Oneworld Cockpit Crew Coalition Condemns Treatment of Cathay Pacific Pilots

[china123]

LONDON, United Kingdom (Dec. 7, 2021) – The Oneworld Cockpit Crew Coalition (OCCC) expressed deep concern regarding what it termed “untenable working conditions” at Cathay Pacific since the onset of the COVID-19 pandemic.

Comprised of the 30,000 professional union pilots who fly for the member airlines of the oneworld Alliance, the OCCC has convened for an in-person meeting in London this week.

“The pilots of Cathay Pacific face a hostile management. The result is a toxic industrial climate,” said Captain John Sluys, Oneworld Cockpit Crew Coalition Chair. “During the past 15 months, Cathay Pacific management has unilaterally terminated the pilots’ Recognition and Good Faith Bargaining agreements and imposed a ‘sign or be fired’ concessionary agreement upon them.

“The pilots and their families have also been subjected to highly onerous quarantine conditions,” said Captain Sluys, who is a 737 pilot for Alaska Airlines.

read article... (https://www.alliedpilots.org/News/ID/9626/Oneworld-Cockpit-Crew-Coalition-Condemns-Treatment-of-Cathay-Pacific-Pilots)

[Silent Treatment]

Cool story...
Off to do my 10th covid test of the month, because science.

[stevieboy330]

I would bet my house this "condemnation" won't make any difference whatsoever.

[Jnr380]

I didn’t know such an “organisation” existed! This might have some weight in other OneWorld carriers where pilots have some pull but I doubt it’ll change things among most OW carriers

[china123]

pilots being at breaking point is absolutely inexcusable and flies directly in the face of their mission statement - the flying public should be very concerned and therefore, every little bit of bad publicity counts!! given the safety issues this raises still want to know why the Civil Aviation Department (Hong Kong) hasn't intervened??

Mission Statement: “Our vision is to be the world's best airline. Being the best means that we always strive to excel in everything we do. Our dynamic team provides the highest quality service so that our customers are happy they chose Cathay Pacific.”

#ccpstooges
#sackmanagement
#relocateUSA

[Bueno Hombre]

If a pilot feels he is at breaking point then he or she should refuse to fly.. It would not be good for safety if a pilot broke during a flight. Think airmanship, professionalism, commonsense, but not money.

[MENELAUS]

The only hope is that IFALPA takes it up. Given the recent treatment of BA, AC and Finnair crews that shouldn’t be a stretch.
Then petition the FAA for a blanket ban on CX, and PRC aircraft in their airspace for safety reasons.

[Silent Treatment]

Anyone flying at the moment or volunteering for anything deserves everything they get - enjoy your tests.

Nothing will change until the fleet is grounded.
So what is it that you're doing to ground the fleet? Please, enlighten us.

[cxflog]

So what is it that you're doing to ground the fleet? Please, enlighten us.
Call in sick for duties, go long term sick, take compassionate leave for any multitude of reasons

or just pack up and leave permanently

[Will IB Fayed]

So what is it that you're doing to ground the fleet? Please, enlighten us.
I’ll back him up by saying it again.

Nothing will change while people keep volunteering for this garbage. It really beggars belief that any of you are volunteering still for closed loop flying.

[Silent Treatment]

I’ll back him up by saying it again.

Nothing will change while people keep volunteering for this garbage. It really beggars belief that any of you are volunteering still for closed loop flying.
Your buddy is the one who assumed I'm volunteering for CL. I am not. Yet neither of you can answer my question. What have you done today to ground the fleet?

[Silent Treatment]

Call in sick for duties, go long term sick, take compassionate leave for any multitude of reasons

or just pack up and leave permanently

Add not sign PoS18 to your list. I'm sure you set the example to us all and didn't sign over. Am I right?

[Zhang777]

Surely One World OCCC cannot be legal for China. Be more professional. Don't refuse duty or sick leave. The attitude is unbelievable. Nice flat, nice aircraft, nice hotel, Stop complaining.

[MENELAUS]

Surely One World OCCC cannot be legal for China. Be more professional. Don't refuse duty or sick leave. The attitude is unbelievable. Nice flat, nice aircraft, nice hotel, Stop complaining.

Thank you President XI. WTF are you talking about ?
Perhaps you should volunteer for guard duty in the camps in Urumqi. Alleged camps sorry

[Acepilothk99]

Surely One World OCCC cannot be legal for China. Be more professional. Don't refuse duty or sick leave. The attitude is unbelievable. Nice flat, nice aircraft, nice hotel, Stop complaining.
Zhang777 are you trolling mate? How much do you know about what is going on? Let us educate you in the real world.

[Diogenes.]

