View Full Version : Virgin Blue Pacific

Sweet N Innocent
12th Jan 2003, 12:21
Could it be that there are 3 767-300's on the ground over N America way all sporting Virgin Blue
It seems a passenger who had flown from Vancouver connecting with a DJ flight in Sydney saw these Beauties with her very own eyes.
Does anyone care to confirm/deny?

12th Jan 2003, 13:27

Not wanting to start anything here by any means, but this 'passenger', does she know the difference between Boeings? Could of it been 737's that she saw? Just curious. I'm led to believe if/when "Pacific" gets up and running, a revised livery would be applied anyway.

12th Jan 2003, 20:06
This is the second time Vancouver has come up in relation to Virgin Blue... Very interesting....

I'd like to know more.

However 767-300 surprises me. You sure it wasn't 737-300s or even 737-700s?

13th Jan 2003, 02:28
dj has three more HGW -700s on order for delivery in the next couple of months so i suspect it may have been these aircraft that our "spotter" saw, 767-300s for dj? i think not, this would go against all that dj stands for, quick turnarounds and high frequency services especially, i believe when dj does go intl that the '73 will be the aircraft of choice....

request deferred
13th Jan 2003, 05:54
Quick, thirty minute turnarounds and high frequency are not the highest priority of medium-haul tourist class airlines.

Lots of bums on seats and an aircraft that can take lots of palletised freight is much more important i.e. the 767-200/300 is better suited than a 737 with manual 'chuck the bags in' cargo hold and a relatively small amount of seats....Seems to be working just fine for the Ochra folk at Australian Airlines

13th Jan 2003, 08:39
yes, good point, though the 737-700/800 would be ideal out of east coast ports to pacific destinations for dj, they haven't even decided where they are flying too yet and will probably not happen till 3rd quarter of this year at the earliest, why would they have 3 767's painted up sitting in Vancouver???? i don't think these aircraft are 767's....

14th Jan 2003, 02:33
Who says they haven't decided.........;)

Expect announcement any day regarding their first destination, and also new Aircraft orders. :D

Sweet N Innocent
14th Jan 2003, 10:02
It's quite possible the passenger may not know the difference between a 76 and a 73.
However in terms of livery, the aircraft was described to look identical to Virgin Blue with Pacific
emblazoned on it...
After reading the last reply, I'm looking forward to the announcement date... ;)

14th Jan 2003, 23:56
If there is an announcement soon, it's been a long time coming. I thought the second coming of the Lord might have happened sooner actually. Godfrey has been a little quiet lately. Maybe VB or VP are going to launch the 737-900X??? :D Steal QF's thunder.

Kwaj mate
15th Jan 2003, 01:04
Even DJ should know that bilateral treaties dictate traffic rights for international & regional services.
Interestingly enough they wrote to regional Pacific countries asking if they wanted DJ to fly into their own back yard - and at whose expense. Their own national carrier would be the first to feel the effects of DJ’s arrival.
They should be checking with the DoT&RS/IASC in Canberra to see where open skies agreements are in place (USA & SIN) &/or what shelf capacity is available for their use.

15th Jan 2003, 01:04
Well if VB want to go to Singapore and Hong Kong, they're going to need something bigger than the 737. A 767 or 757 would be ideal!

As for the -900, one of the problems being encountered is that it's still single aisle and with more pax than the 800 it obviously increases turnaround times with the unloading and loading of pax. If the 2nd fwd door was utilised it then hardly beats the 800 for capacity, and the 800 also has greater range anyway! Not the ideal aircraft for domestic ops when compared with the 800!

15th Jan 2003, 01:37
I could tell you all ;) however then I would have to kill you :eek: and I wouldn't like to do that. :D

Expect BIG announcement very soon. :D

15th Jan 2003, 02:41
Will be interesting to see the 'network' announced prior to the float.

15th Jan 2003, 03:18
Obviously....... :D

But wrong. ;)

15th Jan 2003, 09:38
Come on Air Support, you tease. Tell us something. We wont tell anyone
Check out the company's register and find that Pacific Blue Airlines has just been registered with HQ in Brisbane.
Interesting times ahead.

15th Jan 2003, 12:04
Pacific Blue Airlines was registered as a company on 05/09/01 so its not quite a recent registration.
Does VS have traffic rights between KUL/HKG and AUS?

15th Jan 2003, 14:48
HGW yep can confirm Pacific Blue is looking very promising!!!! They don't want Virgin in the name....

Airsupport.... u know what I know ;) Fleet announcement very very soon and 1st INTL destination...

clue: lets say you can get there with a 737 from the east-coast....

CASA Proposal currently being written!

ETOPS proposal already complete and presented to CASA!!

15th Jan 2003, 20:15
Big clue....... :rolleyes:

Obviously a B737 couldn't make it from the west coast to (you and I know where). ;) :D

15th Jan 2003, 20:19
Look for flights to Fiji. And if you want proof, why are Virgin now rabbiting on about Air Pacific?

