What EK incidents resuted in firing

[JammedStab]

I am disturbed to hear that guys from the recent JFK A380 incident have been fired instead of extra training. It seems excessive. I can understand if intentionally doing something that breaks the rules or if one damages the aircraft but this is not the case here.

I am curious what other incidents(with details of what happened) resulted in someone getting fired?

[Airbubba]

I am curious what other incidents(with details of what happened) resulted in someone getting fired?

You mean like Melbourne, Dubai, and Mauritius and Moscow?

[donpizmeov]

You are wrong Re the MRU crew Bubba.

[Airbubba]

Thanks for the correction, I'm glad to be wrong about those guys. :ok:

The idea of sacking crews to increase operational vigilance might not have the desired effect. As SOPS puts it:

I can see crews so busy trying to comply with procedures so the don't end up sacked, that instead of doing what they are meant to be doing, flying the aircraft, they end up making a mistake because they are so worried about making a mistake...you can see where Im going with this...

In fact, I wonder if the poor guys on 207 fell to the above scenario, so busy trying to follow a procedure, so worried by the fear factor ( or as I called it..the constant Background Radiation), that the fear of NOT following the procedure, led them to NOT flying the aircraft..with the result.

The place is a complete train wreck...

[nakbin330]

Manchester.

[Dropp the Pilot]

Taking selfies in CMB

[Dropp the Pilot]

As a curiously timely example, one chap was fired for having an argument with customs about how much wine he could bring with him when returning to DXB from his layover. This was at the TBF before the TBF before the bouncy castle.

It may also hold the land speed record. If I recall correctly he was fired before crew transport dropped him at his residence that very evening.

[SOPS]

I would say, basically, depending who you upset and how much wasta they have...almost anything has the potential to get you sacked..imho.

[fliion]

It’s the Final Warnings from operational incidents that is also a real concern.

Multiple cases of guys been issued these and deciding it’s too risky to chance losing the Prov fund with another incident - so up and leave.

There are too many of these & the thread would be overloaded. It’s human error to make mistakes, but here is punishable by a deflating flawed mgt policy of punitive measures. The Co is effectively saying - we don’t want you here & the letter is the impetus for said victim to start interviewing.

The Augment firing (notwithstanding the appeal) is a real kick in the bollocz to all of the EK pilots who go out and for the vast majority do a great job. There is no reference in the B-FCTM (380 not sure) for an operational role from CM3 & 4 - yet now that seat is been held to an operational standard even though the GCAA is being deceived for FTL reasons, that said Augmenters are not on duty

This is absolutely a new and deflating low - and the effects are tangible amongst the boys & girls on-line.

[sealear]

I agree re the augmenting role, and as someone who does a lot of ULR I find it extremely disturbing.

What happened in CMB with the selfies? With all the Instagram accounts these days it will hardly be surprising I'm sure.

[Visual Procedures]

Pre insta, when the tigers were flying around and tensions were tighter..

[A320 Skipper]

Is it really that easy to get fired in EK guys?
Was the pilot from the MAN app really fired for that video on Youtube? Also, can someone please be so kind to explain that is a final warning letter?
:confused:

[givemewings]

Ironic now that they actively encourage the selfies... so long as you're one of their chosen ones of course.

Plenty of staff in various departments fired for doing what their own "social media stars" do every day :rolleyes:

As usual, inconsistency at its finest. Either pics on board are OK or they're not.

[donpizmeov]

There was the famous sandwich incident.

[SOPS]

The list is long and distinguished.

[my salami]

No one gets fired, they, ahem... 'leave'.

Any by the way, the company cannot touch your provident fund that you've contractually earned. It's not theirs to take. Regardless of why you're leaving/dismissed. They play on people's ignorance of the rules.

Not really... You're only entitled to get your contribution back.

