Characters in aviation

[formationfoto]

Talking to a few people involved in the display circuit a month or so back and the subject got onto the reduction in the number of characters or personalities involved in aviation. The primary point concerned displays and display pilots where the scene has become more closely controlled (not always a bad thing). There is however a wider point here. Are we failing to create replacements for the characters of old?. There remain idiosyncratic individuals as anyone who has heard the Ogilvy display commentaries at Old Warden or who has met James Gilbert (the 'father' of PILOT magazine as we know it) can testify. The likes of Brian Lecomber would also count. But by and large we are talking 'Meldrew plus' on the age spectrum. I don't see too many young pretenders. Brendan O Brien is mid way.

I'm now in my (early) forties and have been actively flying for 15 years so I am not remembering the far distant past through a decayed layer of fuddled brain cells. Nor, however, am I fully connected to the new entrants. Perhaps I am missing the emerging characters.

Maybe we should instigate a 'hall of fame' for 'aviation personalities'?.

Thoughts on this and names (with details) for this 'fantasy fun flyer fame game' by return please.

James - now I know you read this I have already voted for you!.

[sharpshot]

Great idea - BUT is this not frowned upon in this politically correct world - let alone Blair's Britain.

You have just given me a vision:
XH558 rolls down the Bruntingthorpe runway in 2003 and heads for IAT at Fairford. On its first fly by, memories of Rolly Falke (spelling?) are evoked as the "character" in the left hand seat throws it into a perfectly executed barrel roll..............

Guess we just have to thrive on memories:D :D

[Aussie Andy]

So, what, you'd have to do something dangerous / risky to be a "character"!? Why would that be a good thing? And how on earth Tony Blair is implicated is a bit beyond me... honestly people..!

[Aussie Andy]

... and this relates to aviation..?

[sharpshot]

:) G'day Aussie A - thought characters might still exist in the Antipodes - not so stifled by the bureaucrats and all the 21st century correctness.

Couldn't agree more SS Driver!

Now Aussie, my ancient father is an Antipodean and I had the good fortune to attend a reunion with him in 1993 with a fabulous entourage of aviating characters.

An old friend of my fathers came up to him and my father ended up handing over his prized hat (one that you bushmen wear - forget name) I asked this chap why my father had had to hand it over.
He then related that my father had shot him down in about 1942 and he had been a POW for three years and on returning to the airfield that same day, my old man had helped himself to his prize jumper and kept it.

I scratched my head for many an hour over those two days (couldn't believe the old man could have done this) :confused: :confused: anyway they finally put me right.........nobody was endangered by this and although some are no longer with us, there are few to replace them.

I even came to the conclusion the other day that pilot training will NOT - in the not too distant future require light singles and twins - just go into a room and play on a computer and you will master the art of flying. That will be a sad day!:rolleyes:

[I have control]

I nominate Eddie Todd as a genuine bona fide aviation "character" who is not of "Meldrew" age.

[Negative 'G']

Yup I'd certainly agree with "Fast Eddie", as well as Brian Lecomber & a certain Flying Vet !:D

Neg G

[QDMQDMQDM]

www.kirkflyingvet.co.uk

Look no further.

[skua]

God, the Flying Vet ! I had almost excised him from my mind. Has he still got his licence? His file at the CAA must be 100 x thicker than the PPL average. Bit unfair on Lecomber to talk of him in the same breath !

[Philip Whiteman]

Interesting to see a load of anonymous non-characters debating this, isn't it!
Ian Davies ('formationfoto'): Meldrew represents a frame of mind, not an age band—and are you trawling for 'Pilot' profile subjects, or do you just have time to spare on this kind of stuff? I think we should be told...

[Aussie Andy]

Speak for yourself - I reckon I'm quite a character ;) ...

I'd nominate Bob Cook at BAFC - a very experienced and pleasant old-timer with a wealth of experience, including years as a 747 captain with BOAC then BA, and now lending his years of experience (and his excellent dry sense of humour!) to his students. I did my initial "trial flight" with Bob, and then eventually he was the examiner for my PPL test!

[bottieburp]

A stuffy reply I'm afraid.

The problem with 'characters' on the display circuit is that they tend to kill themselves.

The show-off mentality has no place in our display environment.

THe best display - and I am talking historic aircraft here - is done by a pilot who never strays from the middle of the envelope.

Study the Shuttleworth pilots next time you are there. All humble, no 'wings' on their flying suits - nothing to prove.

I was at a well -publicised fly-in at the weekend when the pilot of a vintage aircraft did a 90 right 'on the deck' and flew over the parked aircraft at half the height of the nearby hangar. A photo would bear this out. He came very close to the model aircraft site.

He should have climbed to 500 ft on the runway heading before departing.

He was showing off and risked other peoples arses as well as his own.

I can tell you that the CAA - already doing an excellent job at dispaly regulation - wil be taking a closer look at fly-ins next year.

Call me a farty if you like - I have been called worse.

However, the innocent spectators at these events are entitled to enjoy safe, professional pilots without an ego to massage.

THe pilot in an ex - 'character' no longer the holder of a DA.

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

Brian Lecomber is an example of a 'character', and an excellent and safe display pilot.

