Just How Badly Can You Treat Passengers - And Get Away With It?

[Magplug]

From BBC News 06-Sept-23 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66727103)

​​​​​​Air Canada has apologised after kicking two passengers off a flight for refusing to sit in vomit-smeared seats.

Susan Benson, who was on the Las Vegas-Montreal service, said the pilot warned the passengers they would be put on a no-fly list if they kept complaining. She added that staff had tried to cover "a bit of a foul smell" with perfume and coffee grounds. Air Canada said the passengers "clearly did not receive the standard of care to which they were entitled to". "We didn't know at first what the problem was," Ms Benson posted on Facebook of the flight late last month. "Apparently, on the previous flight someone had vomited. The flight attendant was very apologetic, but explained that the flight was full. "She said staff "placed coffee grinds in the seat pouch and sprayed perfume", but that the seat and seatbelt were "wet and there was still visible vomit residue". Ms Benson said the pilot came out of the cockpit after several minutes of "back-and-forth". The passengers were told "they could leave the plane… and organise flights on their own dime, or they would be escorted off by security and placed on a no-fly list!" They were then escorted off by security.
Ms Benson said the row made her "ashamed to be a Canadian and ashamed of Air Canada".

Air Canada said it was "reviewing this serious matter" and that "operating procedures were not followed correctly in this instance".
​
We have all been there.... You pitch up somewhere away from base with limited time for a turnround. An inbound passenger has soiled their seat(s) and the superficial cleaning available to you is nowhere near capable of deep-cleaning the trouble away. Now in this case time was not limited as, being the land of the free, the crew would have to clear immigration before getting back on exactly the same aircraft to go back to base. (I never understood why a turnround crew is not allowed to remain on the aircraft in the US like any other country.) In any case cleaning is the limiting option because most airlines don't carry spare seat cushions or seat belts for this eventuality. So the crew get back to the aircraft, the cleaners have gone but the offensive discharge & smell remains - What do you do? The answer is - get the cleaners back but everyone outside the crew is worried about their critical path to dispatch and nobody wants to take a hit for the delay!

Apparently it is now acceptable to subject passengers to any-old treatment and then tell them they will have to pay for another flight themselves if they elect not to fly. Having elevated customer frustration levels to a maximum you then throw a bit more petrol on the fire and threaten them with going on a no-fly list if they refuse to disembark. (To be fair the flight was full but customer frustration tends not to appreciate that when you already have a boarding card for an expensive flight in your hand).

It is 100% predictable that these issues land in the crew's lap when boarding is almost complete, but the attitude that passengers can be threatened with security measures for complaining about an airline's failings has become the new normal. I appreciate the crew were in a hurry to get through the BS immigration process but those seats should have been blocked in the passenger system on arrival and only released when the problem was fixed to the Captain's satisfaction. All these things are avoidable.

[ZFT]

Post covid, pax are no longer customers, just a source of revenue. Airlines now seem to be run for the benefit of staff.

[Level bust]

Unfortunately it now appears to be the way of the world, customer service is now no longer a priority, revenue is.

It is not just confined to the airline business, but I have heard many stories about lack of customer service in the car industry where it takes weeks to get a car fixed because they're arguing with the manufacture about who's going to pay for it!

[Uplinker]

Don't airliner aircraft each carry a couple of spare seat cushions for this very reason? I am pretty sure that we did. I will check with Mrs Uplinker when she gets in.

But it is not acceptable to have passengers escorted off the flight by security for refusing to sit on a wet smelly cushion - there must be more to this story.

[Speed_Trim_Fail]

Post covid, pax are no longer customers, just a source of revenue. Airlines now seem to be run for the benefit of staff.

A lot of crew would argue that this is clearly not the case; Covid revealed exactly how valued crew are by shareholders.

[Lonewolf_50]

Unfortunately it now appears to be the way of the world, customer service is now no longer a priority Seeing this also in the restaurant and bar business.
Agreed customer service is tending to terrible in lots of places. I've been going on about this, as regards the airline industry, for about 15 years. After 9-11, there was a slow but sure degradation of the attitude expressed towards the passengers. COVID only made it worse.
The pilots are not being treated well either.