MS

[BANANASBANANAS]

Whatever the finer points on Prov Fund entitlement are, a review of recent policy changes and (over)reaction to incidents forces me to conclude that Emirates is now actively trying to drive expats out without suffering the loss of company face that would come from it making pilots redundant. Being sacked or being 'resigned' or even genuine resignations are so much easier for the EK PR team to spin. If you resign over the age of 50 are you still considered to be 'retired' by EK HR? That was one of the gems they tried when they were last trying to hide the real numbers.

Why the company would choose to behave like this is open to a certain amount of debate but none of the likely reasons bode well for expats still here.

[gearlever]

Any locals up front on EK-207?

[kipper the dog]

No Gearlever, all western expats up front. To be fair to them, the local guys haven't been involved in any of the 8 or so incidents as far as I know. The last incident that involved one of them was when 521 went belly up.

[gearlever]

Thx kipper. Proportions locals/ expats may have changed after I have left (2013).

[Divertnow]

No Gearlever, all western expats up front. To be fair to them, the local guys haven't been involved in any of the 8 or so incidents as far as I know. The last incident that involved one of them was when 521 went belly up.
Near stall out of Cochin?

[Monarch Man]

Quote:
Originally Posted by kipper the dog View Post
No Gearlever, all western expats up front. To be fair to them, the local guys haven't been involved in any of the 8 or so incidents as far as I know. The last incident that involved one of them was when 521 went belly up.


Near stall out of Cochin?

No no habibi, it was a fault with the MCP, the heading bug was broken :E

[777-200LR]

BANANASBANANAS,

The expat community haven’t exactly made it hard for it to look that way

[Mach.888]

No one gets fired, they, ahem... 'leave'.

Any by the way, the company cannot touch your provident fund that you've contractually earned. It's not theirs to take. Regardless of why you're leaving/dismissed. They play on people's ignorance of the rules.
It’s clear , you have NO idea what you are talking about.

[BANANASBANANAS]

BANANASBANANAS,

The expat community haven’t exactly made it hard for it to look that way

It might be the new year hangover but I am not understanding your point. Can you explain please. Not being difficult just don't understand.

[sealear]

Read your contract guys it says entire provident fund (edit company contribution) is forfeit if dismissed by the company.

[givemewings]

It's cute that anyone still thinks a contract is worth anything in the UAE. They can do whatever they like and sure you can fight them but you'll lose your money or your job/visa or both

[harry the cod]

sealear

Please at least get the facts correct.

The A fund, ie the Company contribution, is the only one of the three that can be rightfully and legally retained by the Company in the event of dismissal. The B & C fund are kept by yourself regardless of how you leave employment.

It is NOT the entire fund.

Harry

[givemewings]

I should specify, the contract from them to you is fluid.

Anything from you to them they will chase down and make you comply.

[harry the cod]

givemewings

I also find it rather cute when people talk complete bollocks on these forums and are obviously clueless to the facts. The Provident fund is not 'contracted' in the UAE. It's an approved and regulated financial scheme based in the Isle of Man and run by Trustees completely independent of Emirates. The money that I contribute to the B & C fund has nothing to do with my employer and is not legally theirs to take. Period.

Harry

[jack schidt]

Sadly 207 looks like we are going to lose some colleagues, that’s despite AIRLIVE reporting a year where no major passenger jets were lost due to accidents.

J

[sealear]

You're right Harry, I did mean the company contribution not your own contributions obviously. Written somewhere around the globe at some hour after some long flight 🙂

[Cloud Bunny]

Sadly 207 looks like we are going to lose some colleagues, that’s despite AIRLIVE reporting a year where no major passenger jets were lost due to accidents.

J
Not sure about that - apparently one of them is working tomorrow. (So I’m told by a 380 mate of mine, I’ve not confirmed that with my own eyes)

[Fuzuma]

They’re all still rostered last time I checked, as well as a few others, who people have claimed have been fired.......would have to agree with cloud bunny

[Talparc]

it’s normal to be rostered as long as the appeal is on going.

