EFA and A330

[prickly]

Is that EFA's first A330 en route SYD to AKL right now

[morno]

Err, no. It’s not

[Capt Fathom]

I don't know why people doubted you morno. :E

[morno]

I don't know why people doubted you morno. :E

:p I don’t know either

[markis10]

Is that EFA's first A330 en route SYD to AKL right now

getting closer but still a WIP in Europe https://www.instagram.com/p/Cv-N8XXMy8Q/

[bangbounceboeing]

How many are they getting?
All Sydney based or are there other base options ?

[soseg]

How many are they getting?
All Sydney based or are there other base options ?

Who cares. What they pay is criminal.

[drshmoo]

Who cares. What they pay is criminal.

The pay is very very poor!

[Swept-Wing]

I would say they would be one of the lowest paid wide body pilots in first world countries currently.

[PoppaJo]

I would say they would be one of the lowest paid wide body pilots in first world countries currently.
Air Asia A330 is ahead of this mob and its A320 offer is ahead of Network. Need I say anymore.

[Australia2]

Does anyone have salary figures for the above ?

[VH-RME]

From the 2021 EBA, for widebodies it appears for 2023 with 0 years seniority:

CN 205,164
FO 138,267

If anyone has more accurate figures would love to hear them

[DeltaT]

They don't slog it out doing max duty hours 5 days a week, so why so critical?
Their Award is freely available on the internet if you look for it.

[Pedalz]

They don't slog it out doing max duty hours 5 days a week, so why so critical?


Some of us still actually have self esteem but hey maybe it's just me?

Apologies for the bluntness but the fact there's people actually defending those in the group working under below award wages because they get a few extra days off a month and can text their mates to cover a flight due to their lack of rostering provisions is astounding.

[DeltaT]

If the mate agrees, and its all legal, whats the problem?

[davidclarke]

They don't slog it out doing max duty hours 5 days a week, so why so critical?
Their Award is freely available on the internet if you look for it.

What a silly comment. So it’s ok to pay well below industry rate then? They also work the most fatiguing duties in the group and almost entirely back of the clock…..but hey let’s pay them less because they work less total hours😡. If anything these roles should be worth more not less.

[aussieflyboy]

I’m sure what the EFA wide body Pilots get paid is comparable to what the Atlas crew operating under the Qantas call signs are getting paid.

[airdualbleedfault]

From the 2021 EBA, for widebodies it appears for 2023 with 0 years seniority:

CN 205,164
FO 138,267

If anyone has more accurate figures would love to hear them
So circa Network 5th year A320 pay, FFS is that legit?

[Capt Fathom]

They also work the most fatiguing duties in the group and almost entirely back of the clock.

Could you elaborate further!

[deja vu]

Some of us still actually have self esteem but hey maybe it's just me?

Apologies for the bluntness but the fact there's people actually defending those in the group working under below award wages because they get a few extra days off a month and can text their mates to cover a flight due to their lack of rostering provisions is astounding.

I would call it self grandiose delusion more than self esteem.
Can thank your sycophantic mainline buddies on short term secondment voting to accept the current EBA for a short term piece of silver.

[soseg]

So circa Network 5th year A320 pay, FFS is that legit?

Network 320 FOs don’t earn that much.

[Lambswool]

Could you elaborate further!

Night freight... Does it need to be elaborated any further?

But i guess if you havent done it then you would be none the wiser. Its conducive to chronic fatigue and ones health suffers as a result. $$ dont fix it, but it should at least be compensated accordingly.

[plotplot]

Some of us still actually have self esteem but hey maybe it's just me?

Apologies for the bluntness but the fact there's people actually defending those in the group working under below award wages because they get a few extra days off a month and can text their mates to cover a flight due to their lack of rostering provisions is astounding.
how many extra days a month actually is it?
Anyone know awhat a typical roster looks like?

[bangbounceboeing]

I’ve searched but can’t find the current EBA online. Anybody have a link ?

[MikeHatter732]

Express Freighters Australia Operations Pty Ltd Enterprise Agreement 2021 | Fair Work Commission (fwc.gov.au) (https://www.fwc.gov.au/document-search/view/3/aHR0cHM6Ly9zYXNyY2RhdGFwcmRhdWVhYS5ibG9iLmNvcmUud2luZG93cy5u ZXQvZW50ZXJwcmlzZWFncmVlbWVudHMvMjAyMi84L0FFNTE3MjI5LnBkZg2? sid=&q=Express%24%24Freighters%24%24pilot)

[bangbounceboeing]

Thank you

[markis10]

EBF will be back in country 23 sept.

