Virgin Recruiting

[sangiovese.]

Just popped up on my LinkedIn. Airbus and Boeing looking for rated.

[GetTheQRH]

Anyone have an up to date pay scale (salary plus variable?). I believe during the previous recruitment if you had under 3000 hours you went onto an FO scale, and 3000+ was straight to standard SFO.

[Rt Hon Jim Hacker MP]

I can’t apply. 17000 hours total time. About 15000 hours A320/330 and B757/767. Current TRE but only about 100 hours in the last 12 months. Shame.

[iburnthings]

I would also be interested in any recent information if anybody is willing to provide it either here or via PM. In particular pay scales, t&c's, rosters and the general life in the company.

Thanks guys.

[byrondaf]

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/920x2000/img_5716_4a0e8e0389609a8215ca0d6a7ac0543cf191bc24.jpg

[hoduka]

Thanks for the table!

Can anyone explain the differences between the 3 columns?


All the best
h.

[Balvenie]

Speaking to a mate who works there, he told me.

base contract - full time ( max 10 days off pm), lifestyle (additional 4 days off pm) lifestyle+ (additional 7 days off pm)

Pay was 20% less than other long haul operators due to only flying 750hrs, but now no limit ie 900 hrs pa, but pay still set for 750.

allowances set to HMRC worldwide rates, so don’t cover cost of down route subsistence in most destinations now

new scheduling agreement is basically EASA duty limits. Expect 2 days off after almost all trips, typical roster 5-7 flights + 1 week of standby per month

contract states which type employed on, so effectively not a seniority system any more. Last round of redundancy 20+ year captains on 747 made redundant

there appears to be significant numbers across all fleets and ranks starting to leaving

[am111]

Anyone know if they’ll consider a ‘frozen’ ATPL? I’ve got the hours to unfreeze it but my airline won’t let me take the LST for the ATPL until the command upgrade.

[737 Jockey]

Anyone know if they’ll consider a ‘frozen’ ATPL? I’ve got the hours to unfreeze it but my airline won’t let me take the LST for the ATPL until the command upgrade.


The advert says you need a full UK issued ATPL by the date of joining, so looks doubtful. I believe you need it to operate as a ‘Cruise Captain’ when there’s two FO’s in the flight deck and Captain is in the bunk.

[VariablePitchP]

Anyone know if they’ll consider a ‘frozen’ ATPL? I’ve got the hours to unfreeze it but my airline won’t let me take the LST for the ATPL until the command upgrade.

That’s very sly of them. May be worth just paying to do it yourself. Might cost a few grand but if it gets you out of a crappy airline and into Virgin a few years earlier it’s paid for itself tens of times over. Granted you’ll miss this campaign but it’ll be fine for next time.

Pretty poor of the airline though, given it adds 10 mins max to a regular sim and then maybe 15 mins of admin for the training captain…

[rudestuff]

Anyone know if they’ll consider a ‘frozen’ ATPL? I’ve got the hours to unfreeze it but my airline won’t let me take the LST for the ATPL until the command upgrade.
You'd have to do an OCC on joining, so you could get the ATPL issued then. There is only one ILS separating you from an ATPL.

[A320baby]

Speaking to a mate who works there, he told me.

base contract - full time ( max 10 days off pm), lifestyle (additional 4 days off pm) lifestyle+ (additional 7 days off pm)

Pay was 20% less than other long haul operators due to only flying 750hrs, but now no limit ie 900 hrs pa, but pay still set for 750.

allowances set to HMRC worldwide rates, so don’t cover cost of down route subsistence in most destinations now

new scheduling agreement is basically EASA duty limits. Expect 2 days off after almost all trips, typical roster 5-7 flights + 1 week of standby per month

contract states which type employed on, so effectively not a seniority system any more. Last round of redundancy 20+ year captains on 747 made redundant

there appears to be significant numbers across all fleets and ranks starting to leaving

Regards to the last comment, I’ve not heard of many leaving other then the senior pilots that have decided to take a financial incentive to leave, managed exit.

I do stand to be correct tho!

In my opinion Virgin is one of the best gigs in UK aviation.

[Whitemonk Returns]

Time to command for an experienced pilot joining now?

Also what's the pension and how much on top of those figures could you expect as an FO in duty pay etc. Cheers

[A320baby]

I’m not to sure with time to command but if you plan on 7-10 years you wouldn’t be far off

pension is pretty good, you pay 6% they put in 15% anything less then 6% and they put in 9%

flight pay is built into your salary so the above figures are all in! Whether you fly or not. Although you get an allowance for each trip which depends on location and duration. This is roughly 150-200$ For the average one night trip!

Apply, good luck! You won’t regret it.

Time to command for an experienced pilot joining now?

Also what's the pension and how much on top of those figures could you expect as an FO in duty pay etc. Cheers

[Jack D]

Rather vague to quote max days off as 10 pm.
what is important is the min days off according to tthe contract one decides to sign .
The “ lifestyle” contract offers 4 extra days off , based on what ? If one was awarded 8 days off
on a base contract + 4 = 12 days . Only 2 more than the quoted max of 10 days with a substantial
salary reduction … this will most likely happen imo.

[sudden twang]

How do HMRC rates stated by Balvenie equate to A320 baby 150-200 US for a nite stop?
Genuine Q

[A320baby]

How do HMRC rates stated by Balvenie equate to A320 baby 150-200 US for a nite stop?
Genuine Q

Balvenie is second hand information mine is first.

[sudden twang]

Balvenie is second hand information mine is first.
thanks for that was he right about EASA FTLs?

[am111]

That’s very sly of them. May be worth just paying to do it yourself. Might cost a few grand but if it gets you out of a crappy airline and into Virgin a few years earlier it’s paid for itself tens of times over. Granted you’ll miss this campaign but it’ll be fine for next time.

Pretty poor of the airline though, given it adds 10 mins max to a regular sim and then maybe 15 mins of admin for the training captain…

The fact that it says an ATPL on joining led me to believe they might still consider fATPL holders. Granted it’ll put me on the back foot slightly but I’d be happy to pay for an LST with a job offer in hand if that’s what is required.

[3Greens]

The fact that it says an ATPL on joining led me to believe they might still consider fATPL holders. Granted it’ll put me on the back foot slightly but I’d be happy to pay for an LST with a job offer in hand if that’s what is required.
it doesn’t work like that. Virgin will be swamped with experienced pilots with thousands of hours; so extremely doubtful they’ll make you an offer with conditions attached.
The onus is on you to make yourself marketable to virgin and to ensure you meet their entry criteria. Otherwise you will be unlikely to make it past even the first filtering stage I’m afraid.

[byrondaf]

The onus is on you to make yourself marketable to virgin and to ensure you meet their entry criteria. Otherwise you will be unlikely to make it past even the first filtering stage I’m afraid.

To add onto this...Zenon also have zero flexibility when it comes to filtering etc. I applied about 3 years back and at the time I applied I had 2450 hours, so they offered me the FO scale, yet if I'd had 2500 hours I'd have gone straight onto the SFO pay scale. This was despite telling them that after working my next months roster I'd have 2500+ and more than likely 3000 by the time I joined. Still, computer said no and I thus declined to go any further. So in your case, unlikely to get through but by all means try.

[BIGBAD]

Regards to the last comment, I’ve not heard of many leaving other then the senior pilots that have decided to take a financial incentive to leave, managed exit.

I do stand to be correct tho!

In my opinion Virgin is one of the best gigs in UK aviation.

You must be getting preferential treatment or have worked for some pretty awful company’s but Virgin is NO longer one of the best gigs in the UK. It’s now a low cost airline from the employees point of view. In the years I have been here to T&Cs have been going backwards and just recently dropped off a cliff. Morale is the worst I have seen in any airline I’ve worked for and there are people leaving.

The figure Balvenie quotes for allowances are accurate. For example all 3 day India trips 100-120$. A 4 day South Africa trip $90. A 4 day Pakistan trip $120. A 4-6 day Caribbean trip ( all inclusive hotel ) $30 .

[BIGBAD]

thanks for that was he right about EASA FTLs?

In a nutshell , yes.

[A320baby]

You must be getting preferential treatment or have worked for some pretty awful company’s but Virgin is NO longer one of the best gigs in the UK. It’s now a low cost airline from the employees point of view. In the years I have been here to T&Cs have been going backwards and just recently dropped off a cliff. Morale is the worst I have seen in any airline I’ve worked for and there are people leaving.

The figure Balvenie quotes for allowances are accurate. For example all 3 day India trips 100-120$. A 4 day South Africa trip $90. A 4 day Pakistan trip $120. A 4-6 day Caribbean trip ( all inclusive hotel ) $30 .

Go on then, what’s a better airline gig in the UK?


looking at my last few trips allowance wise,

$285 $254 (both two night trips) $173 $163 $148 for one night whether it’s good or bad I don’t know, but sounds like you need to get on the Airbus 😉

[BIGBAD]

BA, Tui, Jet2 , Norse, EasyJet, Ryanair for a whole plethora of reasons.

Virgin 2.0 is low cost long haul with all the disadvantages of long haul but none of the pluses of a low cost lifestyle.

I know plenty of guys regretting leaving the Middle East to come here as an FO again , take the big pay cut for the lifestyle. The lifestyle has gone, just a copy of Middle East carriers now but the pay is nothing like it !

But it’s horses for courses, you seem happy with you’re lot so I guess some people think it’s still ok !!!

sounds like you need to get on the Airbus

nah, I’ve already been made redundant before , you’re welcome to it

[Whitemonk Returns]

Go on then, what’s a better airline gig in the UK?


looking at my last few trips allowance wise,

$285 $254 (both two night trips) $173 $163 $148 for one night whether it’s good or bad I don’t know, but sounds like you need to get on the Airbus 😉

Are you joking? A year 1 Jet2 or Easyjet Captain would take 15 years to get back to the same payscale, work harder and have to move to London. If the former stayed put they will be flying to Barbados in the LHS quicker than if they joined Virgin.

​​​​​I was shocked when I seen those payscales, I thought Virgin guys were well paid, I was incorrect.