I did my bit. I left. :ok: Permanently! :p

Having flown the IGS, I was entitled to a crappy leaving token. No gold watch after all that BS :confused:. It took a couple of minutes to leaf through all the leaving photos to find my own. (And it wasn't a particularly good photo either; hardly worth the effort). Anyway, I reflected on the fact that all those photos in front of me, stacked in that pathetic, nondescript back office, easily represented thousands of years of experience on company aircraft! ALL DOWN THE DRAIN! Tragic!

Nobody is leaving hey?! Ha!!!

You say nobody is leaving (BS!), well come again cos scores upon scores have already left! And many, many, many more to come! News articles galore about how Cathay pilots are leaving, 'cos of Covid' 🙄, and the rest of them are on the edge of a nervous breakdown, (BBC News), and I imagine some are, though not many! You've got to be mentally tough to survive in that Witch's Cauldron. Cathay pilots can weather this storm! Anyway, not a single mention in any of those articles of the fact that if you failed to 'sign or be fired' within the first week then Hong Kong was to become uncomfortable, (debatably unlivable), after the next 12 months? Where's Lois Lane? Are there no good journalists out there with a nose for a good scoop? Nobody that can see the angles? Come on?!

Can't help feeling Cathay Management are going to be desperate to hear that Omicrom's great granddaughter 'Megatron' will still be wreaking havoc next winter so they can blame the MASS EXEDOS on Covid and hope the end of the housing allowance, (huge oak beam that utterly crushed the camel's back), can be ignored as the main driver of the huge number of resignations of the most experienced! Anyway at least they got away with it this winter. GIVE THEM A BIGGGGG BONU$$$$$$$!!!

In October 2020, Cathay Pilots where handed an ultimatum, 'sign or you're fired'....

Option One. You're Fired. (Result: Large number of resignations plus handful of firings.)
Option Two. Sign within the second week and Hong Kong becomes uncomfortable/unlivable in January 2022. (Result: Large number of resignation at the end of 2021)
Option Three. Sign within the first week and Hong Kong becomes uncomfortable/unlivable in January 2023. (Result: You ain't seen nothing yet. :D)

I am still incredulous that any of that was legal. Especially in Hong Kong!!! I guess 'a deal is no longer a deal' there, and that's a 'big deal' for a place like Hong Kong. Might as well be doing business in Shanghai. :=

Anyway. 'Step aside. You're blocking my light!' (Ancient history)

[china123]

Originally Posted by Zhang777 View Post (https://www.pprune.org/fragrant-harbour/644107-oneworld-cockpit-crew-coalition-condemns-treatment-cathay-pacific-pilots.html#post11153186)
Surely One World OCCC cannot be legal for China.

two words that don't go together 'China' and 'legal' !!!

move the entire CX operation to the US or anywhere away from HK and the quicker the better❗👍✔

[triple7driver]

I am still incredulous that any of that was legal. Especially in Hong Kong!!! I guess 'a deal is no longer a deal' there, and that's a 'big deal' for a place like Hong Kong. Might as well be doing business in Shanghai. :=

The sad part is that none of this sh*t would fly north of the border! HK and China are worlds apart in terms of labor laws.

[Diogenes.]

North of which border?

[controlledrest]

Here are some things we should and can do:

1. Do not volunteer for Closed Loop or Extended Duties
2. (Using burner emails if need be) advise HKG CAD, SCMP, BBC etc of the stress you are under ($, fatigue, emotional etc), the stupidity of the HKG Govn requirements (G Days are legally required to be free of all duties, jumping on MTR or Bus to get tested, 21 day quarantines etc) Include the 65% pay forced on us. Make noise about what life is like. Get the word out there
3. Pressure the company to re-open bases, even if they are temp. GMA prefers to call them TERPs, so make sure you call them what they are: Temp Bases

Don't just suffer in silence, bring the attention of the public to the madness that is HKG and CX. Two evil empires.

[Longtimer]

Toxic climate’: Hong Kong pilots buckle under ‘zero COVID’ rules‘Toxic climate’: Hong Kong pilots buckle under ‘zero COVID’ rules (aljazeera.com) (https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2021/12/9/hk)

[Will IB Fayed]

Your buddy is the one who assumed I'm volunteering for CL. I am not. Yet neither of you can answer my question. What have you done today to ground the fleet?
I took a volun-told redundancy and left. Thanks for asking.

[china123]

thanks for the article @Longtimer. 👍🙂

#ccpstooges
#toxicmanagement
#sackmanagement
#relocateUSA
#pilotSOS
#CXunsafeairline

[Silent Treatment]

I took a volun-told redundancy and left. Thanks for asking.
I hope you've been able to move on and find something better in your life. Unlike some of your former based colleagues who, not only have returned and signed PoS18, but are also doing multiple loops and have signed up for TC roles.