[givemewings]

Harry re read I said nothing about provident funds I mentioned contracts. In general.

They can and will find ways around whatever they want to get around (including their own ERM, SOPs or anything else). Including paying you monies due when you leave, refunding medical expenses or a dozen other things. But they will squeeze you for every ruddy dirham on the way out.

Unlike some here I did actually work for EK.

[pumpkin]

sealear

Please at least get the facts correct.

The A fund, ie the Company contribution, is the only one of the three that can be rightfully and legally retained by the Company in the event of dismissal. The B & C fund are kept by yourself regardless of how you leave employment.

It is NOT the entire fund.

Harry

According to Nick Foxton.. if he is to be believed.. and also Peter Shaw at Mondial, the Provident fund is under the trustees overseas and is in our names. The only way the company can take our A fund, is if EK can prove to the trustees that you did something really bad- such as purposely damage an airplane, assault someone etc- ie a real crime. Dismissal is not grounds for them to keep the A fund. Apparently if they did try this it could be appealed overseas and they would have a hard time proving why they could take this money from us.. as it actually is in our names. So.. does anyone actually KNOW someone who was fired and had their A fund revoked?

[GMC1500]

4 guys from my building were fired back in the old days when firing was rampant.
1. the CMB selfie FO
2. failed a drug test, and was a problem child in any case
3. failed the medical, colour blindness
4. apparently because of a poorly timed/worded email that offended some in the bouncy castle. Again, probably other issues behind that one.

[halas]

The 'A' Fund is an Ace Card the company holds up it's sleeve.

When they are tired of you, they place a resignation letter in front of you to sign.

Sign here and you keep your 'A' Fund.

No recourse. All further correspondence will not be entered into. You are gone.

halas (Literally)

[fo4ever]

Well, the MEL CAPT and FO were not fired but forced to resign with a kalashnikov in their backs by the little midget Mr TCAS.

I quess that 9 years later EK has not changed one bit!

VERY TROUBLING

Fly safe with EK

[JammedStab]

Near stall out of Cochin?

What happened in Cochin?

[Mach.888]

That's my understanding, but hey .888, what do I know...��

Exactly, “what do you know”
The problem here is that nothing is in black and white.
We can hope, think and believe whatever we like until that day when we find out.
You can always assume that everything is going to be sweet just because you think that they always paid out the A contribution.
Well guess what, one day they might decide not to. And that may be your life saving gone.

[JAARule]

You mean like Melbourne, Dubai, and Mauritius and Moscow?

There was also the Joburg accident after which the captain (RIP) and FO were sacked then later unsacked but kept off roster for a considerable period of time. Does that count?

Also in Africa, the two guys who flew over the palace and made a bit of noise. Can't remember which city now. I think they were possibly also sacked then unsacked.

The "DEC Graveyard" claimed a few scalps too and not just DECs.

[BANANASBANANAS]

There was also the Joburg accident after which the captain (RIP) and FO were sacked then later unsacked but kept off roster for a considerable period of time. Does that count?

Also in Africa, the two guys who flew over the palace and made a bit of noise. Can't remember which city now. I think they were possibly also sacked then unsacked.

The "DEC Graveyard" claimed a few scalps too and not just DECs.

What is this 'DEC Graveyard' please?

[SOPS]

There was also the Joburg accident after which the captain (RIP) and FO were sacked then later unsacked but kept off roster for a considerable period of time. Does that count?

Also in Africa, the two guys who flew over the palace and made a bit of noise. Can't remember which city now. I think they were possibly also sacked then unsacked.

The "DEC Graveyard" claimed a few scalps too and not just DECs.

On one of my last flights JAA, I flew with the Captain on that African Palace flight. He had been "sacked", but then sent on "leave" asked to come back and was "unsacked" and demoted to an FO. Don't know about the other crew members fate.

[White Knight]

demoted to an FO

Not that I recall... Fired and unfired yes but not demoted.