[Rebus]

Don't airliner aircraft each carry a couple of spare seat cushions for this very reason? I am pretty sure that we did. I will check with Mrs Uplinker when she gets in.

But it is not acceptable to have passengers escorted off the flight by security for refusing to sit on a wet smelly cushion - there must be more to this story.
I'm sure it was part of our weekly or monthly check, to check the spare seat covers.

[Tango and Cash]

It seems like this is an ongoing competition among the North American carriers (and probably others, my recent experience is limited to North America).

Customers are treated as inconveniences (at best, threatened with arrest at worst) by staff.
Staff is treated as an expense to be minimzed by management.
Management is treated to bonuses as the stock price goes up.

[MechEngr]

Soon to a flight near you - an extra fee for not having a seat soaked in bodily fluids.

[Magplug]

Airlines now seem to be run for the benefit of staff.

Do you seriously mean that? I don't see the staff reaping any benefit. Most legacy airlines employ their own staff at base and handling agents wearing the airline's uniform down-route. Most LoCos simply use handling agents. Pretty much everywhere the staff have been transferred from one contract to another to their detriment over the years. There is no loyalty to a brand or company any more... ground-staff both handling agents and legacy staff have been shat on by their employers without a second thought, hardly a recipe for good customer service. They turn up for their shift, do their utmost to avoid conflict with angry passengers and then go home. Their relationship with their employer is purely transactional.

Crews now have a major problem with sorting out issues at the aircraft door that never would have made it that far in the past. We talk a lot about the slices of the cheese lining up to precipitate an accident. When I started in this business everyone involved with the dispatch of an aircraft was qualified, experienced and diligent. Now everyone's role has been devalued as far as possible towards minimum qualification and minimum wage. In time gone by the Flight Crew were the final arbiters of safety, now they are the ONLY arbiters of safety.... If it gets past us we buy the farm. With so much reliance on others reporting dispatch tasks to you it is seriously worrying to operate in an environment where colleagues are so demotivated they would rather look the other way than engage in a safety process.

[Out Of Trim]

Air Canada Engineering staff or their agents would normally hold a stock of spare seat covers, belts and cushions for this very purpose. When the crew get on board their first task is to complete a security check at every sear row which would include checking the cleanliness etc. Normally cleaners would be recalled and engineers called to fix any cabin defects before boarding is commenced. Obviously, the checks were not carried out properly leading to an embarrassing incident. Then this was further mishandled by their staff.

Did they really expect their passengers to sit in wet vomit 🤮 and not protest about it! :rolleyes:

[Herod]

Pre 9/11, put them on the jump-seat/seats. Free food and drink, assuming it isn't already, and a note to the company to offer them a free flight anywhere on the network.

Post 9/11 (at least in UK, and prior to my retirement) no chance.

[EEngr]

But it is not acceptable to have passengers escorted off the flight by security for refusing to sit on a wet smelly cushion - there must be more to this story.

Possibly the definition of "refuse".

[Less Hair]

If these guys ended on a no fly list what does the government think about littering these lists with this retaliation for a service mishap?

[BlankBox]

That was a Bio-hazard situation...it quite possibly is gonna bite A/C in the rump...

[ChrisVJ]

Reports of Easy Jet deplaning a whole aircraft in row over "rude" passenger, a pregnant woman no less and with a disabled child!

How many points do you get for that one!

[albatross]

Possibly the definition of "refuse".

According to reports there was a police officer traveling on the flight. He stated that at no time were the passengers abusive to the cabin crew.
What person would agree to sit in a wet, vomit stained seat?
The crew and especially the supposed Capt. were way out of line.
A quick, sincere, apology and offers to pay for and expedite their departure on the next available flight on any airline should have been offered if it was necessary.
As an aside If the passengers had checked bags those would have had to be located and offloaded due to security regulations. Surely in that time that would have taken they could have replaced the cushions, covers and seat belts. For Gawd’s sake they were in Las Vegas a major airport…not a bush strip in a jungle somewhere.
I highly doubt that this was the first time someone has vomited on an airline seat.