[Raph737]

Go on then, what’s a better airline gig in the UK?


looking at my last few trips allowance wise,

$285 $254 (both two night trips) $173 $163 $148 for one night whether it’s good or bad I don’t know, but sounds like you need to get on the Airbus 😉

TUI and Jet2 are the best gigs in the U.K.
Shocked at those payscales to be honest.

[am111]

it doesn’t work like that. Virgin will be swamped with experienced pilots with thousands of hours; so extremely doubtful they’ll make you an offer with conditions attached.
The onus is on you to make yourself marketable to virgin and to ensure you meet their entry criteria. Otherwise you will be unlikely to make it past even the first filtering stage I’m afraid.

I thought that might be the case and is supposedly the reason my airline doesn’t allow FOs to take the LST. Historically they were losing too many experienced FOs to other carriers back when the ME3 also required an ATPL. I believe they responded by dropping that requirement. At least that’s how I’ve understood it from talking to my colleagues. I guess Virgin still have the luxury of being picky. Will probably throw an application in anyway. Thanks for all the replies and input folks.

[there she blows]

Are you joking? A year 1 Jet2 or Easyjet Captain would take 15 years to get back to the same payscale, work harder and have to move to London. If the former stayed put they will be flying to Barbados in the LHS quicker than if they joined Virgin.

​​​​​I was shocked when I seen those payscales, I thought Virgin guys were well paid, I was incorrect.
white skunk,
you really need to stay in Harry ramsdens land and allow professional pilots to discuss our improved terms and conditions, life style and ……. STAFF TRAVEL, 5 STARR RESORTS.
You get yourself and family down the Leeds ibis, sun yourself in Yorkshire sunshine

[A320baby]

BA, Tui, Jet2 , Norse, EasyJet, Ryanair for a whole plethora of reasons.

Virgin 2.0 is low cost long haul with all the disadvantages of long haul but none of the pluses of a low cost lifestyle.

I know plenty of guys regretting leaving the Middle East to come here as an FO again , take the big pay cut for the lifestyle. The lifestyle has gone, just a copy of Middle East carriers now but the pay is nothing like it !

But it’s horses for courses, you seem happy with you’re lot so I guess some people think it’s still ok !!!



nah, I’ve already been made redundant before , you’re welcome to it

I’ve worked for two of the above airlines and believe me it’s not pretty! I guess it depends on what your priorities are but for me short haul is a very tough gig.

That being said I get your points and stand corrected! It may not be the best gig in the UK but it’s one of the better jobs out there depending on your circumstances.

I was made redundant and soon realised very quickly how difficult it is to earn a fraction of what I was getting at Virgin doing a much harder job.

[plikee]

You get yourself and family down the Leeds ibis, sun yourself in Yorkshire sunshine

Much better than being jetlagged and not be able to enjoy your off time with your family at all - all for the same pay. Enjoy your time at 5 star resort while you're away of what matters in life. Like it or not, Virgin pay is poor compared to other LH gigs.

[Alrosa]

Different strokes for different folks. Know thyself, what you want from your flying job, what you want from life outside, do the research then apply.

Different people are looking for different things …Virgin might be a great choice for some people, others will be better off at a different gig. I think it’s easy to fall into the trap in these airline-specific threads (I’m seeing it in the BA thread) of thinking everyone thinks like me, is in the same financial situation as me, and is looking for the same things as me.

The good news is in the space of a week, the options for people to look elsewhere have gotten much better.

[plikee]

Different strokes for different folks. Know thyself, what you want from your flying job, what you want from life outside, do the research then apply.

Different people are looking for different things …Virgin might be a great choice for some people, others will be better off at a different gig. I think it’s easy to fall into the trap in these airline-specific threads (I’m seeing it in the BA thread) of thinking everyone thinks like me, is in the same financial situation as me, and is looking for the same things as me.

The good news is in the space of a week, the options for people to look elsewhere have gotten much better.

Spot on - not everyone is the same or have similar priorities. I was about to get my CV fired up, but now that I looked at that pay scale I can't justify a pay-cut of £300k plus over the next 10 years until I get a shot into a position I already have. While VS have a lot of really nice perks, they still fall short on the long run. Wish I was 21 again!

[A320baby]

Different strokes for different folks. Know thyself, what you want from your flying job, what you want from life outside, do the research then apply.

Different people are looking for different things …Virgin might be a great choice for some people, others will be better off at a different gig. I think it’s easy to fall into the trap in these airline-specific threads (I’m seeing it in the BA thread) of thinking everyone thinks like me, is in the same financial situation as me, and is looking for the same things as me.

The good news is in the space of a week, the options for people to look elsewhere have gotten much better.

spot on and totally agree.

[Vokes55]

Different strokes for different folks. Know thyself, what you want from your flying job, what you want from life outside, do the research then apply.

Different people are looking for different things …Virgin might be a great choice for some people, others will be better off at a different gig. I think it’s easy to fall into the trap in these airline-specific threads (I’m seeing it in the BA thread) of thinking everyone thinks like me, is in the same financial situation as me, and is looking for the same things as me.

The good news is in the space of a week, the options for people to look elsewhere have gotten much better.

Correct. Personally I have a far better overall quality of life doing long haul over short haul, having experienced both. Jetlag is usually gone after the first night if managed correctly.

Unfortunately every thread about pay and conditions is hijacked by a particular delusional company lapdog who can’t miss an opportunity to come onto an anonymous public forum and attempt to justify his life choices, so these threads just become a phallus waving contest whilst completely ignoring the fact that everybody is different. Given my life experience, I could never go to a short haul only airline (and no, Jet2 won’t be flying to Barbados any time soon), the same way others couldn’t go to a long haul only airline. Horses for courses.

[Stein7b]

Thanks to the VS folk who have given some info on this thread. I am seeking a bit more info if you have the time.

Trying to find a reason to apply, so looking past the salary scales. Lifestyle is important to me, I live up North and would plan to commute (kids settled in school etc).
If the above post regarding EASA FTL’s and 900hrs is true, is this going to be achievable?
I’m assuming commuters make it work by arriving into LHR night before, trip, then head home on same day after landing.

How many trips are people doing and how are the blocks of days off arranged? (Assuming boeing fleet).

Are the majority of trips bullets? Or is there a good mix even if junior? Do juniors get USA trips regularly on the 787?

How many days leave/year and how many days off a month is typical?

Staff Travel? Anything special or just usual ID90 standby?
Easy to take partner on a trip?

Allowances. Seems to be a bit of uncertainty whether it’s the previous system of a few hundred bucks or the HMRC minimum?

Finally, Overtime. Is there much available? Is it all last minute on the day or could you pick it up as a commuter with a bit of notice?

Thanks.

[Speedbrakes Up]

Living up north is no problem.
Pilots sometimes come down the day before, especially if its an early check in, otherwise most travel down on the day. Really depends how far north you are.

900hrs is the legal maximum, is it achievable, I don't think so, but I do think 800-850 is achievable.

4-5 trips a month, usually 2-3 days off after a trip depending on length of the trip.

Good mix of trips, west coast the majority are 2 nighters, east coast and florida are mainly bullets, as are India, Pakistan is 2-3 night due to the schedule.

Good mix no matter what your seniority is. Its a rotating bid group system, which is wip but will improve.

35 days leave per annum, with 1 day extra per year up to year 10... I think.

Days off per month minimum 10.

Staff travel is good especially with Virgin, standby fares, zed fares, mates rates etc.... ID90 with all over carriers.

Allowance are HMRC global rates.

Overtime, yes plenty for now, but if your full time and only fancy 1 or 2 days off you might be able to move a trip perhaps a day or 2 forward, but If you have a family and plan your life once the roster is out, I'd forget overtime. Unless you for example have a week of annual leave in the middle of school term, and by chance they need extra working, you might be ok.

[Stein7b]

Speedbrakes Up

Thank you, that’s exactly the info I was looking for.

[NAT Zulu]

Well - here I am, 15 years served in VAA and skipper on the A330. Made redundant with no reference to seniority. "Failed" my return interview from the hold pool with an unblemished 15 year record. Used to be a union rep. Probably just coincidence!

.....yeah - great gig.

Think very carefully and do your research diligently.

[BIGBAD]

Thanks to the VS folk who have given some info on this thread. I am seeking a bit more info if you have the time.

Trying to find a reason to apply, so looking past the salary scales. Lifestyle is important to me, I live up North and would plan to commute (kids settled in school etc).
If the above post regarding EASA FTL’s and 900hrs is true, is this going to be achievable?
I’m assuming commuters make it work by arriving into LHR night before, trip, then head home on same day after landing.

How many trips are people doing and how are the blocks of days off arranged? (Assuming boeing fleet).

Are the majority of trips bullets? Or is there a good mix even if junior? Do juniors get USA trips regularly on the 787?

How many days leave/year and how many days off a month is typical?

Staff Travel? Anything special or just usual ID90 standby?
Easy to take partner on a trip?

Allowances. Seems to be a bit of uncertainty whether it’s the previous system of a few hundred bucks or the HMRC minimum?

Finally, Overtime. Is there much available? Is it all last minute on the day or could you pick it up as a commuter with a bit of notice?

I live up North and would plan to commute (kids settled in school etc).
commuting prior to COVID was feasible, from up north or the continent, post COVID it is substantially more difficult. Rosters now only give the minimum required, by agreement or EASA rules. At least half of all trips now only have 2 days off afterwards. This includes India trips which tend to finish late, followed by 2 days off which then can be followed by early Caribbean / USA trips which require commuting the day prior.

Other considerations for commuting, which maybe short term, but are significant at the moment - hotac at LHR has become quite expensive even with staff rates, getting standby seats is almost impossible this summer with lots of last minute cancellations, trains are also very difficult with strikes etc. Rosters, whilst they have stabilised in the last six months are no longer as stable as they used to be due to changes in our scheduling agreement and booking confirmed non refundable tickets (plane/train) is much more of a gamble.

If the above post regarding EASA FTL’s and 900hrs is true, is this going to be achievable?

This is true and more than achievable.regularly roster 80-90+ hrs a month, sometimes with a block of standby or week of leave thrown into the month too !!

I’m assuming commuters make it work by arriving into LHR night before, trip, then head home on same day after landing.
see the answer above, but if you do this you may find you only have 1 clear night at home.

How many trips are people doing and how are the blocks of days off arranged? (Assuming boeing fleet).