15th Jan 2003, 22:23
Virgin will make their fleet announcement @ 11am today in T2 @ Sydney.
Only 30mins to go !:D :D

16th Jan 2003, 01:29
Dow Jones

Virgin Blue: Plans Overseas Flights By End 2003 -2

SYDNEY -(Dow Jones)- Virgin Blue Chief Executive Brett Godfrey said Thursday the no-frills airline will start international services from Australia by the end of calendar 2003.

Services are most likely to be to the South Pacific, with possible destinations including Fiji and Samoa, he told reporters.

Godfrey also hopes to start services to Southeast Asia.

Earlier Thursday, Virgin Blue announced it will acquire up 50 new Boeing 737 aircraft, worth as much as A$5.4 billion.

16th Jan 2003, 02:38
Well, I understand that it is no longer a secret, I certainly hope not. ;)

The first destination will be Fiji. :D

Plus of course the massive new order for Boeings, not Airbuses. :D

AViON calling!!
16th Jan 2003, 04:08
Interesting to read here that a couple of B767's painted in DJ livery were seen in Vancouver, supposedly awaiting to be delivered to Australia. Do the crew know?
Surely someone must have been rostered for training on the new type by now or is this another "big secret" that no one is talking about and the cabin crew are now trained and pilots upgraded or hired, I think not. And correct me if I am wrong but I really cant see an operation like DJ having a couple of idle a/c sitting around doing nothing waiting for crew to be endorsed. Aircraft on the ground is lost money, as we all know.

Will DJ operate their new regional pacific flights with the domestic crew they now have or will they recruit new crew for international operations only? With the short flying times to these destinations (Fiji etc) does anyone know if the crew will be overnighting? I wouldn't think so. Just asking.

16th Jan 2003, 05:15
Looks like exciting times ahead for all concerned! I wonder if it will be a seperate low cost international operation?

Enurpp - "ETOPS proposal already complete and presented to CASA!!"

Enurpp was the proposal based on a 60 min single engine cruise speed (CAO 20.7.1b / 13.4 "c") or "specific ETOPS as approved by the authority (CAO 20.7.1B / 13.6)". If so what time limit is proposed?

I know this may be dated reference material! Will go and look on the CASA web site shortly.



16th Jan 2003, 12:24
Servo it was for 90mins..

Fiji is no.1 due no ETOPs required (apart from normal 60mins) .. due Noumea and Vila en-route.

16th Jan 2003, 16:08
servo, BNE-NAN can be done non-etops with NOU, or NLK and VLI with a dog-leg if NOU is unsuitable on the day. With NOU you dont need VLI, nor would VLI be my first choice as an en-route airfield.

17th Jan 2003, 00:31
Straight from the DJ website.............

Virgin Blue's Going Boeing
$5.4-Billion For up to 50 New Aircraft

Australia’s only low fare airline Virgin Blue, has announced it has signed a major contract with US-based Boeing Commercial Airplanes for up to 50 brand new 737 Next Generation aircraft.

The order now positions the carrier as one of the world’s largest low-fare airlines and also cements Virgin Blue as the operator of the youngest fleet of aircraft in the Asia Pacific region, if not globally.

Virgin Blue has spent the past ten months in tense negotiations with exacting expectations of both major aircraft manufacturers.

Chief Executive, Brett Godfrey said, “We set out almost a year ago to buy our new aircraft needed to continue our value based strategy and the reason it took so long is because we weren’t prepared to compromise until we got what we wanted. The three biggest factors were obviously cost, quality and reliability and we were unwavering in our commitment to ensuring we could maintain our position as Australia’s low fare leader.”

“The Boeing team worked tirelessly to put together an outstanding offer and this order is a win for us, it’s a win for Boeing but most importantly, it’s a win for Australian travellers who will have even further proof that flying on brand new state-of-the-art aircraft does not mean higher fares.”

The deal gives Virgin Blue 50 aircraft purchase rights, ten of which have just been converted to firm orders for 737-800 aircraft. All ten will be delivered by August 2004 taking the Virgin Blue fleet size to 40.

The remaining 40 purchase rights will position Virgin Blue to seize new domestic and international growth opportunities and also allow for older aircraft “swap-outs” to ensure Virgin Blue maintains its youngest possible fleet.

Jim Belz, International Sales Director for Boeing Commercial Airplanes, said, “As anyone who has dealt with them knows, Virgin Blue has some of the most accomplished negotiators around and they worked us hard to ensure their airline has the ability to continue being a low fare leader. We’re very pleased to be a continuing part of Virgin Blue’s success.”

It’s the first time the airline has purchased aircraft instead of leasing with pre-delivery finance secured from WestLB and Hamburgische Landesbank, building on the existing relationship between Virgin Blue and WestLB leasing company Boullioun Aviation.

Brett Godfrey continued, “When there’s well over $5-billion on the table, you aren’t talking about play money. This is a massive investment and a major milestone for Virgin Blue and it gives a clear indication of our bold future expansion plans.”

“Obviously one of the big moves this year will be the launch of international services and the 737-800 aircraft will have regional Pacific capabilities so that the only differences between us and the competition will be our lower fares and of course our fantastic service.”

