ATPL training Funding

[PilotKye]

I’m 17 years old and just about to finish my final year at sixth form. I’ve been looking everywhere for loans etc. I have only came across a few things, Pegasus finance and remortgage. Unfortunately, I’m quite unprivileged and my mum and dad are separated. Asking my dad to remortgage would be an option but I wouldn’t be able to get more than £60,000. I’m not too sure if he’s be willing to do that either. Does anyone know of any funding options within the UK. The RAF is an option but it’s very rare to be accepted for the pilot training course. Also, the school I’m looking at currently FLYBYSCHOOL. I wondered if anyone could give me any reviews on it.

[Banana Joe]

Go modular. Work and save and do your PPL and ATPL theory in distance learning. With hard work and dedication, it can be done. Many of us did, many more will do.

[maximus610]

I double what Banana Joe said. You are very young, try first for a ppl or gliding scholarship and stick to a club. Get a job or/and a degree, work hard, save enough, go modular. Did about the same (except I was 28 yo). No regrets.

[Chris the Robot]

You basically want to earn the maximum amount of cash in the minimum amount of time whilst having something which will be a reasonable backup should the pilot training plan not work out (medical, unable to get a flying job etc.).

If I could go back to when I was 17, I'd seriously consider railway signalling as a career. It's safety-critical shift work, it pays well from day one, there's progression opportunities and a good pension. Merchant Navy is perhaps another good pick, so long as you join directly with a sponsoring company. You could study the theory exams whilst at sea and do the flying during the two-three month blocks at home.

[KT1988]

I have no idea where you can get your money from. But you can do your training in Poland for example. For £42,000 you will get everything ( PPL(A) + nVFR + 100 hours PIC + MEP(L) + ME/IR + CPL + JOC/MCC) PLUS an FI rating and a guaranteed job as FI (ofc. if you are good enough to pass all the ratings including FI rating) so while you wait for the airlines you build your hours and get paid for it. Its not absolutely necessary to use more than £60,000 on training, for example at the flight school I am doing my 0-ATPL+FI all the instructors who instructed me in 2018 and wanted to get into the airlines got a job already in 2018 no one waited more than a year. So it looks like currently there is no reason to pay a ton of money for the flight school.

[PilotKye]

The military route would be hard since there selection process only lets in 3/50 Pilots. Also, I am slightly colour blind meaning I will probably not be accepted into the RAF especially as a pilot.

[PilotKye]

£42,000 is still a lot for someone like me. Also, its not just £42,000 you have to take into the account of travel, living expenses and leisure. Basic needs of life. You're looking at a minimum of £60,000.

[Rarife]

I have to agree with others. It would be best if you go modular. Maybe you will not have that much ground studies and it will take maybe a bit longer but you will be able to do that.
Since you do your training only once in your life it is hard to compare but I would really recomend you to go to Eastern Europe, it will be cheaper for you.
Honestly, you really do not need that much money for yourself. We had (it is still there) a little house for pilots in training just on the airport. You had to pay for that but it was really cheap, just for pilots or people from aviation, quite comfy, there was everything you need. Bed, internet, bathroom, kitchen. It was just 1 km walking on taxiway to hangar.

Find a job, aviation industry related job, ramp agent or something. Maybe money are bad but you will be in business. Or something well paid, it is up to you. Work a lot, live cheap, save money. Do your PPL from your salary and savings. Start ATPL theory, keep working, do your time building and when it is time, go for loan, take money, take time off and go do CPL, IFR etc.

[ford cortina]

Pilotkye, its not what you want to hear, but study hard go to University, enjoy it get a decent job.
Build some equity, then and only then start training, it can be done Modular, £60K is not enough, I would have thought nearer £100,000. In fact I spent much much more.
If it helps, I got the bug at age 11, flying to Toyko over the pole, 18 hours on a JAL 747-100/200 in 1981. I spent some time in the flight deck the guest of the flight crew. When I was 16 I had a lesson, at Barton in Manchester, I did not go to uni and got on with my life. When I was in my early 30's I started my PPL, it developed into what I have now.
I got my first job when I was 37
There are no shortcuts, it is long and arduous, just don't expect a quick fix. You will be a better pilot for it.
Good Luck

[Ronaldsway Radar]

From personal experience, I have a few suggestions for you.