Full time 5 trips+. All trips have 2 days off, 5 out of 7 west coast trips have 3 days off, don’t expect to get any more off than that. Quite possible to be rostered 2 west coast trips with 2 days off within a block of 8 days.

Are the majority of trips bullets? Or is there a good mix even if junior? Do juniors get USA trips regularly on the 787?
Almost all trips at least 3 day pattern, 20-24hrs down route. Lot of night flying. Majority of route network USA

How many days leave/year and how many days off a month is typical?
35 days , upto 40 days after 5 years. Minimum 10 days pm, however read that as maximum because roster will be filled with a block of standby to use up spare days

Staff Travel? Anything special or just usual ID90 standby?
Usual interline agreements, ID90s. After 10 years (used to be 5 years) get annual free tickets (1 trip for a family must pay taxes) usually confirmed unless book in busy times

Easy to take partner on a trip? Usually

Allowances. Seems to be a bit of uncertainty whether it’s the previous system of a few hundred bucks or the HMRC minimum?
No uncertainty, it is HMRC rates, if you’re going to India /Pakistan/South Africa around $90-120 for a trip. All inclusive in some Caribbean destinations so almost nothing.

USA trips is more approx $200-240 over a 4 day trip (2 nights down route) but considering the cost of living in the big cities we fly to don’t expect to be able to bring much home

Finally, Overtime. Is there much available? Is it all last minute on the day or could you pick it up as a commuter with a bit of notice?
There is a lot available, at the moment, but you have to live by your phone as it goes quickly and also be willing to not plan your life if you want to do it. Depending on your commute, it can be difficult.

[Twiglet1]

BA, Tui, Jet2 , Norse, EasyJet, Ryanair for a whole plethora of reasons.

Virgin 2.0 is low cost long haul with all the disadvantages of long haul but none of the pluses of a low cost lifestyle.

I know plenty of guys regretting leaving the Middle East to come here as an FO again , take the big pay cut for the lifestyle. The lifestyle has gone, just a copy of Middle East carriers now but the pay is nothing like it !

But it’s horses for courses, you seem happy with you’re lot so I guess some people think it’s still ok !!!



nah, I’ve already been made redundant before , you’re welcome to it

BIGBAD
What's up? If you've been made redundant before you tend to have a different outlook on Airline life. During Covid did you not think think VS might go to the wall?
Pilots from the Middle East not happy? Tell them to go back they are all recruiting again.

[BIGBAD]

BIGBAD
What's up? If you've been made redundant before you tend to have a different outlook on Airline life. During Covid did you not think think VS might go to the wall?
Pilots from the Middle East not happy? Tell them to go back they are all recruiting again.

Not entirely sure what you’re driving at ? I’ve been made redundant twice and worked for many airlines but it doesn’t mean I should be grateful for the crumbs being thrown.

Many airlines have had T&Cs and contracts ripped up, Virgin being no exception. It has gone from being a ‘lifestyle’ airline, ie average pay (for an airline) but good lifestyle to no lifestyle, increased working (20%) and the same pay, after enduring either a 47% cut or redundancy ( although a meagre sub inflation rise is in the pipeline).

it’s rather simplistic to say , go back to where you came from, these are life changing decision, maybe you don’t understand that ?

Some have left, many are biding their time to see what comes in the next year or so. Don’t get me wrong Virgin was a great place to work but times have changed, it may be once again but it will take years to regain just a fraction of what has been lost.

[Stein7b]

BIGBAD. Thanks for your insight.

[Stein7b]

Looking at the payscales posted above. It looks like approx. £4300 net after tax/pension as a Yr1 SFO, that includes flying pay. Does that sound about right?
I imagine the down route subsistence will be swallowed up whilst on the trip so I’ll discount that.

Any idea on the overtime rate?

[737 Jockey]

Is the option to take ‘pension cash’ still available? That would make the salary more liveable until a few rungs up the ladder.

[Nauti]

May I ask what a realistic time to command at VAA is presently, if joining as an SFO?

Also, I assume everybody who meets the threshold hours for SFO joins as SFO1 - ie somebody with significantly more hours wouldn't join on a higher SFO tier? May be a daft question.

[zero/zero]

May I ask what a realistic time to command at VAA is presently, if joining as an SFO?

Also, I assume everybody who meets the threshold hours for SFO joins as SFO1 - ie somebody with significantly more hours wouldn't join on a higher SFO tier? May be a daft question.

Plan on 10 years probably. Might be a bit less with retirements and expansion, but there are also plenty of people who have waited 13-14 years+.

Nope, plenty of people join with much more than the min requirements, but everyone starts on SFO1 payscale.

For overtime questions... disruption payments vary between £630-£1260 per day depending on how much notice you get and whether you're doing it as an additional trip

[Nauti]

Perfect, thank you for the very informative response!

[ChickenRiceAndPeas]

I appreciate this might seem completely unimportant to most people but is it still true that Virgin gets discounted eurostar tickets? If memory serves me right I heard it was something to do with the tribe card. And if so, how do they work? Standby? Minimum notice?

It would make the potential commute more feasible given the LHR/CDG/AMS/(any major airport) chaos going on recently

[CABUS]

Stein, if it helps the starting for an sfo will rise to be a smidge under 79k from September and 82k from January.

[Stein7b]

Stein, if it helps the starting for an sfo will rise to be a smidge under 79k from September and 82k from January.

Thanks Cabus, good to know.

[jimbols6]

The two different lifestyle options are they available from day one of joining the company or is there some kind of 2-3 year waiting list??

Thanks in advance for the information

[A320baby]

there’s a waiting list atm but that could all change

The two different lifestyle options are they available from day one of joining the company or is there some kind of 2-3 year waiting list??

Thanks in advance for the information

[zero/zero]

there’s a waiting list atm but that could all change

Well sort of… it’s still at a trial stage but everyone that wanted it when it was originally offered got it AFAIK.

Company have recently said you’ll be able to bid for which contract you want on an annual basis. There’ll be a new trawl for it shortly and then we’ll see what the uptake is… it will be allocated in seniority order apparently (although they’re still reluctant to issue the seniority list so who knows)

The problem is that currently the part timers are working nearly as many hours as the full timers (working more in their available days). BALPA and Virgin have promised that hours will even out according to the percentage pay, but the honouring/transparency of industrial agreements is currently flaky at best, so this remains to be seen.

[A320baby]

Well sort of… it’s still at a trial stage but everyone that wanted it when it was originally offered got it AFAIK.

Company have recently said you’ll be able to bid for which contract you want on an annual basis. There’ll be a new trawl for it shortly and then we’ll see what the uptake is… it will be allocated in seniority order apparently (although they’re still reluctant to issue the seniority list so who knows)

The problem is that currently the part timers are working nearly as many hours as the full timers (working more in their available days). BALPA and Virgin have promised that hours will even out according to the percentage pay, but the honouring/transparency of industrial agreements is currently flaky at best, so this remains to be seen.

What he said, you’ve summed it up perfectly!

[zero/zero]

SUMMARY:

For those thinking about it, Virgin is a tough place to recommend currently.

It’s a very different company to what it was 3+ years ago. It used to have the best lifestyle in the UK IMHO, but right now it probably offers one of the worst. Joining at the moment comes with a fairly serious health warning and you will fly 90+hrs a month with a mix of east, west, min rest that destroys your body. It is Emirates/Qatar without the tax free salary.

I still enjoy it, but I live close to LHR and have a very understanding wife and kids that can cope without daddy being home. I have friends elsewhere that are interested in applying but my honest advice to them as a mate is to stay where they are.

It might get better… we have some very capable people in the VACC, but they are faced with management that are desperate to cut every possible corner to pay back the sizeable Covid debts. The next few years will probably be very volatile as we fight the company for every inch.

Your decision depends on individual circumstances and there are many jobs that are worse, but apply with your eyes open that this isn’t the company that it used to be.

[Dunhovrin]

Well - here I am, 15 years served in VAA and skipper on the A330. Made redundant with no reference to seniority. "Failed" my return interview from the hold pool with an unblemished 15 year record. Used to be a union rep. Probably just coincidence!

Blimey!

Did Balpa not have anything to say about that? I mean, a union rep and all.

[Nauti]

I'd be very appreciative if anybody (privately if preferred) could show me a snapshot of a recent, fairly standard roster month. Thank you very much in advance.

[NAT Zulu]

Blimey!

Did Balpa not have anything to say about that? I mean, a union rep and all.

Oh they certainly did! One has formally apologised and provided compensation for falsehoods propogated in response to awkward questions being asked about what really happened behind closed doors in consultations with management. They are subject of active litigation along with the Company, and so it would be wrong to say anything here pertaining to what they did "actually say about it"! Suffice to say that there was unbelievable toxicity and they most certainly did not help when the executions were carried out from their "industry leading redundancy hold pool".

There are now multiple pilots involved in consolidated legal claims against the Company that are scheduled for six weeks worth of hearing in the future. Like others have said (likely VAA long timers as opposed to newer voices on here).....do your research.

There are some very accurate appraisals on this thread, and others - not so much. I guess it probably depends on how much actual experience you have in VAA and if you have known anything different in VAA before the last few years. This along with a truthful self appraisal of what you want for your own personal future (and perhaps most importantly - what your family wants!)

But one fact to be aware of : seniority is not something you can rely on at VAA now the precedent has been set. This is worth considering in this volatile industry of ours when you are waiting for a command for ten years! I waited twelve in the RHS and was unceremoniously made redundant at fifteen years from the LHS.

I was not a BALPA rep, BTW. Like I said, prob just coincidence.

Look through untinted glasses....if it is still for you compared to your current gig, good luck and go for it.

[Seosan]

I'd be very appreciative if anybody (privately if preferred) could show me a snapshot of a recent, fairly standard roster month. Thank you very much in advance.

Would also be very keen to see this if possible.

[iburnthings]

Apologies if it's been asked before. Can anyone clarify the difference between the FO/SFO payscales? Do you enter direct as SFO if experienced with certain amount of jet hours? Or does everyone enter on FO1 now?

Thanks for sharing info guys.

