CX to decide if you’re really sick.

['round midnight]

In the climate of greater, if not excessive, touchy freely comms from management, a somewhat anonymous missive, totally lacking in ownership, landed in pilots’ inbox, today.

24 hours after a conspicuously silent and dreary FOP weekly update, the new draconian - and discriminatory, since it only applies to HK and NZ flight crew (other jurisdictions cannot be trounced quite so easily) - revision of the Noticed of Revised Sick Leave Policy has been declared.

Let’s not beat around the bush and let’s communicate frankly: you pilots are pulling fake sickies, is the only, very unsubtle message conveyed by the author(s) of this cack, oppressive unexplained change in policy.

From day 1 of your injury, sickness or incapacity, your priority within 24 hours, is to self-diagnose your predicament or ailment or make damn sure a medical professional can attend to you and do so on your behalf, without condition, especially if you fall ill outside Hong Kong, and communicate the same to Our Dear Leaders.

Failure to do so is not spelt out in this gash revised policy, just so that the implicit disciplinary threat hovers ever so slightly closer over you.

A spineless, impractical document, if ever one was conceived by over excitable incumbents of new managerial positions.

It makes me sick.

Can I self-certify for that?

[Airbubba]

CX pilots brag here and elsewhere about how they are going to call in sick and stick it to the company. Then the company says they are going to verify sick calls.

I'm shocked, shocked I tell you... ;)

The simplest answer is often the best.

We do what we should have done in December.

Just go sick.

Massive FO sick-out today.

It’s starting.

Just got my 10 day sick note with a review for another 20 to come.
Happy Christmas CX.

For many, many years now I have targeted long, inefficient patterns for roster adjustment. There are multiple ways to do this. One is the old fashioned sick call, but another is a well-timed ASR-F.

[betpump5]

Another one to add to the list Darryl. Regardless of what sh1te is on the table, Big NO vote from me with the current & updated AMP.

[mngmt mole]

Just makes me want to hurt them more (and send a big :mad: welcome to the new GMA who i suspect is behind this). Havent gone sick in a while but i am now. Any doubts what needs to happen everyone?

(and I concur, a NO vote from me as well)

[SloppyJoe]

Amazing they want a doctor's note from day 1 if not in hkg. In any 1st world country if your sick, and a pilot, the Dr will be very cautious and probably ask, how long do you need Off!

[AB335]

Diarrhea is a common problem after consuming food from unhygienic origin. It can put a professional pilot unfit to fly any aeroplane for up to 3 days. Photograph and video evidence are available on request. :8

Self certification completed :cool:

[Apple Tree Yard]

This reeks of desperation. I take comfort in the fact that they are obviously so panicked, they are now resorting to patently self-damaging strategies. Also, anyone notice that the Boeing Chief Pilot says in the latest newsletter that you can't call in unfit after you have been called out for a duty off standby? Hmmm, let me think about that? I am on the train to start my callout duty, and I feel unwell by the time I get to the airport. I'm just supposed to now operate unfit. I think this suggestion from management has a putrid stink of illegality. AOA, what is your take on that? This company is in the final stages of meltdown. I'm getting some fresh popcorn and will sit down and watch the show.

[Bangaluru]

So, more reports are going to help FOP contribute to the profitability of the company? The only change I see is more paper (electrons) work. No problem.

[cxorcist]

This reeks of desperation. I take comfort in the fact that they are obviously so panicked, they are now resorting to patently self-damaging strategies. Also, anyone notice that the Boeing Chief Pilot says in the latest newsletter that you can't call in unfit after you have been called out for a duty off standby? Hmmm, let me think about that? I am on the train to start my callout duty, and I feel unwell by the time I get to the airport. I'm just supposed to now operate unfit. I think this suggestion from management has a putrid stink of illegality. AOA, what is your take on that? This company is in the final stages of meltdown. I'm getting some fresh popcorn and will sit down and watch the show.

Exactly correct ATY! All of these “sickies” or PRAs are only necessary as a result of a badly broken rostering system. If they want sickness rates to go down, bring in 21st century scheduling which honors seniority and stop treating everyone like they are on reserve all the time. It’s pretty obvious really. For the record, a pattern optimizer is not a comprehensive scheduling system. There are two more pieces which benefit pilots as well as the Company. We don’t hear much about those these days. Perhaps there’s a reason for that?!?!

