View Full Version : Hong Kong Airlines A350
Below the glide
1st Sep 2017, 13:24
The first of many A350's arrived in HKG today. Looked actually very good in their livery.
Well done HKA, crew sounded as a delivery crew.
LongTimeInCX
2nd Sep 2017, 11:58
crew sounded as a delivery crew.
And how does a delivery crew sound?
Could you hear them going "where tf's my curser gone?", or, "my OIS has frozen again!", or you just mean slick and professional?
777300ER
2nd Sep 2017, 14:00
Funny guys. More importantly though, the HKA pilot supply pool (CX) is on the verge of making the final adjustment (opening the floodgates) to supply crew for all foreseeable expansion plans. Maybe we should help out by giving them some slots too.
Trafalgar
2nd Sep 2017, 14:07
Awaiting details with sincere interest. Thank you.
Maybe the HKAOA should be negotiating with HKA instead of CX!
DessertRat
2nd Sep 2017, 19:08
....the HKA pilot supply pool (CX)....
Exactly right. Guess where all the RA55 CX guys with 350 ratings will go if the company lets them go? Straight to HKA. Including C&T.
Gifting our experienced operators straight to the competition. Cathay. You can't make this up.
Oval3Holer
2nd Sep 2017, 23:02
If the company lets them go? Are they indentured servants? Oh, wait. Don't answer that.
Is CX giving RA55 guys 350 ratings?
Dilbert68
2nd Sep 2017, 23:10
And all those RA55 guys had the option to take RA65 but declined to do so to keep their travel fund (just as I did)
Now they are approaching 55 and complaining that they can't stay, too bad boys, you made your choice. Have fun at HKA, I'll be on a beach somewhere.
Trafalgar
3rd Sep 2017, 00:16
Dessert Rat. As someone else pointed out...anyone can leave at anytime. Not sure what you are implying with your statement.
Dilbert. The RA55 guys chose not to be blackmailed by the company (unlike the rest of us who folded immediately). The fact that the company is being bloody minded and stubborn on insisting they leave, just when we have a genuine pilot shortage developing is evidence of a small minded and myopic leadership, the same leadership that has burdened this airline with almost unsolvable problems. I don't think your sarcasm is warranted or appreciated. As a matter of fact, it's hurtful and immature. It will be fitting if they all take their skills and ratings to HKA, helping that airline grow and prosper at the very expense of the airline losing their experience. Another CX own goal. :mad:
Captain Dart
3rd Sep 2017, 00:19
CX does not have a problem with expensive senior pilots leaving, in fact they welcome it, as they will be eventually replaced by the cheap ones that our trainers are happily churning out, diluting their own contracts. That is also an 'own goal'.
Trafalgar
3rd Sep 2017, 00:54
CX does have a problem with senior pilots leaving, at an ever increasing rate. Even more importantly, the company's insurer does as well. But I do appreciate your regular message that the C and T's are the real problem, and not our management (and I eagerly await your AOA motion to have the C and T's resign...which I will do as soon as such a motion is passed. Of course, in the mean time you could stop doing your job for CX as well, to prove your 'integrity'). :rolleyes:
http://cms-bucket.nosdn.127.net/94b5f7ac16394f089f37213e7336c1df20161127094547.jpeg?imageVie w&thumbnail=550x0
Captain Dart
3rd Sep 2017, 01:44
As a regular reader of the AOA updates, I don't see any particular uptick in the rate of senior resignations. And the few I have spoken to after having submitted their resignations were not exactly begged to stay on by management, much less offered any inducement to stay.
It was more like, 'Don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out'.
Mill Worker
3rd Sep 2017, 02:02
Any truth in the rumour that HKA are about to offer a sign on bonus for HK licensed and rated drivers?
Shep69
3rd Sep 2017, 02:02
All I can say is many aspects of what happens here can be summed up in the wisdom of the epistle to the Galatians:
"for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap"
TheGreenDragon
3rd Sep 2017, 03:42
There will be a few leaving CX, prob the early retirees. A few locals from KA to the 330 or 320.
For the rest, why give up 90% schooling subsidy, 100k housing (b scale)
OT, and union protection for the unknown?
