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Kazt
4th Sep 2018, 12:12
Kansai International is closed as Typhoon Jebi's storm surge overwhelmed the east side of the airport, 06R and 24L, as well as the whole ramp around the terminal is under water. They have power outages and all ILS, LOC, etc, seems too be out. Please refer to NOTAMs. Additionally, an anchored tanker broke its moorings and smashed into the only bridge which connects the manmade island airport with the mainland.

Broomstick Flier
4th Sep 2018, 13:00
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/500x496/screen_shot_2018_09_04_at_08_59_06_44299533d9d0a7d5f89b100ac 8855ebbff2eaf3b.png
Does not look good at all

3888/18 NOTAMN
Q) RJJJ/QFALC/IV/NBO/A/000/999/3426N13514E005
A) RJBB B) 1809040600 C) UFN
E) AD-CLSD DUE TO FLOOD
CREATED: 04 Sep 2018 05:51:00
SOURCE: RJAAYNYX

wideman
4th Sep 2018, 13:31
Open only for seaplanes?

Carbon Bootprint
4th Sep 2018, 16:12
It doesn't look good, and may take a while to sort out. The bridge is damaged, but that could be the least of the worries.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApA__uDiJ20

Apparently the tanker is used to deliver fuel to the airport. It apparently came off its moorings in the storm and hit the bridge.

airseb
4th Sep 2018, 17:37
https://www.express.co.uk/news/weather/1012741/Typhoon-Jebi-Japan-video-live-Kansai-International-Airport-submerged-update

msbbarratt
4th Sep 2018, 23:30
I don't know if the pictures that show the terminal are indicative of the peak water level, but if so then it's just possible that the terminal has got away with it. Most of the public areas are upstairs, apart from the baggage / arrivals hall.

The entire terminal building is supported on hydraulic jacks, used to keep it level as the artificial island settles underneath it. I think there's a ton of machinery for all that in a basement level below, and that'll all be wrecked. Fortunately the hydraulics are only required to change the level (steel shims are inserted after a lift), so it can probably all be replaced. KIX is an expensive airport to run, and it's just got pricier. They may need a bail out from the local prefectural government, and taller sea walls.

The eastern side of the airport is the main terminal where the likes of Lufthansa, Cathay, etc fly to. The other side is where Peach Aviation operates from, and they've probably got away with it over there.

The bridge has taken a proper walloping - a lot is going to depend on whether that displaced section has also dislodged the adjacent railway section and the road section on the other side, or moved the bridge pier. If they're unserviceable, that's going to take ages to fix. I worry that if that's the case then the likes of LH and KLM might use it as an excuse to stop services to KIX altogether, which would be annoying.

TBH the bridge could do with a significant upgrade - I've nearly missed flights before from KIX due to the trains being stopped due strong winds (the aftermath of a typhoon).

EDIT - just seen some other video, looks like the ground floor of the terminal has got soggy, but only just.

Airbubba
5th Sep 2018, 00:06
The entire terminal building is supported on hydraulic jacks, used to keep it level as the artificial island settles underneath it. I think there's a ton of machinery for all that in a basement level below, and that'll all be wrecked. Fortunately the hydraulics are only required to change the level (steel shims are inserted after a lift), so it can probably all be replaced. KIX is an expensive airport to run, and it's just got pricier.

Many of us have seen the wooden boxes around the columns on the lower level of the main terminal. They are periodically opened to place shims in for the leveling operation described on this KIX airport web page:

Jack-up System Used for the Passenger TerminalThe huge passenger terminal is KIX's signature building, and one if its unique features is its big basement in the terminalís main building. Consequently, the main building is lighter than the adjacent structures. Iron ores have been installed all over the bottom of the main building as weights to even out the weight distribution.