[china123]

a good example of how CX obey the CCP and why the entire CX operation needs to relocate away from HK! I believe that there is a CCP member on the CX board.

429FCLrKPc4

#bringbackRupert

[china123]

woohoo, fresh off the press 👍🙂👇

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1999x1009/22db62af_2709_4299_9aa9_7edb97d922a3_22d9bb01_63f4f2aa4953e3 6468b0197fc041ce56c0e242a0.jpg

Cathay Pacific’s Hong Kong pilots weigh Los Angeles move as airline looks to ease burden of coronavirus quarantine rules

Embattled flag carrier asks for volunteers for four-month stints in California as it struggles to stem flight cancellations, pilot resignations.

The airline last month began sounding out demoralised aircrew about the possibility of being based out of Dubai or the United States.

read article... (https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/transport/article/3159046/cathay-pacifics-hong-kong-pilots-weigh-los-angeles-move)

[china123]

re the above article ☝, the grapevine is telling me that this is too little too late and every CX pilot is now actively looking for work elsewhere!!

the general consensus is that the covid restrictions aren't about public health anymore, it's all political and all about control from the CCP!!

get serious and move the entire operation out of HK!!

[KABOY]

re the above article ☝, the grapevine is telling me that this is too little too late and every CX pilot is now actively looking for work elsewhere!!

the general consensus is that the covid restrictions aren't about public health anymore, it's all political and all about control from the CCP!!

get serious and move the entire operation out of HK!!

Only problem with that is that CX is a Hong Kong based airline. Might have a problem with the principle place of business argument that has been used against previous competitors.

[Cury Lamb]

Only lawful US citizens and residents need apply, and if ever there was a perfect opportunity to interview and start training with a US operator, whilst employed by CXit, this is it!
Spank you very much :ok:

[Will IB Fayed]

I hope you've been able to move on and find something better in your life. Unlike some of your former based colleagues who, not only have returned and signed PoS18, but are also doing multiple loops and have signed up for TC roles.
Found a flying job in my home country. Pays half as much, but I'm twice as happy!

[china123]

Only problem with that is that CX is a Hong Kong based airline. Might have a problem with the principle place of business argument that has been used against previous competitors.

this should be an easy argument to win given that nearly two thirds of Cathay's voting rights reside in London with the Swire Group.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/711x427/cp_sharespng_4cd14d2fd14500d58d0746605d757dc7477a6612.png

HK has changed for good and CX must move accordingly!

[Busbuoy]

And in this case "accordingly" is probably "elsewhere........"!

[china123]

And in this case "accordingly" is probably "elsewhere........"!

correct Busbuoy amongst other things, but the priority right now is to sack the CEO.

Incompetent doesn't even begin to cover the scale of his failures. Failures pilots and their families are now all paying the price for!!!

He will go down in history for being DIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE for the greatest Cathay Pacific disaster in Hong Kong aviation history!!!

[QNH set]

China, unfortunately I don’t think he is the guy running/ ruining the show. GH is the man making the decisions….

[Cury Lamb]

China, unfortunately I don’t think he is the guy running/ ruining the show. GH is the man making the decisions….

CCP cadres up north are pulling the strings. The rest are all just puppets.

[Bueno Hombre]

Warren Buffet said Several times earlier in his career he had warned against investing in airlines. “The worst sort of business is one that grows rapidly, requires significant capital to engender the growth, and then earns little or no money,” Buffett said. “Think airlines.”
So why does Swire continue to support this ultimately doomed airline?
First loss is the best loss. Close it down and put everyone out of their misery.

[Dingleberry Handpump]

Warren Buffet said Several times earlier in his career he had warned against investing in airlines. “The worst sort of business is one that grows rapidly, requires significant capital to engender the growth, and then earns little or no money,” Buffett said. “Think airlines.”
So why does Swire continue to support this ultimately doomed airline?
First loss is the best loss. Close it down and put everyone out of their misery.
Hypocrisy from the old goat. WB was the second largest shareholder in the USA majors, behind one hedge fund. They both had huge positions in all 4. He sold (badly) after the Covid stock collapse.

Despite his decades-long investment in airlines, he has had billions and billions in long positions for a long time.

[Bueno Hombre]

Hypocrisy from the old goat. WB was the second largest shareholder in the USA majors, behind one hedge fund. They both had huge positions in all 4. He sold (badly) after the Covid stock collapse.

Despite his decades-long investment in airlines, he has had billions and billions in long positions for a long time.
Decline in CX share price and lack of dividends long time tells it all. Parasite airline milking the shareholders.

