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RUMBEAR
11th Sep 2018, 10:43
Im interested if anyone has encountered this situation?

AIRBUS FCOM states we should delay flap retraction until an inspection of the mechanism can occur when landing in icing condition ( or something to that effect ). I was just reading the chapter on Landing Gear and specifically the many inputs from the LGCIUís that effect various system relating to AIR/GROUND sensing.

I noticed that when on ground, Flap retraction is inhibited when a cargo door is open (which seems like a reasonable system design) it was just new to me!. Has anyone encountered this combination of events or do other operators provide some sort of operational information about this in their winter operations info to crew?

Uplinker
12th Sep 2018, 05:51
Never seen that mentioned in the winter ops brief. On contaminated taxi ways we are told not to deploy flaps during taxi out until reaching the runway, and leave them out until inspected on taxi in, owing to the possibility of slush getting thrown up into the tracks and mechanism.

As you say, it is reasonable to inhibit flaps on the ground with a cargo door open, because in that instance there will be ramp personnel around and you donít want to clobber them by moving the flaps. But I canít see what relevance that has to winter ops specifically?

SW1
12th Sep 2018, 06:49
I asssume ,by following the below procedure, you can retract the flaps regardless of whether the cargo door is open or not. PRO SUP-91

 After landing:
To avoid damage on the slats/flaps mechanism, do not retract the slats/flaps.
 After engine shutdown:
Make a visual inspection to determine that the slats/flaps mechanism is free of
contamination.
 When the slats/flaps mechanism is clean and before the flight crew shuts
down the aircraft electrical network:
YELLOW ELEC PUMP pb ............................................................ .........................ON
BLUE ELEC PUMP pb-sw ............................................................ .................... AUTO
BLUE PUMP OVRD pb ............................................................ ............................. ON
SLATS/FLAPS.......................................... RETRACT and MONITOR on ECAM page
YELLOW ELEC PUMP pb ............................................................ ....................... OFF
BLUE PUMP OVRD pb ............................................................ ............................OFF
NORMAL PROCEDURE................................................... ............................ RESUM

RUMBEAR
12th Sep 2018, 08:45
That is my question. Will this procedure allow flaps to retract with cargo door open?

SW1
12th Sep 2018, 09:01
yes it will. when we used to leave the flaps at config 1 when temperature was above 30 degrees- I have had to retract them(cargo door open) because the refueller at outstation wouldnt couple the refuel hose until the slats were retracted.

hans brinker
12th Sep 2018, 14:13
yes it will. when we used to leave the flaps at config 1 when temperature was above 30 degrees- I have had to retract them(cargo door open) because the refueller at outstation wouldnt couple the refuel hose until the slats were retracted.

Smart refueler. We had a refueler got his hand caught in the slats when he fueled during a flap inspection.

FlightDetent
12th Sep 2018, 22:53
Hmm, I've operated S/F with door open couple of times, but do not remember any INHIBIT to tackle. The above proc: yes, to re-introduce HYD power. Quite sure here that RUMBEAR did not mean to call the 0 HYD press an INHIBIT. Can we get an FCOM reference pls?

@hans: Different parts of the world, whole countries refuel with 1+F for the longer part of the year. Natural selection perhaps?

RUMBEAR
13th Sep 2018, 00:19
Flight Detent
The reference I came across that sparked the interest is FCOM DSC-32-10-30 P4/10. It is within the Land Gear chapter relating to Proximity Sensors on Shock Absorbers. And yes you are correct, HYD press 0 is an obvious inhibit. I was interested to see if this system based INHIBIT has been experienced operationally.

Rumbear

FlightDetent
13th Sep 2018, 00:57
The bushes are dense and thorny in this part of the FCOM!

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/770x329/fdwu_ce8741e46541eb7b924a8740cd8dfdf516a70234.png

No mention of said "flap movement inhibit" in the F/CTL chapter.

Frankly, I do not remember any restrictions. Just like the procedure SW1 quotes: pump up the HYDs and up they went. But it was a non-frequent occurrence, bird strike inspection etc.

The graphics at DSC-32-10-20: B-PROXIMITY DETECTOR OUTPUT SIGNALS brings no light into it. I assume they mean signal type 5 is L+R SH ABS STRT compressed.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/756x393/n5fd_2dab5e87f6c392fe15d9ec39836b60e5005e4266.png

IFixPlanes
13th Sep 2018, 08:01
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/770x329/fdwu_ce8741e46541eb7b924a8740cd8dfdf516a70234.png
...

Flap movement is inhibit if cargo door is opened.
Means -> during operation of cargo door.

See also:
FCOM DSC-52-10-40 (FWD AND AFT CARGO DOORS)
...
Note: When the electric pump operates the FWD or AFT cargo door, the remaining yellow system
devices that operate are the brakes and the engine 2 thrust reverser.


FCO DSC-52-50 (HOW TO OPERATE THE FWD AND AFT CARGO DOOR)
...
Note: The yellow hydraulic system is pressurized (the YELLOW ELEC PUMP is energized).
The operation of the flight controls and PTU is inhibited.

RUMBEAR
13th Sep 2018, 11:27
IFixPlanes.

That seems like a reasonable explanation. Thank you.

Rumbear

FlightDetent
13th Sep 2018, 14:39
Thank you IFix, congratulations on your anniversary!

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/167x113/zgfb_b23c8478cfe039b22893f9d278041d5f2a02563a.png