Doncaster Sheffield-2

[toledoashley]

What about Wizz / Wizz UK?

[TimmyW]

What about Wizz / Wizz UK?

Would be a completed untested market for them, picking up the FlyBe routes. Just can't see it myself, but who knows.

[Cazza_fly]

Would be a completed untested market for them, picking up the FlyBe routes. Just can't see it myself, but who knows.

Everything except the UK domestic routes could be a possibility for Wizzair UK with their aircraft type. The BHD and JER would be the biggest losses that need a regional aircraft realistically but has potential from still being served by Flybe or the likes of Loganair.

Dublin has proven demand and too could be picked up by Ryanair / Aer Lingus should they have capacity to do so.

That would just leave NQY as an unserved route,.Qith it being available as a PSO route to LBA i can't see there being any need for replacement at DSA.

I wouldn't be surprised to see the Flybe base be wound up before summer the way they are going. Very sad. Best wishes to all the crew and staff that handle the operation.

[22/04]

Everything except the UK domestic routes could be a possibility for Wizzair UK

Wizz Air UK seem to be building up their fleet of A321s so far at the expense of one A320 - a lot of seats to fill.

As I have posted elsewhere DSA seems to be the loser in an area where I think there are too many airports. I don't know what the business case was but would have thought it included taking at least some traffic from LBA. It hasn't done that (except for TUI maybe) and competing with LBA and EMA where Jet2 and RYR are entrenched and to a lessor extent HUY it will be difficult.

[G-FORZ]

Wizz Air UK seem to be building up their fleet of A321s so far at the expense of one A320 - a lot of seats to fill.

As I have posted elsewhere DSA seems to be the loser in an area where I think there are too many airports. I don't know what the business case was but would have thought it included taking at least some traffic from LBA. It hasn't done that (except for TUI maybe) and competing with LBA and EMA where Jet2 and RYR are entrenched and to a lessor extent HUY it will be difficult.

The masterplan would argue that DSA can become the airport with the best infrastructure, and entice passengers and freight from EMA, LBA & even MAN. The commercial development around DSA has grown significantly in the last three years with massive warehousing for the likes of Amazon. To call it a loser does not properly reflect the full growth of the airport and surrounding business in recent years specifically since the opening of direct link roads from the Motorway network.

DSA still lacks a proper UK based Loco, but the deal with Flybe has at least shown a market for the flights they have chosen to operate. Wizz (quietly) remain the largest operator, and hopefully their relationship with Peel/DSA can be constructive in replacing and lost BE routes with a Wizz UK operation. On Peels part they will not be upsetting an incumbent as might be the case if they were to pursue RYR or EZY. Peel wont upset TUI trying too hard for Jet 2 - but if growth can be maintained over the next few years proving the calims of the masterplan, maybe even Jet 2 will see the restrictions of LBA and move some of their capacity to the airport that has room to grow.

[TimmyW]

Interested points, but where is that growth coming from?
Unless a replacement is found for FlyBe in the next few weeks, this years passenger numbers will be massively down.

I don't see Wizz picking it up, they have said previously they are interested in operating bucket and spade routes from the UK, and I don't see them going against their business model with routes such as AMS.

[Robert-Ryan]

Last time an airline screwed Peel over like this they screwed them back to the tune of £12m...

[G-FORZ]

Interested points, but where is that growth coming from?
.

You would hope TUI are monitoring what JET2 are doing up the road at LBA (and everywhere else) and try to take back some of the market they have lost - to DSA of course as TUI's airport of choice :)

[Gsm1]

Last time an airline screwed Peel over like this they screwed them back to the tune of £12m... BMI baby at Teesside?

[Alwayslistening]

There are about 30 Wizzair flights at present for Winter 19/20.

It remains to be seen what the Flybe schedule will be, I suspect there will be a daily BHD and then on to AMS/CDG and back with a late return to BHD. Its difficult to see how anything else can be flown thru, maybe the Jersey but thats limited, unless they do something like EDI-AMS-DSA-AMS-EDI.

Lots more to come out of this in my opinion. For sure it seems DSA/CWL don't fit with what Virgin want (to feed their hub at LHR and MAN) but Connect are also 30% owned by Stobart.. DSA themselves won't want to lose these routes and I imagine will do what they can to find a replacement, the loads have been good so clearly the demand is there.

Flybe "management" to blame here. for sure they'll be fine tho - as per usual. :cool:

[davidjpowell]

Is Timmy bleating here? he has been given short shrift on the Flybe thread.

We don't yet know what is being cut. Flybe have said that they will still be serving DSA using Dash aircraft, presumably on W patterns. It's hard to imagine them doing the longer Spain/Portugal flights, but hopefully we will keep Dublin, Amsterdam, Belfast and Paris in some form.

[pug]

Last time an airline screwed Peel over like this they screwed them back to the tune of £12m...

Forgive me for my seeming ignorance, but aren’t the airlines the customer of an airport? If their chosen airport fails to deliver the passenger throughput to sustain a viable operation then the airline is surely free to leave on that basis? Caveats of buy in deals aside - coincidentally FlyBe were bought in - how much leverage do you think that gives a struggling airport when trying to attract new airline custom?

Beggars cant be choosers. As defined here.

[wowzz]

Forgive me for my seeming ignorance, but aren’t the airlines the customer of an airport? If their chosen airport fails to deliver the passenger throughput to sustain a viable operation then the airline is surely free to leave on that basis? Caveats of buy in deals aside - coincidentally FlyBe were bought in - how much leverage do you think that gives a struggling airport when trying to attract new airline custom?

Beggars cant be choosers. As defined here.
As someone who lives only 25 miles away from DSA, I would love to use the airport for all my flights. However, the only airline that flies anywhere of interest to me, is TUI, but at silly prices compared to flights with Jet2 from BHX or LBA. Not sure how DSA can be blamed for not delivering the passenger throughput if the airline itself is offering uncompetitive fares to pax that would love to use their local airport.

[EI-BUD]

I guess the big question now for the future of DSA is whether anyone is going to come in and fill the gap left by Flybe?

This loss will be several hundred thousand passengers per year.

I just can't see who. Easyjet maybe?

easyJet have been and gone, can't see any reason they'd be back. The airport need a slice of the Jet2 cake, though that may be extremely hard to achieve, but who knows.

[pug]

Age old argument of passengers wanting to reduce an airlines revenue by suggesting that they give them cut price fares on flights where passenger demand is already hard to justify. Well done also to EI-BUD for proposing that Jet2 should multiply its costs and compete on its own services.

The airport owner can only be blamed for opening an airport in an area where propensity to fly isn’t high enough to fulfil their ambitions. My response was aimed directly at a poster that was keen to remind people that the last time an airline crossed Peel by dropping Teesside from their schedule, the airline in question ended up £12million out of pocket. Great incentive to attract new business in an already saturated market.

[Robert-Ryan]

If their chosen airport fails to deliver the passenger throughput to sustain a viable operation then the airline is surely free to leave on that basis?

DTVA were delivering the pax though, and I don't buy into the lack of yield argument either

[EI-BUD]

Age old argument of passengers wanting to reduce an airlines revenue by suggesting that they give them cut price fares on flights where passenger demand is already hard to justify. Well done also to EI-BUD for proposing that Jet2 should multiply its costs and compete on its own services.

The airport owner can only be blamed for opening an airport in an area where propensity to fly isn’t high enough to fulfil their ambitions. My response was aimed directly at a poster that was keen to remind people that the last time an airline crossed Peel by dropping Teesside from their schedule, the airline in question ended up £12million out of pocket. Great incentive to attract new business in an already saturated market.
Good morning Pug,
My point is that the this is the greatest opportunity that the airport can wish for now, they've explored so many avenues already, easyJet, Ryanair etc.
The topic is wasn't about Jet2.
​​​​​​
Jet2 have significant market power particularly in the family and packaged holiday market, if DSA want a big slice of the cake in the region, Jet2 could bring it. I wouldn't speculate on the commercials or such things as cost duplication. We don't always see the cost benefit analysis and many airlines operate from neighbouring airports with commercial justification, let me give you some examples;

Ryanair - bases at PIK, GLA and EDI
Jet2 - bases at LBA, MAN
Jet2 - bases at BHX, EMA
easyJet - bases at LTN, STN, SEN

I agree that the region is incredibly competitive from an airport perspective, but airline do and can often justify having bases close together and there is nothing to say that Jet2 however unlikely it may be, couldn't split their operation between LBA and DSA, without duplication of services. Afterall, reading the history on the threads for DSA, the belief seems to be that DSA could prove an excellent alternstive to LBA. Indeed there was a group of posters proposing a new alternstive airport for Leeds at one point. I wonder what commercial rationale that stood behind that.

Play nice people ...
EI-BUD

[pug]

EI-BUD, it is less populated than West Yorkshire and East Midlands region, barring some significant strategic shift it just isn’t going to happen. Sorry. Jet2 haven’t grown to be the strong business they are through duplicating costs. Quite the opposite in fact. The examples you have given are of different airlines and entirely different locations which have their own idiosyncrasies.

I maintain that the best best bet for growth in that sector would be from easyJet given that they have no coverage throughout central and Eastern England between NCL and LTN/STN. So if they show no interest, what makes you think that Jet2 -with large bases at LBA, EMA and MAN - would fare any better? Sorry to labour the point, but we were told 15 years ago that airlines would vote with their feet. They have.

[ROC10]

Ryanair - bases at PIK, GLA and EDI


Ryanair actually closed their base at GLA, this was first announced over a year ago. Many of the flights were moved to EDI.

[EGPO]

EI-BUD, it is less populated than West Yorkshire and East Midlands region, barring some significant strategic shift it just isn’t going to happen. Sorry. Jet2 haven’t grown to be the strong business they are through duplicating costs. Quite the opposite in fact. The examples you have given are of different airlines and entirely different locations which have their own idiosyncrasies.

I maintain that the best best bet for growth in that sector would be from easyJet given that they have no coverage throughout central and Eastern England between NCL and LTN/STN. So if they show no interest, what makes you think that Jet2 -with large bases at LBA, EMA and MAN - would fare any better? Sorry to labour the point, but we were told 15 years ago that airlines would vote with their feet. They have.

With respect Easyjet left at a totally different time at DSA, it was located in the back of beyond , hard to get to .and this certainly stifled it's potential.
There was very little freight and it seemed a lack of interest from management.