'Characters' don't have to be irresponsible loonys

SSD

[formationfoto]

Slightly surprised that 'character' has to equal unthinking lunatic in many peoples minds. Not for me. Also possible to display spirit and character whilst remaining safer than many who regard themselves as cool and professional.

What a suspicious mind you have Philip W. Had I been seeking material for PILOT I would have been open about the intent. No point in pretending I could do it by hiding. Not beyond other mags from reading the same material on the site anyway so a bit pointless as a competitive thing.

Sadly the answer is simple - I enjoy contributing to this sort of debate and don't regard myself as any different just because I have a link to PILOT magazine (albeit a corporate link rather than one of editorial and operational influence. As requested you have been told...

I don't suppose you were looking around the Forum for ideas for FLYER or the AOPA magazine by any chance?

[Evo]

Andy - I had the pleasure of meeting Bob when I landed at Wycombe on my QXC (he rather delayed my departure - I couldn't stop the flow of advice). Certainly a character :)

[Philip Whiteman]

Must concede you are correct Ian 'formationfoto'; I do have a suspicious mind. I'll leave it to other ppruners to work out how this may have come about.

For the record, AOPA's magazine is called 'General Aviation'. Something of a little acorn at present, but intended to be an enjoyable read. Any feedback would be welcome; I am the editor, so it's mostly my fault.

[Evo]

Actually I don't care if or why you have a suspicious mind. Can you two slag each other off via e-mail? :rolleyes:

[Aussie Andy]

Hi Evo, yeah he's a top bloke - always has time for a chat and to give advice to some "young idiots" ;)

Re- the slagging match: come on children, not in public please! I reckon Pilot is excellent, and Flyer for that matter, and I reckon General Aviation's format is getting much better.

[bingoboy]

It could be argued that anyone who makes a long term committment to earn a living from light aviation is a bit of a character. I base this on my belief that they cannot be doing it for the money !!

So any fulltime CFI at a school that has no commercial trainees must count (along with non hour building FI's).

Also many LAE's could also qualify.

[formationfoto]

Philip
And what a good and improving magazine 'General Aviation' is. Anything which develops the relevance and GA community awareness of AOPA is a good thing in my view.

BTW if this is public slagging off let the slagging commence!.

Let me add my own 'Character'. My instructor when I learnt at Andrewsfield many years ago. Des Delaney. Been there, had done it, had the T shirt, and no doubt the engraved timepiece. Loads of flying stories, able to demonstrate with ease, and able to pull off some spectacular 'stunts' in a safe and 'non showing off' way. I compare him as a character to another instructor I had who demonstrated how to loop a Cessna in the circuit (below 1500 ft). This guy was a show off not a character. Whether show offs ever become characters I don't know but this guy was more likely to become worm food.

I guess I must include the flying vet without condoning all of his actions.

From East Anglia I would certainly add Henry Labouchere - Mr Tiger Moth as far as I am concerned, Ken Wallis the autogyro pioneer, and Jimmy Hoseason of boating holiday fame who is extremely entertaining and was one of the team who had the foresight to buy Seething airfield in the 60s and turn it into a membership owned facility.

[Lowtimer]

I find aviation to be absolutely crammed with "characters" (meaning very forceful personalities, not foolhardy pilots - I've met very few of those). Hardly surprising, as it is a tough world in which to make a commercial success of things, and unlikely to attract particularly passive personalities. In any small world where you have a lot of forceful people, inevitably they will rub occasionally rub each other up the wrong way.

Douglas Bader and Neil Williams, both childhood heros of mine, were just two people who demostrated the positive ways in which a forceful and charismatic personality could drive achievement, but who in other ways had a reputation for "not suffering fools" to put it mildly!

For his sheer determination and refusal to back down in the face of bureaucratic interference, Mark Jefferies has to regarded as a modern-day aviation "character", and I admire his achievements in popularising the Yak in the UK and keeping Little Gransden alive and well.

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

And I would add James Gilbert to the list of aviation characters, owner and editor of 'Pilot' magazine for many years. I think that mag's unique and special character came directly from James.

It will be interesting to see how it fares now it is in 'corporate' hands, rather than those of a colourful individual. And in these PC days, will we ever see its like again?

SSD

[dedstikyfingerz]

I aggree, too much emphasis on paper work procedures and immpressing the cliky croud with perfect rt breeds a mass of non characters. Sure, i dont disagree with the paper work etc but u need a little va va voom in yer flying. I am not even 1/4 of a century old yet so maybee u shouldn't listen to the likes of me, but i know my crowd treat flying as a bit of fun that can scare the crap out of u if you try, (brian lacomber did) try looping something that shouldn't or buy a doodle bug hand glider, that'll cheer you up. flying in nudes prety cool (scuse pun) also. :D :D :D :D

[charlie-india-mike]

dedstikyfingerz

Just curious, did you recently take a trip to France with some other aviation type people?
:) :)

[Final 3 Greens]

Sadly no longer with us, Chris Freeman aka Mr Headcorn was a true character.

Surrounded by a pack of Jack Russells, his A/G information was a delight in the efficient use of the airwaves - allowing for the odd yap or bark intruding!

Many of us remember his courageous fight to keep Lashenden going.

[Ace Rimmer]

Well, last week I was out at the NBAA convention and I had the great good fortune to spend some time chatting with Bob Hoover. Now here is an individual who has been there done that but is also witty, gregarious and the personification of the word gentleman