Ultimately HKA is for the young wannabe not the mid career types from CX or for that matter ka. A face full of jet lag, thats all.
Trafalgar
3rd Sep 2017, 05:00
....until HKA realise that, by hiring CX crew, they can expand effortlessly, and screw up CX at the same time. Then the panic will start in earnest (and it's already started on the 3/9th floors....). And Shep, you are absolutely correct in your scriptural quote. Thank you. A lesson to all here and the decisions they make.
cxorcist
3rd Sep 2017, 05:22
All I can say is many aspects of what happens here can be summed up in the wisdom of the epistle to the Galatians:
"for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap"
Oh, the irony doesn't come much thicker than that. Thank you for a good laugh Shep! Try Matthew 7:2-5. See how that shoe fits.
raven11
3rd Sep 2017, 06:53
Cxorcist...what is your point? That Shep should not be judgmental lest he be judged?
Is so, that truly is ironic...
Air China is not even close to being the largest carrier in the world. Even if they bought CX outright, they still would not be anywhere close. That is considering passengers carried, fleet size, revenue, employees etc. etc.. Not even close. American Airlines is, by far, the worlds largest carrier. Not that it means anything to be the worlds largest carrier. For pilots, pay and quality of life are all that matter, and once again, Air China does not come anywhere close.
I see only two problems with that:
A) HKA/HNA group hasn't figured that out yet and they probably never will.
Imagine HKA offering part time, commuting rosters, you name it.
Imagine HKA treating their staff with respect instead of Cathay's 'CAN NOT' stone age attitude.
The truth is, at the moment HKA is the same as Cathay when it comes to management/staff relations, therefore it is not a solution.
B) Who has more influence in Beijing, Air China or HNA ?
Probably there is more behind the mutual ties between Cathay and Air China than pure business reasons.
With the stake of Air China Cathay bought political influence in Beijing as well.
Air China is their flag carrier and has the potential to become the biggest airline in the world (after a Cathay takeover, which might be the long term plan).
Following business news quite a few deals planned by the HNA group were blocked by Beijing over the last few months.
So if HKA really posed a threat to Cathay at some stage I wouldn't be surprised if Beijing intervenes.
cxorcist
3rd Sep 2017, 09:01
Cxorcist...what is your point? That Shep should not be judgmental lest he be judged?
Is so, that truly is ironic...
No, if you know Shep, you know he is doing something very similar to his colleagues that he accuses his employer of. The irony exists there.
If myopic, short term management of a situation which benefits very few in the near term at the expense of a much larger group in the longer term; then the parallels are profound.
Dan Winterland
3rd Sep 2017, 10:26
Back to the thread topic: And here it is arriving. It's a shame one of the fire-trucks squirted water into the APU intake causing it to flame out and the welcoming committee sat there scratching their heads wondering why the engines weren't shut down.
https://cdn2.i-scmp.com/sites/default/files/styles/980x551/public/images/methode/2017/09/02/5553c694-8f92-11e7-9f40-4d9615941c08_1280x720_124842.JPG?itok=Wl8rkU1v
And in the distance there's lurking B-HLK, the 25 year old A330 jalopy, being flogged by KA on yet another Ka904.
LOL. Who's "time to win" now?
Oh and to the CX rated guys, get in line as HKA are only taking A330 rated guys. CCQ internally. Plenty of MAS pilots already singing up . Long Que. stay where u are , negative flyers not needed . Lol.
cabbages
3rd Sep 2017, 14:53
"Long Que."
Multilingual as well......is there no start to your talents?
Cpt. Underpants
3rd Sep 2017, 16:38
The "only A330 rated" thing is a smokescreen generated by the MAS guys. They want A350 rated pilots. Now.
Dilbert68
3rd Sep 2017, 20:11
Trafalgar,
The RA55 individuals had a choice whether to work another 10 years or go at 55. The RA 55 was attractive to most of us to keep the travel fund. Now these same pilots are complaining about having to go at 55? Give me a break.
Oh they are trainers? How will we ever cope with them leaving?
This is how it works, line Capt becomes a TC, TC becomes an STC and the big wheel keeps on turning. None of you trainers are nearly as valuable as you think you are.
Get over yourself
Farman Biplane
3rd Sep 2017, 20:28
What travel fund?