Now it is well connected directly to several motorways ( via M18 ), EG , M1 , A1(M) , M62 etc.
Cargo is going through the roof , this change with Flybe had NOTHING to do with a bad airport , it was EVERY airport , an Airline consolidating back to its core and best known business -short - medium sectors on Dash8 aircraft.

And IS continuing , further investment is being made by the airport team and will be going ahead shortly with , a major refresh and fair sized Terminal expansion , also into previously an unused ( mothballed) part of the Terminal .

During one debate here or elsewhere some link to an alleged comment by a potential Airline , stating these changes were expected if expansion was to occur .

TUI pulled from both EMA and LBA' , and even on this forum , was an EMA post about DSA ' poaching custom now, and are up to , Three based 737, ( TUI ) , plus one visiting weekly longhaul 787 this year , and much more next year as Cancun , has been added .

To sum up the airport is a very different prospect now, since ' easyJet ( 9 years ago !! ) , The airport year on year wins awards as best airport .
So you cannot compare, and equate why easyJet are not coming

Nobody knows for sure, also on these very pages people said , exactly the same of Flybe " won't ever open a base , it will dilute surrounding airports" .
And that was proven wrong .
Noone knows the future, you cannot say for sure who will open routes .
But eventually they will come .
Who and when , you'll just have to wait and see!.

[davidjpowell]

All sounds quite positive.

https://www.doncasterlocalonline.co.uk/new-cargo-boss-keen-to-build-on-record-results-at-doncaster-sheffield-airport?fbclid=IwAR1-5Djvy9zFea6Xj1qT0UOWi7UI3mZxCkhLcXKumrejPX67rw9Xn8gIVh8

[Cautious Optimist]

Any truth to the rumour that both DSA and LPL have been put up for sale today??

[Cazza_fly]

Not sure. Although it wouldn't be a bad thing. Peel have very little care in airport passenger operations. It would be good to see new energy behind the running of these two airports from an organisation with more passion and/or experience.

[N707ZS]

Lets hope Stobart doesn't buy them or it will be groundhog day for Durham Tees Valley.

[Alwayslistening]

Not sure. Although it wouldn't be a bad thing. Peel have very little care in airport passenger operations. It would be good to see new energy behind the running of these two airports from an organisation with more passion and/or experience.

Agreed. Wouldn’t take too much to put DSA even more on the map, get the terminal extended and get that airbridge in ASAP. Border entrance in particular I think will cause issues this summer I fear - which the terminal extension would have solved.
If Newcastle can support a daily Emirates 777 so can DSA, particularly with the cargo facilities.
Some head hunting wouldn’t go a miss either, get some more personal with proven track records in key positions.

[TimmyW]

Any truth to the rumour that both DSA and LPL have been put up for sale today??

Where have you heard this?

[Cautious Optimist]

New owner of DTVA told a local village at a meeting about the airport

[EGPO]

Wouldn't trust that source ,going on his email
I got where he promised on 1 million plus pax at DTVA

[egcntristar]

Flybe timetable starting to yield information on the winter schedule. AMS (daily) and BHD (4 X weekly) match last winters frequencies utilizing BHD and BHX props. So far so good.

[PDXCWL45]

Flybe timetable starting to yield information on the winter schedule. AMS (daily) and BHD (4 X weekly) match last winters frequencies utilizing BHD and BHX props. So far so good.
Where were you able to find that?

[egcntristar]

Where were you able to find that?

As per the post, on the timetable - click along from October.

[PDXCWL45]

As per the post, on the timetable - click along from October.
I tried that but nothing happened.

[stewyb]

I tried that but nothing happened.

From the timetable you add date first for W19/20, then your chosen departure/destination airport!

[PDXCWL45]

From the timetable you add date first for W19/20, then your chosen departure/destination airport!
thanks it's coming up now though slightly concerning that I haven't found anything for Cardiff yet but early days I guess!

[TimmyW]

Only Amsterdam and Belfast survive for DSA.
A real shame.

[Alwayslistening]

Only Amsterdam and Belfast survive for DSA.
A real shame.

This is a travesty and somethings not right here IMO.

The Flybe loads are very very good!!!! Makes no sense to cut all these routes, why no Dublin - always good loads? No Paris?

More to devolp here I think....

[TimmyW]

This is a travesty and somethings not right here IMO.

The Flybe loads are very very good!!!! Makes no sense to cut all these routes, why no Dublin - always good loads? No Paris?

More to devolp here I think....

According to their social media, no further routes to come for DSA this winter.

[JobsaGoodun]

This is a travesty and somethings not right here IMO.

The Flybe loads are very very good!!!! Makes no sense to cut all these routes, why no Dublin - always good loads? No Paris?

More to devolp here I think....

It's easy to fill and aircraft and still not make money. Flybe will have tried to encourage people to pay more at DSA but if the only way they can fill the aircraft is to drop the price, there isn't much more they can do. They're a business that very nearly didn't make it so can't be sentimental about things.

[Alwayslistening]

It's easy to fill and aircraft and still not make money. Flybe will have tried to encourage people to pay more at DSA but if the only way they can fill the aircraft is to drop the price, there isn't much more they can do. They're a business that very nearly didn't make it so can't be sentimental about things.

Have you seen the prices they are charging?? No way Donny or Cardiff are based that are losing money, no way.

[Sharklet_321]

The whole Flybe model is flawed. They can't make money even on high fares - everyone knows that. It's in their books. Their average fare is ludicrous when compared with easyJet or Ryanair. In order for them to make money they need to INCREASE fares even more. This is not possible in todays market.

[TimmyW]

Local Doncaster newspaper has tweeted that the airport "has no plans" to replace the lost routes in the short to mid term future.

[EGPO]

Well after calling Flybe , they told me , that other routes are still to be loaded .
Obviously Newquay won't be back when you have a daily flight or more from LBA.
But they should have or hopefully keep Paris and Dublin , and perhaps add LCY.
The latter could have extra flights on a Friday and Sunday so people looking for a City Break , in the Capital can either fly after work on a Friday so a later outbound from DSA might be popular.
Yes some will argue the train is faster but Lcy has a lot of onward destinations, that are not even served from MAN. so in theory that route should be a good sell.

The only other couple of Airlines , one of which openly said it wanted to expand in Northern England ( Loganair) , and Stobart could both run those lost routes , Loganair even have ER4 aircraft .

But the one good thing out of all this , is keeping Amsterdam that's a very Key route , unless KLM came along .

[TimmyW]

They aren't keeping the other routes, it is there in black and white if you bother to look.
Why the hell would they add LCY?

[JobsaGoodun]

Have you seen the prices they are charging?? No way Donny or Cardiff are based that are losing money, no way.


Fair enough but if they were making money, why are they pulling the flying? They are try to compete flying aircraft half the size of their competitors from other nearby airports.

The problem is that the general public seem prepared to pay the taxi driver that takes them 10 miles to their local airport the same as the airline flying them halfway across Europe. I'm not saying it's wrong, its great for the travelling public but that airliner costs many times more than that taxi does to run.

You wouldn't walk into your local corner shop and expect to pay Tesco prices so if enough of the travelling public aren't prepared to pay more in big enough volumes for the convenience of flying from DSA then unfortunately, the routes aren't sustainable. Flybe have given it a good try but I guess they have to make difficult decisions to save the business.

[davidjpowell]

Ignoring Timmy who is always full of doom and not always accurate, I do hope that Dublin survives. It's always a reasonably busy service, especially in it's winter configuration. Our local papers don't know there backside from their elbow so no issue there....

LCY though.. that/s not happening....

[Cazza_fly]

Ignoring Timmy who is always full of doom and not always accurate, I do hope that Dublin survives. It's always a reasonably busy service, especially in it's winter configuration. BHD.

LCY though.. that/s not happening....

I'm sure DUB will return again at some point. Realistically though, i'd only imagine with either Ryanair or Aer Lingus.

The route that i can see returning with Flybe is Jersey,. Though i wouldn't expect that to be until the summer schedule release.

For all other routes, DSA needs a new LCC based in the form of either W9 or FR. W9 would be absolutely crazy to give up an opportunity like this - having no competition aside from the TUI package routes. DSA already has a close relationship with W6, so i'd hope W9 would be the natural choice for future expansion... I just wonder how long we'll have to wait and see? Without starting to see a decline again, we'd need to see replacement routes on sale by September / October in readiness for a summer 20 schedule.

[TimmyW]

There's no way WIzz will start picking up dropped bucket and spade routes. It doesn't fit their business model.
The routes dropped by Flybe will go unfilled for the foreseeable future.

[EGPO]

I'm sure DUB will return again at some point. Realistically though, i'd only imagine with either Ryanair or Aer Lingus.

The route that i can see returning with Flybe is Jersey,. Though i wouldn't expect that to be until the summer schedule release.

For all other routes, DSA needs a new LCC based in the form of either W9 or FR. W9 would be absolutely crazy to give up an opportunity like this - having no competition aside from the TUI package routes. DSA already has a close relationship with W6, so i'd hope W9 would be the natural choice for future expansion... I just wonder how long we'll have to wait and see? Without starting to see a decline again, we'd need to see replacement routes on sale by September / October in readiness for a summer 20 schedule.

Sorry who are W6 and w9?

[Plane mad 134]

Sorry who are W6 and w9?

W6 are Wizzair
W9 are Wizzair UK

Hope this helps.

[EGPO]

W6 are Wizzair
W9 are Wizzair UK

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the explanation

[egcntristar]

Wizz to start a 2 X weekly Chisinau service in December.

[Alwayslistening]

£3.5m on a 2000 space car park, £350k on a 76 seater costa. Are either of those needed with current traffic volume?? Especially with the Flybe jets leaving..

I wonder if we will soon see an announcement from Wizz??

[wowzz]

£3.5m on a 2000 space car park, £350k on a 76 seater costa. Are either of those needed with current traffic volume?? Especially with the Flybe jets leaving..

I wonder if we will soon see an announcement from Wizz??


You need to sell a lot of coffee for that sort of investment. I wonder what the payback period is on £350k?

[PintofDoom]

With the higher costs associated with airports the 350k would be paid back over a period of 10 to 15 years. Provided the revenue of the store is over 10k a week. And costs are well managed by the store manager. (wasteage/staff/sales drive).

Costa is a well liked British brand so will do well here I believe.