[VHOED191006]

Does anyone know if the EFR has been sold off yet?

[deja vu]

What a silly comment. So it’s ok to pay well below industry rate then? They also work the most fatiguing duties in the group and almost entirely back of the clock…..but hey let’s pay them less because they work less total hours😡. If anything these roles should be worth more not less.

So what exactly is "industry rate" Is it Mainline or Virgin or Jetstar, maybe REX or Bonza, then it could be Aero Costa Rica , or Air France or maybe its the "award"

Could be interesting if Tony Bourke's "same job same pay" thing actually happens.EFA paying mainline rates or ice versa.

[vhpjl]

EBF will be back in country 23 sept.


EBF departing PUS - BNE in 5 minutes. ETA 0941z

[puff]

So what exactly is "industry rate" Is it Mainline or Virgin or Jetstar, maybe REX or Bonza, then it could be Aero Costa Rica , or Air France or maybe its the "award"

Could be interesting if Tony Bourke's "same job same pay" thing actually happens.EFA paying mainline rates or ice versa.

There seems to be a misunderstanding of the idea of this policy of 'same job same pay'. Its mainly for usage in say the place of mines - where person A is employed by the mine, and earns 100K a year, person B is employed as a contractor, does the same job as person A, but earns 80K a year.

Its not on the basis that person C earns $160K at another mine doing the same job as person A and B, and that they will now all earn 160K.

Where it effects a company like QF, is the cabin crew where you have mainline crew, and QCCA etc working together on the same aircraft on different wages and conditions, as that is the same as the A/B situation as above.

[Johnny_56]

There seems to be a misunderstanding of the idea of this policy of 'same job same pay'. Its mainly for usage in say the place of mines - where person A is employed by the mine, and earns 100K a year, person B is employed as a contractor, does the same job as person A, but earns 80K a year.

Its not on the basis that person C earns $160K at another mine doing the same job as person A and B, and that they will now all earn 160K.

Where it effects a company like QF, is the cabin crew where you have mainline crew, and QCCA etc working together on the same aircraft on different wages and conditions, as that is the same as the A/B situation as above.

I guess the question then is: Are Qantas group pilots employed by the same company - ie Qantas/“Qantas group” or are they separate companies in fair works eyes.

[Thumb War]

There seems to be a misunderstanding of the idea of this policy of 'same job same pay'. Its mainly for usage in say the place of mines - where person A is employed by the mine, and earns 100K a year, person B is employed as a contractor, does the same job as person A, but earns 80K a year.

Its not on the basis that person C earns $160K at another mine doing the same job as person A and B, and that they will now all earn 160K.

Where it effects a company like QF, is the cabin crew where you have mainline crew, and QCCA etc working together on the same aircraft on different wages and conditions, as that is the same as the A/B situation as above.

So what about the mainline SOs? These days you can have two of them sitting next to each other on vastly different salaries

[Callsign Please]

So what about the mainline SOs?
Fits the intent of the law perfectly, but the main thrust is targeting labour hire, and minister has even said it doesn’t apply to EBA provisions.
Optimistic but not confident.

[Orange future]

So it’s ok to pay well below industry rate then?The EFA conditions are on par with the “industry rates” you speak of.

QF mainline conditions are the outlier and are a relic from a bygone era.

[ResumeOwnNav]

I’m sure what the EFA wide body Pilots get paid is comparable to what the Atlas crew operating under the Qantas call signs are getting paid.

The Atlas CBA is also available online. Those Atlas Crew operating under the Qantas call signs get a base salary of USD97.60 per hour Year 1. Those early E3s now on Year 3 are USD170.74 per hour. Base Salary.

Minimum Monthly Guarantee is 64 hours. Most would average 75-80 hours credit per month. 13-15 days off.

[ZebraFlyer]

You're about right. $6350 USD before tax.

[skrtel]

Why doesn’t the new 330 freighter have the nose gear bump on the body. Like all other a330 freighters ?

