A bit confused between NPPL and LAPL

[theodoreallen]

So I’m interested in learning to fly and had started to go down the route of obtaining the NPPL. I have since discovered the LAPL and was wondering which would be best?

is there a huge difference in price etc? I’m interested in flying aircraft like the Ikarus C42, which is covered under the NPPL, so would the LAPL be worth doing at all?

cheers!

[Jhieminga]

The big question will be: can you still get a LAPL with Brexit looming...

[skyboy999]

It depends on what, and where, you want to fly. The C42 is a microlight so, presumably, you are training for an NPPL with microlight rating. With some additional training you could add an SSEA rating which would allow you to fly 'Annex 2/non-EASA' aircraft- typically those operating on permit to fly but not your typical Cessna/Piper. As the NPPL is a national licence, you are restricted to flying within the UK although, in practice, agreements allow flying beyond though, in some cases, subject to specific permission.
On the back of an SSEA rating, it used to be possible to convert to a LAPL just by paperwork but this is no longer the case and, to get a LAPL now requires full course of training.
The LAPL allows you to fly both Annex 1 and Annex 2 aircraft throughout EASA land. It also allows you to fly microlights providing you have differences training endorsed in your logbook.
So..... if all you ever want to do is fly microlights like the C42 within the UK, then the NPPL(M) will suffice. If, however, you think you may want to fly something heavier and/or outside the UK in the future then the LAPL may be a better choice. The LAPL can also be upgraded to PPL with additional training.
Another driver will be how far you are currently into your training, as NPPL(M) training hours can't be credited to LAPL training so, if almost completed, then it will be a big overhead; if barely started then much easier to consider (re-) starting a LAPL course.

[MrAverage]

Also remember that a LAPL cannot be used in the rest of the world................

[malcfcook]

Just heard a strong rumour (through BGA) that LAPL licences will be valid in UK for a least two years from Dec 31st this year. Also recently announced that the 600kg class changes will mean that 3 axis microlight hours will count towards annual currency. However that probably not apply to initial licence application if the hours are a mixture of microlight and 600+ kg aircraft. LAPL/NPPL has medical advantages thankfully as some of us can no long gain a class two medical. The really daft bit is if you want to add a 3 axis microlight rating to your existing NPPL A you have to do a full course not a type conversion?

[Fl1ingfrog]

MrAvergae, nor can the NPPL. The advice from skyboy999 cannot be approved upon.

[MrAverage]

approved ?

[BillieBob]

If the UK leaves EASA at the end of the transition period, a UK-issued LAPL will not be recognised elsewhere in the EU. On the bright side, however, and assuming that the UK continues to issue the LAPL, it can become valid on all SEP aeroplanes under 2000kg whether or not they are listed in Annex I to the Basic Regulation. In this case, it would be more logical for the UK to abandon the LAPL and its ludicrous rolling validity and issue the NPPL as the sole UK sub-ICAO licence with either (M), (A) or (H) privileges. By the way, for clarity, Annex II contains the essential requirements for airworthiness and has no relevance to this thread

[TheOddOne]

...IF the NPPL will be valid for flying what will become Part-21 aircraft (formerly EASA types) as well as non-Part-21 aircraft. Medical requirements are less onerous, too.

TOO.

[this is my username]

A C42 is a microlight. In the UK the only licence you can train for on a C42 is an NPPL(M). If you want to fly microlights then the NPPL(M) is the licence for you. The NPPL(M) has significantly lower minimum training hour requirements than the LAPL and is (generally) taught on aircraft with a lower hourly cost.

If you have an NPPL(M) then it is fairly straightforward to convert to an NPPL(SSEA) which will allow you to fly non-EASA light aeroplanes - these are generally permit-to-fly types rather than the Cessnas / Pipers which you will typically see at most flying schools. To fly EASA aeroplanes you need a EASA LAPL or an EASA PPL.

If you want to train in and fly aeroplanes rather than microlights then there are number of licences available to you, of which the LAPL is one.

