take the ATPL(A) exams and achieve a CPL(A) with ATPL knowledge. But the ATPL theory credit dies if you don't also obtain a JAR-FCL IR(A) within 36 months of passing the exams....

Once you've obtained a CPL, you'll have to attend a JAR-FCL Flight Instructor course as described in this thread. But should you wish to teach on ME aircraft, things become even more expensive. There is far less demand in the UK now for ME ratings except for a few private owners and the training schools. The old 'Group B' PPL was much cheaper to maintain, a PPL with MEP Class Rating is far more expensive to maintain.

Don't forget that there is currently a surfeit of FIs in the UK looking for work, so even when you've achieved all your licences and ratings, you'll have to join the queue........

[jamup]

HI

But what about instructing with a JAR PPL and the JAR CPL theory . I have a JAR PPL and a ICAO CPL/Twin/IR , and I recently saw at LASORS website. can u clarify this to me please I even have 150 PIC

[BEagle]

Yes, you could instruct with a JAR-FCL PPL(A) - but not for money.

You will need:-

1. To hold a JAR-FCL PPL(A) with SEP Class Rating;

2. To have passed all the JAR-FCL CPL(A) examinations;

3. To have at least 200 hrs TT on aeroplanes, of which at least 150 hours are as P1C (if you only have a JAR-FCL PPL(A));

4. To have completed at least 30 hours on SEP aeroplanes of which at least 5 hours shall be in the 6 months preceding the FI course pre-entry flight test;

5. To have received at least 10 hours of Instructional IF (not more than 5 in a FNPT or approved flight simulator);

6. At least 20 hours of cross-country flight as P1C of aeroplanes,, including a cross-country flight of at least 300 nm including 2 intermedate landings at aerodromes different to that of departure

7. To pass a specific pre-entry flight test within the 6months preceding the start of the course.

The FI course itself will equip you to give unremunerated day VFR training only at PPL(A) level with supervisory restrictions. You will need to fly at least 30 hours of instruction, complete 125 hours of ground instruction with 7 progress tests and then pass the FI Skill Test. Later you will need to upgrade from FI(R) to FI - this will mean another test. You will also need other courses and tests if you wish to remove the 'no applied instrument' and 'no aerobatic instruction' restrictions from your FI rating. All this will cost a fair bit - so how would you ever recover your costs without being paid for giving instruction?

[mad_jock]

733Driver

How are people taking the JAR change in Germany?

I was flying out of Aachen (Westflug) and the local PPL's seemed quite put out out that under JAR I didn't need to upgrade my PPL to fly in controlled airspace etc. And i seem to remember that to keep your license up to date it was quite abit more than 12hours in the second year etc.

MJ

[2003-EAGLE]

Hi everyone

The cheapest is not always the best option. Quality is essential, so you have to look for the best rate.

I work as a FI in Spain, and JAR have been adopted since June 2001, you might want to check out the prices here.

I think obtaining the FI rating is a good option, that's why I did it, but it's not only to build time, you need to like it. ;)

Good luck to you all!
:ok:

[733driver]

mad_jock,

funny, you flew from Aachen. I know the the airfield, even got an hour of instruction in a warrior once to fly a few circuits after years of flying only the Boeing. Quite interesting...;)

It´s true, under the national rules you had to ad a so called CVFR rating to your PPL to legally fly in class C airspace.

That has changed know that the JARs are in effect I think. I am not up to speed on JAR FCL though. I still fly with my national ATPL and it will be converted to a JAR ATPL when it´s due for renewal.

It used to be 24 hours within 24 months to get your PPL renewed. I understand that has changed to a certain amount of sectors (T/Os and landings) now. I am not to worried about that, though, since my company deals with the authorities for me.

I think even the FTOs here in Germany don´t have all the relevant information on JAR FCL, yet. After all , it has only been here for nine days now!

Do you plan on coming to Aachen again in the future? If so, let me know!

Cheers


2003-EAGLE,

thanks for that! Do you know of a good place in spain? Any contact details. Close to Malaga would be ideal. I can get there very inexpensive.

You are right, teaching just to build hours is not enough. I am more interested in flying some real airplanes again, get a chance to brush up my own basic flying skills and knowledge, and of course in teaching people to fly!


Thank you for your help! Save flying!

[mad_jock]

:D 733

I am a poorly payed FI at the moment so i don't plan to visit Aachen this year. Great place though. The Guiness House proberly still has alot of my CD's of Celtic music playing.
Deaf Shepard was a fav. Might try and get over for the Christmas Market

Do D-ENEU or D-ENHK feature in your log book?

I was just after doing my PPL in the states and was crap.
It was a comedy of errors the Chief pilot of Westflug teaching me to fly. I don't know who was worse my german or his english. Although the tower gave a good translation service ;)

MJ

[justanotherflyer]

2003-EAGLE:

What' the FI market like in Spain at the moment? For an English/Spanish speaker, CPL ME/IR with an unrestricted FI...

[2engop]

Are you sure you need to do all the CPL exams to obtain a JAR CPL from a Kiwi CPL? I know a couple of Aussies who got there JAR ATPL just by doing the law exam (they had Aussie ATPL).

[BEagle]

There are exceptions to the normal requirements for pilots holding non-JAA ATPL(A)s who have over 3000 hours flying experience as pilot of public transport aircraft over 30 tonnes MTWA on scheduled international routes, including a minimum of 1500 hours as P1C (Captain). Those who believe that they qualify should write to the CAA Personnel Licensing Department for a formal written assessment. They must complete form JAR-FCL 680, enclose their logbooks, non-UK licence and validating medical certificates.........and, of course, pay the relevant fee!