[wowzz]

With the higher costs associated with airports the 350k would be paid back over a period of 10 to 15 years. Provided the revenue of the store is over 10k a week. And costs are well managed by the store manager. (wasteage/staff/sales drive).

Costa is a well liked British brand so will do well here I believe.
I have never worked for a company that would accept a payback period of that length of time. Anything over 5 years would be thrown out of court at a very early stage in the decision making process.

[davidjpowell]

Wonder which bit of passenger seating will go for Costa. Wetherspoons already has half the departures lounge.

[egcntristar]

Its a tough market going forward and its hard seeing where growth will come from other than incumbents. Hopefully TUI will keep expanding as next year sees Cancun as well as Sanford for long haul in addition to the three based aircraft. The long hoped for hub connection is no nearer and looks as far off as ever, KLM seem to find slots at slot constrained Schipol whenever they need them - they have the best coverage of the UK regions out of all carriers and so would seem them most likely candidate to do something but aren't interested. The Brexit cloud doesn't phase Wizz who keep expanding - if they were concerned by Brexit they have a funny way of showing it as Chisinau, Timisoara and Krakow have been the most recent additions. If a low cost carrier such as Vueling can't be tempted in to provide a link to Barcelona or the Costa's then its status quo unless Wizz are prepared to base, which then leaves the annual passenger total around 1.5M.

[Cazza_fly]

Wonder which bit of passenger seating will go for Costa. Wetherspoons already has half the departures lounge.

The thing is, there is plenty of space in the terminal to make use of without the need to forfeit passenger seating capacity. This is in the form of the closed self service catering unit to the side of Subway. Also the whole area on the North end of the terminal by the mainly unused Finningley Windmill (Weatherspoons) bar area. Of course the airport will however prefer to remove seats to try and encourage passengers to go sit in the outlets instead.

[G-FORZ]

That would be LBA in 2002 just before Jet2 changed the airport. Get Wizz UK in and DSA could see the same growth LBA has witnessed over the last 17 years (yes it’s that long!) There doesn’t seem to be any potential expansion from anywhere else. Yet strangely it would only take Wizz UK basing 4 aircraft to attract competition in Vueling or even FR or Easy. BE have proved there are markets other than AMS and CDG but only at low relative frequency. If market was seen to exist for a based carrier at higher frequency the competition would want a slice. All of this offset against keeping TUI happy which could potentially stifle any efforts for expansion - but at least Wizz aren’t an Inclusive Tour Operator.

[SWBKCB]

Heaven forbid an airport try's to make money!

[Cazza_fly]

Heaven forbid an airport try's to make money!

Airports need to make money. Or rather their outlets do, which in turn ensure pay rents to the airport. However, that should NOT need to be at the detriment of passenger comfort or other facilities. Adequate seating is a large part of the passenger experience. It comes up time and time again in surveys and feedback.

[SWBKCB]

Adequate seating is a large part of the passenger experience. It comes up time and time again in surveys and feedback.

Does it pay the bills? This is the price of cheap flights.

[Cazza_fly]

Does it pay the bills? This is the price of cheap flights.

Technically yes. Repeat business from.customer satisfaction is key.

[paully]

Technically yes. Repeat business from.customer satisfaction is key.

and the key to customer satisfaction is cheaper and cheaper flights........They might moan about a lack of seating but the cheaper flights will always draw them back..O`Leary has proved that.

[DSA-DUB]

Heaven forbid an airport try's to make money!

Nowt wrong with that.
But if there’s no one about the coffee is going to go cold and the parking spaces will be empty.

Its a a big increase in both seating/parking for less people as of this years pax on say next years pax. In my View the airport must have something lined up to do all this work if not then it’s all in vain.

[TimmyW]

Nowt wrong with that.
But if there’s no one about the coffee is going to go cold and the parking spaces will be empty.

Its a a big increase in both seating/parking for less people as of this years pax on say next years pax. In my View the airport must have something lined up to do all this work if not then it’s all in vain.

The car park expansion was lined up and signed before Flybe announced the based closure.

They will be a big loss next year, and could see sub 1 million passengers again.

Wizz basing is pure fantasy.

[egcntristar]

Sub 1M is doubtful as the Wizz seat allocation is 800,000 alone, add to that the three based TUI and a couple of long haul and top it off with the remaining Flybe. Worse case will probably be 1.3M for 2020.

[TimmyW]

Fair point.

It's a shame that some of the Flybe routes will seemingly be lost for good now. Jersey, Dublin, Paris.

[MDS]

I'd find it hopeful that RYR would start services from DUB, AGP, and ALC with aircraft at those bases. (similar to what happens at NCL)

TUI loads on the sun routes always appear to be well filled (albeit a lot of package holidaymakers) and BE seemed to have healthy loads during the summertime. I understand yields are what matters, although RYR can achieve better than BE when it comes to that. I always wondered what the CASM would be on BE's E175 on the sun routes; can't be particularly great.

It's a real shame to see DSA falling behind once again with BE's overall departure as I find it a great airport. Typically you can arrive 70 minutes before the flight and still have comfortable timing margins.

Wizz is helping to keep it afloat although I believe it doesn't really help to stimulate local knowledge of the airport as it's generally expats from Poland/Hungary that utilize their flights.

[Alwayslistening]

The car park expansion was lined up and signed before Flybe announced the based closure.

They will be a big loss next year, and could see sub 1 million passengers again.

Wizz basing is pure fantasy.

Wizz basing is very realistic. Very. Heard from various sources at DSA and elsewhere in the UK and it is expected they will base soon, I am hopeful for next summer.. so watch this space.

Also don’t count those chickens on the BE summer routes, loads are very very good. Flybe upper management is being overhauled competed!!!

[Alwayslistening]

Fair point.

It's a shame that some of the Flybe routes will seemingly be lost for good now. Jersey, Dublin, Paris.

Also don’t count on that either. No reason why W patterns can’t be flown. DUB probably the worst performing route but with Q400s would be better loads/yields.

[PDXCWL45]

Also don’t count on that either. No reason why W patterns can’t be flown. DUB probably the worst performing route but with Q400s would be better loads/yields.
Or they could do something similar as to Cardiff and base/overnight an aircraft there to operate Dublin and other routes.

[TimmyW]

Will be interesting to see how it pans out.

[egcntristar]

Below are Wizz routes from November when frequencies drop to their lowest. There are also extra flights over Christmas. In total for winter there are 35 weekly flights, whereas summer 2019 had 34 weekly flights.

BUD 2 X weekly
DEB 2 X weekly
RIX 2 X weekly
VNO 2 X weekly
KIV 2 X weekly (new route)
GDN 4 X weekly
KTW 4 X weekly
KRK 2 X weekly
POZ 3 X weekly
WAW 2 X weekly
WRO 2 X weekly
OTP 4 X weekly
CLJ 2 X weekly
TSR 2 X weekly

[Airbanda]

They aren't keeping the other routes, it is there in black and white if you bother to look.
Why the hell would they add LCY?

LCY makes no sense at all given rail's timings/frequency from Doncaster, Sheffield, Wakefield or several other LNER/East Midlands/Hull Trains calling points in the DSA catchment.

[Alwayslistening]

LCY makes no sense at all given rail's timings/frequency from Doncaster, Sheffield, Wakefield or several other LNER/East Midlands/Hull Trains calling points in the DSA catchment.

Totally agree on this one, only London airport that makes sense is LHR. I used to travel to London frequently, trains from both Sheffield and Doncaster throughout the day and some decent prices if you weren’t too set on a time.

Flights from DSA only make sense if you are connecting long haul - virgin for example....

[Alwayslistening]

Below are Wizz routes from November when frequencies drop to their lowest. There are also extra flights over Christmas. In total for winter there are 35 weekly flights, whereas summer 2019 had 34 weekly flights.

BUD 2 X weekly
DEB 2 X weekly
RIX 2 X weekly
VNO 2 X weekly
KIV 2 X weekly (new route)
GDN 4 X weekly
KTW 4 X weekly
KRK 2 X weekly
POZ 3 X weekly
WAW 2 X weekly
WRO 2 X weekly
OTP 4 X weekly
CLJ 2 X weekly
TSR 2 X weekly

Exactly this and why I believe they will base soon. The times are also interesting. In previous seasons all flights have been in evening waves. In addition to evening waves, Wizz are now operating morning and midday flights with loads still high - WAW was over booked last week. No reason why they couldn’t base three aircraft at Doncaster now, could also then add additional routes from DSA. Prague anyone???

[N707ZS]

I would of flow with Wizz to Riga recently but the evening departure totally put me off, wonder how many more people think the same. Budapest with the morning is ideal.

[Strakur]

I would of flown with Wizz to Riga recently but the evening departure totally put me off, wonder how many more people think the same. Budapest with the morning is ideal.

The opposite is try for me from DSA. Living in Sheffield, there is no public transport for early morning flights (unlike to MAN with a 03:24 train). Therefore I only take afternoon/evening flights from DSA.

[N707ZS]

The opposite is try for me from DSA. Living in Sheffield, there is no public transport for early morning flights (unlike to MAN with a 03:24 train). Therefore I only take afternoon/evening flights from DSA.

The big problem for me is what do you do when you land at your destination at say 01.30am, you cannot go to your hotel and there's possibly no transport.

[MDS]

The big problem for me is what do you do when you land at your destination at say 01.30am, you cannot go to your hotel and there's possibly no transport.

Wizz flights aren't primarily designed for tourism.

They're typically used by immigrant workers visiting friends and relatives. Lincolnshire/Yorkshire are excellent catchments for this type of traffic, and besides travelling to Luton face little competition.

[EGPO]

Wizz flights aren't primarily designed for tourism.

They're typically used by immigrant workers visiting friends and relatives. Lincolnshire/Yorkshire are excellent catchments for this type of traffic, and besides travelling to Luton face little competition.

Respectfully, recently DSA themselves have begun to market routes like Timisoara, as ' a tourist destination'.
Also we are still stuck in the mindset that everyone on a Wizz flight is a migrant. But ironically I was chatting to a local Polish friend , who thinks ( naturally) Wizz is a great product, bit he said that there are often tourists on the flights as , like any country Poland ( as an example) has a lot of stunning places .

Also keeping in mind , they are adding routes , so this becursed Brexit drama , seems not to be affecting their offerings, which are up by one flight from the summer , this coming winter .
Also with better timings , and I'm sure while not common , you could in theory pickup a dirt cheap flight to Warsaw then take advantage of connections to , ' city break or tourist destinations' not offered unless you travel to London or Dublin .

