Old Jet A1?

[Sunfish]

Found an abandoned barrel of what appears to be jetA1. Unopened, I think. No paperwork or labels. At least five years old. Is it now blackberry spray or could someone still use it in a turbine?

[Capt Fathom]

Do you still use kero heaters in Victoria?

[Office Update]

Voluntary payment of 'road excise' to the government and use it as diesel fuel in a car or truck!
Lovely clean fuel

[machtuk]

Careful using Jet fuel in diesel engines, OK for brief periods but it's a very 'dry' fuel, injector pumps wear out quickly using Jet fuel.

[compressor stall]

Voluntary payment of 'road excise' to the government and use it as diesel fuel in a car or truck!
Lovely clean fuel
older 80's diesels are fine - so I'm told....

[Cessna 200]

I have no idea of the long term effects however we just started running JetA1 in our 50KVA generators. Would adding say 0.5% oil help with the lubrication in injector pumps or is long term use of JetA1 ok to use in diesel engines?

[compressor stall]

I have no idea of the long term effects however we just started running JetA1 in our 50KVA generators. Would adding say 0.5% oil help with the lubrication in injector pumps or is long term use of JetA1 ok to use in diesel engines?
that’s what I’ve been told to do with newer engines. Never tried it on the Disco or Prado though.

[miroho]

JetA works well in the old Vulcan oil heaters

[thunderbird five]

What did Victorians use before candles?

Electricity.

[ShyTorque]

Add a small amount of two stroke oil for lubrication of a diesel pump?

[Propstop]

Add sufficient two stroke mineral oil to the JetA1 until it feels slippery between your fingers and would be perfectly OK to use in Toyota or Nissan diesels.
I would be hesitant to use it in my common rail 3.0 Discovery simply because of the enormous cost of replacing fuel components. This is what is used in some places in Africa for the old school Toyota engines.

[Office Update]

There was a refueller many years ago at Tullamarine. He was nicking the Jet fuel and he openly used to brag about this.. He used to fly Doves on Penguin flight to Phillip Island in his spare time.
He was using the Jet A1 in his oil heater at home. When the problem became known he had to rip out his oil heater at home to conceal the evidence!

[catseye]

Old style mechanically injected diesels run very well on it with additional oil ie two stroke or if you can get it biodiesel. think diesel fergies and land rovers before high pressure injection. Inspect the drum with a torch to check for water and fuel fungus before pumping it in . jet works very well in cold climates as an alternate to fuel waxing.

[machtuk]

There was a refueller many years ago at Tullamarine. He was nicking the Jet fuel and he openly used to brag about this.. He used to fly Doves on Penguin flight to Phillip Island in his spare time.
He was using the Jet A1 in his oil heater at home. When the problem became known he had to rip out his oil heater at home to conceal the evidence!

i know the very guy -)
Actually there is quite a story behind the Jet A1 pilfering, all but forgotten now.

[Capt Fathom]

Why would you need to ‘pilfer’ it. Most people just saved up all the fuel drain samples.

[old,not bold]

A UK regional airport which shall be nameless decided some years ago to use Jet A1, either discarded from sampling, or rejected for minor contamination, or straight out of the storage, in its RFFS vehicles.

A year later they had to replace every component in all 5 engines which depended on the lubricant additive in diesel sold for vehicle use. The bill for parts and labour ran to thousands.

Just like my bill for repairing a common-rail diesel car engine after I had experimented with mixing diesel 50:50 with used cooking oil. (Yes, I did register as a fuel producer.)

[FakePilot]

No idea of the long term effects .... 50 KVA ? Uh, that's a big generator to be playing with?

[601]

Voluntary payment of 'road excise' to the government and use it as diesel fuel in a car or truck!
Lovely clean fuel

Definitely NOT in a common rail diesel engine.

[Deltasierra010]

Not in a common rail engine that will cost a great deal in an older diesel dilute it with 50% diesel fuel it will be fine

[601]

You could also use it in your vintage Farmall tractor.

[DeRated]

or on the blackberries....

[Peter47]

I'm sure I've seen a Jet A sticker on a pushback tractor somewhere in the States (probably a long time ago). I don't know if they also used additives.

[gerry111]

Mix equal parts of Jet A1, castor oil, ether and shake well. Find the Taipan 2.5cc diesel engine that you haven't run since a teenager..

[machtuk]

Try 20/30% oil not equal parts! -) 20-30% Ether, a few percentage of Iso Nitrate the balance kero/Jet A1, that's what I used to used many years ago in my toy plane engines.

[krismiler]

A modern Diesel engine is extremely critical in terms of the fuel being used, make sure you use the correct Euro spec and not just any diesel pump on the forecourt. Repair bills on these engines will make your eyes water and if you use the wrong fuel it won’t be covered under warranty.

If you’ve got an old wreck of a car, filling to 90% with garage fuel and topping off the rest with JetA1 might be worth trying.

