Sudden wind overturns PA28 at Blackpool

[ETOPS]

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/480x640/4577fca7_2355_4cbe_a908_fe91845a9760_a1e5cb63ead172fb5f1ba40 7bcbca5647470f7a6.jpeg
Given that a small Tornado was reported in nearby Wigan this was an unfortunate outcome.

[UV]

That was to be the Essex Radio traffic reporting Cherokee that used to operate out of Southend.

[Mike Flynn]

That must have been some wind. Sadly the old trick of locking the seatbelt to the control column often resulted in this .
Hard right and full back on the elevator made it flip.

[Spotthedog]

What's the alternatives to using the seatbelt to lock the control column?

[Piper.Classique]

External control locks are the usual way of doing this. They will lock the controls neutral.

[Pilot DAR]

Restraining flight controls at the control stick/wheel is a last resort, always try to use external control locks. The flight control system is not designed to withstand unquantified gust loads while parked in strong winds. If the cockpit controls are locked, yet the flight controls unrestrained, they try to move against the control system as a whole. When something gets damaged in the flight control system, it may be very difficult to detect during a walk around inspection. I have twice taken off in an airplane, whose walk around was fine, but actually had damage, Both times, it affected the way the plane flew in a very unsafe way - which I found out only in flight. I now know what better to look for for defects, but the first thing I want to do is remove external locks. The most serious such event was an Air Moorea Twin Otter, flight 1121, easy search. The plane spent a lot of time on the apron with cockpit locked controls, downwind to jet blast - the elevator controls failed in flight.

If you can't install external locks on all controls, at least turn the plane into the prevailing wind....

[Hotel-Mama]

I second the suggestion of external locks where possible. However, for a PA28 such as this, external locking of the stabilator is not possible. There are some internal locks available involving restraining the yoke with a device or bungee attached to the rudder pedals. The no-cost option is wedging the yoke forward with the seat back, which is quick, always available, and surprisingly effective. I certainly agree that restraining the yoke fully aft with the seatbelt is a terrible idea. See https://www.pprune.org/private-flying/565688-pa28-stabilator-control-lock.html

[FIC101]

Good points about seat belt control locks

I’ve noticed a tendency for PA 28 operators to think the PA 28’s are immune from being blown over. Aircraft should be tied down if high winds are forecast with proper tie down points or concrete blocks. Don’t forget to untie them before flight though, I see in the latest set of MOR’’s a pilot taxied out with all the tie downs still connected and took off. I think the blocks fell off before rotate!!!!!

[punkalouver]

Good points about seat belt control locks
Don’t forget to untie them before flight though, I see in the latest set of MOR’’s a pilot taxied out with all the tie downs still connected and took off. I think the blocks fell off before rotate!!!!!

A link would be appreciated.

[parkfell]

Good points about seat belt control locks

I’ve noticed a tendency for PA 28 operators to think the PA 28’s are immune from being blown over. Aircraft should be tied down if high winds are forecast with proper tie down points or concrete blocks. Don’t forget to untie them before flight though, I see in the latest set of MOR’’s a pilot taxied out with all the tie downs still connected and took off. I think the blocks fell off before rotate!!!!!

A sense of déjà vu as this ‘style’ of take-off has occurred historically. Many moons ago at Elstree??

Did BPL have a TAF published? Was a MET special ~ METAR undertaken?

[Pilot DAR]

Aircraft should be tied down if high winds are forecast with proper tie down points or concrete blocks.

Not so much to the concrete blocks. If you have concrete blocks heavy enough to be useful, they're probably too big the park over/around. I have not seen data for a PA-28, but Cessna, for the 182, in some POH's states that each tiedown should have a capacity of 700 pounds. I learned that lesson forty or so years ago...