Not hard to look up stats on the internet. None of them back up Air China being remotely close.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-31/cathay-needs-less-swire-not-more
crwkunt roll
5th Sep 2017, 01:18
Plenty of MAS pilots already singing up
The barrel seems to be bottomless.
Hugo Peroni the IV
5th Sep 2017, 02:27
It wasn't just the travel fund. There was, for many, a choice of either keeping bypass pay or losing it by signing up to retire at age sixty five.
A choice! We expect our contracts to be honoured so why should this aspect of an employment contract be any different?
Trafalgar,
The RA55 individuals had a choice whether to work another 10 years or go at 55. The RA 55 was attractive to most of us to keep the travel fund. Now these same pilots are complaining about having to go at 55? Give me a break.
Oh they are trainers? How will we ever cope with them leaving?
This is how it works, line Capt becomes a TC, TC becomes an STC and the big wheel keeps on turning. None of you trainers are nearly as valuable as you think you are.
Get over yourself
Someone posted a rather nice photo of the a350 n all you guys talk about is your fat arsed pensions. WTF. Every thread on here is dragged to the bottom of the barrel by the usual suspects. Who really love the fact they pertain to work for CX.
WTF.
Lets see who's still got a smarmy grin on their faces when the 15 th HKA a350 arrives. I hear theres no xtra month for you bitche$?? LOL
mngmt mole
5th Sep 2017, 09:40
How old are you, really? If you are more than 12, then you should be ashamed of yourself. If 12 or under, then no worries, your writing skills and level of grammar are about right.
Hong Kong Airlines - A320 Captains
Base: Hong Kong
Requires: 1000 hours PIC in type. 3,000 hours jet PIC, age under 57 years old at start of assignment, current on the A320 within the preceding 12 months. Compensation: $15,957 per month USD per month plus overtime. Performance Bonus: (paid annually based on personal performance): 1st anniversary after line check: $6,450 USD, 2nd anniversary after line check: $12,900 USD, 3rd anniversary after line check: $19,350 USD. Contract term: 3 years (renewable)
Average Fool
5th Sep 2017, 16:18
What would "personal performance" be based on?
cpahka
6th Sep 2017, 00:41
What would "personal performance" be based on?
guess are unexplainable high sick rate, fail PC/LC, miss or refuse duties etc.
Strewth
6th Sep 2017, 12:42
HX targets CX (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-hk-airlines-strategy/hong-kong-airlines-targets-cathay-pacifics-core-business-market-idUSKCN1BH1M4) Reuters 060917
EhixnemlDus
I noticed from PCC that the a350 firm orders have risen to 21. Also, The HKA CEO has also confirmed that a new type is also being looked at.
So how are CX responding? Looks like a serious haircut for all our regular pprune posters over @ at B1tche$ city.
Das Heiress Anna says: Its time for ... Pay and Increment Freezes, Changes in EFP (i.e. reductions) Prov Fund Changes (i.e. reductions), Rostering practices (i.e. more hours & higher OT threashold)
Of graver concern is the focus on expat pilots in CX, the realisation that basically CX no longer cares for their incumbents , earning above "market rates". The guys are also getting way too much fat cat accommodation assistance.
Time to move. Time to downsize. Welcome to the real world guys, LOL.
raven11
7th Sep 2017, 16:36
A370
It's your crappy contract...the one you accepted...that is the "market" force that Cathay is responding to. Thanks...I guess. It appears that soon our conditions may sink down to your level....Bit*h.
On the other hand, for you, I suppose it's a good thing that Cathay turned you down. LOL
Start Fore
7th Sep 2017, 21:51
Hong Kong Airlines? You've got to be kidding me right? A crap airline who would give the lunatics running Cathay/Dragon a run for their money.
And I'm earning double what I would be at HKA. They'd have to up the package a bit, and then even then I'd be wary.
To give you some idea; I'm seriously considering a 60 percent pay cut to go back to Europe/UK and fly for a proper airline with 1st world employment rules.
So why would I take a paycut to go from the frying pan into the frier?
No thanks, I'll stick to my 200,000 hkd per month for 40 hours flying.
But the South Americans and other dregs of aviation seem to be queuing up.