Ok granted such pax could be counted on one hand , but Wizz would not be introducing routes like Moldova , which I'm not certain there is a huge Moldovan local population.
So it is clearly a Tourist choice as per the DSA announcement, repleat with colourful photos of stunning city scenes !.

[MDS]

Respectfully, recently DSA themselves have begun to market routes like Timisoara, as ' a tourist destination'.
Also we are still stuck in the mindset that everyone on a Wizz flight is a migrant. But ironically I was chatting to a local Polish friend , who thinks ( naturally) Wizz is a great product, bit he said that there are often tourists on the flights as , like any country Poland ( as an example) has a lot of stunning places .

Also keeping in mind , they are adding routes , so this becursed Brexit drama , seems not to be affecting their offerings, which are up by one flight from the summer , this coming winter .
Also with better timings , and I'm sure while not common , you could in theory pickup a dirt cheap flight to Warsaw then take advantage of connections to , ' city break or tourist destinations' not offered unless you travel to London or Dublin .

Ok granted such pax could be counted on one hand , but Wizz would not be introducing routes like Moldova , which I'm not certain there is a huge Moldovan local population.
So it is clearly a Tourist choice as per the DSA announcement, repleat with colourful photos of stunning city scenes !.

My comment definitely wasn't meant in a derogatory sense, rather just an analysis of their primary target market for business purposes, as reflected by their less suitable timings into certain destinations (eg. getting picked up by a relative on the other side late at night)

Destinations in Poland such as Krakow are definitely becoming city break destinations (as per Jet2 from LBA) and it would be nice to see less explored destinations become more attractive to the local tourist market as they broaden their horizons. More people overall = more flights, which is the best outcome after all. :)

KRK, WAW, BUD, and even KIV are great opportunities with well known cities in hopefully stimulating city break holidays from DSA.

[AirportPlanner1]

Destinations in Poland such as Krakow are definitely becoming city break destinations (as per Jet2 from LBA)

Becoming? Krakow (and Budapest, Prague) have been city break destinations for best part of a quarter of a century. Even the likes of Gdansk following in their trail have been recognised some time! When I flew to/from Krakow shortly after EU entry probably 80% or more of pax were British. I have admittedly also seen other flights board (eg Szczecin) where I don’t think a single person was British.

[egcntristar]

Wizz have started to release Summer 2020 flights, so far its looking static which is good news in view of the nations impending Euro doom..

GDN 5 x weekly
KTW 5 x weekly
KRK 3 x weekly
POZ 3 x weekly
WAW 4 x weekly
WRO 2 x weekly

[Alwayslistening]

Wizz have started to release Summer 2020 flights, so far its looking static which is good news in view of the nations impending Euro doom..

GDN 5 x weekly
KTW 5 x weekly
KRK 3 x weekly
POZ 3 x weekly
WAW 4 x weekly
WRO 2 x weekly

Hmmm. Well I would hope this isn’t the full schedule as that’s quite a dramatic decrease from the coming winter let alone this summer!!!!!

Unless that is the schedule for the Hungarian fleet and there are more announcements pending.. Wizz UK fleet...

[egcntristar]

Wizz have started to release Summer 2020 flights, so far its looking static which is good news in view of the nations impending Euro doom..

GDN 5 x weekly
KTW 5 x weekly
KRK 3 x weekly
POZ 3 x weekly
WAW 4 x weekly
WRO 2 x weekly

Further uploaded flights, which means a nice little increase in footfall year on year.

BUD 2 x weekly
DEB 2 x weekly
RIX 3 x weekly
VNO 3 x weekly
KIV 2 x weekly
OTP 5 x weekly
CLJ 3 x weekly
TSR 2 x weekly

[Alwayslistening]

Further uploaded flights, which means a nice little increase in footfall year on year.

BUD 2 x weekly
DEB 2 x weekly
RIX 3 x weekly
VNO 3 x weekly
KIV 2 x weekly
OTP 5 x weekly
CLJ 3 x weekly
TSR 2 x weekly

Thats good to see at least!!!! Still nothing on any sort of replacement on the Flybe routes - I did hear they may be back with jets next summer but I doubt it.

Certainly seems to be a gap for someone to exploit tho..

[stevelincoln]

So thats it for Flybe at Doncaster Sheffield then. I have seen on social media that they are now withdrawing all routes from DSF on Saturday 26th October. I will be sad to see them go

[LBIA]

Posted elsewhere that Flybe have confirmed today that it's withdrawing all services from DSA as of October 26th, 2019.
This includes the planned winter flights to Amsterdam & Belfast City which have being on sale since the base closure announcement earlier this summer.
​​​​
​​​

[TimmyW]

Posted elsewhere that Flybe have confirmed today that it's withdrawing all services from DSA as of October 26th, 2019.
This includes the planned winter flights to Amsterdam & Belfast City routes which have being sale since the base closure announcement earlier this summer.
​​​​
​​​
Gone for good I expect now. Who else is realistically going to pick up these lost routes?

[brian_dromey]

Gone for good I expect now. Who else is realistically going to pick up these lost routes?

Maybe Aer Lingus Regional (Stobart/Connect) for DUB?

[MDS]

Maybe Aer Lingus Regional (Stobart/Connect) for DUB?

RYR would be prime as EI tried DUB as recently as 2015.

Either would be nice though.

[Alwayslistening]

Gone for good I expect now. Who else is realistically going to pick up these lost routes?

"From a DSA perspective, the Amsterdam and Belfast routes have proved popular with a 25 per cent increase in passenger numbers over the summer versus last year, with near full aircraft.

"We look forward to another strong year for Doncaster Sheffield Airport, thanks to our continuing partnerships with our growing airlines Wizz Air and TUI."

Seems as if the connect airways “master plan” is starting to be implemented with the “Flybe” flights being pulled back to ultimate serve Virgins needs ie feed traffic to LHR/MAN. Makes no sense for virgin to operate out of Doncaster and they evidently have no plan to ever provide feed traffic as per their recent LHR announcement.

I still fail to see what Stobart have gotten out of the connect airways arrangement, so far just taking over Isle of Man with two ATRs...

Flybe have proved there is demand at DSA for a variety of routes. It just needs to be operated by a company that sees value in being here and actually has competent management to enact a strategy.

[Alteagod]

LM might take over the DSA from BHD or to BHD etc

[CabinCrewe]

Was it a case of BE - use it or lose it? Noone used them (enough) and you lost it?

[PDXCWL45]

I still fail to see what Stobart have gotten out of the connect airways arrangement, so far just taking over Isle of Man with two ATRs...
Maybe in the long run they will takeover the regional part?

[Cazza_fly]

Was it a case of BE - use it or lose it? Noone used them (enough) and you lost it?

With some of the consistent highest load-factors on the network, i'd say that is not the case.

[ExpectmorePayless]

AMS could be KL or EZY.
KL operated before to Sheffield City airport using F50 so will know the loads and revenue they can expect on such a route.
They already operate to Leeds and Humberside, but it might offer additional feed to their hub network. Smallest aircraft is now E175.

EZY could operate A319 from their AMS base, however the aircraft might be a little too big for the market.

[MDS]

Ideally I'd love to see FR for DUB, AGP, and ALC, with KL for AMS.

KL does rather well at Humberside, and can bring in a lot of business and VFR pax for onward destinations from AMS. If they can make HUY, MME, NWI work on multiple daily frequencies, I have no doubt they could do the same at DSA.

Load factors for BE routes were always high, but it depends on the overall yield they were generating. Airlines with a lower cost base (eg. FR) could certainly make some of those routes work I'm sure. FR has bases in DUB, AGP, ALC, FAO, PMI, BCN etc. and could possibly make a NCL style situation work without needing to base crew or aircraft at Doncaster.

Could sound like pie in the sky though.

[mmeteesside]

KLM tried Liverpool alongside Manchester not too long ago with a predictable result.

[BACsuperVC10]

KLM tried Liverpool alongside Manchester not too long ago with a predictable result.

KLM were doing well from Liverpool and increased from 3 to 4 per day, that's until Easyjet saw them off.

[AirportPlanner1]

Big announcement tomorrow, according to Caroline Flint on C4 News

[TimmyW]

TUI 4th based aircraft

[egcntristar]

Very good and unexpected news, they are putting their money where their mouth is. Should nicely offset the Flybe exit.

A quick search is showing FUE as a new destination weekly and the return of HER weekly.

AYT increases from 1 to 3 weekly
DLM from 2 to 5 weekly
ACE from 2 to 3 weekly
TFS from 2 to 3 weekly
AGP from 2 to 3 weekly
IBZ from 1 to 2 weekly
LCA from 1 to 2 weekly
ZTH from 2 to 3 weekly

[pug]

Lauda to PMI too?

[MDS]

Good news with TUI.

Source on Lauda?

[davidjpowell]

Very good and unexpected news, they are putting their money where their mouth is. Should nicely offset the Flybe exit.

A quick search is showing FUE as a new destination weekly and the return of HER weekly.

AYT increases from 1 to 3 weekly
DLM from 2 to 5 weekly
ACE from 2 to 3 weekly
TFS from 2 to 3 weekly
AGP from 2 to 3 weekly
IBZ from 1 to 2 weekly
LCA from 1 to 2 weekly
ZTH from 2 to 3 weekly
Business routes now bucket and spade. Not ideal.

[bad bear]

it might be an error, but, the flight radar 24 departures for Doncaster shows only 5-7 departures per day this week and the Wednesday shows one flight pre 7 am and the rest around 10 pm.... is the airport dead?
bb

[SWBKCB]

it might be an error, but, the flight radar 24 departures for Doncaster shows only 5-7 departures per day this week and the Wednesday shows one flight pre 7 am and the rest around 10 pm.... is the airport dead?
bb

No, hibernating. With Flybe gone, that sounds about right. Early November, quietest time of the year. Just look around the other regional airports.

[TimmyW]

Very good and unexpected news, they are putting their money where their mouth is. Should nicely offset the Flybe exit.

A quick search is showing FUE as a new destination weekly and the return of HER weekly.

AYT increases from 1 to 3 weekly
DLM from 2 to 5 weekly
ACE from 2 to 3 weekly
TFS from 2 to 3 weekly
AGP from 2 to 3 weekly
IBZ from 1 to 2 weekly
LCA from 1 to 2 weekly
ZTH from 2 to 3 weekly

These are only for 2020, back down to usual frequency for 2021.