[BlankBox]

...me quoting me... :p

That was a Bio-hazard situation...it quite possibly is gonna bite A/C in the rump...

aaand...feds getting involved...

https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/health-agency-probing-air-canada-vomit-incident-that-echoes-broader-customer-woes-1.6550430

[RatherBeFlying]

Search link for vomit

Witness passenger interview on CBC

​ (https://www.cbc.ca/radio/the-aih-transcript-for-september-06-2023-1.6959724)


...It was definitely from the previous flight, but it had come in the night before. So it had sat there, and we were the first flight out the next day. And we knew that because the flight attendant did tell them that and said that there had been a mix-up with the cleaning crew, like a miscommunication with a cleaning crew, and it didn't get cleaned the night before. So they rushed a cleaning crew in to clean it up before we boarded.

NK: And what did you make of that? That it had sat there all those hours?

SB: It did. And that's what the ladies kept saying, like, you knew this before we got on the plane, like it should have been dealt with before we ever boarded...




The adjacent pax were forced to endure the nauseating fumes all the way back to Montreal. At the very least the offending cushions should have been removed, bagged and stowed in the hold.

If replacement cushions were unavailable, it should have been handled at the gate beginning with a request for pax willing to rebook in return for compensation.

[WillowRun 6-3]

Well, since I have a travel-and-vomit story to tell . . . what the heck.

I had nodded off to sleep on a passenger train running between two major cities, in the U.S., a couple summers ago. I was sitting in the window seat; the aisle seat was empty, but a small duffel-like bag I was carrying around was on that seat. The train car wasn't quite three-quarters full. And despite its sometimes pathetic public image and reputation, the coach seats on Amtrak are pretty decent - I mean if a person can tolerate basic transportation, that is.

So I snapped awake to the sensation of that really unmistakable odor. Some clown had puked in the aisle and, unluckily for me, also quite a bit on the duffel bag. But luckily for me, nothing on me or my seat.

The train crew were entirely helpful in bringing stuff to clean up the duffel bag as best I could. (It met an overdue fate once I got to destination, of course.) The thing was, the puking culprit did not report himself or herself, and anyone who witnessed what had occurred evidently was party to some traveling pukers' code of silence.

So, two things. The train crew were very helpful, and courteous throughout - it can be done. Second, the odor . . . I can't understand how anyone would expect passengers to endure same for any length of time, let alone Sin City to Montreal.

[stilton]

Soon to a flight near you - an extra fee for not having a seat soaked in bodily fluids.


Seriously, if the Monty Python cast needs new material

[artee]

Soon to a flight near you - an extra fee for not having a seat soaked in bodily fluids.
Is it fair to say that Air Canada earn the prize for worst non-LoCo western carrier?

[Uplinker]

I checked with Mrs Uplinker, (a purser on wide-body airliners, who also worked on the narrow-body fleet):

Yes, we carried about 4-5 spare seat cushions on each aircraft for this exact eventuality, (as well as passengers wetting themselves, or spilling drinks or food). The engineers would check on the stock of spare cushions and replenish them if required.

Mrs U once physically cut away and removed a complete seat pocket after a passenger had been sick in that, and no amount of cleaning could remove the smell.

So it can be done, service can be good, as you would reasonably expect it to be in situations like this.

PS, if an airline cannot afford to carry a few spare seat cushions on every aircraft, they are not charging enough for their tickets, or they are taking too much profit out of the airline.


........that really unmistakable odor. Some clown had puked.......

my bold: Trust me, nobody wants to puke on purpose, or for a laugh........It is an automatic emergency response.

[601]

Well, since I have a travel-and-vomit story to tell . . . what the heck.
Me with a brand new CPL and 30 minutes into a 3 hour flight. C172 on a summer's afternoon in Oz can make for a some what of a rough ride.
Young lady behind me did not like the turbulence and proceeded to vomit all over the back of my head and neck.
I know for certain that the young lady had eaten passion fruit for lunch.