However JJ, of JNB, was demoted for six months after being unfired many months after the event...

One early DEC nearly flew into the Ngorongoro Hills near Nairobi (a very close shave) and was rightly let go IMHO.

[SOPS]

Well, I stand to be corrected. That is the story he told me.

[aeropix]

But left to another airline in his home country ASAP as he was told that he would never be offered a command in EK.

[Jack D]

Damascus = Graveyard ... must be somewhere else now, or anywhere else judging by recent events .

[Dan_Brown]

So, after 3 pages it's just another airline operation in a third world country.

[shukran]

So, after 3 pages it's just another airline operation in a third world country.

lol.

I know of some great Cabin Crew firings, my favorite is probably the Purser who attacked the Captain while in the Flight Deck just a few months ago. Why haven't I seen anything posted about that incident?

[gearlever]

EK safest Airline 2017
AERO International und aeroscope ? das Online-Portal der Zivilluftfahrt - Studie: Die 20 sichersten Airlines des Jahres (http://www.aerointernational.de/airlines-nachrichten/studie-die-20-sichersten-airlines-des-jahres.html)

[greenfields]

:p:p

Well we know where more EK sponsorship dollars go then don't we?

[JAARule]

However JJ, of JNB, was demoted for six months after being unfired many months after the event....

Further to that, as I recall they were promptly sacked presumably because the result of the as yet incomplete investigation was in no doubt. Then, following the full page advertisement in F.I. by Airbus distancing themselves from the event and the 'training' on the 343 leading up to it, cooler heads prevailed and the pilots were unsacked. They then sat on the bench while awaiting the result of the investigation.

Interestingly, that issue of F.I. wasn't long on the shelves in this town. I still have mine somewhere.

SOPs! How's the train driving going?

[maggot]

lol.

I know of some great Cabin Crew firings, my favorite is probably the Purser who attacked the Captain while in the Flight Deck just a few months ago. Why haven't I seen anything posted about that incident?
A little was but, curiously, ranks closed over it and that was it

[givemewings]

EK? Safest? How?? I mean with how many 'incidents' in the last few months... it must be like their 'Airline of Year' Award they got some year.... in July :ugh:

Shukran, Maggot, I know of one CC who had the details and was willing to spill after their trip but curiously after a 'routine' visit to HQ clammed up on the matter. Surprise.

I also wonder whatever happened to the purser who supposedly got arrested over the CHML or some such.

Then of course there's the ex-CC who allegedly wore her old uniform into the cockpit to take selfies and sit around for a half hour...

And 'EK Standards: Chapter 2: Moet Edition' (although she was fired and he wasn't)

Anything on those???

[shukran]

lol, Moet Edition. Wasn't that at the Manchester Marriott?

[Odins Raven]

The Moët was in Glasgow. You can see that straight away from the bathroom layout. The champagne was also Piper-Heidsick actually, not Moët.

Yes, it’s sad that I noted that much detail but I’m obviously a movie buff ;-)

[troff]

Don’t forget Manchester.

[maggot]

Capt champagne didn't get fired? Of all these maybe he should be in the clink

[Odins Raven]

Capt champagne didn't get fired? Of all these maybe he should be in the clink

It wasn’t a Captain in the champagne in the bath incident. It was a Moldovan girl filmed by a male Brazilian GR1 (who incidentally was married to another crew member). He shared the video with friends who posted it on social media.

Whilst it was a horrible thing to do to the girl who wasn’t aware it would be posted, she must accept that when you take a bottle of champers from Biz Class and let someone film you in the bath inserting said bottle in the holiest of holes whilst saying “thank you emirates for this champagne” and naming your employers - it’s sort of hard to argue innocence.

[SOPS]

:D"The holiest of holes"...now thats funny,

[Modesh]

..............Of all these maybe he should be in the clink

And all of those that shared it!