Landside Subway and WH Smiths have also shut up shop. Not sure if this is just for winter, or for good.

[TimmyW]

it might be an error, but, the flight radar 24 departures for Doncaster shows only 5-7 departures per day this week and the Wednesday shows one flight pre 7 am and the rest around 10 pm.... is the airport dead?
bb

Not dead, but the next few years will be a massive struggle unless something can be pulled out of the bag.

[Yeehaw22]

These are only for 2020, back down to usual frequency for 2021.


I wouldnt bank on that just yet. They dont release the full schedule this early. More gets added later.

[ROC10]

I wouldnt bank on that just yet. They dont release the full schedule this early. More gets added later.

I agree, it wouldn’t make sense for them to cut all this additional capacity in S21. DSA never had TCX flights so it’s not like S20 is just to cover for that, although they may be trying to mop up customers from MAN/LBA/BHX etc. I’d imagine more will be added unless they feel they’ve gone too far and want to scale back, but surely if that was the case they would cut for S20 too...

DSA is also one of their main bases, seeing far more flights than would be expected based on the size of the airport, especially compared to some of their bases at much bigger airports. As I said, this may be making them think they’ve gone too far with the expansion but considering they have virtually no competition at DSA, it would seem silly to reduce their offering.

[Strakur]

I couldn’t see that this has been mentioned (sorry if it has).

The new flights to Chisinau have been cancelled from DSA. My flights got changed to ridiculous replacements at LTN. I didn’t even get an email, I just happened to notice. Wizz are terrible at doing stuff like this.

[egcntristar]

These are only for 2020, back down to usual frequency for 2021.

Landside Subway and WH Smiths have also shut up shop. Not sure if this is just for winter, or for good.

Says who? They have only just added the S20 extra capacity so S21 extra capacity won't probably be sourced until next year. Rather than reaching for your sword every time to spread misinformation take a step back, I know its hard for you as you wait on tenterhooks for the slightest chink in the armour and take pleasure in negativity.

[LGS6753]

One of the pleasures of reading this thread is the relentless negativity of TimmyW.

[rpmac]

Or on the spot reporting

[egcntristar]

AMP/logistics development approved which could number 4,300 jobs, part of the overall site masterplan.

Article link (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/business/around-4-300-jobs-are-set-to-be-created-at-new-doncaster-sheffield-airport-development-1-10103739/amp)

[N707ZS]

Looks very similar to one of the plans they tried to float at Teesside or DTVA when they owned it.

[SWBKCB]

Doncaster Sheffield Airport (DSA) is pleased to announce TUI’s expansion at DSA will be further accelerated with the addition of an extra aircraft operating from the airport for its winter 2020/21 programme launched today.


Robert Hough CBE, Chairman of Doncaster Sheffield Airport, said: “The addition of Cape Verde as a new route announced in TUI’s winter 2020 programme, is great news for Doncaster Sheffield Airport. With this latest expansion, together with flights to Sanford, Florida and Cancun, Mexico, we are truly the home of long-haul in Yorkshire.

TUI accelerates expansion at Doncaster Sheffield Airport (http://flydsa.co.uk/latest-news/tui-winter-expansion/)

[G-FORZ]

Smart move from TUI, their commitment may just about keep any initiative Peel may have had to entice Easy Holidays on the back burner.

[ROC10]

Good news for the airport! They’re really emphasising the idea that Cape Verde is long-haul. On the other hand, TUI class it as medium-haul and it will almost certainly be on the 737.

[easyflyer83]

Smart move from TUI, their commitment may just about keep any initiative Peel may have had to entice Easy Holidays on the back burner.

easyJet holidays are merely holidays sold on easyJet’s existing network. I personally don’t foresee any new bases or flights from DSA explicitly off the back of the holidays business.

[G-FORZ]

easyJet holidays are merely holidays sold on easyJet’s existing network. I personally don’t foresee any new bases or flights from DSA explicitly off the back of the holidays business.
That would I believe understate the knowledge, experience and previous achievements of TUI’s ex management who we’re given to believe are about to launch an assault on the IT market with Easy’s Holiday business.

[easyflyer83]

That would I believe understate the knowledge, experience and previous achievements of TUI’s ex management who we’re given to believe are about to launch an assault on the IT market with Easy’s Holiday business.

Its true that Ex TUI bods have been recruited to launch that side of the business but as things stand I don’t foresee easyJet returning to DSA specifically because of easyJet holidays. I’m not saying easyJet wouldn’t launch DSA flights but they would be additions to the airline network with holidays simply sold on those flights.

[egcntristar]

Great to see the extra winter based aircraft, which in addition to new destination allows 10/12 night options to the Canaries destinations. Good also to see Cancun starting earlier in March 2021 so forward bookings must be good for 2020.

Also the car park will be expanded southwards of the terminal next year and plans are afoot for another hotel.

[TartinTon]

Good also to see Cancun starting earlier in March 2021 so forward bookings must be good for 2020.

Probably due to Easter?

[TimmyW]

Wizz have just cut the Budapest route.

That's 3 lost Wizz routes in the last couple of months. Worrying.

[SWBKCB]

Wizz have just cut the Budapest route.

That's 3 lost Wizz routes in the last couple of months. Worrying.

You've been a worried man for a long time, Timmy! Weren't they pulling out moving to MAN in 2012?

[TimmyW]

2012 is irrelevant. What is concerning now at the huge loss of routes over the last few months at DSA. Whatever the reason, it hardly gives confidence for the future of the airport to operate passenger services.

The airport haven't managed to replace any of the lost FlyBe or Wizz routes. Ask yourself why.

Yet all they talk about is their huge growth etc etc. That will look pretty stupid, when they are back down to 600k passengers again.

[egcntristar]

Timmy, bore off. As SWBKCB said what happened to all your previous trolling doom predictions.

Two flights a week to Chisinau won't happen as there is surprisingly no local market for Moldova and Wizz probably found a more lucrative route for the aircraft doing the two flights to Budapest - they will probably replace them with other routes. Disappointing but not a massive loss considering the new 2nd based TUI for the winter and new 4th based TUI for summer that you have conveniently forgotten about. They will happily put your doom prediction to bed and see the airport on or above 1.3 million passengers again.

B- for effort, try harder next time.

[TimmyW]

If there's no market, then why announce the route?
The loss of routes is massive. 3 from Wizz plus the FlybE ones, with zero chance of them being replaced.

The TUI expansion is by no means certain, given they don't have enough aircraft to operate their summer programme.

[egcntristar]

You really are a troll, of course TUI will have capacity which will come from various sources. They know a lot more than you about running a business.

Before spreading unsubstantiated rumours about TUI (as obviously you will be working in the fleet department) do you want to share some proof?

Chisinau was probably announced to cover Iasi and its surrounding area and it didn't work out as planned.

[BACsuperVC10]

You've been a worried man for a long time, Timmy! Weren't they pulling out moving to MAN in 2012?

I think Wizz are pretty well established at Doncaster and Liverpool for their North of England ops.

[Severn]

Even with BUD dropped from March, Wizz will operate 39x weekly flights over 12x routes from DSA in August 2020, pretty impressive given LBAs RYR base will now only see 56x weekly flights over 14x routes next August due to cuts.

In August 2020, the weekly Wizz schedule from DSA (and competition from neighbouring airports) will be as follows:

Poland - 22x weekly
GDN - 5x weekly (LBA - 4x weekly with RYR)
KTW - 5x weekly
WAW - 4x weekly (LBA - 2x weekly to WMI with RYR / EMA - 2x weekly to WMI with RYR)
KRK - 3x weekly (LBA - 3x weekly with RYR & 2x weekly with EXS / EMA - 3x weekly with RYR)
POZ - 3x weekly
WRO - 2x weekly (LBA - 2x weekly with RYR / EMA - 4x weekly with RYR)

Romania - 9x weekly
OTP - 4x weekly
CLJ - 3x weekly
TSR - 2x weekly

Latvia - 3x weekly
RIX - 3x weekly (LBA - Route cancelled by RYR / EMA - 3x weekly with RYR)

Lithuania - 3x weekly
VNO - 3x weekly (LBA - Route cancelled by RYR)

Hungary - 2x weekly
DEB - 2x weekly
BUD - Cancelled (LBA - 2x weekly with EXS / EMA - 3x weekly with RYR)

[TimmyW]

Even with BUD dropped from March, Wizz will operate 39x weekly flights over 12x routes from DSA in August 2020, pretty impressive given LBAs RYR base will now only see 56x weekly flights over 14x routes next August due to cuts.

In August 2020, the weekly Wizz schedule from DSA (and competition from neighbouring airports) will be as follows:

Poland - 22x weekly
GDN - 5x weekly (LBA - 4x weekly with RYR)
KTW - 5x weekly
WAW - 4x weekly (LBA - 2x weekly to WMI with RYR / EMA - 2x weekly to WMI with RYR)
KRK - 3x weekly (LBA - 3x weekly with RYR & 2x weekly with EXS / EMA - 3x weekly with RYR)
POZ - 3x weekly
WRO - 2x weekly (LBA - 2x weekly with RYR / EMA - 4x weekly with RYR)

Romania - 9x weekly
OTP - 4x weekly
CLJ - 3x weekly
TSR - 2x weekly

Latvia - 3x weekly
RIX - 3x weekly (LBA - Route cancelled by RYR / EMA - 3x weekly with RYR)

Lithuania - 3x weekly
VNO - 3x weekly (LBA - Route cancelled by RYR)

Hungary - 2x weekly
DEB - 2x weekly
BUD - Cancelled (LBA - 2x weekly with EXS / EMA - 3x weekly with RYR)



Not sure DSA will survive the next few months as flights are cancelled.

[N707ZS]

Always doom from TimmyW

[TimmyW]

Always doom from TimmyW

As airlines scale back and flights are cancelled, how else do you see it panning out?

[egcntristar]

Not sure DSA will survive the next few months as flights are cancelled.

Self isolation is the key troll. DSA will be fine European workers will continue to use the Wizz flights. You prophesised failure after Flybe went and the airport has been fine, same after the max debacle with the same outcome again.

[TimmyW]

Self isolation is the key troll. DSA will be fine European workers will continue to use the Wizz flights. You prophesised failure after Flybe went and the airport has been fine, same after the max debacle with the same outcome again.
You clearly can't see the implications.