[moorie88]

Apologies if it's been asked before. Can anyone clarify the difference between the FO/SFO payscales? Do you enter direct as SFO if experienced with certain amount of jet hours? Or does everyone enter on FO1 now?

Thanks for sharing info guys.


Over 2,500 hours= SFO

[ser]

I've had the prescreening phone interview with Zenon, they're not hiring SFOs. Regardless of hours, the contract on offer is around FO2 on the payscale above. Apparently that is "base pay" but they had no details on flight pay or pension.

[midnight cruiser]

So the second year would be SFO3?

[Nauti]

I've had the prescreening phone interview with Zenon, they're not hiring SFOs. Regardless of hours, the contract on offer is around FO2 on the payscale above. Apparently that is "base pay" but they had no details on flight pay or pension.

This seems a little shortsighted, considering the options out there at the moment. And also that they were recruiting SFOs pre-covid.

[ser]

So the second year would be SFO3?

No, not sure what the scale is now, they said the current offer was ~£65k, I imagine that is the latest FO1 rate. I have over 4000 hours and they said it's the same offer regardless of hours. Worth noting that they also offer medical/LOL/dental/critical illness/travel insurance in the package.

[iburnthings]

Is that figure all in? Or with variable/flight pay on top?

[ser]

Is that figure all in? Or with variable/flight pay on top?

I think someone working at Virgin would have to clarify that. I asked the question and he said that 65k was just the base pay but he had no details regarding flight pay or pension yet.

[Speedbrakes Up]

65K is FO1 pay scale. To reach Sfo Pay scale its 2 years.

65k is all in, no flight pay to go on top.

[ppljames]

I've had the prescreening phone interview with Zenon, they're not hiring SFOs. Regardless of hours, the contract on offer is around FO2 on the payscale above. Apparently that is "base pay" but they had no details on flight pay or pension.

Are you happy to give any insight as to what the pre-screening interview consisted of? Thanks

[ser]

Are you happy to give any insight as to what the pre-screening interview consisted of? Thanks

For myself, it was a half an hour phone call, a very friendly guy, and the usual questions:
- "Why Virgin?", "why do you want to leave your current role" etc.,
- They run through your CV and check your hours are correct.
- The last section is where it's different, they ask you a few questions that are related to Virgin's new marketing campaign of inclusivity and being yourself. "Behavioural evaluation" I think they call it.
- If you've passed the initial screening and they've sent you the two emails with attachments, in the born-to-fly document if you go down to the "Our Values" page, this is probably the best prep material, it felt like they were looking for answers that aligned with company values.

From memory, I was asked these questions which led to more questions based on my answers.

"What is the difference between inclusivity and diversity?"
"How is diversity good in a team?"
"How does a diverse crew affect the customer experience?"
"As a First Officer, how would you go above and beyond for Virgin Atlantic?"
"Virgin wants to be everyone's favourite airline, how would you go about presenting that to customers in your day-to-day career"
One Scenario-based question, I got "Aircraft change, ATC slot, the captain wants to skip the briefing as done before on the previous aircraft, what are the considerations and what would you do?"

[Cavallier]

You got asked this on the screening call ?

[ser]

You got asked this on the screening call ?

If you meet the requirements, they will call you to arrange a telephone interview. The above was asked during that telephone interview. This is phase two of five of their selection process, labelled "Zenon Pre-Screen Telephone Interview & Behavioural/Performance based evaluation"

[Stein7b]

I’ve read in a previous thread that they have used cut-e psychometric tests in the past. Does anyone know if this is still the case?
Thanks

[Hueymeister]

Someone delete the table?

[moorie88]

Someone delete the table?


The pay scales? They're on page 1. I believe all the numbers need +4% due to the new pay deal.

[Seosan]

I read in a recent BALPA email that improved scheduling was voted on and agreed as part of the VS pay deal. Can anyone shed light on the improvements? I presume the return of 700 hours wasn’t on the cards

[Nauti]

Has everybody who applies heard back? I applied shortly after it opened, meet all the requirements etc but nothing heard yet.

[737 Jockey]

Think they’re still working their way through the pre-covid hold pool. Someone I know who was in that pool just had his interview, sim ride and job offer this week.

[Byrne11]

What is the Psychometric Assessment like? Are they essentially Cut E tests?

[moorie88]

Has everybody who applies heard back? I applied shortly after it opened, meet all the requirements etc but nothing heard yet.

Yes,

Prescreen interview tomorrow. Applied same day it launched.

[Sharklet]

Has everybody who applies heard back? I applied shortly after it opened, meet all the requirements etc but nothing heard yet.

I heard back on Monday this week. Did not meet the recency requirements (200 hours in the last 12 months) so it was a rejection.

[back to Boeing]

I heard back on Monday this week. Did not meet the recency requirements (200 hours in the last 12 months) so it was a rejection.
out of curiosity. Why did you apply if you did not meet the requirements.

[b4dger]

Had anyone had the competency telephone/Skype interview scheduled yet?

[Sharklet]

out of curiosity. Why did you apply if you did not meet the requirements.

Good question. Since I am 787 rated, it was rumoured that they were in need of rated guys and could potentially overlook the recency part. I guess that rumour remained a rumour. As a matter of fact, it's 0 hours in the last 30 months in my case...

[plikee]

As a matter of fact, it's 0 hours in the last 30 months in my case...

That's your actual reason. Keep trying everywhere, and good luck for your future

[737 Jockey]

Good question. Since I am 787 rated, it was rumoured that they were in need of rated guys and could potentially overlook the recency part. I guess that rumour remained a rumour. As a matter of fact, it's 0 hours in the last 30 months in my case...


Sorry to hear that. Did you get an email from Zenon?

Have you tried Norse? A few mates (787 rated) have started there recently and also hadn’t flown since March 2020. Good luck!

[ToCatLady]

I believe the 200 hour limit is based on virgin doing an OCC course for rated pilots. To do so I think you need to be rather current so it’s only a few sims and an LPC rather than a full course. Correct me if I’m wrong…

[back to Boeing]

Good question. Since I am 787 rated, it was rumoured that they were in need of rated guys and could potentially overlook the recency part. I guess that rumour remained a rumour. As a matter of fact, it's 0 hours in the last 30 months in my case...

The reality in 2022 is if you don’t tick every single box exactly as per the job spec, you’ll be dumped out. There will be so many that have applied, sifting is done mercilessly. If they didn’t want it they wouldn’t have asked for it.

[Sharklet]

Sorry to hear that. Did you get an email from Zenon?

Have you tried Norse? A few mates (787 rated) have started there recently and also hadn’t flown since March 2020. Good luck!

Yes I did, plus I followed up with a phone call, which they happily answered, and explained that it was because of my recency (the e-mail simply mentioned 'eligibility requirements').

[Seosan]

Looking for some clarification; on the job description it says "You must have a minimum experience of 1,500 hours of total flying time on the above with at least 500 hours current on type (hours spent solely as a cruise pilot are not included)."

Does this mean that it's a minimum of 1,500 hours on Airbus/Boeing or 1,500 total flying time?

[737 Jockey]

Looking for some clarification; on the job description it says "You must have a minimum experience of 1,500 hours of total flying time on the above with at least 500 hours current on type (hours spent solely as a cruise pilot are not included)."

Does this mean that it's a minimum of 1,500 hours on Airbus/Boeing or 1,500 total flying time?


i agree it isn’t written very clearly. Assuming the real requirement here is the ability to act as a cruise pilot/Captain whilst the skipper is resting in the bunk, the following requirements for an ATPL issue (from U.K. CAA website) are:Flight timeYou must have completed a minimum of 1500 hours of flight time in aeroplanes, including at least:

1. 500 hours in multi-pilot operations on aeroplanes

2. 500 hours as Pilot in command under supervision (PICUS) or
250 hours as Pilot in Command (PIC)
or
250 hours to include a minimum of 70 hours as PIC and the remainder as PICUS.

3. 200 hours of cross-country flight time, of which at least 100 hours should be as PIC or as PIC under supervision

4. 75 hours of instrument time, of which not more than 30 hours can be instrument ground time

5. 100 hours of night flight as PIC or co-pilot.

Of the 1500 hours of total flight time required, up to 100 hours can be completed in a suitable simulator (FFS or FNPT - but only a maximum of 25 hours may be completed in an FNPT).


Therefore I’d suggest it’s 1500 hours total flight time, with 500 hours on one of the Airbus/Boeing aircraft mentioned. This, in order to save time and money, giving the ability to do a shorter conversion course rather than full type rating.

[Stein7b]

I spoke to Zenon last week, apparently the SFO payscale isn’t an option, regardless of hours everyone will start on circa. £65k (this includes flight pay).

Has anyone heard anything different? Anyone from the inside able to confirm this please?

Thanks

Feel free to PM.

[Rhodes13]

I spoke to Zenon last week, apparently the SFO payscale isn’t an option, regardless of hours everyone will start on circa. £65k (this includes flight pay).

Has anyone heard anything different? Anyone from the inside able to confirm this please?

Thanks

Feel free to PM.

That is incorrect, Zenon are giving the incorrect information. Anyone meeting the criteria for SFO will join on the SFO pay scales.

[moorie88]

That is incorrect, Zenon are giving the incorrect information. Anyone meeting the criteria for SFO will join on the SFO pay scales.


Be great if true. What's the source of this information?

[pudoc]

Be great if true. What's the source of this information?

I don’t know where the person you’re quoting got that info from. But they are correct, I asked management and a friend has got the job starting SFO pay.

[Stein7b]

I don’t know where the person you’re quoting got that info from. But they are correct, I asked management and a friend has got the job starting SFO pay.

I was told by Zenon that for this current recruitment campaign the SFO rate wasn’t on offer. Was your friend in the hold pool from a previous round?

I hope Zenon have incorrect info but I don’t know who else to ask as they are the contact for recruitment.

It’s a deal breaker for me hence why I’ve asked the question on here.

[737 Jockey]

I was told by Zenon that for this current recruitment campaign the SFO rate wasn’t on offer. Was your friend in the hold pool from a previous round?

I hope Zenon have incorrect info but I don’t know who else to ask as they are the contact for recruitment.

It’s a deal breaker for me hence why I’ve asked the question on here.



a current colleague got the offer from VA last week and he said it’s definitely SFO Y1. We’ll see when the contract comes through I guess!