However, the main building remains lighter than its neighbors. The depth of settlement under the main building is relatively shallow when compared with those of the nearby buildings. The difference in depth generates slight tilts between the main building and the wings of both ends, seldom visible to the naked eye. Therefore, the pillars under the passenger terminal have been lifted in order to level the floor of the terminal.




http://www.kansai-airports.co.jp/en/efforts/our-tech/kix/sink/img/img_sink4_fig01.jpg
http://www.kansai-airports.co.jp/en/efforts/our-tech/kix/sink/img/img_sink4_fig02.jpg

http://www.kansai-airports.co.jp/en/efforts/our-tech/kix/sink/img/img_sink4_01.jpg

[KIX] Measures against unequal settlement Kansai Airports (http://www.kansai-airports.co.jp/en/efforts/our-tech/kix/sink/hudou.html)

Dairyground
5th Sep 2018, 01:19
Is Kobe (UKB, RJBE), just across the bay, as badly affected? If not it could serve in the short term as an alternative facility for SH flights, though LH may be more problematic.

Itami,the original Osaka airport, which is reasonably close to downtown Osaka might prove to be a better, and drier, substitute.

rationalfunctions
5th Sep 2018, 11:27
Is Kobe (UKB, RJBE), just across the bay, as badly affected? If not it could serve in the short term as an alternative facility for SH flights, though LH may be more problematic.

Itami,the original Osaka airport, which is reasonably close to downtown Osaka might prove to be a better, and drier, substitute.

ITM is domestic only, despite it's name, and operates near capacity so unlikely to take up the slack. UKB could be a viable alternative for a proportion of KIX international traffic

Kraus
5th Sep 2018, 12:12
No international services at Kobe, customs, finger prints, sniffer dogs etc..next stop for international services is Nagoya.

msbbarratt
5th Sep 2018, 21:36
ITM is domestic only, despite it's name, and operates near capacity so unlikely to take up the slack. UKB could be a viable alternative for a proportion of KIX international traffic

Wasn't Itami Japan's only international airport, a long time ago? I have a feeling that the Osaka Tokyo bullet train line was built for the Olympics instead of building an airport near Tokyo. That was a good investment.

Kobe is indeed domestic only, but has been anxious to pinch some of KIX's traffic and is a lot closer to the Shinkansen line. Osaka wants to close Itami, and put more domestic traffic through KIX. Airlines like Itami because it is so close to central Osaka and popular with passengers as a result. People who live near Itami want it closed. KIX has two biggish runways and no noise issues. Lots of competing factors!

msbbarratt
5th Sep 2018, 21:41
Apparently the southern carriageway of the bridge is now serviceable and back in use, so clean up crews can get to from the island. Attempts to open the western runway are being hindered by flood damage to machine rooms, baggage handling equipment, etc. Sounds like as soon as they get the main terminal serviceable flights could resume, though getting to / from the airport is going to be a nuisance. From previous experience I know that the train companies are adept at laying on buses from Rinku Town station when the railway bridge is closed due to strong winds.

rationalfunctions
6th Sep 2018, 02:56
Wasn't Itami Japan's only international airport, a long time ago? I have a feeling that the Osaka Tokyo bullet train line was built for the Olympics instead of building an airport near Tokyo. That was a good investment.

Kobe is indeed domestic only, but has been anxious to pinch some of KIX's traffic and is a lot closer to the Shinkansen line. Osaka wants to close Itami, and put more domestic traffic through KIX. Airlines like Itami because it is so close to central Osaka and popular with passengers as a result. People who live near Itami want it closed. KIX has two biggish runways and no noise issues. Lots of competing factors!

IIRC Kobe is capable of handling international, but with KIX nearby there was no real demand. And yes, ITM is loved and loathed in equal parts, but with over 40 years to run on it's recent privatisation concession is unlikely to be going anywhere for the foreseeable future

Pearly White
6th Sep 2018, 04:13
Looks like it's open again: https://worldcams.tv/transport/osaka-airport

rationalfunctions
6th Sep 2018, 04:17
Unfortunately mother nature has just taken it's toll on another major Japanese airport - CTS has been closed today by an earthquake
https://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_HK/travel-information/travel-preparation/travel-advisories/sapporo-airport-closure.html
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-05/strong-earthquake-hits-northern-japan-no-tsunami-warning-issued

rationalfunctions
6th Sep 2018, 04:19
Looks like it's open again: https://worldcams.tv/transport/osaka-airport