Even before today's flight groundings Wizz have drastically reduced their original schedule at DSA. As the situation worsens and more flights are cancelled, who's going to keep the airport running? And how long until consumer confidence returns?

Airports with a large route network will survive, those like DSA with only a few flights per day on a good day will struggle to come back from this.

[davidjohnson6]

At the very worst case, many of the staff at DSA can be laid off and the doors closed while coronavirus runs its course.
Much as I hate to say it, the value of an airport lies in its built infrastructure rather than the employees. Even if Peel go bankrupt, there will be a time in maybe 2022 when somebody decides to buy the airport from the insolvency practitioner. This is not Ciudad Real - there is a real and sizeable population nearby that want to fly.

The whole coronavirus thing will eventually pass - even if it means waiting 18 months for a vaccine. The 1918 flu epidemic passed and the world economy recovered
The collection of terminal, runway, equipment and road connection is simply too valuable for it to be abandoned forever

[egcntristar]

Timmy you clearly don't see the overall UK industry long term picture.

All airports are in the same boat. The bigger they are the harder they will fall especially short term those that rely on Jet2 med flights after today's news. Those that relied on Flybe will take a double hit. I don't see you doomongering on any other thread.

[TimmyW]

Timmy you clearly don't see the overall UK industry long term picture.

All airports are in the same boat. The bigger they are the harder they will fall especially short term those that rely on Jet2 med flights after today's news. Those that relied on Flybe will take a double hit. I don't see you doomongering on any other thread.


The government will step in to help larger airports. Wizz had already significantly cut back their schedule at DSA before today's news.

Once airlines regroup, they will focus on larger hubs and airports, not small regionals.

[TimmyW]

Timmy you clearly don't see the overall UK industry long term picture.

All airports are in the same boat. The bigger they are the harder they will fall especially short term those that rely on Jet2 med flights after today's news. Those that relied on Flybe will take a double hit. I don't see you doomongering on any other thread.


The government will step in to help larger airports. Wizz had already significantly cut back their schedule at DSA before today's news.

Once airlines regroup, they will focus on larger hubs and airports, not small regionals.

[SWBKCB]

There's a commonly held misconception on these forums that if you repeat something often enough it will actually come true.

[egcntristar]

The government will step in to help larger airports. Wizz had already significantly cut back their schedule at DSA before today's news.

Once airlines regroup, they will focus on larger hubs and airports, not small regionals.

Ultimately, we are thankfully still waiting for one of your prophesies to be correct.

Rather than doomongering and point scoring think of all the employees of airports, airlines and all associated industries and the effects on them.

[DanAir89]

The government will step in to help larger airports. Wizz had already significantly cut back their schedule at DSA before today's news.

Once airlines regroup, they will focus on larger hubs and airports, not small regionals.


not sure what’s been said before, but after Edinburgh Airport announced yesterday that they could have no passengers for 3 months and BA could go bust it seemed perfectly reasonable to suggest that there could be dark times ahead for DSA just as there is for every Airport. Who knows when the summer season will start and how many TUI planes will be based then.....

[ROC10]

not sure what’s been said before, but after Edinburgh Airport announced yesterday that they could have no passengers for 3 months and BA could go bust it seemed perfectly reasonable to suggest that there could be dark times ahead for DSA just as there is for every Airport. Who knows when the summer season will start and how many TUI planes will be based then.....

I agree, not being negative but realistic. It’s almost certain that TUI will need to make significant reductions which will of course impact on DSA. I think even one or two based aircraft would be ambitious at the moment.

[TimmyW]

I agree, not being negative but realistic. It’s almost certain that TUI will need to make significant reductions which will of course impact on DSA. I think even one or two based aircraft would be ambitious at the moment.
If they close the base, then the airport would not be viable as a commercial concern.

[ROC10]

If they close the base, then the airport would not be viable as a commercial concern.

True and the same can possibly be said for the likes of EXT/CWL/BOH/NWI.

As mentioned, even EDI (large airport who don't rely largely on any one airline) are expecting massive consequences.

[Davidiansmith]

True and the same can possibly be said for the likes of EXT/CWL/BOH/NWI.

As mentioned, even EDI (large airport who don't rely largely on any one airline) are expecting massive consequences.

Seems to be a lot of people wanting this place to fail.

I work at the airport, and I can say after the last few days we are all expecting the worse. The management are usually very positive but even they believe this will be the final straw.

​​​​​Very sad, but I guess this is an unprecedented situation.

[ROC10]

Seems to be a lot of people wanting this place to fail.

I work at the airport, and I can say after the last few days we are all expecting the worse. The management are usually very positive but even they believe this will be the final straw.

​​​​​Very sad, but I guess this is an unprecedented situation.

Of course I don’t want the airport to fail...

Posting about the reality of the situation doesn’t mean I want it to happen.

[SealinkBF]

Seems to be a lot of people wanting this place to fail.

I work at the airport, and I can say after the last few days we are all expecting the worse. The management are usually very positive but even they believe this will be the final straw.

​​​​​Very sad, but I guess this is an unprecedented situation.

Best of luck.

[Buster the Bear]

Cargo will still be flown, probably on passenger aircraft, simply as the freight capacity being decimated from passenger airline cancellations.

[SotonFlightpath]

so, so sorry to hear this - it's truly awful. I'm sure that unfortunately a similar situation will happen at many of our regional airports. I'm just a passenger (mainly at SOU), so for me it's just an inconvenience, for the guys involved in keeping these airports running over the last few years I'd like to say a huge 'thank you', and my thoughts are with you. Good luck to every one and let's hope for better news soon.

[ericlday]

Wizz 803 (G WUKI) Positioning in from Luton........is this to operate a flight or storage ?

[nowhereasfiled]

Wizz 803 (G WUKI) Positioning in from Luton........is this to operate a flight or storage ?

Joining KK and KH for storage.

[davidjpowell]

The majority of staff have now been put on leave. We've been told to think of ourselves and find alternative employment if we can.

All of the food and drink outlets have closed, terminal is being prepared to be moth balled and a security firm coming in to look after the place for the short term.

The odd flight is still scheduled to operate, and some staff will be paid an hourly rate for the time needed to cover these flights.

Not sure what the long term plan is at this stage.

the airport has said elsewhere.

We'd like to clarify the situation re this forum post. We can confirm the Aviation industry globally is facing significant challenges and we are currently working hard on our business continuity plans with our people are at the forefront of those plans. The terminal building and runway are fully operational. As per our statement yesterday, there has been disruption to flights at DSA - as is the case at all UK Airports but none of the Airport's staff have been put on leave. Furthermore, there is no member of staff across the airport with the name of the forum contributor. Please follow our official social media channels for updates.

[BACsuperVC10]

Seems to be a lot of people wanting this place to fail.

I work at the airport, and I can say after the last few days we are all expecting the worse. The management are usually very positive but even they believe this will be the final straw.

​​​​​Very sad, but I guess this is an unprecedented situation.

Its very depressing people throwing doom at this airport so frequently .

[LTNman]

Flight radar 24 is showing a Magma 747 heading into Doncaster. Would this be correct?

[egcntristar]

Flight radar 24 is showing a Magma 747 heading into Doncaster. Would this be correct?

Yes, there is a 3 x weekly freight service covered by Magma/Astral 747 and WGA MD11.

[davidjpowell]

DSA seems to be reasonably busy with it's cargo business, based aircraft and maintenance contractors.

My theory is they will have a lower cost base than the larger airports, and while bleeding from the temporary loss of passengers, it might not be the stab in the heart that other regional airports have suffered, especially with the estate to service the large cargo operators.

[SWBKCB]

Think it's to do with having regular widebody freighters continuing to operate, so had the resources to handle the additional freight traffic whereas many other regional airports didn't

[G-FORZ]

I see current 767F on ground arrival from Almaty. Just out of interest what do we import from Kazakhstan into DSA?

[egcntristar]

I see current 767F on ground arrival from Almaty. Just out of interest what do we import from Kazakhstan into DSA?

Came from Xian with a stop on the way. Lots of recent Russian 777 visitors coming from China via home stops in Moscow.

Also good to see the scheduled cargo services getting a recent permanent frequency uplift.

[davidjpowell]

I see current 767F on ground arrival from Almaty. Just out of interest what do we import from Kazakhstan into DSA?

PPE probably

[Buster the Bear]

UN warehouse I believe close by, storage for humanitarian relief and probable PPE?

[inOban]

I'm sure I read on another thread that these flights actually originate in China but stop in Kazakhstan.

[SWBKCB]

I'm sure I read on another thread that these flights actually originate in China but stop in Kazakhstan.

It was at post #407 above.

[TimmyW]

Good news on the cargo front.

Wish same could be said on the passenger side.

Two wizz routes and one TUI route cut today.

Unfortunately can't see any positives on that side of things for the time being.

[TimmyW]

Good news on the cargo front.

Wish same could be said on the passenger side.

Two wizz routes and one TUI route cut today.

Unfortunately can't see any positives on that side of things for the time being.


Also, seems to be no indication of when will be resuming flights to Doncaster, despite them resuming at other UK airports.

[ericlday]

From Wizz air web site shows Riga 17/21/24/28 June, Vilnius starting 17/6, Gdansk 15/6, All the others start in June, check website for dates.

[TimmyW]

From Wizz air web site shows Riga 17/21/24/28 June, Vilnius starting 17/6, Gdansk 15/6, All the others start in June, check website for dates.
​​​​​They've been on sale for last couple of weeks earlier than that, then the flights don't actually operate

[SWBKCB]

Unfortunately can't see any positives on that side of things for the time being.

Really - there's a shock...

[TimmyW]

Really - there's a shock...


Do you?


​​​​​

[SWBKCB]

Do you?​​​​​

Far too early to tell - but if there is a negative to be found, you'll find it.

[TimmyW]

Far too early to tell - but if there is a negative to be found, you'll find it.

Didn't i say it was positive response regarding cargo?

Not sure how else you can view the loss of routes as anything but negative. Its not like the airport has a large network of routes to start with.

[SeanM1997]

Good news on the cargo front.

Wish same could be said on the passenger side.

Two wizz routes and one TUI route cut today.

Unfortunately can't see any positives on that side of things for the time being.

What was the TUI route cut?

[TimmyW]

Hurghada.

A lot of reductions on rotations for next summer compared to the expansion that was announced a few months ago.

[ATNotts]

Hurghada.