[Dingleberry Handpump]

Decline in CX share price and lack of dividends long time tells it all. Parasitic airline milking the shareholders.
CX maybe - I was referring to your reference to Buffet, who has got his airline investment strategy completely wrong. He lost tens of billions in his fire sale, and while he was preaching not to invest in airlines, was building the second largest airline ownership position in the USA.

[china123]

this is how CX pilots are feeling right now...

wJVpihgwE18

[Agent Blake]

So Cathay Pacific owns one of the largest catering services in the region but their crew at Penny Bay are reliant on friends & family to do food drops. Be nice to see Cathay Catering deliver some quality food to their guys being held captive rather than write BS solidarity emails for the Fridays news fluff.

[china123]

So Cathay Pacific owns one of the largest catering services in the region but their crew at Penny Bay are reliant on friends & family to do food drops. Be nice to see Cathay Catering deliver some quality food to their guys being held captive rather than write BS solidarity emails for the Fridays news fluff.

excellent point! 👍

sorry, I have to say it again...

the priority right now is to sack the CEO.

Incompetent doesn't even begin to cover the scale of his failures. Failures pilots and their families are now all paying the price for!!!

He will go down in history for being DIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE for the greatest Cathay Pacific disaster in Hong Kong aviation history!!!

"I really, truly feel for people that are at Cathay," a FedEx pilot who recently left Hong Kong said. "I am genuinely concerned about their mental health and how they are."

pilots and others have wasted far too much of their precious time and money challenging the malfeasance, indifference, obstruction, arrogance, inconsistencies and self-serving behaviour that comes with this mob!

#AugustusTangmustgo
#moveCXnow

ps: you all should be listening to the animals - 'we gotta get outta this place' video I have posted above while reading this thread. It is a classic! 🙂

[quadspeed]

Will you please give it a rest.

A long time ago, CX was the French Foreign Legion of pilots.

Now, it's the bottom of the barrel where, if you can't qualify for a job at home, you can sell your dignity for a selfie on a widebody.

They don't want your gweilo ass. Deal with.it.

[KABOY]

excellent point! 👍

sorry, I have to say it again...



"I really, truly feel for people that are at Cathay," a FedEx pilot who recently left Hong Kong said. "I am genuinely concerned about their mental health and how they are."

pilots and others have wasted far too much of their precious time and money challenging the malfeasance, indifference, obstruction, arrogance, inconsistencies and self-serving behaviour that comes with this mob!

#AugustusTangmustgo
#moveCXnow

ps: you all should be listening to the animals - 'we gotta get outta this place' video I have posted above while reading this thread. It is a classic! 🙂


This is the guy you need to direct your anger at, the Swires highest paid prince in CX and also overseeing its operations. He masterminded COS 18..

https://au.wallmine.com/hkse/0293/officer/1714460/gregory-hughes

[china123]

This is the guy you need to direct your anger at, the Swires highest paid prince in CX and also overseeing its operations. He masterminded COS 18..

https://au.wallmine.com/hkse/0293/officer/1714460/gregory-hughes

thank you KABOY, another legend in his own lunchtime!

we have a new hashtag: #GregHughesMustGo

have been alerted to this very good article...IFALPA Commends Extraordinary Efforts of Cathay Pacific PilotsCathay Pacific management has unilaterally terminated the Associations’ Recognition and Good Faith Bargaining agreements and imposed what is essentially a “sign or be fired” concessionary agreement upon them. Management continues to impose egregious working and isolation conditions on their pilots and refuses to acknowledge the negative impacts on the mental and physical health of their crews.

“We want the Cathay pilots to know that we have not forgotten them. We will continue to work with our 100 Member Associations and the 100,000 pilots they represent to support you in your struggle…” Captain Netskar stated, “…we are also actively collaborating with the Oneworld Cockpit Crew Coalition (OCCC) to encourage other airlines to hire Cathay Pacific pilots as the opportunity arises.”
make sure everyone reads this... (https://financialpost.com/pmn/press-releases-pmn/business-wire-news-releases-pmn/ifalpa-commends-extraordinary-efforts-of-cathay-pacific-pilots)

[Jnr380]

As long as Swire is at the helm with their outdated management practices there will be no improvements and it will only get worse. One thing I’ve realised is most “expat” airlines operate like Swire and as with everything in aviation, it’s always the last industry to change.

[Bueno Hombre]

Hypocrisy from the old goat. WB was the second largest shareholder in the USA majors, behind one hedge fund. They both had huge positions in all 4. He sold (badly) after the Covid stock collapse.