The new aircraft will feature the latest in liquid crystal cockpit displays, distinctive 2m high range-enhancing winglets and will be capable of flying non-stop from Australia to destinations such as Singapore and Samoa.

The aircraft order propels Virgin Blue into the top half dozen low fare carriers in the world in terms of fleet size, alongside the likes of Ryanair, easyJet, JetBlue and WestJet.

“We don’t think that’s too shabby for an airline that isn’t yet even three years old and we will continue our foray in to new domestic and international markets to allow even more people to take advantage of our affordable and fun flying alternative,” finished Brett Godfrey.

Fast Facts

10 of 50 purchase rights converted to firm order for new 737-800 high gross weight aircraft direct from Boeing to be delivered within a twelve month period from August 2003
These aircraft will take the company’s fleet to 40
Further purchase rights for up to an additional 40 737NG aircraft over the next 10 years with choice of 737-700, 800 and 900X aircraft at Virgin Blue’s discretion
Maximum take off weight 79 tonnes, CFM56-7B26 engines with 26,000 pounds of thrust
Performance enhancing winglets
The 737-800 will have 180-seat configuration with all leather seats.
Capable of regional Pacific flight duration
Max gross contract value should all purchase rights be executed of US$3.1billion, which equates to approximately AU$5.4 billion based on current exchange rates.
Virgin Blue is already one of the top 10 737NG operators by aircraft number in the world and is now also one of the 6 largest low fare airlines in the world.
WestLB and Hamburgische Landesbank will provide the pre-delivery finance after Virgin Blue’s first foray into the debt market.
Virgin Blue expects to obtain long-term finance from the commercial debt market, including the support of the US Export Import Bank in the near future.

17th Jan 2003, 01:28
Yes Liquid and all very well but does it leave the company in a position to improve the wages/conditions for pilots???

50 Cal
17th Jan 2003, 02:36
more to the point...when the hell are they going to put in visual [ movie screens not the girls!!] entertainment.

Surely that would have to be a priority. SYD to PERTH....It would drive me crazy without a movie or something!!:D :D

17th Jan 2003, 02:39

Hope so. For everyones sake - including QF drivers.:)

17th Jan 2003, 02:49
Fri "West Australian"

Virgin Blue puts on full throttle
By Geoffrey Thomas

VIRGIN Blue has announced massive expansion plans with an order for up to 50 Boeing 737s worth $5.4 billion at list prices.

Analysts are tipping more intense fare wars as Virgin Blue strives to double its market share and Qantas defends its turf.

The first part of the order for 10 Boeing 737-800s will be delivered between August this year and March next year and will be configured with extra leg room for east-west flights.

Speaking in Sydney yesterday, Virgin Blue chief executive Brett Godfrey said the new aircraft would also be used for Virgin Blue's first international flights to be launched later this year.

The new 737s will be able to fly to Bali, Fiji, New Zealand, Singapore and Samoa. On Virgin Blue's radar are Perth-Bali, Sydney-Melbourne-Singapore, Sydney-Fiji as well as New Zealand flights.

Virgin Blue will convert the additional 40 options to firm orders over the next eight years but insiders say those aircraft will be all in the airline's fleet within five years. The 50 aircraft will take Virgin Blue's fleet to 80 737s.

Aviation analysts believe Virgin Blue will take delivery of about 10 new aircraft each year. The order ends a 10-month evaluation which pitted the Airbus A320 against the 737, which was already in the Virgin Blue's fleet.

Virgin Blue extracted an extremely good deal from Boeing, which has suffered many cancellations in orders in the wake of September 11 terrorist attacks.

"This is the best deal I have ever seen, which is great for our passengers," Mr Godfrey said.

Virgin Blue may also opt for an even bigger model. "We are looking at the 737-900X which can seat over 200 passengers," he said.

The order now sets the stage for an intense battle for market share as Qantas Airways introduces the new 300-seat A330 on Australian routes this month.

Qantas has said it will defend its market share of over 70 per cent while Virgin Blue has made no secret that it wants to double its current market share of about 20 per cent.

Those conflicting goals will mean even lower fares for passengers, analysts say.

In stark contrast to the Ansett fleet which was for the most part well over 10 years with some aircraft 20 years old, the Virgin Blue fleet, with the new aircraft, will be no more than three years old.

"This order is a win for the Australian travellers who will have further proof that flying on brand new state-of-the-art aircraft does not mean higher fares," Mr Godfrey said. "This 737-800 is a superb aircraft and the most modern in Australia."

The order also clears the way for a public offering of shares in Virgin Blue. While Mr Godfrey would not set an exact timetable, it is understood that an offering will be made in the first half of the year.

Virgin Blue is to acquire the planes, not lease them as it has done in the past, with $20 million of its funds and a further $200 million supplied by a syndication of banks.

The balance of the money will be sourced from the Export-Import Bank of the US.

Sir Richard Branson, through his Virgin group of companies, has a half share in Virgin Blue with Chris Corrigan's Patrick Corp holding the other half.