A lot of reductions on rotations for next summer compared to the expansion that was announced a few months ago.

Come on, we haven't had this summer yet, and if you look elsewhere you will see that TUI are going through a major retrenchment at the moment, globally. DSA won't be the only place effected, may not be the worst case effected.

[TimmyW]

Come on, we haven't had this summer yet, and if you look elsewhere you will see that TUI are going through a major retrenchment at the moment, globally. DSA won't be the only place effected, may not be the worst case effected.


I understand that, however DSA has only two operators, one of which reliant on migrant workers, so the demand there is going to be reduced.

Most other airports have the luxury of a lot larger route network and more operators.
​​​​​​
Look at the loss of FlyBe. Eastern have picked up routes at other airports but have avoided Doncaster.

When Doncaster loses routes, they aren't replaced.

Far better for them to focus on the cargo side for the foreseeable. I don't see how the passenger side can be sustained.

[ATNotts]

I understand that, however DSA has only two operators, one of which reliant on migrant workers, so the demand there is going to be reduced.

Most other airports have the luxury of a lot larger route network and more operators.
​​​​​​
Look at the loss of FlyBe. Eastern have picked up routes at other airports but have avoided Doncaster.

When Doncaster loses routes, they aren't replaced.

Far better for them to focus on the cargo side for the foreseeable. I don't see how the passenger side can be sustained.

You may well be right about DSA's long term future, and in that they may be little different to EMA which I feel may struggle with it's heavily leisure orientated offering passengerwise. DSA appears to handle cargo very efficiently, and has gained some interesting operations. It could well become akin to Maastricht, where EMA is more akin to Liege in terms of it's cargo market. I imagine that post Brexit, when trucking stuff in from EU airports will be made a deal more complicated, DSA might hope to pick up the likes of Emirates or Qatar cargo, or even Jordanian or Egyptair who both tend to serve the fruit and veg markets through Oostende.

[davidjpowell]

I understand that, however DSA has only two operators, one of which reliant on migrant workers, so the demand there is going to be reduced.

Most other airports have the luxury of a lot larger route network and more operators.
​​​​​​
Look at the loss of FlyBe. Eastern have picked up routes at other airports but have avoided Doncaster.

When Doncaster loses routes, they aren't replaced.

Far better for them to focus on the cargo side for the foreseeable. I don't see how the passenger side can be sustained.

You never do.

[TimmyW]

You never do.


Just saying it how it is. You can't deny that DSA has a poor record attracting operators and retaining routes.

Who's going to pick up the routes as Wizz and TUI scale back? Why haven't the FlyBe routes been picked up like some have at other airports?

[SWBKCB]

Why haven't the FlyBe routes been picked up like some have at other airports?

Eastern, Blue Island, Loganair have picked up routes from existing bases. Apart from Eastern at SOU (which is re-opening of a base at an airport they already operated from) can't think of any others?

[rpmac]

I have to agree. Every airport is going to struggle to get back anywhere near what it used to handle and DSA will have an uphill fight on its hands. Will the numbers from Eastern Europe still be there in a few years time to support Wizzair, who knows? For DSA the cargo side of things looks like something to build on.

[TimmyW]

The Eastern European workers in Doncaster having been going home in droves since Brexit.
Unless Wizz diversifies its offering to more leisure orientated routes, I can't see them offering the same frequencies to Eastern Europe. The demand simply won't be there.

I think we can forget routes like Amsterdam, Dublin, Belfast etc ever coming back. There's no one who will realistically come in and operate them.

[2Planks]

BBC reporting an Astral 747 left the black bit and is now on the grass at 1455 this afternoon, 14 Jul. 1 diversion to EGNM

[ericlday]

Notam......Q) EGTT/QMRLC/IV/NBO/A/000/999/5329N00100W005
B) FROM: 20/07/14 16:35C) TO: 20/07/15 05:00E) AERODROME CLOSED DUE AIRCRAFT OBSTRUCTION ON RUNWAY

[STN Ramp Rat]

FR24 data suggests that it happened during the turn at the end of the runway at low speed.

[N707ZS]

Have they dragged the 747 off the grass? Amazed Timmy hasn't been on saying this is the end.

[ericlday]

He is at the Airport organising the recovery !!!!!

[Wickerbill]

He is at the Airport organising the recovery !!!!!
Recovered by Air Salvage International, with a little help from local contractors

[Startledgrapefruit]

He is at the Airport organising the recovery !!!!!
Probably ran out in front of it to get the airport in the news

[N707ZS]

Looks like this mornings 747F has gone to East Midlands.

[TimmyW]

Wizz to open a base at DSA this October with new routes to Alicante, Malaga, Faro, Lublin and Larnaca (plus more according to press release)

Great news for DSA.

[JSCL]

Wizz to open a base at DSA this October with new routes to Alicante, Malaga, Faro, Lublin and Larnaca (plus more according to press release)

Great news for DSA.

Without knowing the market there, I assume that would cause some degree of competition for catchment with Jet2 over at LBA?

[SWBKCB]

Yes - presumably Wizz UK? interesting move...

[TimmyW]

Yes - presumably Wizz UK? interesting move...

I think this has been on the cards for a while, and the reason behind the terminal enhancements and extension will be going ahead soon.

[SeanM1997]

Wizz Air UK - one based aircraft - 7 new routes: Larnaca, Lublin, Suceava, Faro, Kosice, Alicante and Malaga

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293842329468633088

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293842856269021185

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293843154190446592

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293843479257391104

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293843761857024002

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293844222769012736

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1293844493154897920

[TimmyW]

Full press release
https://flydsa.co.uk/latest-news/the-only-way-is-dsa-as-wizz-air-uk-announces-second-uk-base

Also states there is an intention to bring in further aircraft as part of the agreement within a matter of months.

[paully]

Interesting developments. Will certainly give Jet2 a run for their money being situated halfway between their bases of Leeds and East Mids and now easier to get to via the motorways, at much cheaper prices.

[SWBKCB]

Not just LBA and EMA, Newcastle and Teesside will welcome this news like a hole in the head.

[TimmyW]

Interested to see future developments as it sounds like this is just the beginning.

[paully]

Interested to see future developments as it sounds like this is just the beginning.

They started with an expanded Europe sun spots at Luton and I would expect some Canaries stuff for next year at Doncaster as well as an increased offering from their existing base at Liverpool.

[ATNotts]

Full press release
https://flydsa.co.uk/latest-news/the-only-way-is-dsa-as-wizz-air-uk-announces-second-uk-base

Also states there is an intention to bring in further aircraft as part of the agreement within a matter of months.

I wonder how much DSA is paying Wizz UK. The last time they gave sweeteners to an airline it didn't end well (Flybe).

[TimmyW]

Who says they are?

They have a 15-year relationship, and as stated previously, this has been on the cards for a while now.

[SWBKCB]

I wonder how much DSA is paying Wizz UK. The last time they gave sweeteners to an airline it didn't end well (Flybe).

Think you are comparing chalk with cheese - Wizz are in a far better financial position and will know the DSA market well having been there many years. This move will have a lot of people looking over their shoulders.

[jumpseater]

Who says they are?

They have a 15-year relationship, and as stated previously, this has been on the cards for a while now.

OMG, Timmy is now some sort of expert! One wonders why he didn’t mention the negotiations in this post from January.

A quick reminder to his previous trolling. Only one person looking pretty stupid at the moment.


https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/750x825/434e7502_5b13_4bfe_8b12_3b79ed072632_d66a2c332713f957c013ffd 6ab2df45398a10e86.jpeg

[ROC10]

May also be a little unsettling for TUI who have basically held a monopoly on holiday routes at DSA for a while now.

[egcntristar]

Great news for the airport and a 180 from the naysayer.

Interestingly the below article names Tenerife, Barcelona, Prague, and Szczecin which aren't on the list today - genuine mistake or Freudian slip?.

https://airlinergs.com/wizz-air-base-at-doncaster-sheffield-airport-provides-catalyst-for-expansion-and-economic-growthwizz-air-base-at-doncaster-sheffield-airport-provides-catalyst-for-expansion-and-economic-growth/

[TimmyW]

Great news for the airport and a 180 from the naysayer.

Interestingly the below article names Tenerife, Barcelona, Prague, and Szczecin which aren't on the list today - genuine mistake or Freudian slip?.

https://airlinergs.com/wizz-air-base-at-doncaster-sheffield-airport-provides-catalyst-for-expansion-and-economic-growthwizz-air-base-at-doncaster-sheffield-airport-provides-catalyst-for-expansion-and-economic-growth/

The DSA press release states that further aircraft will be added soon, so maybe these are just yet to be announced officially.

[SWBKCB]

It says they go on sale today and that just looks like a cut and paste from a press notice - maybe an early version and there have been late changes?

[egcntristar]

Another slip, this one mentions Tenerife, Barcelona and Prague...

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/business/consumer/low-cost-airline-wizz-air-adds-new-destinations-sheffield-doncaster-airport-it-expands-region-2941170

[TimmyW]

Wizz will base a 2nd aircraft with a further 6 new routes

https://flydsa.co.uk/latest-news/wizz-air-announces-2nd-based-aircraft-and-6-new-routes

[Albert Hall]

Hmmm ... Doncaster to Eindhoven.

Why?

[Alteagod]

Seens the most unlikely city paring.

[flyerguy]

Hmmm ... Doncaster to Eindhoven.

Why?

Offers a quick and easy road connection to Amsterdam City Centre, which is a massive city break destination for U.K. travellers, with wizz already large number of flights out of EIN.

any new destination should be welcome news during these times.

[virginblue]

Hmmm ... Doncaster to Eindhoven.

Why?

As in "we want to cream off the AMS business built up by Flybe but" (make your pick) a) "we cannot get slots at slot-constrained AMS" or b) "we are too stingy to pay AMS fees"

[AirportPlanner1]

Seens the most unlikely city paring.

Its not too strange when you consider the catchment of Eindhoven which is huge and the catchment of DSA. Eindhoven is within about 90 mins of Amsterdam, Antwerp, Brussels, Dusseldorf, Maastricht, Rotterdam.

[G-FORZ]

Maybe a good City route for its connectivity but Sunday and Wednesday only and early afternoon is Going to limit its practicality

[OC37]

Its not too strange when you consider the catchment of Eindhoven which is huge and the catchment of DSA. Eindhoven is within about 90 mins of Amsterdam, Antwerp, Brussels, Dusseldorf, Maastricht, Rotterdam.