Despite his decades-long investment in airlines, he has had billions and billions in long positions for a long time.
Yes indeed::
Buffett's Berkshire takes stakes in four major airlines (cnbc.com) (https://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/14/buffetts-berkshire-takes-stakes-in-four-major-airlines.html)
I previously thought that Buffet only invested in airline stocks after the initial impact of Covid and expecting defeat of the disease. In fact we see that he had previously going back many years invested in airline stocks.
Nevertheless ,those of us in the know , know the old adage:
How to make a small fortune? Answer is Start with a big fortune and invest in an airline.

[Torukmacto]

Watched him interviewed and he admitted he has weakness for airline stocks . Knows to stay away but can’t help himself .

[china123]

Hong Kong (CNN Business) - Before the pandemic, Hong Kong was an aviation hub attracting pilots from around the world. Two years on, pilots at flagship airline Cathay Pacific are so exhausted and depressed from working under one of the world's strictest quarantine regimes that some are reaching a breaking point. Once known as a premier employer, the Hong Kong-based airline is now grappling with plummeting morale, a spike in resignations and mounting frustration as staff undergo arduous self-isolation measures, according to two Cathay pilots, who spoke with CNN Business on condition of anonymity for fear of reprisals.
"The morale is all gone. All gone," said the first Cathay pilot, who has worked at the airline for several years. Everybody's angry."
The 'closed loop'Since the pandemic, Cathay has adopted so-called "closed loop" flights, mostly for those traveling to countries designated by Hong Kong as "high risk," such as the United States, India and the United Kingdom.
This typically means that pilots fly out for several weeks, cannot leave their hotel rooms upon arriving at their destination, and return to hotel quarantine in Hong Kong for another two weeks, according to the Cathay pilots who spoke to CNN Business. That is then followed by a further two weeks of isolation at home, they said.
The arrangement is voluntary. Crew who don't participate can be assigned other routes, such as ones involving cargo or which go to "low-risk" destinations, according to the pilots. Some do not have the chance to fly at all.
But currently for the "closed loops," "they're not getting the volunteers," according to the first pilot.

another great article... (https://edition.cnn.com/2021/12/10/business/hong-kong-covid-quarantine-pilots-intl-hnk/index.html)

[china123]

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1209x323/cx_ad_aeee3c83c871e9ab196c0c44081bc0ac1e44c5f8.png

[bored]

Your buddy is the one who assumed I'm volunteering for CL. I am not. Yet neither of you can answer my question. What have you done today to ground the fleet?
Well, I'm unfit for 2 months.....you?

[china123]

Coronavirus: Cathay Pacific aims to stop pilots from leaving overseas hotel rooms with one-time-use key
Cathay Pacific aims to stop pilots from leaving overseas hotel rooms with a one-time-use keycard to minimise Covid-19 risks, but the measure has stoked data privacy concerns as the airline steps up monitoring of staff flying abroad.

Efforts by the city's flagship airline to comply with strict government measures include requesting records of the time Cathay staff enter and leave their rooms, according to a leaked email the company’s hotel supplier sent to the JW Marriott in Dubai.
read article... (https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/transport/article/3159346/coronavirus-cathay-pacific-seeks-comply-strict-hong-kong)

[Silent Treatment]

Well, I'm unfit for 2 months.....you?
12 months and counting...thanks for asking. Hope you feel better soon. I hear training positions are being made available...

[china123]

Hong Kong quarantine pushes Cathay pilots to 'breaking point'
Hong Kong (AFP) - Cathay Pacific has been hit by a wave of pilot resignations in recent weeks as resentment over Hong Kong's strict quarantine regime boils over and crew scramble for emerging opportunities overseas.
AFP interviewed four Cathay pilots who requested anonymity. Each said they knew more than a dozen colleagues who had resigned in the last few weeks.

More were applying for jobs at rivals in places that have shifted to a strategy of learning to live with the virus, they added.

"Things are horrible, resignations are through the roof," one pilot, who has more than 20 years' flying experience and has applied to two rival airlines, told AFP.

"There are a lot of guys at their breaking point. It's actually amazing that we haven't had an accident yet."
read article... (https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20211202-hong-kong-quarantine-pushes-cathay-pilots-to-breaking-point)
seeing worldwide publicity now!

[Bueno Hombre]

re the above article ☝, the grapevine is telling me that this is too little too late and every CX pilot is now actively looking for work elsewhere!!

the general consensus is that the covid restrictions aren't about public health anymore, it's all political and all about control from the CCP!!

get serious and move the entire operation out of HK!!
said every CX pilot is now actively looking for work elsewhere!!. "Every" is a big statement that many of us would choose to discount.