[Pilapt]

Anyone done the Cut-E assessment yet? If so, which tests do you have to do as part of it?

[antonov09]

I spoke to Zenon last week, apparently the SFO payscale isn’t an option, regardless of hours everyone will start on circa. £65k (this includes flight pay).

Has anyone heard anything different? Anyone from the inside able to confirm this please?

Thanks

Feel free to PM.


Someone I know that was half through the process with Zenon before Covid hit and recently just picked up where he/she left off. That person has hours for SFO and was offered SFO recently. So this person was not in a hold pool (Just a couple of stages ahead). Why would they get offered SFO and someone beginning process with required hours would not?

[Stein7b]

Someone I know that was half through the process with Zenon before Covid hit and recently just picked up where he/she left off. That person has hours for SFO and was offered SFO recently. So this person was not in a hold pool (Just a couple of stages ahead). Why would they get offered SFO and someone beginning process with required hours would not?

Thanks for the info. I can’t answer your question though. I can only hope that if successful, the offer will be on SFO rates.

[egwechris]

Anyone done the Cut-E assessment yet? If so, which tests do you have to do as part of it?

Yes CUT-E tests, very similar to these:
https://www.pilotest.com/en/

[Pilapt]

Thanks egwechris! Does it consist of all of the tests found under CUT-E on that site? Or just a select few of them? Cheers

[moorie88]

Yes CUT-E tests, very similar to these:
https://www.pilotest.com/en/


Surely not as hard as some of those 😑

Any in particular you got from that site?

[Seosan]

Did anyone get an email prior to being phoned by Zenon or was it out of the blue?

[roll_over]

Did anyone get an email prior to being phoned by Zenon or was it out of the blue?

Out of the blue mate to check up regarding the 200hrs.

[Seosan]

Out of the blue mate to check up regarding the 200hrs.

Cheers mate. Roughly how long from app submission was it before they called?

[Sharklet]

Out of the blue mate to check up regarding the 200hrs.

Were they interested in the type you did the 200 hours on?

[Byrne11]

Has anyone any experience of the competency based interview?

[moorie88]

Has anyone any experience of the competency based interview?


Looking for the same
Was thinking to setup a WhatsApp group, anyone interested or can share ?

[ToCatLady]

It’s a competency based interview? What ideas are you going to share?

“Tell me a time when…” it’s really that simple.

If you need a WhatsApp group to navigate past this stage, Zenon have a gigantic task on their hands.

pretty sure Virgin aren’t looking for Pilot’s who need their hands holding throughout.

[moorie88]

It’s a competency based interview? What ideas are you going to share?

“Tell me a time when…” it’s really that simple.

If you need a WhatsApp group to navigate past this stage, Zenon have a gigantic task on their hands.

pretty sure Virgin aren’t looking for Pilot’s who need their hands holding throughout.


Clearly you're a little narrow minded.

It's for the whole process and to get to know other people who you maybe in a type rating with.

[clvf88]

It’s a competency based interview? What ideas are you going to share?

“Tell me a time when…” it’s really that simple.

If you need a WhatsApp group to navigate past this stage, Zenon have a gigantic task on their hands.

pretty sure Virgin aren’t looking for Pilot’s who need their hands holding throughout.

Why are you here :ugh:

[b4dger]

How long did it take for people to hear back after the competency interview to see if they were then invited to the sim?

[JMS90]

In the process too. Comp Interview next week, when arranging this, Zenon were pencilling in dates for the sim within Sept too (providing Interview goes well..of course). Think VA are recuiting in 'batches' and if we're getting all these done now, we're in batch 1 according to someone at Zenon (pinch of salt to be taken) so trying to fire people through.

Would be good to chat people on potential type rating groups, cheers.

[moorie88]

Anyone who wants into the WhatsApp group - PM me your number and I'll add you

[Rostermouse]

Why not wait until you actually get offered a job before setting up a type-rating WhatsApp group, like normal people? :ugh:

[Nauti]

😂😂 ok​​

[pudoc]

Management has again confirmed that pilots with >3000hours will join on SFO pay, not FO pay.

[BIGBAD]

I read in a recent BALPA email that improved scheduling was voted on and agreed as part of the VS pay deal. Can anyone shed light on the improvements? I presume the return of 700 hours wasn’t on the cards

The only improvements in lifestyle is a guaranteed 3 days off after some flights, still a lot of trips with only 2 days off after and no more than a maximum of 1 block of standby/reserve allocated at roster production ( no more than 7 days per block). However trips can still be replaced by standby blocks at the live stage.

Other improvements 2.5% pay rise this year and 4% next year.

[737 Jockey]

Re: Zenon pre screening interview.

Anyone who’s already completed this care to share the ‘three’ questions asked? PM if you like. TIA

[Stein7b]

Re: Zenon pre screening interview.

Anyone who’s already completed this care to share the ‘three’ questions asked? PM if you like. TIA

The info provided earlier in this thread is accurate.

[737 Jockey]

Anyone who’s competed the stage 2 pre screening interview with Zenon. How long did you wait to complete the online tests?

Cheers.

[Twiglet1]

The only improvements in lifestyle is a guaranteed 3 days off after some flights, still a lot of trips with only 2 days off after and no more than a maximum of 1 block of standby/reserve allocated at roster production ( no more than 7 days per block). However trips can still be replaced by standby blocks at the live stage.

Other improvements 2.5% pay rise this year and 4% next year.
Bigbad any agreement on total leave and days off in a year?

[vpcaptain]

Hi everyone just looking at some practice cut e tests and there are a multitude of online companies advertising practice tests can anyone recommend the best one ( not necessarily the cheapest ) who will give a representative sample of the virgin tests

thanks vpcaptain

[Stein7b]

Hi everyone just looking at some practice cut e tests and there are a multitude of online companies advertising practice tests can anyone recommend the best one ( not necessarily the cheapest ) who will give a representative sample of the virgin tests

thanks vpcaptain

I used Skytest, they were good preparation for the actual tests.

[vpcaptain]

Thanks Stein7b will check them out

[NP1927]

I used Skytest, they were good preparation for the actual tests.


Which part of Skytest tests did you use?

[Subria321]

Has anyone completed the final stage virgin interview? Is it competency based or does it include a technical side as well?

Thanks
321

[smith]

What's best? Integrated or modular?

[Sharklet]

What's best? Integrated or modular?

The Search function.

[PilotPhil]

Hi,

Thanks for all the information. I have the final interview soon and was wondering what level of technical questions will come up?

[Barcli]

Need to be quick guys - they wont be around for long.......

[737 Jockey]

Need to be quick guys - they wont be around for long.......


What are you alluding to there?

[kendrick47247]

Need to be quick guys - they wont be around for long.......

What are you alluding to there?

A troll to be ignored. Looking at their post history, they’re angered/terrified by Virgin’s steps towards inclusivity

[Fiddlesticks]

has anyone done the sim yet

[Phantom4]

has anyone done the sim yet

Sim two sectors PF PM return ,LHR to LGW SID,NDB tracking,abnormal event, radar to ILS,steep turns.
return LGW to LHR same.

[webby_crx]

Sim two sectors PF PM return ,LHR to LGW SID,NDB tracking,abnormal event, radar to ILS,steep turns.
return LGW to LHR same.


Which aircraft type are they using for the sim?

[moorie88]

737-8 Fixed base

[manflexsrsrwy]

Any info of what ZENON recruitment ask in the pre screening telephone interview ?
many thanks in anticipation

[Stein7b]

Any info of what ZENON recruitment ask in the pre screening telephone interview ?
many thanks in anticipation

All the info you need is further up the thread.

[chemtrail_operator]

Hello,

Is the full time contract at Virgin suitable for commuting from a major European city to LHR?

How many round trips would be necessary in one month?

Thanks :)

[IrishCarrotts]

Hi All,

On the Virgin Roster, is it possible to commute?

Living in Dublin so this is a deal breaker!

Hear it’s only 2 days OFF in between trips. Is this true? if so the job is a no go.

Thank you

[Time Traveller]

I would suggest watching the latest Virgin advert on a loop (and'making of', on YouTube). If after that, you dig it, all groovy, then go for it. If it leaves you feeling a bit bewildered and discombobulated, I really wouldn't bother - you won't be for Virgin, and they won't be for you. (I do wonder though, if the main demographic of their paying clientele might come to the same conclusion, particularly being so systematically airbrushed out from the media).

[Capt. G L Walker]

and they won't be for you.

Nota bene.

[babaorhum]

Can anyone confirm if new joiners are now on 10% company pension contribution?

[737 Jockey]

Think they said it was 8% company contribution if you put in the same. Quite different to existing crew I believe.

[CABUS]

From what I am aware nothing has changed, all pilots are joining on the standard 6% personal and 15% company.

[737 Jockey]

Well, I sure hope I’m (Zenon) are wrong and you’re right.

[A320baby]

Well, I sure hope I’m (Zenon) are wrong and you’re right.

15% from the company is correct

[Olivez]

Hi guys,
Anyone has done the Zenon competency interview and minds sharing some hints, whether here (better) or thru DM?
Thanks!

[737275]

Any chance someone would be willing to post or DM me an example of a SFO monthly schedule?? Thanks in advance.

[ToCatLady]

Well, I sure hope I’m (Zenon) are wrong and you’re right.


sounds like Zenon have been getting quite a lot wrong throughout this process. I’ve had three different agents contact me to start the process all without knowing that I’m already half way through.

on top of that, each one will tell you wildly different info regarding the process, contract, terms and requirements.

VS have to get that in order next time they recruit as Zenon are giving it a bad name right now.

[kmw63]

Anyone with recent information on the final interview they'd be willing to share -- especially what they mean by 'technical questions' -- just how technical are we talking?

Thanks!

[Lordflasheart]

...
Roll up ! Roll up ! Virgin Atlantic is recruiting Second Officers.

https://www.zenon.aero/jobs/5171-virgin-atlantic-b787-second-officer/

" ... you’ll provide consistent operational excellence above the clouds ..."

Will they be bonded (or have to pay) for their 787 Type Rating ?

LFH
...

