Aerial photography below 500ft AGL in the US

[FairWeatherFlyer]

What's the procedure in the US to ask the FAA for permission for helicopter-based aerial photography below 500ft above-ground-level in areas where the 500ft rule (from 91.119 (https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/91.119)) would be broken? I don't need to do this I'm just curious how much process, risk assessment and record keeping there is around this?

[Sikpilot]

1 word.....


DRONES


Customers will use drones. Cheaper. Quieter. Safer.

[Robbiee]

What's the procedure in the US to ask the FAA for permission for helicopter-based aerial photography below 500ft above-ground-level in areas where the 500ft rule (from 91.119 (https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/91.119)) would be broken? I don't need to do this I'm just curious how much process, risk assessment and record keeping there is around this?

You don't need permission below 500ft in a helicopter :-)

[Gordy]

What's the procedure in the US to ask the FAA for permission for helicopter-based aerial photography below 500ft above-ground-level in areas where the 500ft rule (from 91.119 (https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/91.119)) would be broken? I don't need to do this I'm just curious how much process, risk assessment and record keeping there is around this?

Read para (d):

(d) Helicopters, powered parachutes, and weight-shift-control aircraft. If the operation is conducted without hazard to persons (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=24a80ca42ed148d527b7ddad982da95a&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) or property on the surface -

(1) A helicopter (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=7dc120721ef47a2c4dc17c9948799e0e&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) may be operated at less than the minimums prescribed in paragraph (b) or (c) of this section, provided each person (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=24a80ca42ed148d527b7ddad982da95a&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) operating the helicopter (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=7dc120721ef47a2c4dc17c9948799e0e&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) complies with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=7dc120721ef47a2c4dc17c9948799e0e&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) by the FAA (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=df14de7c16e00ca3868915d263954ee7&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119);

[rudestuff]

Reg changes like that are the kind of thing that really should come up on a flight review.

[Gordy]

Reg changes like that are the kind of thing that really should come up on a flight review.

This reg has not changed that I know of in at least 30 years. We have always been allowed below 500'.

[MikeNYC]

1 word.....


DRONES


Customers will use drones. Cheaper. Quieter. Safer.

Horses for courses. Drones simply can't accomplish everything that can be done with a helicopter, and vice versa.

[FairWeatherFlyer]

Gordy The text of that regulation doesn't help to understand it unless you understand precisely what's meant by "complies with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=7dc120721ef47a2c4dc17c9948799e0e&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) by the FAA" (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=df14de7c16e00ca3868915d263954ee7&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119)

[FairWeatherFlyer]

Bit before my time, but didn't the Twilight Zone accident (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twilight_Zone_accident) change risk assessment and have a lasting effect on aerial photography?

[LRP]

Gordy The text of that regulation doesn't help to understand it unless you understand precisely what's meant by "complies with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=7dc120721ef47a2c4dc17c9948799e0e&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) by the FAA" (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=df14de7c16e00ca3868915d263954ee7&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119)
It means that if the FAA has prescribed any routes or altitudes, then the operator must comply with them. If not, the operation may go below 500 ft as long as the operation does not pose hazards to persons or property on the surface.

[JimEli]

It means that if the FAA has prescribed any routes or altitudes, then the operator must comply with them. If not, the operation may go below 500 ft as long as the operation does not pose hazards to persons or property on the surface.

Previous wording was less, I mean more ambiguous:
"(d) Helicopters. Helicopters may be operated at less than the minimums prescribed in paragraph (b) or (c) of this section if the operation is conducted without hazard to persons or property on the surface. In addition, each person operating a helicopter shall comply with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters by the Administrator."

[Gordy]

Gordy The text of that regulation doesn't help to understand it unless you understand precisely what's meant by "complies with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=7dc120721ef47a2c4dc17c9948799e0e&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119) by the FAA" (https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=df14de7c16e00ca3868915d263954ee7&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter:F:Part:91:Subpart:B:S ubjgrp:4:91.119)

It means exactly that. If the FAA has published a route, for example, New York has specific routes for helicopters, or if the FAA control tower gives you a specific routing or altitude, then you must follow that. If not, then you can fly any altitude you wish, 20 feet if you wish.

Bit before my time, but didn't the Twilight Zone accident (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twilight_Zone_accident) change risk assessment and have a lasting effect on aerial photography?

Ahh yes, the Dorcey Wingo accident. When working on movie sets or even for documentaries etc one can be issued a waiver. Where I work we have a set waiver that allows us to go as close to people/property as needed to get the shot under certain circumstances. We have listed pilots, aircraft and have to produce a "production call list" along with each shot and the FAA will issue a specific waiver. All people inside the "shot area" must be signatory to the waiver etc. Details here: Form 7711 (https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Form/FAA_Form_7711-2.pdf)

Dorcey wrote a good book BTW, Rise and Fall of Captain Methane

[MikeNYC]

It means exactly that. If the FAA has published a route, for example, New York has specific routes for helicopters, or if the FAA control tower gives you a specific routing or altitude, then you must follow that. If not, then you can fly any altitude you wish, 20 feet if you wish.



Ahh yes, the Dorcey Wingo accident. When working on movie sets or even for documentaries etc one can be issued a waiver. Where I work we have a set waiver that allows us to go as close to people/property as needed to get the shot under certain circumstances. We have listed pilots, aircraft and have to produce a "production call list" along with each shot and the FAA will issue a specific waiver. All people inside the "shot area" must be signatory to the waiver etc. Details here: Form 7711 (https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Form/FAA_Form_7711-2.pdf)

Dorcey wrote a good book BTW, Rise and Fall of Captain Methane (https://www.amazon.com/Rise-Fall-Captain-Methane-Autobiography/dp/1432748289)

Additionally, one form of a 7711 waiver often comes in the form of a Motion Picture Manual, which, once approved, can simplify the waiver process and FSDO notification for frequent wavered work. See FSIMS Document Viewer (http://fsims.faa.gov/PICDetail.aspx?docId=8900.1,Vol.3,Ch3,Sec5)

[Gordy]

Additionally, one form of a 7711 waiver often comes in the form of a Motion Picture Manual, which, once approved, can simplify the waiver process and FSDO notification for frequent wavered work. See FSIMS Document Viewer (http://fsims.faa.gov/PICDetail.aspx?docId=8900.1,Vol.3,Ch3,Sec5)
Yes, I have a motion picture manual----guess I did not make that clear----you have to have the manual with procedures listed and approved and then get a waiver for each production based upon your manual.

[MikeNYC]

@Gordy that was more directed at the OP. I figured you're fully aware of the Motion Picture Manual.

[Gordy]

@Gordy that was more directed at the OP. I figured you're fully aware of the Motion Picture Manual.

Figured as much---it was early when I responded....