View Full Version : H2 Legacy
Well it seems that Swire shall leave their indelible print on CX and Hong Kong.
The leaders, Hughes and Healey have created a legacy that shall forever haunt CX as they attempt to ramp up their post COVID 19 ops.
Yep, that boardroom meeting in Oct 20 will make sure their impact is felt right throughout the business. The short sightedness of taking government money and cutting limbs to keep the body functioning is coming home to roost. Now the body is sick and any limb there to offer support is...gone. Best of luck in reaching pre pandemic levels after their legacy.
And the funny part is how well they thought they played the HKSAR at the time.
May their legacy forever live in Swine history.
Greg, enjoy those slings in retirement. Patrick best focus on the company cola.
Asianexpress
1st Apr 2023, 12:34
Hear, Hear.
So true H & H.......let so much experienced talent go to the competition.
Babyjet_dododo
2nd Apr 2023, 01:03
Hear, Hear.
So true H & H.......let so much experienced talent go to the competition.
They’re keeping Swire happy and that’s all that matters.
Busbuoy
2nd Apr 2023, 03:47
Let us also not forget that yesterday was the 30th Anniversary of the beginning of the great assault on the pilot workforce. Since Red Oddington started that campaign the progress has been relentless.
Interestingly, Red noted to one of his Cricket Club pilot colleagues at the time that if the pilot workforce had just stood up for themselves mangerment's resolve would have been easily tested.
Do not be deluded into thinking they're happy and they're done cutting.
RAT Management
2nd Apr 2023, 09:19
Let us also not forget that yesterday was the 30th Anniversary of the beginning of the great assault on the pilot workforce. Since Red Oddington started that campaign the progress has been relentless.
Interestingly, Red noted to one of his Cricket Club pilot colleagues at the time that if the pilot workforce had just stood up for themselves mangerment's resolve would have been easily tested.
Do not be deluded into thinking they're happy and they're done cutting.
Don't be deluded that the pilots will ever stick up for themselves!
Flex88
11th Apr 2023, 04:47
They’re keeping Swire happy and that’s all that matters.
You think Swires are "happy" ? They're leveraged to the hilt to the CCP so much so they'll NEVER get out from under their CCP thumb.. They've lost it and they're adjusting their losing slime PR blather to save face. Just like their new masters ..
KABOY
11th Apr 2023, 06:58
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x823/screenshot_2023_04_11_at_4_55_27_pm_bd340d7e4b4169a8dfa00e19 779e02f73292051c.png
I love it when the boys can get a few extra $$$ for their hard work in a year they keep punching out the losses.
May their legacy live on!
Babyjet_dododo
11th Apr 2023, 09:28
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x823/screenshot_2023_04_11_at_4_55_27_pm_bd340d7e4b4169a8dfa00e19 779e02f73292051c.png
I love it when the boys can get a few extra $$$ for their hard work in a year they keep punching out the losses.
May their legacy live on!
We do apologise that we can no longer reward our staff who have reached significant milestones in the company, but bear with us while we stack our directors with a ship load of money.
mngmt mole
12th Apr 2023, 03:58
Well, the reality is if you keep working for the dollars they offer....that will be the dollars they offer
KABOY
12th Apr 2023, 08:47
Well, the reality is if you keep working for the dollars they offer....that will be the dollars they offer
Looking at those numbers, the exec team are pocketing every dollar they are raking from their employees. Nice move by the Swire Exec, they are merely transferring their costs from employee savings to executive renumeration to maintain the calibre of executive or more likely the Swire renumeration bands which have maintained pace with inflation since the 1980's.
Cheers Patrick..
Oasis
12th Apr 2023, 10:14
Think about this next time you take unpaid leave to help out.
KABOY
15th Apr 2023, 23:40
Wall St (https://simplywall.st/stocks/hk/transportation/hkg-293/cathay-pacific-airways-shares/news/cathay-pacific-airways-hkg293-takes-on-some-risk-with-its-us)
Probably smart not taking the additional loan as it guaranteed the lead weight. Now the problem is find those staff to turn that EBIT around. No staff, no revenue, no EBIT. Ronald has been given a ship with the H2 harpoon in the side, something needs to change quickly.
Maybe another HKSAR, "help us please, we know you need us to make HK great again"
LootedfromCPA
16th Apr 2023, 04:47
We do apologise that we can no longer reward our staff who have reached significant milestones in the company, but bear with us while we stack our directors with a ship load of money.
Is this published anywhere? What's the source
LootedfromCPA
16th Apr 2023, 04:50
I hope the execs will feel better with all that cash they stole from the pilots and flight attendants. Don't spend too much cash on therapy 😂
mngmt mole
16th Apr 2023, 06:40
STW, you really are trying too hard. Be a management sycophant, we accept that is your position. Just don't try to suggest that anything to do with the management over the past 30 years is right or reasonable. They have reduced a once great airline to a shadow of its former self. There is no longer a career to be had at CX, only a job. One that is not fit to provide a reasonable return on the time invested. It is a travesty of its former grand self.
(I see you just deleted your post, the one I just replied to. You are a coward as well as craven )
Sam Ting Wong
16th Apr 2023, 07:13
The contract demise alone is no evidence.You ignore the macro side. Almost any airline is less attractive to work for these days. I am sure Pan Am in 1978 was a cool gig. Maybe try to make an argument instead of producing pointless insults, so much less boring.