[Rie]

More were applying for jobs at rivals

*COUGH* competitive contract *COUGH*

Shot themselves in the foot and are proud of it. Thanks POS18

[smogluver]

Funny how the fact they put everyone on a **** contract prior to all this quarantine BS has been completely overlooked by the media. That IS THE REAL REASON PEOPLE ARE LEAVING, YOU MEDIA DROPKICKS. People will endure all sorts of bull**** if the money is right. Sadly Cathay Pilots have set a new precedent for what they are willing to endure on peanuts.

[china123]

said every CX pilot is now actively looking for work elsewhere!!. "Every" is a big statement that many of us would choose to discount.

and I would argue that "many" is an even bigger statement.

[china123]

ok, it is time we addressed the elephant in the room and what really is in play here.

is it possible that CX is being set up for a major sell-off by Swire?

a crisis can be the perfect catalyst to adopt lean operations management principles in setting the company up for a major sell-off.

…and we all know who would be making the first bid. it would not surprise me if discussions are already well underway!

watch this space.

[Progress Wanchai]

ok, it is time we addressed the elephant in the room and what really is in play here.

is it possible that CX is being set up for a major sell-off by Swire?

a crisis can be the perfect catalyst to adopt lean operations management principles in setting the company up for a major sell-off.

…and we all know who would be making the first bid. it would not surprise me if discussions are already well underway!

watch this space.

Yes, a change of shareholder/management rights is very likely.

Except it’s not the seller manipulating the market, it’s the buyer.

[Will IB Fayed]

is it possible that CX is being set up for a major sell-off by Swire?.
Do you think? Can you ever see CX getting ahead under the CCP with Colonial Swire as majority shareholder? I bet GH's left nut, the restructure is what swire have been told to do, in order for the company to be sold to Air CCP.
Put the crew on POS18 contract (POS stands for "Piece of ****" media people)
Get rid of the uncontrollables (based staff)

I'm actually not convinced that life will get worse under Air CCP?

[china123]

Trade Alert: The Non-Executive Director Of Cathay Pacific Airways Limited (HKG:293), Merlin Swire, Has Sold Some Shares RecentlyInvestors may wish to note that the Non-Executive Director of Cathay Pacific Airways Limited, Merlin Swire, recently netted HK$217k from selling stock, receiving an average price of HK$7.23. While that isn't a lot of money, it was a substantial 100% of their holding, so certainly isn't a good sign.

read article... (https://simplywall.st/stocks/hk/transportation/hkg-293/cathay-pacific-airways-shares/news/trade-alert-the-non-executive-director-of-cathay-pacific-air)

[Pistolpete47]

Don't think that means anything. HK$217k is couch change for Merlin.

[china123]

Don't think that means anything. HK$217k is couch change for Merlin.

as stated above...
While that isn't a lot of money, it was a substantial 100% of their holding, so certainly isn't a good sign.

[Cury Lamb]

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/828x1679/583bdc94_8e09_4b20_9f8f_f905b4ca8a8d_26b3298e6db0205ed10f3d4 f5a0185890b143364.jpeg
“Hong Kong’s zero-Covid strategy has almost shut down the local aviation industry and its infection-control policies are “killing” Cathay Pacific, the CEO of Qatar Airways, the flag carrier’s third-largest shareholder, has warned.

“You can’t just shut the aviation industry [down] because somebody got infected coming in [on] someone’s aeroplane,” the outspoken airline chief said in an exclusive interview with the Post in which he also discussed the immediate fallout from the new variant’s spread and looked to the year ahead.“

What El Baker is trying to say is: get your act together otherwise I’m pulling out - shares at HKD 6.30 and dropping faster than the Turkish Lira :p

[china123]

for those who want to read the above article...

click here (https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/transport/article/3160217/hong-kongs-zero-covid-strategy-killing-cathay-pacific-ceo)

[china123]

a very good comment made on the above article 👇

"Do the health "experts" consider the tremendous adverse mental effects on pilots who have been quarantined repeatedly throughout the last two years? The effects of not having fresh air, sunlight, proper exercise and social interaction for up to 6 weeks at a time? Even a prisoner undergoing the 'cruel and unusual punishment' of solitary confinement, gets some daily time outside to exercise!
The fact that these crew are keeping Hong Kong supplied and we can still go to Wellcome and buy fruits and vegetables and other things? That people aren't panicking about empty grocery shelves and apples costing $300 each because these pilots keep the cargo flowing in and out of Hong Kong? The fact that 5 positive flight crew cases out of hundreds of thousands of covid tests in the past two years is proof that Cathay flight crew are actually very low risk and that the draconian measures on them should be relaxed instead of tightened? The fact that due to these quarantine measures, many crew haven't seen their families in 2 years and the harsh policies actually led to an increase in divorce, social disharmony and families breaking up? The fact that many people's livelihoods, and consequently their physical, financial, emotional and psychological health depend on their jobs in the aviation sector? Why not focus on increasing the vaccination rate instead of advocating increasing torture of flight crew and further strangulation and suffocation of Hong Kong?"

