Virgin Atlantic will be recruiting

[DeltaT]

From their web site:

Recruitment Plans

We are looking to begin recruiting for First Officers in the New Year. Our minimum requirements will be: at least 2500-3000 hours total time - this should include at least 1500 hours commercial jet time for those coming from a commercial background. Candidates should also have a full UK or JAR ATPL and the right to live and work in the EU.

[Dan Winterland]

This isn't recent news. Interviews have been going on for about a month now, the first 'post9/11' course starts monday.

[tailscrape]

Dan,

Not that I find this subject of great interest, and indeed I will not be applying....but it probably is GOOD news in the bigger scheme of things.

If you want to work for Virgin that is. Otherwise you probably won't care less. Like me. And you. Probably.

[citadel]

Definitely a bit of Animal Farm going on. I know of at least one guy with the right 'type rating' was phoned up and offered a course and he hadn't even applied.

[BEagle]

Chums who used to fly for VS say that they aren't sure that management wouldn't embark on the same panic reaction as they did post 11 Sep if there was another airline slump. So they won't exactly be queueing up...

People used to fall over themselves to get an interview with VS - it had an excellent name. But some fell foul of the trick cyclist..... Now that fewer will be likely to apply, perhaps the airline's interview captains will have more of an input?

People with type ratings being cold-called isn't new. An A320 acquaintance of mine (flies for My Little Pony or whatever the silly name is) was cold-called recently by a certain 737-operating airline which has just ordered a shedload of A319s....

[joebanana]

Sounds like they've got to the bottom of the redundancy list with a whole load of 'thanks for offering me my job back but please take your kind offer and shove it up your ar$e!'

Me included!

Looking forward to watching the forthcoming pay negotiations from the sidelines. ;)


(edited for spelling!)

[The Big Easy]

Yup, been for the interview. They are short of f/o's but with rock bottom long-haul pay and decades to command. I think not !

The Big Easy.

[Lavdumperer]

With the Classics gone, which aircraft are VS hiring into - the 747-400 or the A340 typically? Let's say you have 757 experience and more than minimum hours requirements with a charter carrier and aspire to be a VS pilot - which aircraft can you expect? How about recently - which aircraft have newhires been training on lately?

Personally, wouldn't mind sitting in a 400!!!!!


Cheers

[RIAB]

The Classics are not gone. On the contrary, there is a good chance at the moment of newhires flying a Classic on an Icelandic licence into Lagos and Port Harcourt! Suddenly that 757 doesn't look too bad!!

[Carpe]

Nearly correct. Recruiting will most likely be onto the classic either LGW or MAN based but flying into MCO and the Caribbean.

Big Easy, I totally agree (but keep watching).

Tailscrape, sounds like your hurting.

Citadel, I sincerely doubt your story. Your mate may have been offered an interview, unsolicited, but there's no way he was offered a job.

[PPPmember]

......... give me an address or something ........ sounds like my time has come to apply to them ........

Have 12.500 hrs total - MD80 and Lears OK ...... ??

[citadel]

Carpe

Correct, he wasn't offered a job, because he turned the interview down. Why would you be asked to an interview with no prospect of a job offer?

PS A340-300 is operating to LOS & PHC

[Orangewing]

According to the latest missive from BALPA, most recruitment is for the B747-400.

[tailscrape]

Carpe,

On the contrary. I have never applied to VS. I think they are probably reasonable, if they don't dump you on the street as soon as the wind gets a bit blowy.

I enjoy my secure job which pays above the industry standard.

Do you enjoy yours, or do you wish that you had "Carpe Diem" when you had the chance?

Enjoy your ten year wait for command OR the sub standard long haul terms if you got there already.......

[dickyflys]

Apply at your own risk! You have been warned from the inside!

[Carpe]

Tailscrape,

An enjoyable, secure, highly-paid job, in the airline industry today? Hmmm!

Good luck to you.

[tailscrape]

Carpe,

Enjoyable: yes, i still enjoy it.

Secure: Well my employer seems the most secure there is.

High wages: I never said that, just above average for the aircraft I fly. That is wages mind you, not necessarily the whole package, so I accept your sentiment there.

All the best.

[Smokie]

So given the choice, Boeing or Airbus ? are there a good selction of routes on both ? are there routes you would rather not be rostered for ?

Are there more and more min rest periods between duties ?