That sounds about the same logic as Ryanair's early logic of "Let's fly people to the middle of nowhere where nobody actually wants to travel to"!

[southside bobby]

Certainly works/worked for Ryanair...

[AirportPlanner1]

That sounds about the same logic as Ryanair's early logic of "Let's fly people to the middle of nowhere where nobody actually wants to travel to"!

Yes but Eindhoven, an actual city with a regular Champions League team and which is home to a huge multinational in Phillips as well as a lot of other industry and with an airport that already serves a number of destinations, is a somewhat different proposition to say Skavsta or Hahn which previously had almost nothing.

[OC37]

Yes but Eindhoven, an actual city with a regular Champions League team and which is home to a huge multinational in Phillips as well as a lot of other industry and with an airport that already serves a number of destinations, is a somewhat different proposition to say Skavsta or Hahn which previously had almost nothing.

So shall Doncaster Rovers be playing PSV Eindhoven anytime soon?

Eindhoven is a loco and holiday charter airport, pretty much people fly from Eindhoven to take a nice holiday and not to travel to Eindhovem, not even KLM are interested in serving it, roll on Costa del Doncaster!

[MDS]

So shall Doncaster Rovers be playing PSV Eindhoven anytime soon?

Eindhoven is a loco and holiday charter airport, pretty much people fly from Eindhoven to take a nice holiday and not to travel to Eindhovem, not even KLM are interested in serving it, roll on Costa del Doncaster!

KLM focuses on their bread and butter - Amsterdam. Similar to why BA doesn't fly to Birmingham or Stansted for example.

Wizz also serves Eindhoven with a couple of dozen routes already which makes it easier for them to fly there.

I think the Canary routes are a great move, although I'm not too sure EIN will be a big hit. I don't think there's many VFR or business pax in either direction (unless I'm missing something) and I agree that Amsterdam city itself is quite far (and expensive to get there from Eindhoven airport).

[ATNotts]

KLM focuses on their bread and butter - Amsterdam. Similar to why BA doesn't fly to Birmingham or Stansted for example.

Wizz also serves Eindhoven with a couple of dozen routes already which makes it easier for them to fly there.

I think the Canary routes are a great move, although I'm not too sure EIN will be a big hit. I don't think there's many VFR or business pax in either direction (unless I'm missing something) and I agree that Amsterdam city itself is quite far (and expensive to get there from Eindhoven airport).

Not that so many people holiday in such areas, but Eindhoven isn't so far from Maastricht (an excellent city break destination) and the South Limburg area of the Netherlands which is just about the most undulating part of the country, very picturesque and contains attractions such as Valkenburg and the ZLSM preserved railway, both of which are worth a visit. Further afield is the Ardenne in Belgium, and the Eifel in Germany, again both very much under rated tourist areas. If it weren't for the fact that we prefer to drive to the region, living where I do, DSA/EIN would be attractive.

Job to do for some tourist bodies in The Netherlands, Germany and Belgium methinks.

[richardwpprn]

KLM focuses on their bread and butter - Amsterdam. Similar to why BA doesn't fly to....Stansted for example....

BACF have operated lots of flights to Stansted last summer and winter. When you have lots of planes you utilise them when you can.

[OC37]

KLM focuses on their bread and butter - Amsterdam. Similar to why BA doesn't fly to Birmingham or Stansted for example.

BA might not do STN, the same as they don't do LTN, because they already operate to/from three LON airports.

KLM Cityhopper and/or KLM Exel targeted such regional airports as EIN, GRQ, MST & RTM when they operated an appropriately sized puddle-jumper fleet of 50 seats or less, nowadays operating a fleet with their smallest sized aircraft being some 88 seats the regional airports, in KLM's apparent opinion, are no longer viable.

[davidjohnson6]

KLM offer plenty of flights from Eindhoven under the brand of Transavia - focussed very heavily on taking Dutch residents on holiday
Ryanair have a sizeable operation, again focussed on taking people to holiday destinations
TUI seem to do the same thing

Wizz run a lot of routes from Eindhoven to Eastern Europe.

Neither airport has a huge inbound tourism draw. Neither serves a major (and wealthy) city within short travel time.
I cannot see particularly strong corporate/trade links between south Yorkshire and Eindhoven
Unless there is a desperate need to rotate aircraft around bases for maintenance, I am stumped as to why they think Doncaster-Eindhoven will possibly work.

[OC37]

KLM offer plenty of flights from Eindhoven under the brand of Transavia

That is alike suggesting that BA offered plenty of flights from STN under the brand of GO, that TATA cars are coomonplace upon British streets, just that they're called Jaguars and/or Land Rovers etc.

I just happened to work for Transavia on a detachment for 6 months, at that time they were 95% owned by KLM, totally different companies, KLM were merely the shareholders that needed to be answered to whilst Transavia operated as a totally stand-alone operation, with the sole exception of their SPL/LGW/SPL route Transavia were solely holiday charters whilst KLM were solely scheduled services whilst Martinair were solely cargo whilst the handling agent(s) in the group were independent handling agents.

[SWBKCB]

So endless fascination over "why Eindhoven?" (nice short, cheap sector between two "known" airports, keeps the a/c busy between long sectors), but no real discussion of the impact on all the major players north of BHX (airports and airlines) of a second unit being introduced within two weeks?

I bet having another Wizz tank parked on the lawn so quickly is grabbing some attention

[OC37]

So endless fascination over "why Eindhoven?" (nice short, cheap sector between two "known" airports, keeps the a/c busy between long sectors), but no real discussion of the impact on all the major players north of BHX (airports and airlines) of a second unit being introduced within two weeks?

I bet having another Wizz tank parked on the lawn so quickly is grabbing some attention

Somewhat bemusing that they are starting, not one but, all four Canaries routes in one roll of the dice, how many people actually care which island they holiday in so long as the price is right and they can fly from their local airport, now it shall likely be "Which Canary Island would you like to go to dear, Ip, Dip, Sky or Blue?" thus operating four aircraft partly loaded rather than one or two aircraft fully loaded.

Regarding the EIN route it has to be something to do with either swapping aircraft, loco's seem incapable of achieving that away from a main operating base by operating aircraft W patterns, or they have a few hours to spare so let's squeeze blood out of a stone than applying some down time maintenance for the aircraft.

[SWBKCB]

Regarding the EIN route it has to be something to do with either swapping aircraft,

It's a Wizz UK operation, not Wizz mainstream?

they have a few hours to spare so let's squeeze blood out of a stone than applying some down time maintenance for the aircraft.

think the modern phrase is 'making best use of expensive assetts' - it's how LCC's make money! :ok:

[OC37]

It's a Wizz UK operation, not Wizz mainstream?

And where is Wizz UK's maintenance base for B checks and above, at which UK airport?

think the modern phrase is 'making best use of expensive assetts' - it's how LCC's make money! :ok:

All mechanical appliances need some TLC from time time, to neglect aircraft of maintenance is a false economy.

[Alwayslistening]

So many experts on here as usual. “DSA are useless don’t fly to any destinations” -Announces new destinations- “DSA and Wizz are rubbish, why are they flying there” YAWN

This is excellent news, Wizz won’t stop at two based aircraft.

[Buster the Bear]

No doubt nice start up subsidies from Eindhoven and Doncaster.

[OC37]

So many experts on here as usual. “DSA are useless don’t fly to any destinations” -Announces new destinations- “DSA and Wizz are rubbish, why are they flying there” YAWN

This is excellent news, Wizz won’t stop at two based aircraft.

I guess that you've never heard the true story of the time a certain airline based in Hungary employed a Captain and without so much as a simulator check scheduled him for flying duties, on his first outing soon after airborne he decided for himself that he was incapacitated and declared a MAYDAY, the First Officer took conrol landing back in BUD not just saving the day but saving all the passengers also.

And not a mention of the word "rubbish", there's some mighty fine First Officers out there!

[TimmyW]

Ten of the thirteen new routes have been put back to mid December starts, although in reality I doubt the base will get into full swing until restrictions are lifted, which could be a long long time yet.

Also, with the last TUI flights this month, there will only be a handful of weekly departures with the current schedule. I'm not sure how feasible it is keeping the terminal running through the winter on that schedule.

[egcntristar]

It will be feasible the same way they managed this summer.

Stop reading the S** and listening to Talkradio.

[MARKEYD]

Have to ask but is “ TimmyW “ related to “ RW20 “ from
Southampton ?
You sound just like his little brother !!!

[BA318]

And where is Wizz UK's maintenance base for B checks and above, at which UK airport?



All mechanical appliances need some TLC from time time, to neglect aircraft of maintenance is a false economy.

Plenty of airlines don’t carry out maintenance in their home country. BA carries out A380 work in Manila! There are loads more examples.

[TimmyW]

It will be feasible the same way they managed this summer.

Stop reading the S** and listening to Talkradio.
You mean when the terminal was closed?

[egcntristar]

You mean when the terminal was closed?

You can read then.

If it needs to be closed it will be on certain days, if not it won't. It will be a business decision again same as every other airport.

[TimmyW]

A lot will depend on what this government task force will do. Anything other than loosening restrictions will mean another very tough year in 2021. Unfortunately, I see next summer being pretty much identical to this

[pug]

You keep saying this, but the Covid issue is so fluid that actions of the past 7 months have purely been reactionary risk mitigation due to lack of knowledge. Restrictions simply cannot continue indefinitely, not just for the sake of the aviation industry but the economy and wellbeing of the population in general.

Assuming a vaccine isn’t forthcoming, then depending on the continued virulence of Covid, more cost effective and rapid testing is likely to be a high focus for development.

Hoping for positive developments next year with a return to growth generally by Summer 21. Wizzair U.K. are good to go and simply waiting for a relaxation in restrictions.

[G-FORZ]

TimmyW can you just stop being so pessimistic

[TimmyW]

Testing at airports would be a big help but unfortunately the cost factor would not be appealing to the majority.

[pug]

You’re making judgements based on cost per head as of now - and credited your source as the Sun! Tests are in development to reduce both the cost and time to result. I find it hard to believe that movement will not have happened on this before next summer, given the incentives to do so.. Not to mention that history tells us pandemics do have a shelf life, one way or another this will pass.

My concerns longer term are how the Government are likely to confront climate change and the fallout from brexit. Perhaps the apparent reluctance to offer assurance to airlines is borne out of these factors..