[WillowRun 6-3]

Certainly, Uplinker, any given puker cannot always reach a proper receptacle in time.

Mostly I was referring to the individual's disappearing act.

[EEngr]

Trust me, nobody wants to puke on purpose, or for a laugh........
Never been a member of a college fraternity?

[India Four Two]

Yes, we carried about 4-5 spare seat cushions on each aircraft for this exact eventuality,

Back in the 80s on a QANTAS 747 to London, my young son threw up on his seat. Immediate cleanup response by the crew, which included replacing the seat cushion.

[Uplinker]

Never been a member of a college fraternity?

Ha ha ! No, I don't think we have fraternities in the UK? But like most young men, drinking a lot was part of my 'growing up', but the point was not to be sick - that would be a waste of good beer !

We were once complimented by a pub landlord who had observed my work colleagues and I drinking a LOT of beer one evening. He said "I have never seen a group of people drink so much beer and be so well behaved". :D

We could handle our drink :ok:

Anyway, sorry, back to the thread.

[bafanguy]

To answer the OP's question, as long as people continue to buy tickets airline management will see no need to do anything different. Why would they ?

As for carrying spare seat cushions/covers as a routine matter, Delta doesn't and never did to my knowledge.

[megan]

Mrs U once physically cut away and removed a complete seat pocket after a passenger had been sick in thatIn company with Spouse and Daughter boarded a Qatar A330 at Doha for a flight to Melbourne, reached into the pocket for the briefing card and came up with a hand soaked in vomit, the stench was atrocious, though not noticeable prior when taking our seats. The aircraft from our vantage point was full but seats were found to reposition us, though split up and not together. Given the state of the floor awash in the terminal toilets and the appalling treatment seen of another passenger at passport control was more than happy to pledge never to return.

[Red41]

easyjet has a target for revenue from charging pax for bags at the gate that fall
outside policy. Said policy has been changed and made so confusing to create traps for the uninitiated to fall into. It truly is a race to the bottom.

[MissChief]

In company with Spouse and Daughter boarded a Qatar A330 at Doha for a flight to Melbourne, reached into the pocket for the briefing card and came up with a hand soaked in vomit, the stench was atrocious, though not noticeable prior when taking our seats. The aircraft from our vantage point was full but seats were found to reposition us, though split up and not together. Given the state of the floor awash in the terminal toilets and the appalling treatment seen of another passenger at passport control was more than happy to pledge never to return.

Not a favoured airline by many. No further comment from my side.

[megan]

Not a favoured airline by manyNot many airlines offer, I should say demand, a free vaginal examination to the Ladies, some in Oz wonder if that was an issue in refusing Qatar's recent request for extra flights being denied.

[deja vu]

What the hell is the pilot doing getting involved with pax while on the ground and never in the air. Furthermore were would he or she get the authority to put anyone on a no fly list.
Maybe Air Canada can have the pilot in for a chat,

[albatross]

What the hell is the pilot doing getting involved with pax while on the ground and never in the air. Furthermore were would he or she get the authority to put anyone on a no fly list.
Maybe Air Canada can have the pilot in for a chat,

Perhaps they can arrange a vomit covered seat for the Capt. to sit in for the interview and be told to sit or be placed on a “no fly list”.
I wonder what the reaction would be.
An immediate filing of a complaint about bullying and harassment would be filed with HR and the union rapidly followed by a lawsuit would be my best guess.

[Commander Taco]

Maybe Air Canada can have the pilot in for a chat,

Obviously the situation was completely mishandled. Tea and biccies with the boss is a given.

[oldtora]

Quote : "Seeing this also in the restaurant and bar business."

In a restaurant ? Was it the food ?

[Magplug]

The airline business is perfectly placed to exploit the public through withdrawal of any semblance of customer service.

