Flyer forum troll [Archive]

AliB

1st Feb 2003, 15:48

Thanks to "moderation" I think it may be safe to discuss this here.

I used to enjoy reading and posting to both the Flyer and PPRUNE private flying forums - but a troll (I am pretty sure it is all the same guy) has made a mess of Flyer over the last week or so.

So, to those who are also fans of both forums (forii?) - what shall we do?

I favour ignoring everything the silly boy says (even the apparently sensible things) and waiting until he gets bored - but that will only work if the majority of posters do it, which seems unlikely.

The alternative is to pack up shop and come over here permenantly - it is fairly quiete over here sometimes compared to Flyer, but if we all come, and the (apparantly very good) moderation keeps the trolls out, maybe that is best for all.

Thoughts? If the main posters to Flyer can discuss and come to an agreement here we can then post our decision on Flyer and implement it.

Should I post to Flyer pointing people in the direction of this thread - or (mr moderator) is that too risky for this forum (again - I suspect that this is an ex pprune troll who got booted out).

:confused:

AliB

28thJuly2001

1st Feb 2003, 15:57

I vote ignore him/her/it.
They soon get bored and move onto the trainspotters forum within a week or two.
So my vote goes IGNORE.
I enjoyed the thread about flying with a road map and drawing in the airports and CAS, he may be a troll, but he had me chuckling.
28th,,

Vizsla

1st Feb 2003, 15:58

Dont you think you can sort it out yourself? I have looked at Pilot & Flyer forums occasionally and the topics seem very nieve and might annoy some of the old timers here

Keef

1st Feb 2003, 16:44

The troll is on the Flyer Forums. He thinks he can't be traced - and is probably in for a nasty surprise.

The last serious troll attack I was involved in came from a misguided youth who thought he couldn't be traced. He was traced, and bitterly regretted his trolling.

Leave it to the admin folks at Flyer Forums. Ignore the troll, and above all don't feed it.

BRL

1st Feb 2003, 16:51

Hi ALiB. I don't think its a good idea to get them all 'over here'. We are not here to compete, far from it and I reckon most post on both sites anyway. Don't let the troll put you off though, the Flyer forums are alright at the end of the day.

As for the troll, just simply ignore them. That really works well. they want attention and when they don't get it they eventually go away. When you see the name just ignore it or read something else, don't make a fuss and they will soon get bored and go away, I assure you of that.

Give me some details, e-mail me with the name(s) and I will have a word with Nick Wall (Flyer Ed) and he can get onto it. :)

AliB

1st Feb 2003, 17:53

Thanks BRL,

I'll stick with the Flyer forum and hope that others catch on to the "ignore" idea. My hope with posting here is to advertise that policy and hasten the retreat of the trolls.

Vizsla - I hope we can sort it out ourselves too. My hope was that other Flyer posters could have a quiet discussion of the matter here and agree to ignore the troll - at the moment he is getting too much "food". I agree that Flyer attracts the less experianced PPLs. Perhaps their questions are naiive, but it is good that they have a place they can feel confidant to post "silly" questions and (usually) get reasonable replies - so I think that Flyer compliments pprune rather than competes with it. As the saying (and a recent Flyer post) goes - there are no stupid questions, just stupid answers.

Here's hoping that the adults on Flyer catch on to the idea that the best way to treat attention seaking children is to ignore them. :)

AliB

Speedbird252

1st Feb 2003, 20:10

Hey, AliB, whay do you assume that the Flyer forums attract less experienced PPL`s that feel more comfortable asking naive questions?

You say that they feel more confident in posting silly questions?

That is total ar$e mate.

The Flyer forum is full of experienced and not so experienced pilots all willing to offer advice based on practical experience, which is worth its weight in Gold for the up and coming, and experienced PPL`er.

Im sure we can solve this, maybe ill mail IanS and se id he cant block the user ID. I dunno, but I agree it is a problem.

Will you PM me and make sure we are talking about the same `arry?

Cheers, Speedy

;)

Kingy

1st Feb 2003, 20:34

Chaps,

Not wishing to appear stupid but... What is a troll? and how is a troll harmful to the board?

Kingy :O

28thJuly2001

1st Feb 2003, 22:53

A troll is someone who has no interest in the subject matter being discussed but tries to gain a reaction from the contributors by being abusive.
They also ask absurd questions and hope well meaning individuals will answer thus making themselves look a tw*t.
Re: My comments about using a road map to navigate.
They also change identities after a while and then continue to be a pain in the nether regions.
The trolls occupying the Flyer forum at the moment are particulary annoying because they APPEAR to be pilots and are slagging off anyone who posts a sensible answer to a question.
28th,,

Mr Wolfie

2nd Feb 2003, 07:49

The guy on the Flyer Forum may be a troll, but at least he has the virtue of of a modicum of wit. I agree with 28th's earlier post, and admit that the thread instigated by the troll about navigation using a road map had me smirking too.