1. Consider very carefully whether you would want to put the financial pressure of funding your training onto your parents. Would they be able to cope if something went wrong and you couldn't complete training, meaning they have to potentially re-mortgage houses etc.? Unless you have thought through every possible outcome I would avoid this.
2. Get yourself into a well-paid career and save every penny. Some great ideas above already. However even the average office job will give you the opportunity to work and save enough over several years. Yes, several years! It may take a while, but after starting saving when I was 21 I am now 30 and have just been able to fund my CPL, MEIR etc.
3. Take the modular route. This will save you thousands of pounds and quite frankly be a great life experience. I have had a great time training over the past few years. My net spend will be around the £60k mark by the time I am finished, if not slightly over due to the APS MCC requirement.
4. If you're good with computers & Excel, set up a budget calculator and plan out every expense and how much you expect to be able to put aside until you reach £60k saved. This will mean that, like me, holidays become one of the first things that get cut. Nights out / trips are budgeted for but keep these within limits - I would recommend keeping a good social life though as all work and no play is not great for the mental psyche :o)
5. If you do need to borrow money to fund the courses, consider a personal (unsecured) bank loan. After considering all the options I was able to obtain a loan for £24,500 over seven years with a very reasonable APR %. Factor your repayments into your budget calculator to make sure you can afford the repayments if you need to return to a back up career path.
6. Don't scrimp on your flying courses. Do not select the cheapest course provider. Do your research, visit schools, speak to students (past and present) and find out exactly what kind of service you are paying for. PPRuNe has plenty of recommendations in terms of good modular schools in the UK and abroad.
7. This route will not be easy, and it will take a while to achieve. However, if you can show you are motivated enough to commit to this route and have met all the challenges along the way, then your desire to succeed should shine through in the airline interview stage. Don't give up on it.
8. Lastly, medicals. The single most horrifying and nerve-wracking part of the whole process! If you can't hold and maintain a Class 1 licence, there's no point going any further. Read up on the medical requirements and make sure you can meet them. The UK Civil Aviation Authority website is a good place to read up on medical requirements.

Hopefully this helps in some way. Good luck!

[KT1988]

£60K is not enough? For a modular route? Actually for £100,000 you can get the whole 0+ATPL+FI PLUS your own (used) Cessna 172 and still have money left. I do not know where people get their prices from but in Poland it cost £42,000 for 0 - ATPL + FI. As for the cost of living I imagined people who are short on cash do not need to live 2 years in luxury. In Poland renting a flat is less than £400 per month even in Warszawa. So using more than £1,000 per month in Poland means you eat at restaurant every day and drive a taxi everywhere if you live alone. The prices are definitely not like in UK or Norway etc.

[Rarife]

£60K is not enough? For a modular route? Actually for £100,000 you can get the whole 0+ATPL+FI PLUS your own (used) Cessna 172 and still have money left. I do not know where people get their prices from but in Poland it cost £42,000 for 0 - ATPL + FI. As for the cost of living I imagined people who are short on cash do not need to live 2 years in luxury. In Poland renting a flat is less than £400 per month even in Warszawa. So using more than £1,000 per month in Poland means you eat at restaurant every day and drive a taxi everywhere if you live alone. The prices are definitely not like in UK or Norway etc.

They live in Western Europe. There they get those prices and I would say they have higher living standard.

[ford cortina]

KT1988, I speak from experience. I have no doubt that it is possible to obtain a fATPL for less , but of course that does depend on first time passes in everything.
When you are spending £1000 per day (2 hours flying), doing your multi engine IR, the costs soon add up.
Best of luck with your ground school KT

[KT1988]

@ford cortina: The whole program cost £42,000 with an FI rating and job guarantee as FI (if you are good enough ofc. to pass the FI course before the official exam). As for DA-42 (or Piper Seneca III (tecnam at some other schools) whichever you prefer) time its more like 3+ extra hours in Poland for £1000, 1 hour cost 1500 PLN.