[Aussie Bob]

If you’ve got an old wreck of a car, filling to 90% with garage fuel and topping off the rest with JetA1 might be worth trying.

I ran a Mitsubishi 2.5 diesel van for 10's of thousands of kays on straight Jet A1, well over 200k on home made biodiesel and a few thousand on diesel. Still have it, it's still going strong and it now has 290,000 on the clock. Original engine, one reco on the pump and one new set of injector tips. Jet A1 is often sold as diesel in very cold climates. Much lower cloud point. I will take the Jet A1! Perfect diesel fuel for old rattlers.

[NutLoose]

RAF used to add Avtur which is Jet A to the tankers fuel during winter to prevent waxing.

[Runaway Gun]

Nutloose, the current crew tell me that is now out of favour - they prefer to use lasers to remove bushes.

[lucille]

Here’s a business plan. Repackage your nicely aged Jet A1 in 100 ml bottles with a wick and market it to the thousands of turbine tragics. They can light the wick and infuse their homes with the romantic scent of burning kerosine. Label it Parfum de Tarmac. Perhaps include the optional CD of a choir of APUs howling in harmony to add to the ambiance.

[The Banjo]

Nutloose, the current crew tell me that is now out of favour - they prefer to use lasers to remove bushes.

Lasers or Razors - same result!

[compressor stall]

Here’s a business plan. Repackage your nicely aged Jet A1 in 100 ml bottles with a wick and market it to the thousands of turbine tragics. They can light the wick and infuse their homes with the romantic scent of burning kerosine. Label it Parfum de Tarmac..
My wife calls it “eau de pilot”.
Even if I didn’t spill / splash a drop, she could tell I’d refuelled.

[Desert Flower]

My wife calls it “eau de pilot”.
Even if I didn’t spill / splash a drop, she could tell I’d refuelled.

I used to call Jet A1 Kero De Cologne & Avgas Eau De Avgas.

DF.

[Sunfish]

Update: Jet A1 proves to be somewhat more inflammable than I thought! It isn’t as benign as diesel. It’s somewhere between diesel and avgas.

it’s just cost me a new umbrella for the patio and four new cushions for the outdoor lounges.

...and it was only a couple of cups in the fire pit to get the wood burning.

...and a slightly singed Sunfish!

[werbil]

Update: Jet A1 proves to be somewhat more inflammable than I thought! It isn’t as benign as diesel. It’s somewhere between diesel and avgas.

it’s just cost me a new umbrella for the patio and four new cushions for the outdoor lounges.

...and it was only a couple of cups in the fire pit to get the wood burning.

...and a slightly singed Sunfish!

Given that the flashpoint of Jet A1 is 38 degrees I think you did very well to make it go woosh today in Victoria. Were you atomising the fuel, or was there already a bit of heat present?

The characteristics of Jet A1 are very similar to diesel except for the flashpoint which is 62 degrees for diesel. The flashpoint for Petrol / AVGAS is -43 degrees.

One thing that most people don't realise is that Diesel and Kerosene have a lower autoignition temperature than Petrol. This is the temperature that the fuel will ignite without a naked flame, so if you spill diesel on a hot exhaust it is more likely to ignite in the absense of a spark than petrol.

So if you'd used Diesel a few more things may still be intact, but not necessarialy so - if you get the conditions right any fuel can make a big bang.

[Sunfish]

There was a “smouldering “ fire in the pit that needed sparking up. I now think I know that the difference between a 38 and 62 degree flashpoint is not to be sneezed at.

[werbil]

There was a “smouldering “ fire in the pit that needed sparking up. I now think I know that the difference between a 38 and 62 degree flashpoint is not to be sneezed at.

There is a reasonable chance it may not have made any difference - so I wouldn't suggest repeating the experiment using diesel thinking it is safer just in case.

[Superfly Slick Dick]

Mix it with orange juice, and drink that **** UP!

[havick]

Careful using Jet fuel in diesel engines, OK for brief periods but it's a very 'dry' fuel, injector pumps wear out quickly using Jet fuel.

Just dose it with double the recommended amount of Morey’s Diesel conditioner (greenish colored bottle).

Ran my prado for 4 years with zero issues.

[cooperplace]

There was a “smouldering “ fire in the pit that needed sparking up. I now think I know that the difference between a 38 and 62 degree flashpoint is not to be sneezed at.
Unfortunately the burns units in hospitals pick up quite a bit of business this way. Usually involving petrol.

[cooperplace]

Years ago I bought a house with an old oil heater tank, still half full. So I put a few litres into every full tank of my old beetle until it was all gone. Car ran fine.
Edit: car ran like a beetle.

[Sunfish]

It definitely lights up and burns faster than diesel. I tested both today on igniting my burn piles. We are now mowing and clearing combustible fuels as fast as we can to get ready for the bushfire season.

[ShyTorque]

It definitely lights up and burns faster than diesel. I tested both today on igniting my burn piles.

You can get soothing cream for that.. :eek: