Kuwait 777 high nose landing attitude at AMS

[skydler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWJwnIxiAyc

[lomapaseo]

is that what you call greasing it

[safetypee]

'Surprising' for a casual observer; the landing was different from the norm (their norm), but in the actual conditions, poor visibility, wet runway, gusty winds, - a good landing at the correct touchdown speed - as required.

Safety needs to look at what goes right, and not label the 'unusual' as an error; instead a well judged adjustment for the conditions.

Pprune is an open, public, professional forum. It tolerates a wide range of views, but in return we could expect a considered opinion, or at least an understanding, an explanation of comments which covertly allocate blame.

Understanding provides the basis for learning - appreciating or resetting our 'norms', adding knowledge, and considering how to use this.

"I believe in evidence. I believe in observation, measurement, and reasoning, confirmed by independent observers.”— Isaac Asimov

https://fs.blog/2020/08/observer-effect/

[oceancrosser]

Appalling landing. And certainly not a “greaser”. And a smooth landing does not have to have a nose high attitude.

[Capt Scribble]

Training maybe, flared early and high, eventually pushed down before the tail hit.

[ACMS]

possibly, also possible they suffered an undershoot shear sink and simply pulled back to stop the sink.....suffered a considerable speed loss and continued without adding thrust or indeed going around....

[Pilot DAR]

'Sure looked like challenging meteorological conditions.....

[DND delivery]

You can see the same landing from a different angle here:

https://youtu.be/7GpY8HCVlEs

[blue up]

Am I missing something? The way the spoilers retract and the lack of wing flex upon landing looks like MS Flightsim 2020.

[JCviggen]

lol, Yeah that video is definitely not real life. Quite obvious if you look at it at a decent resolution.

[SpamCanDriver]

Which video is fake?

Both look real to me, there is no 777 in FS2020 and that is most definitely a real background. The way the spoilers disappear is because of two clips being blended together.

[junior.VH-LFA]

JCviggen

Your perception on reality has clearly been lost if you think either of those videos are not recorded in "real life."

[JCviggen]

SpamCanDriver

The second is quite clearly not real.

First video looks like they shot a real video with no plane in it and added the CGI plane afterwards. The Dutch guy's verbal expressions of amazement are also extremely unconvincing. The YT account has no previous videos in it of any kind. A bit weird for a "Max Aviation" channel.

[Big Pistons Forever]

I thought the long body 777's have a tail strike protection system in the autopilot that will command a pitch down in the landing flare if it senses a tail strike is imminent.

[Laurence25]

Yeah looks like a fugazi to me.

The chap standing in his shorts and tee shirt In the pissing down rain gives it away....

[Imagegear]

Yup second video definitely faked:

The grass is waving in the wind at the start - but the guy in field never twitches or changes his aiming point whatsoever,

At the point of touchdown (00.52 secs), the grass and tall wild flowers are rock steady,

At 2160p, (4K Def) the spray coming of the undercarriage looks CGI,

Finally, left wing correcting down when wind is from the right is just not on.

But even if it is MSFS, the rendering is better than anything I've seen so far.

[Pistonprop]

Yeah looks like a fugazi to me.

The chap standing in his shorts and tee shirt In the pissing down rain gives it away....

Fake or not I wouldn't judge it on that guy. I can tell you that it was a warm day with short sharp local showers passing through. Different to Chester where it never stops raining! ;)

[SpamCanDriver]

It is most definitely not from MSFS 2020, there is not even a 777 available for it.
If its CGI added on top of another video then its extremely well done. Speaking as a 777 pilot of nearly 12 yrs, look at the detail in the wheel wells, undercarriage, flap track fairings etc. Also the wobble in the tailpane, reflections in the fuselage and heat blur and depth of field when passing infront of the KLM 737.
Truly top drawer cgi if it is

[DaveReidUK]

Yup second video definitely faked

The author of the second video (assuming you mean the one linked in post #8) has more than 1500 videos on YouTube, almost all showing landings and takeoffs at Schiphol.

Are they all fake, too, or just this one ?

[DIBO]

Nothing fake.
This is the young guy (https://www.gelderlander.nl/binnenland/vliegtuigspotter-legt-spectaculaire-landing-vast-dit-had-heel-anders-af-kunnen-lopen~a9e6375b/175157388/) who made the first video (or was it his girlfriend...) Here's the complete Dutch newspaper article (https://www.gelderlander.nl/binnenland/vliegtuigspotter-legt-spectaculaire-landing-vast-dit-had-heel-anders-af-kunnen-lopen~a9e6375b/).
Job well done :) minimal runway occupancy time, touchdown well beyond 1km from piano-keys, high speed exit at 2.4km

[SpamCanDriver]

Yep I didn't think it was fake, got no idea what the other guys are seeing

[DaveReidUK]

minimal runway occupancy time, touchdown well beyond 1km from piano-keys

Nice try, but sadly Arrival ROT (https://ext.eurocontrol.int/lexicon/index.php/Arrival_runway_occupancy_time) gets measured from when you cross the threshold, regardless of how much farther on you actually touch down. :O

[TBSC]

Expat-pilots-fired effect?

[parkfell]

Would someone like to comment on the slow deployment of SPOILERS.