[blubak]

Why doesn’t the new 330 freighter have the nose gear bump on the body. Like all other a330 freighters ?
Pretty sure its only 330's actually built as freighters that have the 'bump' as you mention.
The reason it is there is to make the floor level for easier loading/unloading.
The converted 330's have an electric cargo moving system installed to overcome the nose up attitude on ground.
Happy to be corrected on this 1.

[Wizofoz]

Saw an EFA A330 land at Adelaide today.

[KAPAC]

Look at pax A330 they are lower at the front , convert them to freighters and they need to be level , hence the bump underneath . That’s what I was told a decade ago ?

[blubak]

Look at pax A330 they are lower at the front , convert them to freighters and they need to be level , hence the bump underneath . That’s what I was told a decade ago ?
The 'bump' is only fitted on 330's actually built as freighters & it is as you say because the passenger aircraft has a nose down attitude on ground.
Converted 330 freighters do not get the 'bump' as it is required on factory built freighters because the nose gear attachment points are different to get the floor level on the ground for ease of moving freight.
The converted freighters apparently have an electric system installed as part of the conversion because of the issue you say i.e nose down attitude on ground.

[Vacation]

I’m sure what the EFA wide body Pilots get paid is comparable to what the Atlas crew operating under the Qantas call signs are getting paid.

LOL. Not even remotely. If you like min wage (or sometimes less than min wage) and no roster at all, efa is the go

[A320 Flyer]

Lowest paid 330 pilots in the world I believe

[soseg]

An atlas FO second year would be on about 100k a year more

[MK 4A Tank]

Tasman Cargo Airlines definitely!!

[Window heat]

Yep, EFA wages are woeful.

[davidclarke]

Yep, EFA wages are woeful.

Yep. I do wonder, with 8 airframes to be delivered in the new few years, how they plan to get pilots to fly them….it really is a GA outfit. And with the adversarial way QF have treated Network negotiations I doubt there will be enough pilots to even fly the current fleet come negotiation time.

[Gas Chamber]

How did Australian pilots allow bean counters and MBA retards to decimate the industry so badly?
It really is time for dramatic change.
unite the unions and work collaboratively like America.

[prickly]

How did Australian pilots allow bean counters and MBA retards to decimate the industry so badly?
It really is time for dramatic change.
unite the unions and work collaboratively like America.

As much as I dislike what has happened in the industry you can't blame anyone but the pilots. We saw what happened in '89 and continues today, unity became a thing of the past never to be seen again. There will always be someone looking to advance their career even to the expense of their colleagues.

[tiger-palm]

Does anyone know if EFA pilots will fly the A321and A330 as a common fleet type.

[neville_nobody]

How did Australian pilots allow bean counters and MBA retards to decimate the industry so badly? It really is time for dramatic change.unite the unions and work collaboratively like America.

Because pilots never went into management. Every other industry is controlled by the professions. Mining companies are controlled by the geologists and engineers, medicine by the Doctors, Law Firms by the lawyers etc etc. Somehow though aviation seems to get controlled by people with very little operational knowledge. Boeing are at a existential crisis right now because they stop letting the engineers run the show and are paying folks circa $50 000 000 to screw the joint up and go away. QF could arguably be in a similar position. Time will tell how that ends.

[Lapon]

Does anyone know if EFA pilots will fly the A321and A330 as a common fleet type.

Seperate pay scales for narrow and widebodies so not that I can see.
Disc: I don't work there so I don't have all the details.

[soseg]

Does anyone know if EFA pilots will fly the A321and A330 as a common fleet type.

No. Zero chance.

[logansi]

The 'bump' is only fitted on 330's actually built as freighters & it is as you say because the passenger aircraft has a nose down attitude on ground.
Converted 330 freighters do not get the 'bump' as it is required on factory built freighters because the nose gear attachment points are different to get the floor level on the ground for ease of moving freight.
The converted freighters apparently have an electric system installed as part of the conversion because of the issue you say i.e nose down attitude on ground.

This would definitely make sense, on pax A330s its quite common for unlocked units to roll forward under their own weight. As a rampie, the closest I've come to bring crushed as a rampie was when a stuck pallet in the forward hold of an A330 released and suddenly started moving forward quite quickly under its own weight. Could understand this being an even bigger issue with heavier, larger main deck units.