[Apple Tree Yard]

On just about EVERY level, this company and it's policies towards aircrew are BROKEN. Almost beyond repair. If the new management do not realise the precipice that the pilot staffing situation is teetering on, they will quickly be subject to a rude awakening. This change to the sickness policy will play out one way. Even more sickness will eventually result. Why?, because more of us will quite this pathetic airline in disgust, thereby placing an even greater burden on the remaining pilots, who will then be subject to even more chaotic rostering, resulting in even more sickness. It's called a "death spiral" for a reason. This truly is the company appearing like a one-legged matador, waving their red flag to the enraged bull (pilots). The outcome is not in doubt.

[Apple Tree Yard]

It seems that CX management are the only management in the industry who haven't figured out they will soon be critically short of pilots. They also don't seem to have figure out that the industrial advantage has swung firmly in favor of the pilots. I suspect the length of the weekly newsletter will grow, due to the very long list of resigning pilots they will have to type up each week.

[betpump5]

Apple tree

They also don't seem to have figure out that the industrial advantage has swung firmly in favor of the pilots.

I want to pose your statement to Us pilots and the AOA. Who among my colleagues is going to vote Yes because of a 1.75% pay rise or a couple of thousand on HKPA? Or a 1 year rolling extension to ARAPA? Or an RP that has changes "to the language of O and R days?

​​​​​​We will never ever be in a better industrial than we are now - What will we do with that advantage? If I leave Cathay Pacific, it won't be because of the Company or the stench of the Fragrant Harbour from my 400sqft room. It will be because my fellow pilots rolled over and consented to an anal shafting.

Time for the Chairman to show real leadership.

[Dan Winterland]

Yesterday, my wife booked a doctor's appointment for her mother in the UK. First one available - August 3rd! So what should you do if you need an sick note. Go sick for two weeks while waiting, even though you were better days ago?

General Practioners in the UK are in such short supply, sick notes can be issue by e-mail on self certification. Also, many cases are now being seen by practice Nurses. Are these acceptable, or do you need to see a doctor?

[Flex88]

The jellyfish rolls over on almost day 1.. His management style to a T.

Just wait for the CMP fiasco to pan out.

Time To Win !!!

[IDS]

Oh well... just go and see a GP now for a every little illness which would have disappeared within a day or two, and get a proper sickness certificate for a week or longer - just to make sure you're cured. What they are implementing now defies the purpose 100%.

[RAT Management]

Ppppffffftttttttt! What a joke.

[Liam Gallagher]

Anybody who thought the Jellyfish will be any different, has their answer very quickly. A heavy handed and ill-considered policy announced late on a Friday evening. We have all seen that movie before and we all know how it ends.

So long as you are in an English-speaking country, it's not difficult to get a Doctor's certificate. So apart from adding to the company's medical bills, this should have no impact for pilots that have their stuff together.

Had an interesting experience a few weeks back. Took a tumble whilst out running when on leave in the UK. Strained my quad. Not too bad, thought it would be 4-7 days and back running again. Was supposed to head back to work, but couldn't put any weight on the damaged quad, so thought it best to go sick. Saw my friendly doc in Manchester, who referred me to an equally friendly physio. Sent in the documents to the company and enquired if the "injury" meant my licence was suspended and would I need an MCQ. "Yes" was the answer. I had a duty on a Saturday and aimed to fly that duty. Doctor's don't work weekends, so first available appointment is Monday afternoon. Another 3 days off work, but managed to get some good rehab on the quad hiking up The Peak. I see the Company Doc who wants some details from the Doctor in Manchester. The next 7 days sees a big pointless and expensive paper chasing exercise.

The net result, if I could have self-certified I would have been off work 4 days. Following the Company's procedure cost about $3k in medical and 2 weeks off work. Did I care?-no. Did Corporate Medical care?-No. In fact both myself and Corporate Medical agreed the policy is stupid and neither party was particularly motivated to make it work.

Time to win?

