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nivsy
15th Aug 2021, 13:50
Interesting reading? .https://crewroom.ca/incident-a-turkish-airlines-a330-attempted-to-takeoff-from-a-taxiway-at-newark-airport/

Airbubba
15th Aug 2021, 15:17
Continental landed a 757 on a taxiway at EWR a while back.

Continental Airlines Flight 1883 - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Airlines_Flight_1883)

Check Airman
15th Aug 2021, 16:00
Does anyone know if there is an ILS to 22R, and if it was operating at the time?

vilas
15th Aug 2021, 17:06
I don't know why should this happen. There is a procedure and in the check list. The runway designation is written on a square block before the RW, while entering the RW that should be checked and announced. Next with present GPS PRIMARY days the aircraft symbol on the ND should be dead on the selected RW. Last if ILS is on then select ILS/LS on and check LOC is centered. Out of the two in front if one of them checked any one of the three it wouldn't have happened. If none is checked then any RW you enter will be taken as the correct one due to confirmation bias and will take you for a ride. This incident is very strange because the aircraft was taxiing on the parallel taxi track left of Takeoff RW. When cleared for Takeoff they entered RW22R, crossed it to line up on a parallel taxi track between the RW22R and 22L and tried to take off.

Musket90
15th Aug 2021, 17:52
Mistakng a taxiway for a runway has happened before at other airports, particularly at night. Don't know what the lighting set up is at EWR but this may have been a factor.

tcasblue
16th Aug 2021, 01:54
Pilots need to confirm where they are when lining up. The first thing one can do is to have in mind to never line up on a stretch of pavement intended to be used for takeoff that has blue lights or green centreline lights. Be looking for white lights. Seems obvious but it happens.

Many companies have checklists with runway confirmation. Your best bet is to use the painted runway number, even if you already used a sign for runway confirmation as this also ensures that you are on the centreline because there have been attempted takeoffs from the runway edge.

Of course there is the possibility of an approach localizer for confirmation(which is frequently used in low vis ops due to reduced ability to see markings properly) but there is the risk of forgetting about it being in the FMC and therefore losing auto-tuning and the problems that can cause.

Using heading only is insufficient to ensure that one is on the proper runway at many airports. Best to look for the runway numbers. And there is frequently a yellow taxiway line leading one toward the runway centreline with that yellow taxiway line ending and the white runway centreline continuing.

Alpine Flyer
16th Aug 2021, 17:09
RAAS would prevent that. Unfortunately the industry has become too cheap to install whatever new safety equipment is available.

Crosswind Limits
16th Aug 2021, 18:02
A few years ago we were given a sidestep at night from ILS 22L to visual 22R at about 6 miles due to the aircraft ahead bursting a tire on landing. At the time there were no PAPIs on 22R and with parallel taxiways both sides it really focused the mind after an 8 hour flight!

Chiefttp
16th Aug 2021, 23:53
I find it hard to believe it was a passenger who alerted the crew, the time it would take to alert the flight crew, while on takeoff roll seems implausible. I heard an ATC tape and the tower alerted them that they were on taxiway P. They rejected at 90 knots.

rmiller4292
17th Aug 2021, 00:34
It didn't read to me as a passenger alerted the crew, rather the passenger gave a statement to the news about the airplane being on a taxiway. The story clearly says that the tower cancelled the takeoff clearance when they observed the airplane on the taxiway.

Chiefttp
17th Aug 2021, 01:48
RMiller4292,
My mistake. Kudos to the Tower personnel who noticed the mistake and acted quickly to avoid a potential accident.

megan
17th Aug 2021, 07:07
I can see how you would need your wits about you.


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/784x486/u_d797c8167703d378795d8f5c9243af79a5616d60.png

jmmoric
17th Aug 2021, 08:52
Considering the displaced threshold, those number could be hard to see from the cockpit lining up? Or could they? They would from my Piper 28 at least....

Consol
17th Aug 2021, 09:54
Anyone can make a mistake but....
Multiple aircraft write offs, one of which was fatal,
Mitigation measures by airports when they fly there,
No Turkish (the country) accident reports ever published if they happen in Turkey.
Ask any ATCO how they view this airline.
Still, so long as all the paperwork is okay what could possibly be wrong?

wiggy
17th Aug 2021, 11:37
Seems they lined up from the W intersection, which is fairly standard for 22 departures and puts a lot of the unusable behind you…it also used to be well signed/well lit.

I wonder which taxiway they were on northbound before they took the right/east turn onto W, and which they expected/thought they were on?

DaveReidUK
17th Aug 2021, 12:23
They took Twy B, then straight ahead on Twy R, per FR24:

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/674x671/tk30_ff606a78513c296cc408c0cd198ffa11012c6238.jpg

wiggy
17th Aug 2021, 12:42
Thanks, looks like the ATC plan and the taxi-out was pretty much the standard one as I remember it so that’s even more of a ? from me.

I’m mystified as to what mental model the crew had that led to them actually managing to cross 22R without it seems recognizing it for what it was, and then turning right onto the parallel.