When his various alter-egos started debating the virtues of saving money by either using an AA map and annotating by hand airfields, CAS, VORS, etc., or drawing your own chart from scratch, or cutting out all the various snippets of CAA charts in Flyer and Pilot articles and glueing them all together, my smirk turned to a chuckle.

He may be an idiot with too much time on his hands, but from my brief scan through his posts he seems pretty harmless (and compared to most trolls, pretty polite too - no specific abusing of other posters that I can recall).

If he is winding you up - ignore him, & like others have said he will soon get bored of chatting to no-one except his own aliases.

Mr. W

Davidt

2nd Feb 2003, 10:26

I took the road map post as a practical joke as such it worked well ,provided light relief for many and harmed none.

If the troll continues with witty original posts let him carry on.

The worst aspect of all these boards is the bitching that sometimes ensues. ban bitching keep the good natured banter and exchange of info!

Rattus

2nd Feb 2003, 13:02

When, at the age of about 7, I first read The Hobbit, I was petrified (if you'll forgive the pun) when the troll appeared.

Then, a few pages later, I discovered his name was Bill Huggins :} and he somehow didn't seem so terrifying. :p

Rattus

AliB

2nd Feb 2003, 15:20

Wolfie, DavidT,

If it was just the clearly spoof threads I would not mind either. But he has picked up on several regulars and thrown abuse at them (not me - so this is not a personal thing). Also the posts to threads they dont initiate are clearly designed to annoy the regulars, trigger arguments and generally disrupt the forum. If this was going on when I first came across the forum I would have moved on immediately - which is the main concern. Despite some of his accusations we don't want Flyer to be a clique and this sort of thing is just going to put new people off.

Speedbird,

I believe Flyer is a little less intimidating than pprune to new PPLs - maybe I havn't been concentrating but I think there is a higher percentage of new blood over there than here. No offence to PPRUNE intended - the first P I suspect puts a lot of PPLs off looking further - if they discover this group and read it a bit I am sure they would feel just as confidant posting "silly questions" here as on Flyer.

Maybe if it goes on for much longer I will collect together a few usernames and send them to Flyer, you and BRL - then again, I dont think that will work. Flyer is not rigidly controlled, and although I am sure they could bar the exisiting usernames it would be too easy for him to create new ones. I fear that would just provide him with the attention he clearly craves.

"Ignore him" is good advice - it does seem to be working too. He seems to have taken to replying to his own posts under alternative usernames - hopefully boredom follows desperation...

(Trying to stay cool and not let this guy wind me up... :cool: )

AliB

28thJuly2001

2nd Feb 2003, 16:12

The troll even quoted one of my posts from Pprune.
I don't know whether to be honoured or annoyed.
I feel we may have played into his hands because not only are we talking about it on the Flyer forum, we are discussing it here.

Now everyone say after me....
"I (insert name) hereby pledge to ignore any troll on Pprune and Flyer. I will understand that the person/s is/are mentally challenged and answering or discussing them only encourages more flames and does not a good forum make".

Right thats that done...now a question....ummmmmm
"Why are fuel gauges in light aircraft crap?. I mean, in my car I can judge when I am running out to the nearest mile, but in my plane I dont even look at the gauge cos it's so unreliable"
28th,,

Speedbird252

2nd Feb 2003, 17:17

I agree with all you say AliB, its a tough one and its difficult to know what to do.

Mass ignorance may be the order of the day!

Let me know if ya come up with anything,

:cool:

Gerry Actrick

2nd Feb 2003, 19:11

Don't get uptight. One man's troll is another man's etc. etc
What Keef said is correct, and should be remembered by said troll - it's not hard to trace people.
Gerry

ps - what's wrong with road maps?

28thJuly2001

2nd Feb 2003, 19:16

trace him and do what?.....although I am not condoning the trolls who get up everyones noses exactly what law has he broken?
As far as I know it is not against the law to be an annoying git.
DOH!!!
I said I wasn't going to get involved anymore.
28th,,
p.s. There is nothing wrong with road maps, as long as you use them whilst in your car.

GRP

2nd Feb 2003, 19:29

Somebody pointed out quite correctly over in the Flyer forum that most pilots flying in the French Alps do indeed seem to use a road map of the area for flying. The road maps have all the topographical information you need as well as showing the roads (funnily enough) which are quite handy for navigation round there! Having flown around the area a bit last year I can attest to this, and invested in a road map of the appropriate scale myself for that very purpose. Naturally, the aeronautical chart needs to be somewhere to hand as well! I went flying with a local from Megeve and was initially quite surprised when he pulled out his Michelin map.