[oriental flyer]

If my memory serves me correctly , they tried this once before , it was abandoned after the medical bills to comply with the new rules went through the roof .
It’s not difficult , if you don’t feel well go to a doctor , even in HK you can’t always get to a GP on the same day, so what are you supposed to do ? . If the company is coming down hard on you . File a report directly with the CAD bypass Cathay management entirely .
Alternatively print out a preformatted letter stating the CAD position pertaining to operating an aircraft whilst unfit . Go to chief pilot explaining that you do not feel competent to operate an aircraft , but if they insist that you must operate then they have to sign your letter acknowledging that you have informed them of your condition and they are forcing you to operate irrespective .
‘I really don’t see too many letters being signed .
My GP tends to err on the side of caution, so whilst I might take a week off for a bad cold he would always give me an extra few days on top just to be sure .
Or go to the GP get a few days off , go back for a few more days off , and a third time to ensure that you are fully fit
multiply that by 3000 pilots and watch the bills for medical visits expand exponentially
what the hell why don’t 60-80% of Pilots just go and see the Doc for a chat , explain the situation and confirm that you can come and see them whenever it’s necessary
2500x800 average doctor fee = 2 Million . That should get their attention

[rustyoldtin]

They just want you to log into intra CX so they can see where you really are.

[Heathrow Harry]

Can you post the actual missive?

that way we can decide if it's out of order or just much the same as many other outfits - mine requires a medical note after 3 days........

[Brown Nose]

Suppose the AOA will just let this slide in while they carry on ‘negotiating’ with the devil, just like no 13th month for Captains, no payrise last year when it was promised etc etc etc

[Apple Tree Yard]

This new "policy" is a complete joke (and one that smells like the new GMA). If i'm in the UK, and become unfit, I might be lucky to get to see a Dr in three/four days at the earliest. So the policy is unworkable right from the start. Further, the company has NO right to my private medical information. I will do as i've always done: see a Dr (at the first available) IF it's more than 3 days (whether in HK or out of HK). If i'm out of HK, I will make a Dr. appointment, let the company know the DATE OF MY APPOINTMENT and then fax the same Dr. note to them i've always done (and now, as they need a note for ONE day, I will have to wait the multiple days until I can see a Doc, thereby extending my sickness out of HK. Brilliant). They can stuff their new web page up....

Ridiculous, and yet another sign they have completely lost the plot. Don't let yourselves be intimidated. AOA, where are you on this? And also, where are you on the CP telling us we can't call in sick after we've received a callout from reserve? Both of these issues are absurd, probably illegal and patently intimidatory (I thought we had a company policy against that?). I pay my dues, and I expect a serious and immediate attack against these attempts to intimidate me. For those who can leave this clown show of an airline, make haste.

[Farman Biplane]

If the ability to self assess as UNFIT for flying duties is removed from a crew member, then it follows that the ability to self assess as FIT for flying duties is also removed by association?

If you cannot solely determine you are unfit, then how can you solely determine you are fit?

Perhaps we should all be getting a doctors note certifying fit for duty before any flight?

[swh]

If the ability to self assess as UNFIT for flying duties is removed from a crew member, then it follows that the ability to self assess as FIT for flying duties is also removed by association?

If you cannot solely determine you are unfit, then how can you solely determine you are fit?

Perhaps we should all be getting a doctors note certifying fit for duty before any flight?


Excellent point, we should all see a doctor before each duty and get them to certify us as being fit.

What are the chances a doctor will say you are unfit because of alternating day night duties ?

[Starbear]

The Boeing CP's comments re reporting unfit after call out from reserve are unbelievably asinine and open up himself and the company to serious law infringements and subsequent consequences (in those jurisdictions where the rule of law is actually applied). Elsewhere he reminds that Yammer is not Pprune, well here is more news for you CP, company newsletters are not policy documents much as you clearly believe you are permitted to make new policy on the hoof.

[Yonosoy Marinero]

So... the usual CX employee management style then:

Tit for tat. Escalation. No carrot/bigger stick. Threats. Micromanagement. Intelligence gathering. Privacy invasion. General pigheadedness. Vindictiveness. Etc.

Sounds familiar.

[ACMS]

You’ll be lucky to get a Doctors appointment in Melb at short notice, probably all of Australia.

Besides, with a flu or similar the last thing you want to do is leave home and sit in a Doctors waiting room........

stupid.

[Trafalgar]

As I have just posted on another thread, this policy is completely unworkable. I trust the AOA is backing up that point in no uncertain terms to the company. Regardless, it will be fun to watch the retreat by the company on this....only a matter of time. Morons.

[crwkunt roll]

Rumour has it the CMP "Dry runs" on both the 777 and Bus fleets have thrown up some "its legal so it must be safe" shockers.
Will be interesting, as there are not many trips to go round on the 777 these days for the number of crew on it, hence the forced migrations.

