LPMA procedure

[Driver 170]

Any pilots that operate into Madeira, do you modify any waypoints for the VOR DME 05 circle to land like the FUN VOR adding any altitude waypoints before or after like FUN211/6

Greatly appreciate any guidance. Also if i choose to level at 1200 because of good weather after FUN 3.6d will my mins still have to be set at 940?

[Driver 170]

I was told a few procedures. Enter FUN211/6 in the legs page and enter FUN/-2.9 with an altitude restriction of 3000ft. modify FUN vor with 2090.

Is this even allowed within the IAF?

[Nightstop]

I don't modify anything, no need because it's all correctly coded in our database of the aircraft I operate into FNC. Minima of 940' QNH is always entered in the primary PERF, even if planning to level at 1,140'. After the MAP at FUN 3.6D, it's visual with prescribed tracks (or Go Around) and I have PM activate the SEC FPL which is already programmed with CF to threshold 05 (no Minima in the SEC PERF because we've commited to continue anyway). Fly downwind in TK/FPA and at 1,140' ( or 940' if you have to) and turn towards GELO at FUN 6DME. Land or Go Around, depending on the Final windcheck ;)

[Driver 170]

I'll leave my database alone in the 737NG FMS. I'm not very familiar with primary PERF, SEC FPL and SEC PERF? What aircraft is this if you don't mind me asking?

Would it be advisable to have a CDA to FUN D6 cause levelling off at 1140 or 940 with gear down and f15 is a massive fuel penalty hit after D3.6

[Nightstop]

We're on different aircraft types, some readers will know which it is. But no, it's not a good idea to fly a CDA to FUN 6DME, because in limiting weather you need to be at FUN 3.6 DME at minima looking for the "airport environment" as we call it. Our fuel plan allows for the high drag fuel penalty after the MAP, it should be included in yours...

[Driver 170]

If the weather is good ceiling above MDA is it not good airmanship to perform a CDA with V/S? Or is that commanders discretion?

[Nightstop]

Not at FNC. Clouds often hang over the FNC VOR, the weather clears and deteriorates quickly. Rain showers are particularly problematical. If you modify the approach to acheive a CDA towards FUN 6 DME you're not flying the published approach and could come unstuck. Stick to the published procedure and send the fuel bill to your Company. We don't have any discretion, this is how it's flown, period.

[Driver 170]

Ok i'll ditch all modifications to the approach procedure and stick to the published procedure!

Not sure what else to ask really. Thanks for helping out :)

[Chesty Morgan]

Don't modify the FMC but I do brief that going high on the vertical profile is not an issue if we're visual and stay visual until the MAP (there is no point at all in descending early). I plan to be level at about FUN 5d at the latest and I'll be flap5 180/170 until then. However, if the weather is iffy then fly the profile.

Yes, your minimums will still be 940'.

It's all in the brief.

[Driver 170]

Very interesting CM cheers.

If during the visual part and you had to go around. During the turn right to FUSUL the aircraft is accelerating and at acceleration altitude, would you commence flap retraction? Or wait until the turn is complete? Couldn't find anything in the FCTM cheers.

[Nightstop]

The missed approach point is FUN 3.6 DME, if you pass that and continue visually your minimum of 940' is irrelevant. If you pass the MAP high and continue descent to 940' in IMC you've not complied with the procedural MAP. Problem with FNC is the weather can be difficult to second guess, unless you can see the whole circuit from ABUSU I'd strongly advise you stick to the procedure. Anyway, happy landings you all!

[Driver 170]

If you pass FUN 3.6D you can still descend to 900 minimum to have a better look?

What is IMC in this case? Visibility Less than 5000m and cloud base less than 1000 AAL.

[Chesty Morgan]

Very interesting CM cheers.

If during the visual part and you had to go around. During the turn right to FUSUL the aircraft is accelerating and at acceleration altitude, would you commence flap retraction? Or wait until the turn is complete? Couldn't find anything in the FCTM cheers.

Well, up until I started the base turn I'd turn LEFT to FUSUL! There's not really a rush to accelerate and clean up; make sure you're going the right way first, away from the high ground towards FUSUL. There's nothing wrong with levelling at 3000 before you accelerate and clean up.

[Driver 170]

CM thanks for that. You wouldn't be able to send any briefs on this airport through PM?

[aterpster]

The RNP AR IAPs at this airport are a very good application of that concept.

[Smokey Lomcevak]

Usually I would be advocating this sort of KISS approach to it - we want to get to FUN 6D at around 1000ft ready to turn. So long as we don't need to break cloud, I'd agree self positioning to that point at the end of the downwind leg, using a nice CDA and efficient speeds and configs would be a simpler way to do things than attempting to nail this 3 degree NPA only to level off with drag out.

The problem at FNC is that one cannot see what is happening on that side of the Island. A lot of traffic comes from the North - DEGUN and NAVIX and so they'll never get a good view of the weather until the MAPt. The speed at which the weather develops there is also not to be underestimated. A 30 minute old METAR reporting CAVOK could quite easily become 3000m in +SHRA by the time the next one is due.

[Driver 170]

Yeh just checked LIDO charts for 05 RNP (AR) and has a right turn from the RWY THR of course!

Thanks smokey i suppose once arriving weather situation will dictate if you need to be at FUN 3.6 940 or have a nice CDA to FUN 6D at 1200 if cloudbase is above 1200?

[Nightstop]

Why do you ask so many questions? It's obvious from your 300 + other posts you're not qualified to operate a public transport aircraft, the B738 or into FNC!

[Driver 170]

No certainly not. I have my own 737-800 home cockpit and using Prepar3D simulator. I'm not a pilot so i should of stated that! I hope thats not a problem? I appreciate all the help guys.

[Amadis of Gaul]

Yeah, probably would have been helpful to open with that.

[Nightstop]

No major problem Driver 170, except you're been asking loads of questions on the wrong forum. Spectators Balcony is more appropriate for you until you're qualified.

[Chesty Morgan]

Does it really matter?!