I used to fly a kindly lent to me 172M. It lived at a private grass runway near my home, with its only co airplane there being a Seabee, parked across the field hundreds of feet away. Both were tied down to stacks of concrete patio stones (I'll estimate 300-400 pounds per stack). I got a frantic phone call at dawn one morning from the non pilot farmer who lived at the farm where the runway was. "In the big wind last night, the planes blew into each other!!!". I had been last to fly the 172, I was worried - I rushed to the plane. Sure enough, they were now "together". The Seabee had cartwheeled all the way across the apron, and its wing (now devoid of a wingtip float) had passed over the 172 wing. The stack of concrete patio stones, still tied to the Seabee tiedown point, were now under the 172 wing, with the rope a little deflected by passing over the aileron. Aside from a very small bend on the trailing edge of the aileron, the 172 was otherwise undamged - the Seabee was a mess - dented and wrinkled at all corners. I gently pushed the 172 out from under the Seabee to prevent further damage. I learned that day that if you mean it, to have to tie planes well, and I believe Cessna's 700 pound value.

[Andrewgr2]

Not so much to the concrete blocks. If you have concrete blocks heavy enough to be useful, they're probably too big the park over/around. I have not seen data for a PA-28, but Cessna, for the 182, in some POH's states that each tiedown should have a capacity of 700 pounds. I learned that lesson forty or so years ago...

I used to fly a kindly lent to me 172M. It lived at a private grass runway near my home, with its only co airplane there being a Seabee, parked across the field hundreds of feet away. Both were tied down to stacks of concrete patio stones (I'll estimate 300-400 pounds per stack). I got a frantic phone call at dawn one morning from the non pilot farmer who lived at the farm where the runway was. "In the big wind last night, the planes blew into each other!!!". I had been last to fly the 172, I was worried - I rushed to the plane. Sure enough, they were now "together". The Seabee had cartwheeled all the way across the apron, and its wing (now devoid of a wingtip float) had passed over the 172 wing. The stack of concrete patio stones, still tied to the Seabee tiedown point, were now under the 172 wing, with the rope a little deflected by passing over the aileron. Aside from a very small bend on the trailing edge of the aileron, the 172 was otherwise undamged - the Seabee was a mess - dented and wrinkled at all corners. I gently pushed the 172 out from under the Seabee to prevent further damage. I learned that day that if you mean it, to have to tie planes well, and I believe Cessna's 700 pound value.

If you consider that the average passenger will weigh around a 80 kg and most of the tie down blocks I’ve seen weigh less than 40 kg it’s hardly surprising that a pair of them won’t stop the typical light plane trying to take off on a 50-60 kt gust! The concrete blocks have less effect than putting a person in the plane.

[Russell Gulch]

What's the alternatives to using the seatbelt to lock the control column?
Tie the thing to the ground, that's why they're called tie-downs. What an avoidable wreck.
Russ

[Maoraigh1]

"Tie the thing to the ground."
Is in addition to tying control column. It will allow control surfaces to move in the wind.
PS I understand fixing stick back in a tailwheel aircraft into wind. But in a nose wheel aircraft, with tail and wing tie-downs, into wind,, it will try to lift the nose and increase lift.

[visibility3miles]

I second the comment about tie downs…

Have some sturdy bolts imbedded deeply in the ground, then tie the plane down so it doesn’t blow away like a leaf in the wind.

If you think a hurricane is approaching , then fly it away elsewhere to get out of the way, or stick it in a hanger.

Weather forecasting is pretty good these days.

[visibility3miles]

One time my spouse and I hopped out of a Cessna 172 after a flight, leaving both doors wide open once I taxied into our tie down spot, at which point the breeze started to make it roll forward.

The open doors turned it into a kite, catching the wind, which we could have predicted HAD WE THOUGHT ABOUT IT IN ADVANCE.

We immediately bounced back towards the plane and slammed the doors shut so it wouldn’t slam into a plane across the way. Oops!

We pushed it back and tied it down. Lesson learned.

The wind was straight down the runway, so landing was easy. It’s the tie down that got interesting.

[BigEndBob]

Rope around rudder pedals to yoke aileron neutral and down elevator.

[Pilot DAR]

For me, in cockpit control locks are a last resort. Twice, I've take off in planes to find in flight, hidden control system damage which resulted from unlocked flight controls straining against locked cockpit controls.