Since 9/11 not only have draconian security measures been introduced and accepted by the public as part of measures to 'keep me safe' but also used as an excuse to treat customers like some bovine flock who exist only to be exploited. Youtube is full of 'Karen' videos of people who have 'lost their ****' with airlines, usually because they have been treated appallingly. The internet has also played it's part on commerce. At the flick of a switch ticket prices can be rigged in real time to demand the highest price for every seat on the jet. The internet allows airlines to completely control their relationship with the customer, reducing their ability to communicate with the airline or complain. Customer helplines are so sparsely manned that you get a reply in hours not minutes. The supplier sets the sometimes erroneous conditions of sale which place the entire burden on the poor customer who may have to re-purchase another ticket in time of disruption instead of simply being re-routed by an airline agent.

For the part of the airline staff.... Their contracts have been cut to the bone so enthusiasm is a thing of the past. I can tell you from personal experience that new procedures are trotted out like dictats from the politburo, procedures that will patently degrade the customer experience but add a few cents to the bottom line. The staff will complain as it is they that face the angry customers but it will be in vain. Failure to implement any direction comes with the immediate threat of disciplinary measure. Leadership is a thing of the past.... today it is all about short term gains and getting that management bonus.

Bullying passengers is now quite acceptable because that has become the very real culture of airlines from the top down.

[Private jet]

Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.
Remember that nobody forces anyone to fly anywhere, it's not like food, or oxygen, it's not essential to life. Aviation is a discretionary product. The industry might well do better, for both users and those that make their living from it, if the industry contracted.

[brogul]

Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff..

Last year we bought 2 business-class tickets to Korea (from LA via Tokyo) from AA for about $5K each, 3-4 months ahead of time. By the time we got near our travel dates, the price of those tickets had gone up to $12K. A few days before, there was some SNAFU with one of the connecting flights and we got a message to call AA. I called, was told the wait time was 9 hours. I tried again the next day, got someone in about 90 minutes who told me that there was no available rebooking, I could take a credit or a refund. They said it nicely, but did try to steer me to the credit by implying the refund would "take some work and approvals".

So how much extra should I have paid to get a level of service above waiting for hours to be told we were being cancelled with no effort to get us where we were going? I don't mind getting lemonade if that's what I paid for, but a cup of vomit I have to complain about.

[allthatglitters]

Several airlines I have worked for as a Licensed Aircraft Engineer have carried spare covers and belts. But 1 I can think of never even had sick bags on the aircraft, even after speaking with the Senior Airline Hostess, nothing changed, eventually they where looking at putting a few sick bags in the toilets, I remarked do you think someone is going to que for one, eventually they put one bag in each left hand Aisle row seat, regularly there was mess over the walls and carpets. But still no fresh covers. Ended up cabin crew and mechanics moving cushions around the fleet, causing other issues as the aircraft where built with differing airlines seats, cushions and covers. Meaning unrecorded seats with no cushion.

[robocoder]

To me, the biggest spit-in-your-face declaration is random seating of tickets bought together. That's going out of your way to purposely screw your consumers.

[Cleared Visual]

Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.
Remember that nobody forces anyone to fly anywhere, it's not like food, or oxygen, it's not essential to life. Aviation is a discretionary product. The industry might well do better, for both users and those that make their living from it, if the industry contracted.

That comment might make sense, in general, if the pax in question had booked their tickets on a ULCC, rather than a full-service legacy carrier. Air Canada arent exactly charging "lemonade money". Regardless, it doesnt matter if the customer pays $60 or $600, its never acceptable to force them to sit in vomit or be placed on a "no-fly list"...

[B Fraser]

To me, the biggest spit-in-your-face declaration is random seating of tickets bought together. That's going out of your way to purposely screw your consumers.

It's so they can make families pay extra to sit together. Disgraceful.

The solution is that when the CC realise that they need to swap pax around so children can sit with parents, smile sweetly and refuse. I know that goes against common decency and is very difficult to do in practice but as long as pax solve the problem, the practice will continue.