Graham

28thJuly2001

2nd Feb 2003, 20:03

.....enough already.....
That's it,,, I am going to fly from Cardiff to Biggin Hill using my A-Z and if I infringe controlled airspace, danger areas or other assorted horrors I am going to tell the authorities that it must be ok cos they do it in the SODDING French Alps ..aaaarrrrgggghhh.
28th,,

QDMQDMQDM

2nd Feb 2003, 20:08

Once I was responsible for managing a message board system a bit like pprune. The reality is that these things will always occur on an unmoderated board, along with flame wars and the like. Encouraging mass ignoring is probably your best bet if you can't interest the people responsible for the forum to get involved and do a bit of banning and warning off (not necessarily in that order).

Failing that, you'd better come here where Miss Whiplash (aka BRL) rules us with a rod of iron. It hurts, but we love it!

QDM

Timothy

2nd Feb 2003, 20:38

Is it not ironic (and predictable) that the discussion about road maps has found its way here.

Was that the original intention?

W

Gerry Actrick

2nd Feb 2003, 21:00

Think it was about people getting uptight about things -
(The french also tend to write road numbers so they can be seen from above.)

For those of us who look out at the ground, things like roads are useful.
Gerry

Rod1

3rd Feb 2003, 10:24

Nick W has started taking action against the Troll.

You can all come back now!

Rod

BlueRobin

3rd Feb 2003, 11:54

Rod - what type of action (beside sticking a warning msg up)? WHatever it is, I hope it's very pro-active.

poetpilot

3rd Feb 2003, 12:58

Speaking as one of the "abused" I can tell you that some of the really nasty posts have been wiped. That started when I took the advice (which I should have done it earlier) and started to ignore him. But they were nasty.

I don't particularly care, I'm cool about it underneath and maintain a very low blood pressure.

What p's me off is the impression it gives to newbies. The regulars know each other and we generally know who we are, what experience we do or don't have, what our viewpoints are, etc. But the forum has never been a clique as such. If it's guilty of anything it's guilty of giving advice, opinions and experience, but in that respect it doesnt differ from pprune, and to an extent the two complement each other.

I do sincerely apologise to the real aviation community if my responses made it worse.

BRL

3rd Feb 2003, 13:32

A simple I.P address search will reveal very little about the person but what you can do then is barr the last couple of numbers in the I.P. address so that it can't access the site. Full barring won't work as the I.P address is probably shared.
Best advice though is simply ignore them, its really that effective.

As for it being discussed on here, I can't imagine anything sadder then some donut sitting there at home thinking "WOW, they are talking about me on pprune now......" :yuk:

BlueRobin

4th Feb 2003, 14:25

Still continuing... :(

Am I wrong in thinking this "proxy.aol.com" user has been banned from pprune and now, as it's an easy target, is trolling the FLYER forum?

BRL

4th Feb 2003, 14:36

Bluerobin I have not banned anyone (yet) with an AOL I.P from this forum. I can look at the banned list and see if its anyone been done recently but its been very quiet on the banning front(On all forums). I will look into it and see what I can find out. :)

Bootlegger

4th Feb 2003, 15:07

Just laughed my head off at the comment " cutting charts out of magazine"...........( it is funny, isn't it?? ).well i think so :D

Rod1

4th Feb 2003, 15:17

Capt PPRuNe posted the following on the FLYER forum

________________________________________________

FYI, it is possible to get the immature trolls off the forum. I have done it with kids who thought it was fun to do a similar thing on PPRuNe.

In an attempt to assist Flyer I have advised them on how to deal with the problem. It is not instantaneous and can take some time but they are eventually dealt with.

What happens is that the IP address is traced back to the ISP and a message is sent to the ISP's abuse department with a copy of the server logs and a description of the behaviour and any rule breaking. They then can identify the user and pass on a warning on our behalf. If the offender persists then their account can be terminated. If this happens a few times they will soon give up.

This method does not require any court orders and will cause a lot of bother for the offender. I have advised that this is started here in order to put a stop to this kind of childish behaviour.

_____________________________________________

As someone who uses both PPRuNe and FLYER I would like to thank him for his help.

Rod

28thJuly2001

6th Feb 2003, 09:37

Have you been over to the Flyer forum lately?
It is now totally unusuable and it looks like the trolls have won. Tried the ignore tactic but it is filled with troll's egging on troll's and more change of identities than you can shake a stick at.

28th,,

poetpilot

6th Feb 2003, 13:53

maggioneato

6th Feb 2003, 13:57

28th. Have just come over from there, I am one of the regular browsers there, and here. I did think the maps thread was funny,but the site is now unusable,would have thought these guys could have passed on some of their aviation knowledge instead of being a pest. I have a good sense of humour, but it's not funny any more.:(