I said I find it remarkable that pilots are usually politically right of centre, but the moment our industry is affected it's all about unions and labour exploitation.
bored
16th Apr 2023, 09:36
You need to take the difference between correlation and causation into account. The current state of our employer or our contract demise alone is no evidence.You ignore the macro side. Almost any airline is less attractive to work for these days. I am sure Pan Am in 1978 was a cool gig. Maybe try to make an argument instead of producing pointless insults, so much less boring.
I said I find it remarkable that pilots are usually politically right of centre, but the moment our industry is affected it's all about unions and labour exploitation.
Is the "macro side" you refer to the same macro that recently prompted American to write to their pilots advising them their new pay deal would reach USD590K for a senior widebody Captain? Seems pretty attractive!
Sam Ting Wong
16th Apr 2023, 10:22
Yes, a perfect example actually. The market in the US is forcing airlines to pay more.If airlines in the US were able to recruit personel from global sources (as Cathay, EK etc are allowed to), the pay would look very different.
Another indicator for general market forces is the higher pay across multiple airlines in the US.
BusyB
16th Apr 2023, 11:54
STW, the CX passenger service is barely a shadow of what it used to be. That and the lowering of pilot quality and experience is not going to improve by paying staff less.
Sadly, I no longer consider it a safe airline for my family to fly on.
magenta magnet
16th Apr 2023, 12:14
STW, the CX passenger service is barely a shadow of what it used to be. That and the lowering of pilot quality and experience is not going to improve by paying staff less.
Sadly, I no longer consider it a safe airline for my family to fly on.
Not sure if you are bashing cadets or what, but CX has had cadets and hired low time pilots for decades...
If you don't work for CX then I would possibly understand.
Don't make the mistake of thinking experience = quality. I've flown with co-pilots with under 1000 hours and ones with over 7000 hours, the low time one was on another level of professionalism and ability was top notch, the other.... struggled and struggled. Sure not all are the same, but that one person taught me a lot.
Sam Ting Wong
16th Apr 2023, 12:18
STW, the CX passenger service is barely a shadow of what it used to be. That and the lowering of pilot quality and experience is not going to improve by paying staff less.
Sadly, I no longer consider it a safe airline for my family to fly on.
CX employs more or less the same pilots as before, just with worse pay and a lower total. Your safety argument is hence futile. I don't believe safety will be compromised in the future either, but that is a different discussion.
Whether they could have had more aircraft operating today without bleeding to death earlier I really don't know. Let's not forget: it was totally unclear when China would open up, nobody could say. There was probably no worse place on the planet than Hong Kong to have an airline based at for the last 3 years. Look at the competition, or what's left of it.
If you mean by passenger service quality of service on board then I would argue it did not change much. If more pay for thousands of flight attendants would improve service to a point where resulting higher profit would make the investment worthwhile.. no idea.
BusyB
16th Apr 2023, 13:02
What an entertaining pair of responses!
MM, Having been involved in their training I know well the early courses of Cadets were of a high standard. This was enhanced by the experienced crews they flew with.
Don't make the mistake of thinking a high standard cadet can cope with a low experience crew.
STW, When crews are overworked and under-rested the standard does not remain the same. I have seen this myself. As a passenger I have seen and heard disgraceful behaviour by SO's in the galley which all business class were aware of. This would not have happened in the past with only one SO in the crew. What I am aware of in the lowering standards is what I aim to avoid.
You are in a world of your own if you think the cabin service compares with the standard when CX was one of the worlds top 3 Airlines. Look at Utube to see the previous standards. You discredit yourself if you believe what you say.
Babyjet_dododo
17th Apr 2023, 02:36
Is this published anywhere? What's the source
obviously you missed all the announcements by Patricia (Director of People) there was 3 in all
Gaisha
17th Apr 2023, 06:40
CX employs more or less the same pilots as before, just with worse pay and a lower total. Your safety argument is hence futile. I don't believe safety will be compromised in the future either, but that is a different discussion.
Whether they could have had more aircraft operating today without bleeding to death earlier I really don't know. Let's not forget: it was totally unclear when China would open up, nobody could say. There was probably no worse place on the planet than Hong Kong to have an airline based at for the last 3 years. Look at the competition, or what's left of it.
If you mean by passenger service quality of service on board then I would argue it did not change much. If more pay for thousands of flight attendants would improve service to a point where resulting higher profit would make the investment worthwhile.. no idea.
every single person I speak to is appalled at cathay’a service and quality of food. It’s come way down compared to what it was 5 years ago whilst prices have gone up. Many previously loyal customers have decided to move to other carriers and are happy to go via the ME to Europe because they are paying far less and getting a much better product with EK or Qatar. Cathay has a long way to go to win back support of its long standing customers.
Sam Ting Wong
17th Apr 2023, 07:21
Flights are full and that is why prices for remaining seats are high.Doesn't look like there is a demand problem to me.
As I said, I don't know enough about the ROI of on-board service, and I strongly suspect you don't either. Many make the equation good service = good business, which I find simplistic.Look at highly profitable American airlines and their product as an example. But again, I don't know the answer.
More importantly, do you think we get paid more if the on-board service improves or Cathay wins a passenger survey? I am pretty sure the answer is no, which is why I don't care much about what is going on in the back.
controlledrest
20th Apr 2023, 13:29
Look at highly profitable American airlines and their product as an example. But again, I don't know the answer.
Have you flown on a USA carrier? Or are you just repeating what you have heard?
I expected American Airlines to be **** compared with CX, based on what one hears. I flew AA international and domestic. Better seats, better IFE, better food. Less drama and stress. The service was straight forward and efficient. Made CX look like ****. AA are making money and treating their staff well. What is CX doing?