[AvionicsHippo]

Air Canada Engineering staff or their agents would normally hold a stock of spare seat covers, belts and cushions for this very purpose. When the crew get on board their first task is to complete a security check at every sear row which would include checking the cleanliness etc. Normally cleaners would be recalled and engineers called to fix any cabin defects before boarding is commenced. Obviously, the checks were not carried out properly leading to an embarrassing incident. Then this was further mishandled by their staff.

Did they really expect their passengers to sit in wet vomit 🤮 and not protest about it! :rolleyes:

As an engineer, we are frequently called for precisely this situation. It is possible that Air Canada did not to have spare seat cushions, covers or seat belts at the specific airport, and the airline I work for carries additional waterproof emergency covers that go over everything for this eventuality.


If this was not a base Air Canada regularly fly to and there were no engineers available to changes seat cushions, covers and belts, and there were no emergency waterproof over covers on board then this is clearly Air Canadas problem and threatening passengers is really poor behaviour from the captain

[twb3]

Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.
Remember that nobody forces anyone to fly anywhere, it's not like food, or oxygen, it's not essential to life. Aviation is a discretionary product. The industry might well do better, for both users and those that make their living from it, if the industry contracted.

Good lord, expecting your seats to be reasonably clean is hardly "champagne service"!

[Noxegon]

The solution is that when the CC realise that they need to swap pax around so children can sit with parents, smile sweetly and refuse. I know that goes against common decency and is very difficult to do in practice but as long as pax solve the problem, the practice will continue.

I think you'll find that airline terms allow them to move your seat, and on that basis, refusing a request from CC to switch seat will likely have you moved off the plane.

Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.

Where I live there's a choice between low fare service or low fare service. I'd love to pay more and get more, but the product isn't available.

Besides, I'd expect lemonade service to include the right not to sit in a vomit-covered seat.

[MechEngr]

Much of modern passenger travel in aircraft reminds me of the Monty Python sketch where one could get a session of Argument or Abuse. Of course Argument gets one put on a list that allows access to neither. Just as in the sketch, the staff are polite, but the product is the product.

[megan]

Look away now, a good news story via Avweb

When young Broadway actress Mikayla Renfrow’s Delta Air Lines flight to New York from Europe was delayed, the casting director of Aladdin texted her not to worry. They’d find someone else to fill her spot in the ensemble for that night. But four hours into the flight, she got another text. Renfrow is also the understudy for actress Sonja Bolsara in the lead role of Jasmine, and Bolsara had taken ill. Could Renfrow get to the theater on time for the 7 p.m. curtain? The flight’s ETA at JFK was 5 pm.

Renfrow explained the situation to a flight attendant (so far, only identified as “Leisha”), desperately hoping for a seat nearer the front of the plane for a hasty exit. What she got was a lot more than that.

When Leisha notified the flight crew of the situation, the pilots first arranged for a gate closer to Customs, then asked if Renfrow was aware of Blade’s helicopter service from JFK to Manhattan. “I’m a normal person,” she told Playbill magazine. “I have no idea what that is. I was shocked that they cared.” The Delta crew booked her for the seven-minute ride to Manhattan—price $175, which the Aladdin casting director gladly paid. Perhaps the bargain of a lifetime for the Broadway hopeful.

For the rest of the flight, Renfrow tried to relax and rest up for her opportunity. The captain came back for a visit, cheering her on with her adventure. After landing (one can likely assume there was some throttle-bending and negotiations with ATC from the seats up front), Delta staff members whisked the young actress through Customs and into a car to take her to her Blade flight. Just like in … a Broadway show, she arrived at the stage door of the New Amsterdam Theater 30 minutes before curtain, not a minute to spare for getting into costume and makeup.

After the drama just to get her there, performing on stage might have felt like an anticlimax. But Renfrow told Playbill, “There were a lot of moments during that show where I was [thinking], ‘I’m going to open my mouth and hope the right thing comes out.”

After the final curtain, she was surprised to see Leisha, still in uniform, waiting to congratulate her on her performance. The theater had comped her a ticket. “It was just special moment after special moment after special moment,” Renfrow said.