I hear conflicting stories so whats the basic take home for F/Os on both fleets ?

Is it true that your staff travel privileges have been decimated ?

If offered an interview, is there a sim ride or not, if so what is it in, a current type or something else, eg a 111 or 737 .

Thanks in advance for any usefull info guys.

[Digitalis]

Right now, there is a very wide-ranging discussion between the pilots (through BALPA) and the company going on. As well as the well-known low pay, these negotiations will, hopefully, sort out a number of currently unsatisfactory terms of service. I wouldn't anticipate an early, or easy, end to this process!

That said, I'll try and answer some of your questions.

The B744 currently operates JFK, BOS, EWR, IAD, MCO, MIA, LSV, LAX, SFO, ANU, BGI, UVF, and JNB. The A340 operates JFK, EWR, IAD, LAX, LOS, CPT, JNB, PVG, HKG, NRT, DEL and PHC is to start in the New Year. The B742 (still around) will be operating MAN-MCO, MAN-BGI, LGW-BOS and LGW-Tobago/Grenada in 2003.

The predominance of East Coast and Caribbean in the 744's destinations means that rosters are frequently up to 6 trips a month, with 2 or 3 days between trips. The A340 roster is less busy, but has equal time away. Most routes have some good points, but it would be fair to say that LOS and NRT aren't among the favourites! Contracted hours are 750 per year, but there aren't many that will come in under this figure this year. Overtime is paid, annually, for any hours over 750. Rosters are supposed to be published by the 15th of each preceding month, but increasingly haven't been recently. Particularly on the 'Bus, there has been a lot of roster instability over the last few months, apperently due to the delayed intro of the A340-600.

Basic pay for a new-hire FO is £38,200. If you live in UK (not compulsory) that means a take-home basic of £2350 or so. After 5 years, the salary is £43,500. Pension contributions (6% from you gets 15% from the company) will be deducted from this figure. The pension, like all money purchase schemes, is pretty weak right now.

Sector pay is very low, between £4 and £12 per sector (roughly £80 per month), and allowances down route average £70 per night.

Staff travel is, in theory, great, but good loads, new security procedures, and occasionally obstructive gate/check-in staff make standby travel very risky. Reasonable fares are available for firm tickets most of the time. The loss of firm tickets for companions for Christmas/New Year trips, and after 5 years in the company has not gone down at all well, and is probably the main cause of dissatisfaction with the staff travel system right now.

The interview does include a sim ride. It used to be on the B742, and may still be.

Hope this helps. Remember, a lot of this may be out of date soon!

[Smokie]

Digitalis,

Many thanks, I shall keep my ear to the ground and watch with interest.

[Chokdee]

Approaching 3rd year with VS on B744. Basic after tax per month 2375 and approx 350-400 in allowances. Fairly average company but has the potential to improve. Rgds.

[Smokie]

747-400 vs A340

Hi guys, any thoughts on preferences on the 744 vs A340
Pluses and Minuses for both aircraft ?

If you had a choice which one would you go for and why ?

Also, what are the lay-over times like on both fleets, is it min rest, then the Bullet back to ole Blighty ?

I've believe that recruitment is for both fleets at the moment so please treat these as serious questions.

Many Thanks in advance. :)

[Chokdee]

Hi Smokie,
In the event of job losses I think that the Airbus rating would be more valuable in the short term, at least until everyone starts flying 400 freighters where it might then even out a little bit. Given the choice now, I would rather be on the Airbus because it is an easier fleet to justify commuting to work on. The Airbus generally does longer trips, thus slightly more days off between work patterns. A possible downside is that heavy crews are often carried, so it might turn into a toss of a coin for a sector. All 400 crews a pleasure to work with, and I am sure the same goes for the 340. Hope this helps a little.
Rgds.

[Smokie]

Chokdee,

Many thanks , I'm starting to get a feel for things now, the 340 could be the way forward.:)

[Mr Gammon Flaps]

Hi Smokie:

Just a quick question, how many hours have you got at the mo? I've got my application in with virgin but have been told to wait until the new year. I've got 3500 hrs most on 757/767.

I've been hearing about interviews taking place recently so was wondering if it was for airbus rated or high time guys only....

Cheers for that, drop me an email if you prefer.

[Smokie]

Mr Gammon Flaps, I have sent you an E-mail.