That looks like Itami (ITM / Osaka International Airport). The one that's closed is Kansai International Airport (KIX)

jrmyl
6th Sep 2018, 06:26
Hey all. Just returned to NRT after being stranded in KIX for the last several days. We operated a cargo flight in on the 2nd and were supposed to depart the night of the 4th. Of course that all went down the drain with the storm. It was a very unique situation at the airport. Reports were there were over 5000 passengers stranded. All of the food was gone by the morning of the 5th. Half of the terminal was without power and there was no internet service. Cellular service was spotty at best. They started running buses to the ferry station and to Izumisano station at 6am on the 5th. Last night at 11pm there was still a very long line of people waiting to escape the island. My f/o and I decided we would wait until the morning to make our escape. We were able to take the ferry this morning to Kobe and it appeared that there were only around 100 people remaining.

There is a lot of cleaning to be done and windows to be replaced. The ramp is covered in seaweed or grass of some sort. All of that will need to be swept off. In my opinion, the bridge will be the biggest problem. The pictures that I have seen shows 1 whole section has been pushed out of alignment. Talking with some locals, that section will need to be replaced by a new section and can't just be put back into place. That will take some time.

I was glad to have experienced this first hand, even though it would have been nice to have not been there. People were very well behaved even though services were limited and the lines to leave were unbelievably long. I measured them on google maps and there were two lines each approximately 1 km long. Yes, that is correct. I am not exaggerating that figure.

What could they have done better? They could have gotten more buses to transport the people. During the day yesterday they had 6 buses transporting people to Izumisano station. That was not nearly enough given the long transport time from the terminal to the station.

But really, they did pretty good given the circumstances. Now if they can just get it back into operation quickly.

parabellum
6th Sep 2018, 06:44
KIX has two biggish runways and no noise issues.
Not strictly true. I can remember one evening being held at 5000' on a close-in downwind leg until abeam the outer marker for RW24 and then instructed to turn in, commence descent and make my own intercept to final. Although still well out over the bay the controller was getting very agitated when I advised I needed further down wind to lose height. It appears ATC/airport administration are far more concerned about noise complaints than they are in providing a safe, radar vectored arrival to a B744. The Japanese public and in places official support for the farmer at Narita, or the totally inflexible approach to curfew times goes someway to demonstrate the Japanese attitude to aviation and the accompanying noise.

Yamagata ken
6th Sep 2018, 11:05
@parabellum

The Japanese public and in places official support for the farmer at Narita, or the totally inflexible approach to curfew times goes someway to demonstrate the Japanese attitude to aviation and the accompanying noise.

So what are the curfew times at Heathrow? How flexible is Heathrow when all the long haul (10 hours from Narita iirc) flights turn up at 6a.m. and you have to spend an hour in the stack? I'm really interested to hear your thoughts on the Brit attitude to aviation and accompanying noise.

filejw
6th Sep 2018, 23:15
Not strictly true. I can remember one evening being held at 5000' on a close-in downwind leg until abeam the outer marker for RW24 and then instructed to turn in, commence descent and make my own intercept to final. Although still well out over the bay the controller was getting very agitated when I advised I needed further down wind to lose height. It appears ATC/airport administration are far more concerned about noise complaints than they are in providing a safe, radar vectored arrival to a B744. The Japanese public and in places official support for the farmer at Narita, or the totally inflexible approach to curfew times goes someway to demonstrate the Japanese attitude to aviation and the accompanying noise.
I used to enjoy that after a 14 hr flight . .We used to train for that situation in the simulator, with a little anticipation slow to 170 knots abeam the FAF then flaps gear and speed brake . A descending turn to cross that last fix at 1600FT was fun and a bit of a challenge after a long trip. Certainly better than going to the fix to the NW and doing the arrival / transition.

Intruder
6th Sep 2018, 23:24
In the 747, just remember "Flaps 20, 220". For just about the best descent angle you can get in the terminal area, go to idle, put the gear down, flaps to whatever is allowed by current speed, speedbrakes out if desired, slow to 220, Flaps 20, descend at 220 KIAS. Approaching desired altitude or glidepath, thrust to 40% N1 or more, speedbrakes in, decel and landing flaps as desired.