[givemewings]

The champagne was also Piper-Heidsick actually

Yeah but that isn't nearly so catchy :}

[JammedStab]

What happened in Cochin?

[greenfields]

I think it was the incident where 2 fools almost stalled a jet because they had set the HDG Bug 180 degrees the wrong way for take off......:ugh::ugh::ugh:

[misd-agin]

HDG bug 180 degrees the wrong way caused the airplane to almost stall? What happened? They try an Immelmann?

[crewmeal]

It wasn’t a Captain in the champagne in the bath incident. It was a Moldovan girl filmed by a male Brazilian GR1 (who incidentally was married to another crew member). He shared the video with friends who posted it on social media.


Thank God there was no such thing as selfies or social media back in the 70's/80's or there wouldn't be anyone left flying for BOAC/BEA.

Do you play spin the bottle of blind man's muff on layovers these days?

[Talparc]

“thank you emirates for this champagne” and naming your employers - it’s sort of hard to argue innocence.

actually she said the F-Word about her valued Employer.

But still a classic video, let’s wait and see what the new seasons will bring.

[ironbutt57]

Thank God there was no such thing as selfies or social media back in the 70's/80's or there wouldn't be anyone left flying for BOAC/BEA.

Do you play spin the bottle of blind man's muff on layovers these days?



yahhhh....used to be fun didnt it?

[BANANASBANANAS]

Yep, all good fun back in the day.

I can see how a certain amount of common sense has had to be applied to some of the more 'exotic' practices but I do feel the pendulum has swung back way too far in the other direction.

We live our professional lives now treading on eggshells, being super mindful of everything we say and do lest some uber sensitive poor soul might, god forbid, be offended and leap on the opportunity to report us. In the process, it has taken away most of the reasons I joined this industry and I really can't wait for the day when I can put the sad state this industry has descended into, behind me.

The frustrating thing is that 99.9% of the people I fly with are all great and would, I am sure, have fitted right in, 'back in the day.' But, we are, as is usual nowadays, running scared of the politically correct minority. And I don't think the world is a better place today than it was 40 years ago, despite all this political correctness.

Maybe one day, genuine common sense, airmanship, manners, courtesy, respect and fun etc will come back in fashion.

Or maybe I have just turned into a grumpy old man!

https://youtu.be/fHMoDt3nSHs

[SOPS]

You should come and my new work place...I don't think they have heard of "PC"....even I was shocked when I started..but do we have some interesting conversations!!

[JammedStab]

HDG bug 180 degrees the wrong way caused the airplane to almost stall? What happened?

Is anybody going to answer this or is secrecy more important than safety?

[Dropp the Pilot]

I know all about it because I'm a stakeholder but since it's none of your business I'm going to go with secrecy.

[ClassCbird]

Err.. isn't 'Spin the bottle' a game we used to play when we were, like, eleven?

[misd-agin]

Sounds like the latest version is more fun.

[crewmeal]

Yep, all good fun back in the day.

It was and what went on in room parties stayed in room parties, that's the difference between then and now.

[SOPS]

Err.. isn't 'Spin the bottle' a game we used to play when we were, like, eleven?
Ummm..this game had a bottle....not too sure how much "spinning" was involved.:E

[Schnowzer]

So what happened��

[GoreTex]

good one SOPS, I almost fell off my chair

[GillEx737]

:yuk: Oof it's a little too early for that!

[EK380]

Operating FO on the JFK seems to be re-enstated. Final warning letter iso dismissal.

Operating CA and Augmenting CA, still awaiting outcome of appeal.

[fatbus]

How long does the final written warning stay active on your file? Too lazy to search !

[givemewings]

VP CC has jumped ship, apparently with no notice as the email was sent by AAR and not LB herself as usually was the case when she had something to say.

They cited 'personal reasons'.

Hers, or EK's is the question. Their loss, LB seemed like on of the few who actually 'got it' when it came to keeping your staff happy (or at least tried to do something about issues that affected the CC on the line and at home)

[SOPS]

Im hearing (unconfirmed) reports that the person in HR in charge of pilot recruiting has been shown the door as well.