[Flex88]

Unworkable, of course it's unworkable. This is exactly what happens when "leadership" policy is driven by spite, signed off and approved by spineless sycophant directors, then given to a "People Director" with massive experience in artillery and boats to promulgate and enforce ( however only in the countries where this policy wouldn't immediately trigger a lawsuit)..

What the hell did you think would happen? All one must now do is wait for the policy to backfire and a few years longer for the privacy and coercion lawsuits to start piling up..

"As the World Turns" right in our own back yard. Movie rights anybody ?

[Waterskier]

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/764x960/775f64ae_0113_4483_86d9_a979eb5fae1c_8c62f7a00490fc563f8d48c 3bd2f96835299f3c1.jpeg

[morningcoffee]

All the Chinese contract jobs that you’re all running off to sign up for (apparently) have their own doctors controlling their own Medicals. You can only get a sickness note off them, for your annual 7 days allowed. Bad time to mention?

I’ll get my coat.

[Apple Tree Yard]

"Apparently"...? You might want to check the latest facts evidenced on the seniority list. As for the Dr notes in China, your point is what exactly? Oh, I forgot, you and your Swire management colleagues are looking to drive the industry (and CX) into the toilet. One small problem with that plan, the rest of the world is heading in the other direction, because their managements have woken up to the crisis of how they are going to crew their aircraft. I wish I was artistically talented, as a drawing of an ostrich with the head of a Swire manager would make for a good bumper sticker.

(ps, I hear that a certain ex personnel recruiter is gleefully processing hundreds of Aussie CX pilots applications)

[Bo Wing]

All the Chinese contract jobs that you’re all running off to sign up for (apparently) have their own doctors controlling their own Medicals. You can only get a sickness note off them, for your annual 7 days allowed. Bad time to mention?

I’ll get my coat.

What you fail to mention MC, with said Chinese contract, you go there with a completely different mindset. You go as a contract pilot, a mercenary if you will, with zero emotional investment in the running of the airline. You also fail to mention that they pay more than CX, you get a guaranteed business seat home with 11 consecutive days off (if you choose that option), all of which leads to a healthier emotional and mental state, which means one’s sickness events probably drop. Oh, based on the recent CX choice for SFO hotel, the mainland carriers hotels can’t be any worse. As always, the devil is in the details. I concede, going north of the border is not everyone’s cup of tea but don’t let the facts get in the way of your ilk’s CX propaganda.

[Air Profit]

At least MC has stopped pretending to be a pilot. That was becoming tedious and frankly a bit embarrassing. He has obviously decided to embrace his cubical reality.

[Progress Wanchai]

Anybody who thought the Jellyfish will be any different, has their answer very quickly. A heavy handed and ill-considered policy announced late on a Friday evening. We have all seen that movie before and we all know how it ends.

So long as you are in an English-speaking country, it's not difficult to get a Doctor's certificate. So apart from adding to the company's medical bills, this should have no impact for pilots that have their stuff together.

Had an interesting experience a few weeks back. Took a tumble whilst out running when on leave in the UK. Strained my quad. Not too bad, thought it would be 4-7 days and back running again. Was supposed to head back to work, but couldn't put any weight on the damaged quad, so thought it best to go sick. Saw my friendly doc in Manchester, who referred me to an equally friendly physio. Sent in the documents to the company and enquired if the "injury" meant my licence was suspended and would I need an MCQ. "Yes" was the answer. I had a duty on a Saturday and aimed to fly that duty. Doctor's don't work weekends, so first available appointment is Monday afternoon. Another 3 days off work, but managed to get some good rehab on the quad hiking up The Peak. I see the Company Doc who wants some details from the Doctor in Manchester. The next 7 days sees a big pointless and expensive paper chasing exercise.

The net result, if I could have self-certified I would have been off work 4 days. Following the Company's procedure cost about $3k in medical and 2 weeks off work. Did I care?-no. Did Corporate Medical care?-No. In fact both myself and Corporate Medical agreed the policy is stupid and neither party was particularly motivated to make it work.

Time to win?

Any injury that would prevent you from performing as a pilot, whether a duty was missed or not, cannot be self certified. Being unable to put any weight on a leg would fall into this category. The HKCAD must be notified, they will immediately suspend your medical certificate which will only become valid again once the process has been followed and completed including a MCQ.