You need first to decide whether you want to fly microlights or aeroplanes - once you have decided that you can work out which licence would work best for you. That said, there are some big changes on the way. The move to 600kg microlights will make a huge difference as will our departure from the EU and our probable departure from EASA.

[BillieBob]

To fly EASA aeroplanes you need a EASA LAPL or an EASA PPL.This is only true as long as the UK is a member of EASA. If we leave on 31 Dec, the UK is free to make whatever licensing regulations it chooses, including making the NPPL(SSEA) valid for use in 'EASA' aeroplanes.

[this is my username]

This is only true as long as the UK is a member of EASA. If we leave on 31 Dec, the UK is free to make whatever licensing regulations it chooses, including making the NPPL(SSEA) valid for use in 'EASA' aeroplanes.

Except that it is true. It is possible (or maybe even likely) that G-reg aircraft which are currently regulated by EASA might move to a different regulator (and thus become non-EASA) but we don't know yet. We don't yet know what licencing decisions the UK will make. It is possible (though it seems unlikely at the moment) that the UK might remain in EASA. So what should we do - advise the OP based on what we know right now with caveats about changes which might be on their way, or make guesses about the future? Or we could advise everyone to stop flight training until we know the answer - in which case there won't be a training industry left for people to use.

[TheOddOne]

I would advise the OP to decide that if they will ever want to fly anything heavier than a Microlight to train for a LAPL. This should cost the same as training for a NPPL-SSEA; the exams are the same. The only difference that I can see is that of the medical. However, there is a big cost difference between the NPPL(M) training and LAPL training.

Yes, we are facing even more uncertainty at the end of the year but all we can do is carry on. I briefly touch on the potential changes with our students, but since no-one, not the CAA, DfT, the government or anyone else actually knows what's going to happen, there's no point in detailed speculation. As a Club, we've survived the current crisis and student and PPL bookings are good enough to keep us going.

TOO

[xrayalpha]

Some sensible advice here, but....

The C42 is also available as a light aircraft!

While it is difficult for a flying school to train on a C42 that is kit-built, as all "light aircraft" C42s are, I believe that it is still possible!

Anyway, welcome to the minefield of Brexit/EASA regulations.

My summary, as a microlight school proprietor:

Do you want the option to train to become a commercial pilot eventually: Yes= EASA. After the UK leaves EASA, it will probably still be possible to train for an EASA licence outside the EU, as - I believe - there are flying schools in the USA that teach for the EASA licence, and the USA is not in the EU! If not, then your UK EASA hours will be grandfathered over to whatever the new ICAO-recognised UK CPL is.

Do you want to fly for leisure and recreation. Y= Microlight. With the limit being raised to 600kgs next year - a UK decision, although based on European rules, will not be affected by Brexit and departure from EASA - you can get quite a range of capable aircraft. Sportscruisers perhaps? Much cheaper operating costs.

Big disadvantage: you can't fly at night over inhospitable terrain in a single-engined aircraft. If that's your idea of leisure and recreation, then get an EASA licence and buy a Cirrus with a ballistic chute.

(ballistic chutes are also available for microlights, but - at the moment - these aircraft are not approved for night flight)

[Jim59]

In the gliding world there were two EASA licences, the LAPL(S) and the SPL (Sailplane Pilots Licence equivalent to a PPL). As of this spring the LAPL(S) was abolished and all holders are deemed to hold an SPL However, there are minor differences to privileges depending on the medical held - which can be either LAPL (for reduced privileges) or Class 2 or higher. The SPL with Class 2 medical or higher is ICAO compliant so can be used worldwide.

[[email protected]]

Has anyone got any update on the proposed move to 600Kg microlight flying in UK under NPPL?

I am considering purchase of a 600Kg microlight in a year or so after retiring from professional helicopter flying under both mil and civil regulations (ATPLH holder and ex-mil QHI) once I complete required FW training and exams.

There seems to be a strong belief it will happen but are we just waiting for the CAA to rubber stamp the paperwork for 600Kg?

[Hadley Rille]

In the July 2021 BMAA magazine it says that although hoped for by the start of May 2021 they expect at least a two-month delay for the legal paperwork of the ANO definition.