[falconeasydriver]

More leaks than the Titanic they said.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vr3VPbsDxNCqcgZuCAZGci3TKfLW6avkxQOw_eIi5bg/mobilebasic

Hopefully this link works

[The Outlaw]

More leaks than the Titanic they said.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vr3VPbsDxNCqcgZuCAZGci3TKfLW6avkxQOw_eIi5bg/mobilebasic

Hopefully this link works

You can pretty much replace the words "cabin crew" for "pilot" and it hits the nail on the head.

[JammedStab]

I know all about it because I'm a stakeholder but since it's none of your business I'm going to go with secrecy.

OK, so in the name of your secrecy, you are willing to let hundreds die in a disaster instead of saying what happened and learning from it. Extremely unprofessional. And it is the public's business, to have the rest of the pilot's out there learn from this mistake in Cochin.

[my salami]

OK, so in the name of your secrecy, you are willing to let hundreds die in a disaster instead of saying what happened and learning from it. Extremely unprofessional. And it is the public's business, to have the rest of the pilot's out there learn from this mistake in Cochi.

JammedStab,
Does your Company release ASR info to public audience?
I don't think so...

MS

[harry the cod]

waltair

Your ignorance of how the legal structure of such a scheme works is clearly evident in your post. We're talking about employees leaving the Company or being fired. We are also talking about three separately accessed funds, all of which are independent of each other. So, I'll say it again, the ONLY fund the Company will have any right to withhold is the A fund. Banks do not control access to the accounts, the trustees do. As for the trumped up criminal charges to access a few hundred thousand dollars? Seriously?

Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean everyone is out to get you!

Harry

[Desdihold]

Harry,

Lets fully develop the A fund situation.

The A fund is one portion of the provident fund and comes from company contributions, the B fund is a mandatory contribution from the pilot and the C fund is an additional ( and optional ) contribution from the pilot.

The A fund will make up the majority of the combined provident fund if just the A and B portions are funded over the years with EK.
The C a/c can be significant depending on how much the pilots elects to contribute however is is generally a much smaller amount then the A a/c.
Both the B and C funds are funded solely by the pilot, the A fund is funded solely by the company.

Should the company elect to withhold the A fund then the pilot will forgo the majority of the combined funds in the provident fund.

true, I have not heard of a situation where the company has withheld the A fund but you just never know what the future holds at the this place.

Your prior posts on the A fund imply that it is just a small portion of the provident fund, your opinion is incorrect.

Harry you are indeed a cod,

Desdi

[JammedStab]

JammedStab,
Does your Company release ASR info to public audience?
I don't think so...

MS

Just because your or my company doesn't release info doesn't mean that you, yourself could save many lives by anonomously posting safety critical info.

Having said that, would it change your mind? I don't think so either.

By coincidence, subsequent to the 777 crash in Dubai, it came out through the rumour mill that my company had a similar incident. Nearly had a tailstrike but got away with it by inches. My company kept it a secret(involved a higher up) and I only heard about it many months later. Imagine if we on this thread ended this idea of the importance of secrecy over safety(even if the company continues the secrecy) and provided information to each other to prevent disasters. The secrecy method means we only learn from disasters with the published report as opposed to the similar incidents that pre-dated the disaster.

Seems like secrecy rules on this thread among the general population though. Perhaps they feel it is more important.

[harry the cod]

Desdihold

Yes, I see what you're getting at but I don't think my posts imply anything other than stating what you yourself have agreed with. Regardless of the monetary value of the fund, the A fund is paid at the discretion of the Company. The other two aren't. That is NOT opinion, that is fact.

Whether people choose to contribute a portion, large or small, of their salary into the C fund is irrelevant. They can invest in bitcoin, the next fancy pyramid scheme or Scandinavian pine forests for all I care. My argument is based on what the Company can and can't do with the money, not how much it will personally mean to the individual as an overall percentage of the 3 funds. It goes without saying that the more years you do here, the more you'd have to lose should the Company withhold its contribution.