The new sickness certification policy has no bearing on this HKCAD requirement or your responsibilities as a license holder.

[Farman Biplane]

AIC 06/16

“1.1 This circular serves to remind every holder of a medical certificate issued under Article 19 or 20 of the Air Navigation (Hong Kong) Order 1995 that he/she is not entitled to act as a member of the flight crew of an aircraft registered in Hong Kong if he/she knows or reasonably suspects that his/her physical, mental, emotional, physiological (such as fatigue) or social condition renders him/her temporarily or permanently unfit to perform such functions or to act in such capacity.”

UNFIT FOR DUTY does not mean SICKNESS, there are many other factors.

If you report UNFIT and do not provide a Doctors note, then you are UNFIT for reasons other than sickness. This by definition is not dealt with by the Sickness Policy or the COS, but can be monitored by the AMP.

DO NOT SELF CERTIFY AS SICK, ONLY AS UNFIT FOR DUTY.

If they wish for you to see a company appointed medical specialist later then you will have to comply as part of the COS.

[Sand Man]

Why the policy change now? Is it preparation for increased sickness in Oct and Nov (CMP)?:hmm:

[Liam Gallagher]

Great question Sandman.

I suspect the answer is something to do with the new DFO/GMA's vision of pilot management. One thing that can be deduced from the new policy is that Management cannot be happy with the existing AMP.

Whether that's because they believe this new policy is actually better, or the resignation rate has got them desperately searching for solutions to make the roster work is a question that will be answered over time!!!

Did I say "overtime"?:}

[mngmt mole]

This whole episode smacks of corporate desperation. To ram a completely unworkable and laughably incompetent policy through, without any warning or negotiation with the AOA shows just how panicked they have become. The sickness rates are climbing at an ever increasing rate (particularly on the freighter), resignations are ramping up and generally the operation is beginning to fall apart (just see how many ports have had their service reduced). CX is now in full panic mode, and this policy (most likely an opening shot from the new GMA) is illuminating in it's thoughtlessness. In light of this move, why on earth are the AOA even considering continuing with negotiations? The company is still not dealing with reality, and until they do we should simply say, "call us when you can talk sense" (and $). In the meantime, I'm going to continue with my recuperation, sit down in my comfy chair with a bucket of popcorn and enjoy the show. You can't purchase entertainment as good as this.

[mngmt mole]

Question for management? If in an outport, how is someone realistically supposed to get to see a Dr the very same day? Not likely. Further, where do I submit the bill for this, to be 100% recompensed? If CX isn't intending on paying, they can't expect or demand that we incur a cost on their behalf. Further, what about the issue of discrimination between pilots in different ports? All these questions are also obviously the remit of the AOA. Awaiting answers from both parties.

[Dilbert68]

Mole,

You have worldwide medical cover so your outport doctor's visit is 100% covered. I have submitted many claims and they have always been paid, albeit at the usual snails pace of CX admin. If you cant get into a walk-in clinic then I suggest you go to the ER, even for a common cold, they will fit you in when they can. ER visits to foreigners are typically at least 5 times the cost of a walk-in clinic, another own-goal for CX and their misguided policies.

[Sand Man]

Dilbert, you would be happy to sit in ER on your time off with gastro? Everyone knows some common sickness problem disappear in 24hrs so why put yourself through such pain and inconvenience.

[DropKnee]

Because each ER visit would cost CX about $1500 USD. After 10 such visits by crews. The policy would be stopped. That’s why😊

[BlunderBus]

A 2 day URTI now magically becomes a 7 day doc certified sick leave !! I mean no point taking just a couple of days off just in case you’re not recovered and have to revisit the quack. Better safe than sorry!!

[BlunderBus]

Oh and won’t be introducing the new policy until I have gathered ‘more data’!!!

[Brown Nose]

A 2 day URTI now magically becomes a 7 day doc certified sick leave !! I mean no point taking just a couple of days off just in case you’re not recovered and have to revisit the quack. Better safe than sorry!!

You got it all wrong. Just go to the Doc for 1 day sick leave, then return to Doc 7 times just to be safe. CX is so concerned for your health that they want you to go to the doctor more than ever before

[controlledrest]

I for one wont be going to ER or the Doctor. If I am sick, they can come to me. I don't give a rat's arse about the expense, I will claim that against the Company.