[RdKetchup]

Now in this case time was not limited as, being the land of the free, the crew would have to clear immigration before getting back on exactly the same aircraft to go back to base. (I never understood why a turnround crew is not allowed to remain on the aircraft in the US like any other country.)


On that point, when going to the USA from major a Canadian airport (Montreal, Toronto Pearson, Vancouver, etc...), you actually clear immigration at the departure airport, so the crew would not have had to deal with customs in Vegas in that case. You get off the plane and it is exactly the same as if you had come off an American domestic flight, walk straight to baggage collection or out of the terminal.

[daelight]

Earlier this month, a Singapore Airlines flight had passengers stuck on their plane for 8 hours at Shanghai (with no Aircon) before the flight was cancelled and they could eventually disembark
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/sia-shanghai-plane-tarmac-passengers-stuck-plane-3753721

[Magplug]

On that point, when going to the USA from major a Canadian airport (Montreal, Toronto Pearson, Vancouver, etc...), you actually clear immigration at the departure airport, so the crew would not have had to deal with customs in Vegas in that case. You get off the plane and it is exactly the same as if you had come off an American domestic flight, walk straight to baggage collection or out of the terminal.

Admittedly pre COVID.... Several times in the crew line at passport control in LAS a Canadian crew of 5 or 6 would arrive behind my 747 crew from London. The skipper asked nicely if they could skip in front of us as they had to turnaround to go home. I asked how long they had been on duty? My reserves of sympathy are pretty exhaused at the end of a 13 hour duty. He saw my point and returned to his place in the queue.

Why was it that CBP agents in LAS were the most miserable in the USA?

[West Coast]

Why was it that CBP agents in LAS were the most miserable in the USA?

Perhaps they fed off the attitudes around them.

[albatross]

I think you'll find that airline terms allow them to move your seat, and on that basis, refusing a request from CC to switch seat will likely have you moved off the plane.



Where I live there's a choice between low fare service or low fare service. I'd love to pay more and get more, but the product isn't available.

Besides, I'd expect lemonade service to include the right not to sit in a vomit-covered seat.

Re moving seats: What is the “need”? The pax could have selected or paid to sit together.

11 hour flight…I had booked, 8 weeks before, an aisle exit row seat as I am 6 foot + tall and have neck and back issues.
They asked me to change to a centre seat in the centre row of the 747 to supposedly allow a father to sit next to his teen age daughter.
I refused and politely explained why. I suggested that the father change centre seats with his daughter and she could sit with her mother and brother. I thought the father just wanted an aisle seat but did not say so.

The flight attendant agreed with my refusal. Case closed.

[Seat4A]

Forwarded to me with the question "should I bring hazmat gear?..."

---

Sept 7 23

"Wouldn't be surprised at all if this were true. A few months ago, a gate agent approached me to say that the previous passenger in my (paid) J seat had vomited on it, but the groomers, in her opinion, had done a great job cleaning up. She had inspected it herself. However, if I were unhappy with the prospect, there was a seat in economy waiting for me.

I went to my seat. There was vomit on it, on my neighbor's seat, on the armrest divider, on the seat in front of me, and the floor. One of the flight attendants gave me and my neighbor some wet wipes to improve on the "great job" done by the groomers.

I sent a note to AC and they did respond with the "we are concerned" template, but I doubt they've made any efforts to improve their procedures."

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/2134133-pax-allegedly-kicked-off-ac-flight-after-refusing-sit-seats-vomit-them-5.html


Sept 24

"AC 8192 - more vomit on plane

Some poor guy just ran down the aisle before take off with his hand over his mouth, and spray vomited between his fingers over all of us in rows 12/13.

Mostly liquid for the upside, but not good…"


"We all got given disinfecting hand wipes by the FA, we wiped ourselves (and my case my iPad) and parts of the plane down before it dripped from the overhead bins. Groomers were called, they milled around, one guy got changed in the washrooms.

SD didn’t even talk to us…."

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/2136315-ac-8192-more-vomit-plane.html