Harry

[Mach.888]

[QUOTE=harry the cod;10024390]

“ So, I'll say it again, the ONLY fund the Company will have any right to withhold is the A fund.”

It’s funny how you swing it Harry.
You still try your hardest ( “ONLY”) to make it sound like everything is just fine.
Well let me break it to you.
75% of something is to many of us a substantial number.

But hey, for us that’s been here longer then a week know what you are all about.

[givemewings]

yes but JS, in most countries you won't land up in jail for sharing confidential safety info publicly if it is indeed in the public interest.

not so if the poster is from or in the UAE.

[donpizmeov]

Do you have an example of that happening Wings? Or is this more galley talk?

[givemewings]

Don, I'm referring to the UAE cyber crimes law, if you are found in breach of it then yes you can go to jail. (Spreading rumor, false information, or any kind of posting that can cause damage to reputation, commercial interest yada yada)

Don't forget that we all agreed to abide by the ERM which includes keeping confidential company info just that. Half the posts on pprune are technically in breach of it, just lucky for us they seem to not have the time to follow up on most of it (although they have been known to pull people into the office to give them a rap across the knuckles for posting in here, and that is just for chitchat)

if someone were to post up confidential safety info here, whether true or not, and they can identify that person, I personally wouldn't be worrying about whether jail time is a rumor or not. I'd be worrying about how to get myself out of dodge.

There is no 'whistleblower' legislation in the UAE. That's not galley talk, that is fact.

[JammedStab]

Re-posted with important added words which have been highlighted.

JammedStab,
Does your Company release ASR info to public audience?
I don't think so...

MS

Just because your or my company doesn't release info doesn't mean that you, yourself could save many lives by anonomously posting safety critical info.

Having said that, would it change your mind? I don't think so either.

By coincidence, subsequent to the 777 crash in Dubai, it came out through the rumour mill that my company had had a similar incident prior to the Dubai crash. Nearly had a tailstrike but got away with it by inches, then the thrust was manually added. My company kept it a secret(as it involved a higher up) and I only heard about it many months later. Imagine if we on this thread ended this idea of the importance of secrecy over safety(even if the company continues the secrecy) and provided information to each other to prevent disasters. The secrecy method means we only learn from disasters with the published report as opposed to the similar incidents that pre-dated the disaster. It might have prevented the disaster at your company. I hope you can help prevent one at my company.

Seems like secrecy rules on this thread among the general population though. Perhaps they feel it is more important.

[skidbuggy]

It wasn’t a Captain in the champagne in the bath incident. It was a Moldovan girl filmed by a male Brazilian GR1 (who incidentally was married to another crew member). He shared the video with friends who posted it on social media.

Whilst it was a horrible thing to do to the girl who wasn’t aware it would be posted, she must accept that when you take a bottle of champers from Biz Class and let someone film you in the bath inserting said bottle in the holiest of holes whilst saying “thank you emirates for this champagne” and naming your employers - it’s sort of hard to argue innocence.

Sounds like she’s a keeper ;)

[harry the cod]

Mach .888

Swing? Well, let me break it to you too. The employee's fund is 5%, EK's contribution is 12% becoming 15% after 10 years. Like for like investment, the A fund will NEVER equate to 75% of the total. And if you'd bothered to read the last post, you'd see that I do indeed acknowledge that over time, the amount itself could be substantial. That, however, was not part of the original debate. We were debating whether the Company can access funds OTHER than the A.

I don't make the policy, nor do I necessarily support it but it's important people have the facts before going off on one!