Thanks, as for the groundschool its learning by Bristol with help from Aviation Exam and other question banks. Then you choose when you want to take the exams you just need to do all 14 in 6 sessions (1 session is 9 exam days and 2 weeks of time). So its the difference between integrated and modular that you have to learn the theory (except for theory needed for practical flying that is being taught and examined very well at the school) working mostly on your own. But thats definitely worth £58,000 cheaper price. All the flight training is just as if it was integrated and you get FI + MCC/JOC as bonus (not all integrated courses got MCC/JOC included, either way I still want to spend extra on VA APS MCC since I believe its the most important part for the airlines and not how you learned the basic stuff). And you can actually finish quicker than the integrated course it all depends on how fast you manage to learn and pass the ATPL theory exams.

[Northern Monkey]

Don't forget the chances are you may have to contribute towards some, or all, of a type rating at the end of your training too. A budget of £60k seems ambitious to me.

[PilotKye]

Don't forget the chances are you may have to contribute towards some, or all, of a type rating at the end of your training too. A budget of £60k seems ambitious to me.
Type rating is included in that cost. This is the cost of the Wizz Air Cadet Course at BAA.

[TryingToAvoidCBs]

You've mentioned you're slightly colour blind. If I were you I'd get your 1st class medical before you start worrying about the cost of flight training.

[nord121]

You basically want to earn the maximum amount of cash in the minimum amount of time whilst having something which will be a reasonable backup should the pilot training plan not work out (medical, unable to get a flying job etc.).

If I could go back to when I was 17, I'd seriously consider railway signalling as a career. It's safety-critical shift work, it pays well from day one, there's progression opportunities and a good pension. Merchant Navy is perhaps another good pick, so long as you join directly with a sponsoring company. You could study the theory exams whilst at sea and do the flying during the two-three month blocks at home.

I’m doing exactly what Chris said, I work at sea for 8 weeks save up a load of money and go home for 8 weeks. I did my PPL practical intensively during the 8 weeks at home and now have started my ATPL distance learning, you don’t even need the internet. Give it some thought but it’s not for everyone- it is however quick, tax free cash and a way to travel.

[PilotKye]

You've mentioned you're slightly colour blind. If I were you I'd get your 1st class medical before you start worrying about the cost of flight training.

Going to get a medical when I leave sixth form.

[Modular Halil]

I have no idea where you can get your money from. But you can do your training in Poland for example. For £42,000 you will get everything ( PPL(A) + nVFR + 100 hours PIC + MEP(L) + ME/IR + CPL + JOC/MCC) PLUS an FI rating and a guaranteed job as FI (ofc. if you are good enough to pass all the ratings including FI rating) so while you wait for the airlines you build your hours and get paid for it. Its not absolutely necessary to use more than £60,000 on training, for example at the flight school I am doing my 0-ATPL+FI all the instructors who instructed me in 2018 and wanted to get into the airlines got a job already in 2018 no one waited more than a year. So it looks like currently there is no reason to pay a ton of money for the flight school.
whats the school called ? Thanks

halil

[yoonie]

Hi PilotKye!

I’ve just found your post while I was looking at ways a ATPL is funded. I’m curious as to what you’re doing now nearly 5 years down the line, and if you managed to find funding and what route you took?

[Tranwell]

There is still no funding in the UK for ATPL. Best you can do is student loans/grants for an academic subject and use that to fund some of your flying. There are a few small bursaries and grants available for the chosen few if you're under 25 from the likes of the Air League, but typically its PPL level and below.

As far as I understand it, unless you have the right to live and work in Europe, forget going to Poland for your ATPL from the UK. Work hard, save like crazy, sell all your stuff... unless you can get on an MPL funded course from BA/TUI.

[CurlyB]

There is still no funding in the UK for ATPL. Best you can do is student loans/grants for an academic subject and use that to fund some of your flying. There are a few small bursaries and grants available for the chosen few if you're under 25 from the likes of the Air League, but typically its PPL level and below.

As far as I understand it, unless you have the right to live and work in Europe, forget going to Poland for your ATPL from the UK. Work hard, save like crazy, sell all your stuff... unless you can get on an MPL funded course from BA/TUI.
I think BA is ATPL now

[MichaelOLearyGenius]

My nephew just got accepted with BA for the training scheme. It's not much but back in the day I applied to the Air League and got a bursary for about 20hrs of flying. Try googling flying scholarships or bursaries.