Works fine, every time!

parabellum
7th Sep 2018, 00:43
I'm really interested to hear your thoughts on the Brit attitude to aviation and accompanying noise.
LAX-NRT, several years ago, still single runway. Considerable snow at NRT, very long delays. Met with an outbound crew in the hotel that evening, met them again at breakfast! A backlog of 6 to 8 aircraft had been cleared push and start and were on their way to the holding point, most delayed by hours, not minutes, when all were ordered to return to their stands, (which had now been occupied by inbounds waiting hours to disembark), lead aircraft protested as he was already at the holding point whereupon all runway lights were switched off due nightly curfew and stayed off. You would not get that at LHR Ken.
The airline I worked for had an early LHR arrival everyday and we never seemed to run out of slots for an early arrival, don't ever remember hearing of QF, CX and other long haul aircraft being required to go into the stack either. Have had to at LGW, fifteen to twenty minutes max, when flying short-haul, several aircraft arriving around time curfew was lifted.

filejw
7th Sep 2018, 15:55
In the 747, just remember "Flaps 20, 220". For just about the best descent angle you can get in the terminal area, go to idle, put the gear down, flaps to whatever is allowed by current speed, speedbrakes out if desired, slow to 220, Flaps 20, descend at 220 KIAS. Approaching desired altitude or glidepath, thrust to 40% N1 or more, speedbrakes in, decel and landing flaps as desired.

Works fine, every time!

True True ! The 170 KTs is to keep you closer to the airport and thatís what they (ATC and noise guys ) are looking for . Otherwise 220 is best and a more comfortable for pax.

Bangkokian
9th Sep 2018, 04:16
Kansai is a pretty big engineering debacle. It's been sinking way, way faster than expected and vulnerability to flooding has been raised as a concern for at least a decade, probably more, even with the seawalls having been augmented at great cost. Very unfortunate series of events this last week and it's good to hear that things were handled well, given the circumstance, but it seems like the airport itself is only going to become more of a problem as time goes on. Hope for the best, I suppose.

Intruder
9th Sep 2018, 22:18
Article in the Seattle Times today sez the runways will be underwater by 2058, given current trends.

msbbarratt
10th Sep 2018, 03:31
I've now heard that it is going to take a month to get the railway running again. The dented and displaced road span will take a lot longer, so there will be a contraflow on the other span for some time to come.

msbbarratt
10th Sep 2018, 03:41
Kansai is a pretty big engineering debacle. It's been sinking way, way faster than expected and vulnerability to flooding has been raised as a concern for at least a decade, probably more, even with the seawalls having been augmented at great cost. Very unfortunate series of events this last week and it's good to hear that things were handled well, given the circumstance, but it seems like the airport itself is only going to become more of a problem as time goes on. Hope for the best, I suppose.

Apparently the rate of settlement has slowed, so perhaps the underlying mud is finally beginning to compact. Regardless, it's difficult to see what else they could do other than keep building those walls taller. It's not like there's many options for a large airport in that region. I don't know how expandable Kobe is, but other than that there's simply no other option that I can see.

I suppose if they did eventually extend the maglev through Nagoya to Osaka then airports to the East/North become more "local" than they already are.

Bangkokian
11th Sep 2018, 03:20
They definitely can't scuttle it. Osaka was the smallest prefecture until they built the airport, the boundaries of which made it the second smallest prefecture. Wouldn't want to go back to being the smallest prefecture - and they're already way into building a new runway!

msbbarratt
12th Sep 2018, 23:15
Looks like they're cracking on with bridge repairs: Japan Times article (https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2018/09/12/national/work-begins-repairing-kansai-airports-bridge-aim-restarting-rail-services-end-month/)

ACMS
14th Sep 2018, 07:19
Intruder:- someone from the Seattle times should ask the Dutch, they should have been underwater years ago but funnily enough they have more land now than ever.......

it can be done.

msbbarratt
18th Sep 2018, 19:45
Rail Services are restored. Two weeks ahead of schedule.

Someone has put in the hours unbending them girders.