[Cury Lamb]

It seems even madame evagram has had enough. Wouldn’t be surprised if our socialite calls it a day at cafay and go back to her former employer, to take over from captains again should they stuff up the approach :rolleyes:

[ToCatLady]

a very good comment made on the above article 👇

"Do the health "experts" consider the tremendous adverse mental effects on pilots who have been quarantined repeatedly throughout the last two years? The effects of not having fresh air, sunlight, proper exercise and social interaction for up to 6 weeks at a time? Even a prisoner undergoing the 'cruel and unusual punishment' of solitary confinement, gets some daily time outside to exercise!
The fact that these crew are keeping Hong Kong supplied and we can still go to Wellcome and buy fruits and vegetables and other things? That people aren't panicking about empty grocery shelves and apples costing $300 each because these pilots keep the cargo flowing in and out of Hong Kong? The fact that 5 positive flight crew cases out of hundreds of thousands of covid tests in the past two years is proof that Cathay flight crew are actually very low risk and that the draconian measures on them should be relaxed instead of tightened? The fact that due to these quarantine measures, many crew haven't seen their families in 2 years and the harsh policies actually led to an increase in divorce, social disharmony and families breaking up? The fact that many people's livelihoods, and consequently their physical, financial, emotional and psychological health depend on their jobs in the aviation sector? Why not focus on increasing the vaccination rate instead of advocating increasing torture of flight crew and further strangulation and suffocation of Hong Kong?"


This is the only language they speak in HKG and should be our only leverage. STOP flying.

The company should have a duty of care and protect its employees and customers. However, When the fleet CP quotes in his newsletter that they "Have no line" when it comes to the Operation we should all be worried. GMO has done a great job since the first Protest keeping the operation running, with no help from his seniors, But the blind Determination to keep the show on the road and refusal to draw no line in the sand is complete negligence and will be one of the first things NTSB, ATSB, AAIB, EASA ect look at when things go :mad: at CX.

Swiss cheese model experts will be using our last 24 months as a perfect University Lecture.

[Dingleberry Handpump]

This is the only language they speak in HKG and should be our only leverage. STOP flying.

The company should have a duty of care and protect its employees and customers. However, When the fleet CP quotes in his newsletter that they "Have no line" when it comes to the Operation we should all be worried. GMO has done a great job since the first Protest keeping the operation running, with no help from his seniors, But the blind Determination to keep the show on the road and refusal to draw no line in the sand is complete negligence and will be one of the first things NTSB, ATSB, AAIB, EASA ect look at when things go :mad: at CX.

Swiss cheese model experts will be using our last 24 months as a perfect University Lecture.

It is sheer negligence.

Also, the CAD are entirely aware of the situation and refuse to offer any comment, insight or ruling. They are equally culpable.

Neither can say they weren’t warned.

[Bueno Hombre]

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/828x1679/583bdc94_8e09_4b20_9f8f_f905b4ca8a8d_26b3298e6db0205ed10f3d4 f5a0185890b143364.jpeg
“Hong Kong’s zero-Covid strategy has almost shut down the local aviation industry and its infection-control policies are “killing” Cathay Pacific, the CEO of Qatar Airways, the flag carrier’s third-largest shareholder, has warned.

“You can’t just shut the aviation industry [down] because somebody got infected coming in [on] someone’s aeroplane,” the outspoken airline chief said in an exclusive interview with the Post in which he also discussed the immediate fallout from the new variant’s spread and looked to the year ahead.“

What El Baker is trying to say is: get your act together otherwise I’m pulling out - shares at HKD 6.30 and dropping faster than the Turkish Lira :p

So let him pull out. No problem .

[MENELAUS]

Yes let him pull out. The only shareholder actually telling the HK gov to go forth and multiply. Then let China Eastern acquire the rest.
And Alhamdulillah, your airline is in full Chinese control. Sounds like a plan.

[Bueno Hombre]

Yes let him pull out. The only shareholder actually telling the HK gov to go forth and multiply. Then let China Eastern acquire the rest.
And Alhamdulillah, your airline is in full Chinese control. Sounds like a plan.
Hong Kong Government paid billions to keep this legacy airline going. Everyone can make mistakes.

[Progress Wanchai]

Hong Kong Government paid billions to keep this legacy airline going. Everyone can make mistakes.