[RARA9]

this truly is a shame to see !
Virgin have gone down hill rather quickly it seems.
but maybe a better option for many

[A320LGW]

Difficult to imagine leaving a job where you’re crucial to the crew composition and get to fly daily to go and be a cruise pilot. If it was a cadet role similar to cathay then fair enough, but it’s not based on the 500 jet/prop requirement. I’m not convinced.

[737 Jockey]

Virgin HR seemed to have lost the plot with recruitment.

They’ve turned down many decent, experienced pilots who don’t fit into their narrow minded, cloud cuckoo vision of what a modern day, professional pilot should be, that they’re now scraping the barrel looking for cruise pilots.

I sympathise with Zenon who are spending all that time and effort selecting candidates, only for Virgin to chop them at the final interview. Someone is not communicating properly somewhere along the line… a real shame!

[kmw63]

Difficult to imagine leaving a job where you’re crucial to the crew composition and get to fly daily to go and be a cruise pilot. If it was a cadet role similar to cathay then fair enough, but it’s not based on the 500 jet/prop requirement. I’m not convinced.

Am I missing something? Where does it say the role is cruise relief pilot only?

I know of other outfits in the UK that use the term 'Second Officer' purely to denote a lower pay point for less experienced pilots?

[Seosan]

Difficult to imagine leaving a job where you’re crucial to the crew composition and get to fly daily to go and be a cruise pilot. If it was a cadet role similar to cathay then fair enough, but it’s not based on the 500 jet/prop requirement. I’m not convinced.

Not exactly uncommon in our industry. In NZ/Aus it’s very common that you’ll give up a prop command for a jet gig on the jumpseat.

Is the Airbus a mixed fleet at VS or will successful FOs be routed into 330 or 350 independently?

[kendrick47247]

You mean anyone who doesn't turn up to assessment day with a handbag and wearing glittered mascara? :E

What a stupid and narrow minded comment.

[Lordflasheart]

...
Am I missing something? Where does it say the role is cruise relief pilot only?

I think the clue is in the genteel expression "... above the clouds ..." (Fourth paragraph of the Zenon advert ) https://www.zenon.aero/jobs/5171-vir...econd-officer/ (https://www.zenon.aero/jobs/5171-virgin-atlantic-b787-second-officer/)

No mention of type ratings or bonds etc. I guess you get a company-specific, non-portable ticket that would be useless elsewhere, and won't get you any P1S time either.

I would be pleased to be told it ain't so.

LFH
...

[SpamCanDriver]

...


I think the clue is in the genteel expression "... above the clouds ..." (Fourth paragraph of the Zenon advert ) https://www.zenon.aero/jobs/5171-vir...econd-officer/ (https://www.zenon.aero/jobs/5171-virgin-atlantic-b787-second-officer/)

No mention of type ratings or bonds etc. I guess you get a company-specific, non-portable ticket that would be useless elsewhere, and won't get you any P1S time either.

I would be pleased to be told it ain't so.

LFH
...

Exactly
Also specifically states supporting the Capt & FO, that would highly suggest being a cruise pilot, to me anyway

"Supporting the Commander and First Officer, you’ll provide consistent operational excellence above the clouds"

[sangiovese.]

Here’s an idea. Just throwing it out there. If you’re genuinely interested show a bit of determination and phone up Zenon and ask? Or just slate UK opportunities from afar before having any facts?

[Kibathepilot]

Anyone got any idea on what they would be paying second officers? the post only says competetive

[Busdriver01]

I suggest those who are confused have another read of the advert. its very clear it's a two year stint as SO/Cruise pilot, with the opportunity to then become an FO. It's not great for experienced pilots but if you were put in the bin during covid with low hours and have been flying somewhere else recently (lots went off to wizz) this is a way back to the UK which may have to be taken for some. Good luck to you all!

[BIGBAD]

Top cadet pay scale is circa £44k and bottom FO is circa £63k . Guessing it will be somewhere in between , probably more likely to be nearer the bottom of those two !!!!

[ToCatLady]

Second officer starting salary is 59k.

[Burger81]

Second officer starting salary is 59k.
Can I ask were you came about this info? A Virgin recruiter my mate messaged directly didn’t even know this info at this stage.

Cheers

[geardown1]

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/920x1992/img_5716_4a0e8e0389609a8215ca0d6a7ac0543cf191bc24_b67fc64be5 d3408da5cacffc13969599995ef30a.jpg
This may be out of date already, and found above in this forum, but no SO position showing, possibly around the same as CDT figures?

[Lordflasheart]

... phone up Zenon and ask ? ...

Well we did ask but were ignored which I understand is industry standard until you have been personally registered as an applicant, and then some.

They all say 'competitive'. ... Well they would, wouldn't they ?

In this case, the word in our pub last Friday is that no decision about pay scales for Virgin Cruise Pilots has yet been made. They are waiting to see how many applicants they attract before deciding how low they can afford to pitch the pay.

LFH

[AIMINGHIGH123]

It was posted above £59k.

I can confirm that is what I was told on the phone as well.
SO cruise pilot
£59k year 1
£60k year 2

When you move to FO you move to first pay point.
The only real benefit is seniority when it comes to command.
You would be ahead of an FO/SFO if they joined after you.

[srjumbo747]

What a stupid and narrow minded comment.
No it’s not. It’s actually closer to the truth than you realise!
Feel free to wear high heels and make up guys!

[kendrick47247]

No it’s not. It’s actually closer to the truth than you realise!
Feel free to wear high heels and make up guys!

I stand by what I said. A forward thinking stance from Virgin, quickly replicated elsewhere.

Welcome to the world where people are (hopefully) not restricted to antiquated gender norms or stereotypes and do not have to kowtow to narrow minded dinosaurs, in or out of the flight deck.

[Vokes55]

I stand by what I said. A forward thinking stance from Virgin, quickly replicated elsewhere.

Welcome to the world where people are (hopefully) not restricted to antiquated gender norms or stereotypes and do not have to kowtow to narrow minded dinosaurs, in or out of the flight deck.

The problem for Virgin is that whilst it's become socially unacceptable for people to openly disagree with their virtue signalling, the company relies on people buying tickets to stay afloat. As this is a thread about recruitment and pilots making career moves into the airline, it is important to highlight that a significant number of people/dinosaurs either disagree with Virgin's stance or are fed up with being preached to and told what to think, and will actively avoid flying with Virgin as a result. This has serious implications on job security.

[Potatos_69]

The problem for Virgin is that whilst it's become socially unacceptable for people to openly disagree with their virtue signalling, the company relies on people buying tickets to stay afloat. As this is a thread about recruitment and pilots making career moves into the airline, it is important to highlight that a significant number of people/dinosaurs either disagree with Virgin's stance or are fed up with being preached to and told what to think, and will actively avoid flying with Virgin as a result. This has serious implications on job security.

If virgin is offering tickets at the right price and start/end points those old dinosaurs won’t care and will still book tickets.

I think you’ll find the vast majority of pax won’t give a sh1t so long as they are served professionally by the crew taking care of them and get to their destination relatively on time.

There will be a few people screaming about this, but the silent majority just want to get on with their lives and holidays/flights…

[BentleyTheDog]

Hi, has anyone that applied for the Virgin SO position heard anything back yet?

Thanks

[Kibathepilot]

Hi, has anyone that applied for the Virgin SO position heard anything back yet?

Thanks

Applied on the website as instructed and was emailed the other day to ask for details and copies of licence and such to be sent on but not heard back since. (they asked friday last week)

[VariablePitchP]

The problem for Virgin is that whilst it's become socially unacceptable for people to openly disagree with their virtue signalling, the company relies on people buying tickets to stay afloat. As this is a thread about recruitment and pilots making career moves into the airline, it is important to highlight that a significant number of people/dinosaurs either disagree with Virgin's stance or are fed up with being preached to and told what to think, and will actively avoid flying with Virgin as a result. This has serious implications on job security.

Nope. Notice how P&O Ferries have miraculously carried on trading despite the cries of a boycott? People don’t care in the slightest.

And if you’re that pigheaded to go out of your way to take a less convenient routing to a destination to ensure that there is no way that a male cabin crew member serving you could be wearing a bit of mascara then you can keep your money…

[zero/zero]

Some will choose not to fly with VS because of the new policies, others will probably find it a reason to book.

The remaining 99% won't give a **** and will book for the usual reasons people always do.

As a potentially new joiner, I'd more concerned by the chronically fatiguing rosters than whether the he/him pronoun crew member bringing the tea is wearing heels or not.

[ToCatLady]

I guess the old interview question about “what would you do if the Captain turned up in the lobby wearing a dress?” has been removed? Or amplified?

[pudoc]

As a potentially new joiner, I'd more concerned by the chronically fatiguing rosters than whether the he/him pronoun crew member bringing the tea is wearing heels or not.

Exactly this. Trip patterns are awfully fatiguing, the recent sleep survey results have said “everything is fine” despite repeated safety and fatigue reports. The mantra on the flight deck was “it’ll get better because it has to”, now the chat is “where are you applying to?”.

It cannot be emphasised enough how horrific rostering is at the moment. I thought it would get better with recruitment but even if we achieve the target recruitment numbers, we still can’t fly the summer program.

New joiner courses being cancelled left right and centre because they can’t fill the spots. The secret is out that Virgin is a totally crap place to work now and I think it’s going to get worse.

Middle Eastern rostering and management ethos with poverty pay.

Go in with your eyes wide open.

[ToCatLady]

The recruitment of Second Officers is a really cheap and thoughtless way to address fatiguing patterns. This current recruitment drive should tell you everything about how Virgin are approaching their rostering and fatigue. They’re going sit a cruise pilot at 36,000ft for 8 hours solid whilst the other crew get time in the bunk. Which means the FDP can be extended and/or the experience in the flight deck reduces as they now require one less CN/FO per flight.

problem solved, “it’s all legal”

[Smooth Airperator]

How many trips per month for a new SFO on a LifeStyle+ contract? Is it even available?

[Kibathepilot]

Anyone know what the interview is like and if there will be sim assesment and what type they will use to do it?

[A38lephant]

How many trips per month for a new SFO on a LifeStyle+ contract? Is it even available?

you wouldn’t get lifestyle or lifestyle + for years. There’s a big waiting list. But probably 3 or 4 trips.