This policy is a breach of the HKG Privacy laws. Details of sickness only need to shared with Avmed. Kiwis tell me that sick notes in NZ are not required to include details of the illness. These details are private between the patient and the Doctor and need not be shared with the employer.

If the company wants to address the sick rate they need to address morale and fatigue.

[VR-HFX]

As Chief of the Army High Command, Hammerstein-Equord oversaw the composition of the German manual on military unit command (Truppenführung (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truppenf%C3%BChrung)), dated 17 October 1933.

He is quoted as originating a special classification scheme for his men:

I divide my officers into four groups. There are clever, diligent, stupid, and lazy officers. Usually two characteristics are combined. Some are clever and diligent -- their place is the General Staff. The next lot are stupid and lazy -- they make up 90 percent of every army and are suited to routine duties. Anyone who is both clever and lazy is qualified for the highest leadership duties, because he possesses the intellectual clarity and the composure necessary for difficult decisions. One must beware of anyone who is stupid and diligent -- he must not be entrusted with any responsibility because he will always cause only mischief.

Vote early and vote often for the DFO's of your choice going back to...say...1985.

[mngmt mole]

I predict (and based on many years of evidence) that the current management will drive the last nail into the coffin of the "expat" career at CX. This airline assumed it's long decline towards oblivion starting in 1994, and we are now at the point that the ship is screaming "Terrain,Terrain,Pull Up, Pull Up". Unfortunately, the Captain has selected V/S, 4000' down, and pushed the thrust levers to the stops. Anyone who thinks this is recoverable is deluded at best. The only place for any of us now is either retirement, or finding a place with a proper first world carrier, which is obligated to follow legal norms, is not racially divided and cannot undermine you by hiring from any third world , low cost country at any time they please. Anyone who is not actively seeking an escape from this train wreck will deserve the destruction of their career that will surely come. The last fleeting moments of escape are upon all of us.

[unitedabx]

A 2 day URTI now magically becomes a 7 day doc certified sick leave !! I mean no point taking just a couple of days off just in case you’re not recovered and have to revisit the quack. Better safe than sorry!!

7 always was a lucky number !

[BlunderBus]

A pre-emptive policy designed to mitigate crew reactions to a very nasty computer generated, company tweaked rostering system about to be unleashed.

[controlledrest]

A pre-emptive policy designed to mitigate crew reactions to a very nasty computer generated, company tweaked rostering system about to be unleashed.

It will become even more important for crew to act as real professionals. If the roster is unsafe due to fatigue:

1. Email head of Crew Resources (the man who never replies to questions on yammar) raising your concerns. Copy in Nina.
2. If the roster isn't changed and at any stage you can't fly it safely, decline the duty and file an ASR-F

PS Don't plan on using Controlled Rest to get the job done.

Want respect? Act like a professional pilot.

[Freehills]

I predict (and based on many years of evidence) that the current management will drive the last nail into the coffin of the "expat" career at CX. This airline assumed it's long decline towards oblivion starting in 1994, and we are now at the point that the ship is screaming "Terrain,Terrain,Pull Up, Pull Up". Unfortunately, the Captain has selected V/S, 4000' down, and pushed the thrust levers to the stops. Anyone who thinks this is recoverable is deluded at best. The only place for any of us now is either retirement, or finding a place with a proper first world carrier, which is obligated to follow legal norms, is not racially divided and cannot undermine you by hiring from any third world , low cost country at any time they please. Anyone who is not actively seeking an escape from this train wreck will deserve the destruction of their career that will surely come. The last fleeting moments of escape are upon all of us.

Already happened in Engineering/ IT/ Medical etc. But without seniority, those professions find it easier to walk.

[controlledrest]

A pre-emptive policy designed to mitigate crew reactions to a very nasty computer generated, company tweaked rostering system about to be unleashed.

This intimidation policy must be resisted. As the company can't do much about refusing a duty due fatigue they are trying to muscle us on 'sickness', as too many of us report sick rather than go through the process of ASR-F. With the unworkable patterns being generated by the CMP (take a look at the Airbus proposed patterns) we must grow a pair and refuse to work any unsafe patterns and file an ASR-F.

It was the levels of fatigue reported via ASR-F which prevented HKCAD from approving the company's request to increase flight hours to 1000, and fatigue is grossly under reported.

[Air Profit]

ASR-F's will be common in a very short time. Oh, and i'll call unfit anytime I feel like it, are we clear CP?