They did indeed. While the company is yet to touch a cent of these billions of taxpayer money, the reason the company was able to secure finance was because the HK government essentially became a guarantor of the debt.

But CX was not alone in securing government handouts to stay in operation. In Australia both Qantas and Virgin Australia received government assistance. However that didn’t buy their silence. Both CEO’s had the backbone to speak out publicly against ridiculous government rules and restrictions on the population and workforce.

As for Qatar selling their shares, I suspect Air China may be an interested buyer. As they already own the maximum shares permitted by legislation they’d have to announce a takeover bid. Potentially not great, but hard to think it could be much worse than being managed by our present silent weaklings,

[Busbuoy]

In Australia both Qantas and Virgin Australia received government assistance. However that didn’t buy their silence. Both CEO’s had the backbone to speak out publicly against ridiculous government rules and restrictions on the population and workforce.,
Ahhh, but these folks weren't going to be locked up by the aforementioned government for criticising their ridiculous rules and restrictions.......

[YeahNahYeah]

I don’t get why Swire is continuing to bother with China or care what orders they might receive for their airline?

Mainland property market is stuffed, bottling surely under review by Coca Cola for continued presence, leaving what? Marine supply? Sugar packets? Really hard to see what they would gain for their their continued commitment, compromises, and utter complicity

[china123]

Hong Kong Covid: The Cathay pilots stuck in 'perpetual quarantine'https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/976x549/quarantine_086224f38757802dd93151e646b2d9a67cccc2eb.jpg"Aircrew have been on an aeroplane for upwards of 25 hours, sometimes closer to 30 hours if there are any delays," says Clark*, another Cathay Pacific pilot.

"They have to sit on a plastic chair and can't sleep, waiting for the tests. The whole process takes about four hours from the time you've landed to the time you get home."

If they test negative, they get to go home - but they're still not free.read article... (https://www.bbc.com/news/business-59370672)

[china123]

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/665x565/cx_appalling2_f1027520662f105d3e9768b453a682999e5313f4.png

[Busbitch]

I can't understand why there is a single Pilot left at Cathay Pacific who has the ability to leave, notwithstanding locals who can't, you have my full sympathy.

[Busbuoy]

I can't understand why there is a single Pilot left at Cathay Pacific who has the ability to leave, notwithstanding locals who can't, you have my full sympathy.
Because they are clinging to the hope that the owners will reappraise their value to the organisation and remunerate them appropriately.
Good ruck!
The owners are already contemplating how to remunerate you less. After all, you let them take the last chunk off you without so much as a whimper!

[SOPS]

Once upon a time it as the Rolls Royce/ Gold Standard/ Rolex of airline jobs. And Honk Kong was a great place to live. My biggest disappointment was in 1991, when I failed my 2nd Cathay interview.

How the mighty have fallen. And what a sad, sad story it is. How did it come to this? ( I actually know the answer .. Bean Counters took charge.. who know the cost of everything, the value of nothing, and have no idea about aviation). And a few at the top, sold themselves for the money.

[china123]

regardless of any hidden agenda by Swire to sell their stake of CX both GH and AT are absolute failures, dangerously incompetent and completely out of their depth when the pressure is on!

Let's face it, any idiot can sack people in the masses but to go missing in action when they are most needed to support their employees in crisis really does take another level of incompetence - completely void of any consistent and realistic guidance/solutions!!

"Incompetence is the true crisis" Albert Einstein

[Skippy69]

I dunno guys and girls, this has some pretty dark undertones, could be a rough year ahead...

[Bueno Hombre]

and I would argue that "many" is an even bigger statement.
Oh it has taken me awhile to think how "many" could be bigger than. "every". Now I will join those more intelligent than me in realising that the bigger take on this is that the word "every" was not used. Means to say some pilots are still in denial..

[Sleepsleep]

What's even more sickening is that many HK locals cheer on this harsh treatment, thinking that CX pilots are lucky enough to still be employed and therefore should be thankful. A lot of popular negative stereotyping about pilots too, thinking that those three cargo pilots who did a Frankfurt trip deserve to be fired because "they probably got hyper drunk in Germany lol because Germany haha I don't care which internal rule they broke if they even broke any or if they even drink any alcohol" smh

[controlledrest]

"they probably got hyper drunk in Germany lol because Germany haha I don't care which internal rule they broke if they even broke any or if they even drink any alcohol" smh

They were doing a sim renewal of their EASA licenses as part of their exit plan.

[china123]

Never fear. GH and AT are on top of it....poised to support their stress-stricken pilots, they'll swing into action very soon.....

any minute now.....

just you wait....

won't be long....

talk about supreme d...h...s❗❗