[zero/zero]

How many trips per month for a new SFO on a LifeStyle+ contract? Is it even available?

An extra 7 days off per month and then the company try and squeeze as much as they can into the remaining 23 days. Have seen a roster where they managed 87 hours in that. Anything better is a bonus

[VariablePitchP]

An extra 7 days off per month and then the company try and squeeze as much as they can into the remaining 23 days. Have seen a roster where they managed 87 hours in that. Anything better is a bonus

Ah, so 100% work for 80% pay? Sounds… Appealing? :ooh:

[de fumo in flammam]

Met a couple of VS managers recently, who were very pessimistic about the future; which surprised me, what with the new airplanes, hiring and coming out from the dark days of covid.

[RARA9]

It truly is a shame to see. I have many friends in Virgin and I can echo the statements above.
Those that can still make a move are actively doing so.

[White Van Driver]

you wouldn’t get lifestyle or lifestyle + for years. There’s a big waiting list. But probably 3 or 4 trips.
just out of interest what's the lifestyle and lifestyle+?

[zero/zero]

Ah, so 100% work for 80% pay? Sounds… Appealing? :ooh:

Welcome to Virgin 2.0

[zero/zero]

just out of interest what's the lifestyle and lifestyle+?

80% and 65% part time options

[hans brinker]

Ah, so 100% work for 80% pay? Sounds… Appealing? :ooh:

I thought it was spelled appalling... 😬

[9 minutes to landing]

It truly is a shame to see. I have many friends in Virgin and I can echo the statements above.
Those that can still make a move are actively doing so.
12 VS pilots resigned on just one day earlier this week, although, oddly, it still appeals to some who have secure jobs elsewhere.

[TheAirMission]

Come to business aviation and you’ll do that in 17 consecutive days…..every month…..all totally legal…..It’s insanity. Funny though that the billionaires in the back think it’s the safest way to travel.

Not at my 6/5 Biz company...

[VariablePitchP]

80% and 65% part time options

It means you’ll do your 900 hours across either 80% of the calendar days of a 100% contract for 80% pay, or 65% of the calendar days for 65% pay by what has been said so far…

[zero/zero]

It means you’ll do your 900 hours across either 80% of the calendar days of a 100% contract for 80% pay, or 65% of the calendar days for 65% pay by what has been said so far…

Not far off. All you need to know about Virgin at the moment is that crewing is (no joke) rebranded as "Crew Establishment and Productivity Department". It's 1984 without the happy ending.

There's a load of fluffy language from management about being "most loved", but underneath it all it's widebody Ryanair without the honesty to admit what it really is. Everyone is knackered and many/most are looking for other options.

If you are in a job that you're vaguely happy with, you'd be foolish to look at Virgin as a step up

[pudoc]

Im convinced it’s managements dream to make rostering so bad that everyone takes “part time”. So the company force nearly 100% flying hours into 80% working time.

So basically 20% pay cut for the same work. And, if a recession happens and flying reduces, then happy days because everyone’s on 80% pay. And if flying picks up, then happy days because pilots have part time weeks to pick up extra trips for a fraction of what it costs to employ an additional pilot. It’s genius really. No wonder the CEO got his £3.2m bonus despite there being “no money”.

At least working under O’Leary you knew where you stood.

[Seosan]

They’re going sit a cruise pilot at 36,000ft for 8 hours solid whilst the other crew get time in the bunk

How dare they!! Nobody has ever used this rostering model before how outrageous!!

Just don’t tell CX, SQ, QF, NZ etc…

[Essex lad]

Has VS changed so much? I’m ready for the command at the blue/yellow LCC but the management here is so toxic that I’m willing to leave the upgrade to move elsewhere.

Only thing slightly holding me back would be the money once captain and the roster pattern. Ok maybe the chance of a regional base but that ain’t too much of a priority (no kids etc).

From reading this thread sounds like I’m better off staying where I am which says a lot about VS….

[sangiovese.]

And bunk time is split equally across the pilots. Relief goes first that’s all and gets a nap at the end.

[ICEHOUSES]

Could anyone tell me the latest package for a new joiner FO full time, realistic monthly salary, average sector pay and pension etc, thanks

[Capt Scribble]

Try post #172 for starters.

[VariablePitchP]

Has VS changed so much? I’m ready for the command at the blue/yellow LCC but the management here is so toxic that I’m willing to leave the upgrade to move elsewhere.

Only thing slightly holding me back would be the money once captain and the roster pattern. Ok maybe the chance of a regional base but that ain’t too much of a priority (no kids etc).

From reading this thread sounds like I’m better off staying where I am which says a lot about VS….

5/4 roster pattern, low CoL area and a decent wedge. Chop all that in for a spot at the bottom of a seniority list which is nailed by all accounts to a ship that is at the very least filling with water? You’d be mad.

[RARA9]

5/4 roster pattern, low CoL area and a decent wedge. Chop all that in for a spot at the bottom of a seniority list which is nailed by all accounts to a ship that is at the very least filling with water? You’d be mad.


Agreed , also if I was in your shoes I wouldn’t go to BA LH either …. Trust me the grass is certainly not greener!

[AIMINGHIGH123]

Agreed , also if I was in your shoes I wouldn’t go to BA LH either …. Trust me the grass is certainly not greener!

That depends on many variables.

Virgin I wouldn’t touch. Certainly not this SO gig even as FO, you never know how long before they need to lay guys/gals off.

BA LH has a lot more benefits compared to RYR even if you are LHS.
As I said in other places here the only benefit of RYR is 5 on 4 off and possibly quick command year 1 and 2 of command is reduced salary.

The salary quoted at RYR includes pension and allowance to pay for your own medical, LOL, etc. No pay increase at RYR every year like at BA. 10 years time you want part time or other at BA you have that option. RYR no way. Might do it over winter but unlikely. Why are so many leaving RYR? Rumours are a 1000 working notices.

If you live within 1 hr of LHR BA passenger Ops is the best option IMO.

[plikee]

BA LH has a lot more benefits compared to RYR even if you are LHS.

By the time you reach BA LHS LH, you've lost so much pay by staying put in RYR LHS that the benefits are almost negligible. If I compare to Virgin pay, changing from RYR LHS to Virgin would mean 15 years of wait to get to the same pay as I'm on today. If you compound, it's almost half-mil lost, and the option to retire earlier also lost. Even if BA pay is much better than Virgin, it is still a big dent. By the time you get to the top of LH payscale, you'll be tired and possibly fed-up of the life style. If you are young and no commitments, BA is a no-brainer. If you are past your 30's, it might not be that straightforward.


As I said in other places here the only benefit of RYR is 5 on 4 off and possibly quick command year 1 and 2 of command is reduced salary.

Maybe times have changed or it is just me, but I definitely value being back at home every night and not live out of a suitcase. No kids for me, I would think someone who has kids would even value this more.

The salary quoted at RYR includes pension and allowance to pay for your own medical, LOL, etc.

Agreed, but only a fool would consider the pension as part of their pay package and not as a benefit. As far as I see it, the pension in fact reduces my income. If I don't contribute, RYR won't either. The benefit of contributing is RYR matching and enjoying that money when you retire.

No pay increase at RYR every year like at BA. 10 years time you want part time or other at BA you have that option. RYR no way. Might do it over winter but unlikely.

Not true, there are pay increases across the network. Whether they are meaningful or not in the current economic climate it's another story. The problem with the way RYR approaches this is they can take it or add as management please. During times of demand, they'll increase, during times of weakness, they'll take it away. However the stark reality is that any operator will adjust to this - COVID wasn't that long time ago and I don't know any operator that didn't reduce pay and/or made people redundant.

Why are so many leaving RYR? Rumours are a 1000 working notices.

Yes, loads leaving at the moment, mainly UK as at the moment it is a niche market (immigration and licence restrictions due to Brexit), but the majority are FOs and not CPT.

If you live within 1 hr of LHR BA passenger Ops is the best option IMO.

But if you don't... That's another downside of BA. Not everyone lives or likes London.

At the end of the day, it is horses for courses. It really depends what are your current circumstances, of what you want in life now and in the future.
10 years ago I would have joined Virgin in a heartbeat without even considering BA, let alone RYR.

[Alrosa]

At the end of the day, it is horses for courses. It really depends what are your current circumstances, of what you want in life now and in the future.
10 years ago I have joined Virgin in a heartbeat without even considering BA, let alone RYR.

I think this is key, and it applies to those considering Virgin as much as to any other airline currently recruiting in the U.K.

It depends on your personal circumstances, and these vary enormously from one person to the next. It also depends on what your priorities are : maximising income above all else/quickest route to command or lifestyle / not having to commute (or some sort of compromise)…etc.

I smile when I see these posts singing a particular airline’s praises coupled with a complete inability to understand why anyone could possibly want to work anywhere else.

As an example, there are now a significant number of people entering the profession who have had a previous career, and have been in the fortunate position to now pursue their boyhood dream of flying. They might not give a stuff about command (they might not get it before they retire anyway) or not reaching the top pay point at airline X. For others, these things will be very relevant ….it all depends.

[AIMINGHIGH123]

By the time you reach BA LHS LH, you've lost so much pay by staying put in RYR LHS that the benefits are almost negligible. If I compare to Virgin pay, changing from RYR LHS to Virgin would mean 15 years of wait to get to the same pay as I'm on today. If you compound, it's almost half-mil lost, and the option to retire earlier also lost. Even if BA pay is much better than Virgin, it is still a big dent. By the time you get to the top of LH payscale, you'll be tired and possibly fed-up of the life style. If you are young and no commitments, BA is a no-brainer. If you are past your 30's, it might not be that straightforward.

Not true, there are pay increases across the network. Whether they are meaningful or not in the current economic climate it's another story. The problem with the way RYR approaches this is they can take it or add as management please. During times of demand, they'll increase, during times of weakness, they'll take it away. However the stark reality is that any operator will adjust to this - COVID wasn't that long time ago and I don't know any operator that didn't reduce pay and/or made people redundant.



I crunched the number with my mate loads on this. I have seen his payslips you won’t be losing as much as you think depending on when you jump.
He is FO year 2 his minimum take home a month is £4600. 1 trip overtime and he netted nearly £2k on top of that. Add in the 15% company pension plus the ability to travel on BA network for very little. Yes he actually gets less days off a month but he isn’t as tired. 5 days on at RYR through summer is hard work landing 1-4am on your first day off technically multiple times wipes you out.

Regarding pay rise RYR you might or might not get a pay rise. BA £3k a pay rise every year with the current pay deal.

I had the same thoughts as you about BA. After sitting down with my mate cards on the table the benefits add up. At BA It’s not as big a difference as you make out. Even coming down to mortgage the bank wouldn’t consider all of my RYR salary. Base plus half the duty pay. Instantly missing out on a leverage opportunity. Makes a massive difference.
Virgin I don’t actually know anyone close enough at Virgin to get the exact figures I have seen a couple of rosters and they do not look nice.
LHS RYR to Virgin doesn’t sound very good. Even RHS to SO position would be a bad move IMO.

[737 Jockey]

Does anyone could shed some light on the sim assessment profile？ I am going to do it next week.


Thanks.

You should receive a briefing pack from Jet masterclass. All Raw data flying, SID, some general handling; steepnturns, climbs, descents, then some kind of issue, either engine flame out or medical emergency, leading to decision/NITS/P.A. and ILS approach. Fairly straight forward. Don’t be rushed into the approach.

[danski]

Does anyone happen to know the full assessment run down? I've got to complete the psychometric assessment next. Just wondering what's next? Many thanks :)

[Kibathepilot]

Has anyone heard back since doing the online assesments?

[737 Jockey]

Does anyone happen to know the full assessment run down? I've got to complete the psychometric assessment next. Just wondering what's next? Many thanks :)


it’s all the posts above ⬆️

[TRY2FLY]

Add in the 15% company pension

I know someone that told me she withdrew her application to Virgin for a few reasons, the biggest of which was that the pension contribution is now reduced to 10% for those joining from this round of recruitment.
Perhaps she was premature if pension hasn’t been reduced to 10%.

[VariablePitchP]

I know someone that told me she withdrew her application to Virgin for a few reasons, the biggest of which was that the pension contribution is now reduced to 10% for those joining from this round of recruitment.
Perhaps she was premature if pension hasn’t been reduced to 10%.

She must have been very on the fence then. That’s basically a 5% pay cut (ish…) which was enough to make her not consider.

Though given what’s been said already, may have just been the last straw.

[turbine100]

She must have been very on the fence then. That’s basically a 5% pay cut (ish…) which was enough to make her not consider.

Though given what’s been said already, may have just been the last straw.

I saw they are now trying to hire cheap 2nd Officers through the Zenon ....

[Sharklet]

And Senior First Officers by the looks of it. They have relaxed their hours requirement as well.

[RARA9]

And Senior First Officers by the looks of it. They have relaxed their hours requirement as well.


they are not getting enough applicants I wonder why ?

[737 Jockey]

Apparently people haven’t been turning up for their conversion courses recently. Maybe received a better offer (BA, J2 etc.)

[Flying Wild]

And Senior First Officers by the looks of it. They have relaxed their hours requirement as well.
Where does that lead one with regards to upgrade?
SFO/FO/SO - it's just a name for the RHS pilot with a certain number of hours behind them.

[Kibathepilot]

Has anyone got to the final stage interview/sim? Zenon phoned me to arrange mine but didn't give many details. Is the sim assesment on a 787 sim or another aircraft type and does anyone have any other details?

[doz111]

It’s on a 737 fixed base sim. All the other details have been given accurately further up in the thread.

[Kibathepilot]

It’s on a 737 fixed base sim. All the other details have been given accurately further up in the thread.
hi I see the bit about what will happen in the sim but they also mentioned about group exercises and interview so was wondering what people had been asked recently

[Raph737]

I stand by what I said. A forward thinking stance from Virgin, quickly replicated elsewhere.

Welcome to the world where people are (hopefully) not restricted to antiquated gender norms or stereotypes and do not have to kowtow to narrow minded dinosaurs, in or out of the flight deck.

I second this, not a Virgin employee anymore but I’m glad some of these “The Sun/Dailymail” avid readers, owners of the “truth”, self righteous, unpleasant, backwards and ultracrepidarian sky-Gods are leaving.

I don’t get why these little men care so much as it doesn’t directly affect them. Why do you care if male crew wear make up? What’s the point of coming here and make such comments? 737 jockey, A320_LGW etc a few who did that, I bet you were the guys your colleagues swapped trips, and the crew avoided meeting down-route because you were insufferable.I looked through recent posts you guys made and there’s quite a few rejections from the job search, wonder why…

Let it go, you’re a bigot, fine, we get it. Let’s steer the conversation to something constructive as we want to hear information about the airline and the process. Don’t like the airline? Move on then.

[Kibathepilot]

Will they ask technical questions in the final stage interview and would they be more likely to be about my current type or the 787?

[Ferry Flight]

For anyone that’s done the Cut e test …. Any idea which tests come up when you log on to the link?

[CaptainCroft]

Would anyone share some feedback on the Cut e test and what tests will come up with the link?

[Essex lad]

After a bit of thinking and having passed the assessment, I chose not to go forward and withdrew my application. Various reasons but sitting down writing out the numbers and going through a list of pros/cons, best to start the command process at Voldemort airlines. Who knows if I’ve made the right decision. Would be nice to fly the 78, visit great locations and chat up the young CC but maybe in later life. Good luck to those still in the assessment process.

[Sharklet]

Would anyone share some feedback on the Cut e test and what tests will come up with the link?-> Inductive Reasoning.
-> Deductive Reasoning.
-> Spatial Orientation.
-> Multi-tasking Capability.
-> Language Skills.
-> Applied Numeracy.
-> Complex Control.
-> Auditory Comprehension.
-> Work-related behaviour.

[srjumbo747]

After a bit of thinking and having passed the assessment, I chose not to go forward and withdrew my application. Various reasons but sitting down writing out the numbers and going through a list of pros/cons, best to start the command process at Voldemort airlines. Who knows if I’ve made the right decision. Would be nice to fly the 78, visit great locations and chat up the young CC but maybe in later life. Good luck to those still in the assessment process.
Which rank did you apply for?

[Essex lad]

Which rank did you apply for?

SFO mate

[Sharklet]

Does anyone know what start dates are being offered?

[pudoc]

Does anyone know what start dates are being offered?

I believe it’s continuous. Multiple courses a month which will continue into the foreseeable.

[sudden twang]

Is there a managed exit pathway in VS?
Asking for a friend

[mac81]

Hi folks,

Does anybody know if VAA is looking for people with no restrictions to live and work in UK or they may sponsor for working permit VISA?
Many thanks 🙏

[CABUS]

Yes, virgin currently has a managed exit pathway.

[sudden twang]

Care to share the managed exit deal?
if as these pages suggest there is an issue recruiting why have a MEP or is it just a reduce costs initiative?

[Sharklet]

Hi folks,

Does anybody know if VAA is looking for people with no restrictions to live and work in UK or they may sponsor for working permit VISA?
Many thanks 🙏

They will sponsor the work Visa if you are successful.

[RARA9]

Care to share the managed exit deal?
if as these pages suggest there is an issue recruiting why have a MEP or is it just a reduce costs initiative?


They are struggling to recruit , an airline which is very exposed .
I would think VERY carefully about joining .If and when another “crisis” happens then be prepared for a knee jerk redundancy.

yes always about cost

[CABUS]

Meps was bought to the table by balpa pre covid. There is no doubt it saves money but it’s also a nice way to retire. Being able to plan to retire years ahead with a percentage of your salary for up to seven years will significantly help the pension and lifestyle pot.

[Sharklet]

Will they ask technical questions in the final stage interview and would they be more likely to be about my current type or the 787?

Anyone with some insights on this one?

[MachBrum]

I Would really appreciate some 787 rosters if anyone has them and could PM me. Or at least trips per month and days off on average. Trying to compare my 78 current roster with a VS 78 roster to see how feasible it would be lifestyle wise

Many thanks!

[Lordflasheart]

...
Which roster would you like to see ?

This is what we got in the pub late the other night ... He's on the airbus and he were well disgruntled. Not 787 specific but it might give some idea.

The roster which was issued because of a 'human error' and was cancelled 24 hrs after issue.
The roster that replaced it, which bore no relation to the first and which arrived several days later, only a short while before the beginning of the month,
The record of actual work done (or not done) which bears little similarity to either of the above rosters

Ask not what the cost to the company is ...

For payment of overtime, extra or disrupted flights,
For unwise or barely legal scheduling economies
To pay for the rumoured imminent mystery scheduling system. JSS Lite perhaps ?

He said it depends on the fleet, but overall it didn't sound pretty.

LFH

[midnight cruiser]

I hadn't realised a large part of Virgin orbit's debts are on Virgin Group's books. The latest developments there can't be helpful.

Times; "The company, whose LauncherOne rocket was unsuccessful in January, is to pause all its operations and furlough hundreds of staff amid financial pressure and a struggle to attract investors."

[pedrothepilot]

Does anyone know if the requirement for SFO is 3000hours airbus/boeing time , or total? The job ad is amiguous. Thanks

You must be currently flying of have flown one of the following AC types in the last 6 months - Airbus A319/A320/A321/A340/A380

You’ll need a minimum experience of 3000 hours of total flying time on the above. This must include at least 500 hours current on type (hours spent solely as a cruise pilot are not included).

Any interpretations? 500 hours on type and 3000 total time just wishful thinking?

[Essex lad]

Does anyone know if the requirement for SFO is 3000hours airbus/boeing time , or total? The job ad is amiguous. Thanks

You must be currently flying of have flown one of the following AC types in the last 6 months - Airbus A319/A320/A321/A340/A380

You’ll need a minimum experience of 3000 hours of total flying time on the above. This must include at least 500 hours current on type (hours spent solely as a cruise pilot are not included).

Any interpretations? 500 hours on type and 3000 total time just wishful thinking?

3000 hours on your type. If not you’ll be on the FO1 pay point. £67691 then FO2 £69876 then onto SFO1 £82048.

[sangiovese.]

Should be 3000 hours total time plus minimum 500 on type

[pedrothepilot]

Thanks all!

[A320LGW]

3000hrs on type in an LCC is command upgrade, on roughly double that pay