Harry

[Mach.888]

Mach .888

Swing? Well, let me break it to you too. The employee's fund is 5%, EK's contribution is 12% becoming 15% after 10 years. Like for like investment, the A fund will NEVER equate to 75% of the total. And if you'd bothered to read the last post, you'd see that I do indeed acknowledge that over time, the amount itself could be substantial. That, however, was not part of the original debate. We were debating whether the Company can access funds OTHER than the A.

I don't make the policy, nor do I necessarily support it but it's important people have the facts before going off on one!

Harry

Harry,
I am sorry. When I wrote 75% I just made a quick approximation from the values in the WTW app.
So Harry, the fact is 72%, in my case.
Nothing more, nothing less.
However the 72% will increase towards 74.999999999999 % over time.
And that’s a FACT.

So people, regardless of how Harry likes to portray the issue.
If you are dismissed for Gross Misconduct, they can decide to keep up to 74.9999999% of the sum of the A and B contributions.
Just saying.

[harry the cod]

So, my question now then is how many people HAVE been fired for gross misconduct?

I'm sure there may well have been one or two but in most cases, is it not the possibility of losing (in Mach's case) 74.999999%, the reason why they 'offer' you the option to resign instead?

Harry

[fatbus]

I can only think one 1 in 16 years.

[fliion]

Harry,
I am sorry. When I wrote 75% I just made a quick approximation from the values in the WTW app.
So Harry, the fact is 72%, in my case.
Nothing more, nothing less.
However the 72% will increase towards 74.999999999999 % over time.
And that’s a FACT.

So people, regardless of how Harry likes to portray the issue.
If you are dismissed for Gross Misconduct, they can decide to keep up to 74.9999999% of the sum of the A and B contributions.
Just saying.

I was told specifically by MG in Mondial who was involved in case that an American did a runner for personal reasons - Co. wanted to deduct the various costs of early exit from A fund, he retained London solicitors with offices in U.K., Isle of Man & Dubai and after two weeks of back and forth between lawyers - all Prov monies released to exiting pilot. I forgot to ask for how long he was here.

Faced with losing any or all of my Prov - it will be worth a fight.

[Odins Raven]

I can only think one 1 in 16 years.

I think the intricacies of whether it’s a firing or a forced resignation detracts from the issue that in almost all cases, the poor employee should neither have been fired, or forced to resign. It’s still losing your job, relocating your family and suffering the stress of being blamed for something that may have its origins in the ethos of the organisation, rather than the ability of the individual.

It’s a sad state of affairs, but one that likely is there to stay.

[fatbus]

O R,

"So, my question now then is how many people HAVE been fired for gross misconduct? "

I was answering the question!

[Odins Raven]

O R,

"So, my question now then is how many people HAVE been fired for gross misconduct? "

I was answering the question!

Yes, I know - wasn’t a dig at you, just felt the thread seemed to drifting into an flippant examination of English comprehension rather than the important issue at hand - colleagues’ lives being ruined by horrible, unaccountable, corrupt individuals. Back on topic...

[donpizmeov]

Looks like the CM1 asking the CM2 if he needs to go potty when the 20min to TOPD call is made will be made compulsory by FCI soon. We may have “THE” ASR of 2018 already.

[Big Enos Burdette]

Pre Descent Bladder Inspection

[Eau de Boeing]

Don, perhaps he was too busy briefing in the descent to get time to go.....?
#rootcause

[cerbus]

At this point at Emirates being let go would be a blessing. Everyone I know that has left has ended up at a better position and hell, it would be hard to go to a worse position than we are in currently.
So Odnis being sacked would actually help your career, not hinder it. I am not necessarily recommending it but it wouldn’t be the end of the world either.

[Curry Goat]

Looks like the CM1 asking the CM2 if he needs to go potty when the 20min to TOPD call is made will be made compulsory by FCI soon. We may have “THE” ASR of 2018 already.

Ha ha ,classic!! The best ASR ever, I'd argue. Bet he went home all chuffed and explained to his wife how he'd schooled this young fellow, and she'd respond "that's great dear, when you flying next?" Knob!!!