As soon as weight on wheels switch is activated the spoilers should work immediately?

[Jumbo744]

safetypee

I'm sorry but that's a lot of garbage you just wrote. No need to be a philosopher to explain what happened. If you have ever flown a Boeing you know this landing was abnornal no matter how you look at it.

[Gizm0]

Good Lord.
What a load of drivel is being postulated here. Surely better things to do / comment on?? In short guys: You weren't there!!

[lomapaseo]

Abnormal has many meanings, but to me it's simply a statistical occurence. that resulted in a safe outcome. To suggest that it might have been unwise depends on examination of many factors

From the passenger standpoint I doubt they even noticed

[hamil]

Would someone like to comment on the slow deployment of SPOILERS.

As soon as weight on wheels switch is activated the spoilers should work immediately?

Honestly, it was a weird landing, so the thrust levers were not likely at idle at that moment (touchdown).

FCOM: "In the ARMED position, the speedbrake lever is driven aft to the UP position when the landing gear is fully on the ground (not tilted) and the thrust levers are at idle".

[Anilv]

I was looking at the windshield wipers in the second video.. way too detailed for a computer graphic. Not saying it wasnt heavily edited or enhanced but the plane looks real enough.
As for the wings not flexing, I guess it touched light.. look at the nosewheel extension ..

Anilv

[Bergerie1]

Jumbo744,

I think safetypee knows a little more about flying than you do.

[pattern_is_full]

I don't get the fuss.

Looks like the crew didn't have a perfect picture of the runway until very short final, due to the rain squall. Saw they were a tad low once out of the rain shaft and made an adjustment with pitch and power to extend the touchdown. Then bobbled the flare due to forgetting they were already in near-flare altitude but carrying power (which also negated the auto-spoilers) and ended up feeling for the ground and yanking the power back after touchdown.

Sloppy and not pretty, but I have seen much worse - without all the screams from the spotters, nor anyone questioning the video.

[stilton]

Yet another reason to be impressed by the triple is it’s apparent cornering ability


I thought he’d end up in the weeds with the speed he took that turn off

[PoppaJo]

I don't get the fuss.

Looks like the crew didn't have a perfect picture of the runway until very short final, due to the rain squall. Saw they were a tad low once out of the rain shaft and made an adjustment with pitch and power to extend the touchdown. Then bobbled the flare due to forgetting they were already in near-flare altitude but carrying power (which also negated the auto-spoilers) and ended up feeling for the ground and yanking the power back after touchdown.

Sloppy and not pretty, but I have seen much worse - without all the screams from the spotters, nor anyone questioning the video.
Sloppy indeed.

There is a certain time to give away the approach and that time had well passed in my book.

Spin it however you want, The training department won’t be impressed. Well I certainly wouldn’t be if they were dealing with me.

I wonder how recent they flew. Recency is going to be a big issue going forward for operators. We have already seen a few blunders in recent months.

[AndoniP]

Looked like the rate of descent from 30 to 44 seconds was quite high (from this angle), then the float up to 51 seconds, then it looked like it was going to stall so nose down at the last seconds and landed on the runway. It would be interesting to know what the winds were like at that very second...

[bekolblockage]

I realize the camera lens foreshortens the distance and increases apparent angles but that exit speed and turn off from the centreline is nonetheless impressive- especially in the wet!
I wish they’d take the RETs like that here!!

[Jumbo744]

Jumbo744,

I think safetypee knows a little more about flying than you do.

That's fine. I've noticed the more someone says he knows a lot about flying, the lower his IQ is.

[Bergerie1]

That's a suprising observation! Do you have evidence?

[DaveReidUK]

A former colleague (ex-navigator) used to delight in saying that anyone with half a mind to be a pilot had all the right qualifications. :O

[Modular Halil]

Am I missing something? The way the spoilers retract and the lack of wing flex upon landing looks like MS Flightsim 2020.
From 0:48 - 0:50 you can just about see some wing flex. This isn't a MSFS 2020 video however I am not dismissing the fact it could be fake.

[hart744]

How close were these people from the runway when the video was taken? Were they on the airside? We have all sat on the taxiways waiting for our turn to take-off. I have never seen a 777 float like that before. It may be possible if your Vref is very high, which means you are not on a stabilized approach. Any sane PIC would have called for a go around.
Fake news!

[Smoketrails]

Video is shot at Amsterdam Schiphol and if you have ever been there you should no that some parts of the airport are not fenced of. Because the airport perimeter is separated by canals.

[xetroV]

This landing has been captured by several aircraft spotters, and apart from these two videos I have seen several photos of the event. So, yes, this was real and people who believe otherwise are either overcritical or easily fooled.

The upside of this is that the era of every small aviation mishap being posted on social media is quickly coming to an end, since we can now easily dismiss it as "nothing to see here, it's just FS2020".

[HPSOV L]

Looks like a crosswind landing that ended up with a bit too much pushing and pulling. May have been a gust in the initial flare. The pitch is about 7 or 8 degrees nose up during the float. 5 or less is normal. Probably got a call from FOQA afterwards and a bit of extra go around training.

[exfocx]

That's a suprising observation! Do you have evidence?

Most likely the same level of evidence as your statement comparing their knowledge.