[Mike Flynn]

I hear what you are saying Pilot DAR but anyone parking a light aircraft outside has to face facts. In strong winds the aircraft is vulnerable unless tied to terra firma. The token tie downs with small lumps of concrete or water filled plastic drums are a waste of time. My last aircraft which was on a few hundred metres from home was protected by a U shaped three metre high bund of straw bales. This offered protection from high winds and screened the aircraft from public eyes. In all honesty leaving a valuable possession such as an aircraft outside is a recipe for disaster. You wouldn’t keep your ride on mower outside so why your flying machine?

[punkalouver]

For me, in cockpit control locks are a last resort. Twice, I've take off in planes to find in flight, hidden control system damage which resulted from unlocked flight controls straining against locked cockpit controls.

Aircraft type please?

[Uplinker]

.............The token tie downs with small lumps of concrete or water filled plastic drums are a waste of time......

Many moons ago I was walking across a light aircraft apron, (with my hi-viz on!), when I observed a Cessna 152/172 taxiing, and actually dragging along the tie-down weights hanging from each main-wing, I kid you not.
I waved my arms to stop the aircraft, which it did. I then thought, how do I convey the problem? I pointed, then stood there, holding each upper arm out horizontal, and doing an up and down motion as if I was lifting a heavy shopping bag in each hand, or doing dips on the parallel bars.

The "pilot" understood, and gave me a big thumbs up. Walk around? what walk around?! Hopefully a lesson learned by him.

[Maoraigh1]

I think DAR is suggesting locking controls with something at the moving surface, rather than in the cockpit. NOT suggesting no lock at all.

[punkalouver]

I think DAR is suggesting locking controls with something at the moving surface, rather than in the cockpit. NOT suggesting no lock at all.
I suspect he is too. But then there is real world. Real world is.....no external locks for most aircraft and not easy to get. Perhaps for a personal aircraft one can do it but for me, renting from a bunch of locations in the last few years.....only one with an external lock provided......a rudder lock for a Grumman Cougar in New York, which was kept in a hangar.

[Pilot DAR]

Aircraft type please?

Cessna 182A, 'hadn't flown in a month or so, owner left it, and asked me to pick it up. Cessna control wheel lock installed. Did my walk around, but did not notice that one aileron pushrod was bent. The effect was to droop the aileron. It took off great STOL with a drooped aileron, but the control wheel was well over in flight. Aileron system inspected, pushrod replaced, ailerons rerigged, and it was fine.

Cessna 150M, 'hadn't flown in many months, let at YYZ. Owner wanted it flown out so as to no longer incur parking fees. Cessna control wheel lock installed. Did my walk around, everything looked normal. Everything seemed normal in flight, until short final, with full flaps extended. I went to flare, and the control wheel jammed in pitch. A desperate and hearty pull released the jam, and I landed with no grace whatever. In cruise flight, the hole in the control wheel tube is "outside" the plastic bearing in the instrument panel. When you retrim after extending full flaps, that hold goes just inside the plastic bearing. I had not noticed that there was a burr around that hole in the tube from the controls banging it for months at Toronto. The burr had caught on the inside of the bearing just enough to jam when I was pulling back and up on the control wheel. (My pre flight control check had been done without lifting the control wheel up, so the burr did not catch - the bottom seemed not to have been burred). I carefully filed the burr off the hole, and it was fine. I had the plane inspected anyway.

In both cases, knowing what I was looking for preflight would have revealed the defect, but, in both cases, I was not looking for that - now I am! Locked control surfaces, and free cockpit controls assure zero risk of flight control systems damage from winds on the flight controls.

[Mike Flynn]

The Cessna family had a simple yoke lock with a pin running through the control column.

I don’t know why by Piper never adopted this system which would have overcome the loose tailplane in winds. I was like many taught by flying instructors to lock the controls using the seat belt method. The same instructors saw three Tomahawks on their backs after a gusty night.

The ubiquitous small concrete blocks or five gallon water drums are locked to aircraft around the world assuming these will defend a forty knot gale gusting sixty. Outside parking demands locking the aeroplane to the likes of steel cables seen in airports across the USA.