Happy Landings:)

[A Life Less Ordinary]

I,m 330 rated and seriously considering an application to Virgin Atlantic. Anybody have a sample 340 roster, is it possible to commute from Europe? How long are the various layovers? How is the working environment on the flightdeck? Is it 52 days annual leave?

I'd really appreciate the information guys and gals..

[Mother]

Was that layovers or layoffs?

[Dan Winterland]

A 340 has the better routes. Hong Kong, Shanghai, Cape Town and Jo'berg (although the winter schedule has the 744 going to Jo'berg at the weekends). 744 is peretty much USA and a bit of Caribbean - San Fran being the only good destination (IMHO). However, the 340 will be doing Lagos and Port Harcourt when the 340-600 introduction gets properly under way.

340 guys tend to do 3 or 4 trips a month, usually with 3 or 4 crew, so landing recency can be an issue. 744, can be 5 or 6 trips with landing recency not being an issue. 744 has lots of 2 pilot trips.

Lots of VS crew live overseas. Commuting not really an issue, except on a 744 six trip roster, you will be spending a lot of time travelling. Also, expect a 4 day block of standby every 2 rosters. You have to be within 2 hours travelling of LHR.

I'm not going to comment on Airbus vs Boeing issues except that they are both pretty dull to fly. Long haul + glass cockpit = boredom.

But, last I heard, (3 weeks out of the loop now) there may be a requirementfor new hire Classic pilots.

[Hood]

Any substance to a MAN base opening up at Virgin?

[mrsmaryhinge]

Surely everyone is missing the point the point here. Virgin is the ultimate employer and all male pilots aspire to work for them. Why?? Well the lovely cabin crew of course.

I've lost count of the number of times I've nearly crashed my car driving past the south terminal bus stop at LGW, trying to simultaneously drool and drive.:D :D

[scroggs]

Virgin operates MAN-MCO, and has done for many years. From next spring there will also be a couple of MAN-BGIs a week. But all pilots are, and will continue to be, London based.

[chiefman]

jeez how do i get one of those jobs. i live in canada and have approx 3800 Hrs and would love to work in Europe. anyone here want to trade jobs?

[crewrest]

If you are on the 747-200, you'll probably be able to bid/swap for just MAN flights.

Pay talks ongoing.

340 = 3/4 trips Good destinations (except LOS/PHC) with best social although you never get a sector as an F/O and you forget how to fly, but are very good at making the bunk in the crewrest and fetching cups of tea.

744 = 5/6 trips a month to more boring destinations although you get a few more landings and feel more tired due to no crewrest on the 2 crew atlantic stuff.

[Shamen]

I am with a UK airline fairly close to a command on a 757. Should I apply to Virgin and go to the bottom of the Seniority list?

Whats the approx time to Command now?

[Tungsten Anteater]

It says on the online application that Virgin are inviting CVs from people with varying experience and backgrounds.Then elsewhere it is stated that a minimum of 1500hrs commercial jet time is the requirement.

Would it be worth a four and a half thousand hour turboprop Captain sending in an application?Or would the CV end up in the electronic waste paper bin?

[scroggs]

Ring Janine Taylor at Virgin and ask.

[Tungsten Anteater]

Thanks mate.I will.

:)

[Shanwick Shanwick]

For info, here's my fairly typical December roster as an FO on the 744:

02-04 MCO
07-09 JFK
12-14 BOS
17-19 MIA
22-25 BGI
29-01 LAX

Apart from the LAX it's all 2 crew trips so plently of sectors but with only 2 days off between trips I'll be too spaced out to enjoy Christmas. I also commute to France which makes things worse.

[A Life Less Ordinary]

anybody willing to put a typical A340 roster?

[northern boy]

744 a bit short of crew at the moment, currently on the conversion myself and quite a number to follow through next year. Maybe things will start to ease off over the next few months. (hopefully?)

[scroggs]

My A340 roster for November:

Oct 28 - Nov 03: CPT
Nov 07-10: Sby
Nov 13: Sby
Nov 14-17: PVG
Nov 23: Sby
Nov 24-27: LAX

Total 58 hours.

This is a relatively lightly-tasked month, mainly due to the large amount of training going on (trainers' rosters are very busy!). The late introduction of the A340-600 has led to a lot of roster instability, hence the Standby before each trip. That's an unusual feature that doesn't normally happen.

As a comparison, my December roster has a similar hours total in spite of having 10 days' leave.