Metroliner crash after T/O in Malta

[fabiensf]

Photos: Aircraft crashes in Luqa - timesofmalta.com (http://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20161024/local/aircraft-crashes-in-luqa.628979)

[Less Hair]

Very steep bank...

https://3a09223b3cd53870eeaa-7f75e5eb51943043279413a54aaa858a.ssl.cf3.rackcdn.com//f71d83892b284e8e0b43573d1d6ceba72c885530-1477296013-580dbf8d-620x348.jpg
picture by Laurent Azzopardi

[Kyprianos Biris]

Caught on camera for a few seconds:
https://www.facebook.com/lazz178.mt/videos/vb.100005160452053/642528069262536/?type=2&theater

[AN2 Driver]

https://youtu.be/wMiDMVyfCeA

Looks like it's turned more or less on it's back.

Vmc accident? Would not be the first for the Metros...

[SanHor]

Rumours that it's N577MX

[danielson81]

Live updates here: https://www.maltairport.com/index.html

Yes they have confirmed its N577MX.

[Cyrano]

More information (http://www.maltatoday.com.mt/news/national/70876/aviation_incident_Malta_airport) - apparently the flight was part of a French customs surveillance operation.

[KyleTheAviator]

Looks a lot like a stall with a wing drop.
Pilot may have panicked and tried to roll out aggravating the stall.
would explain the inversion and low speed.

[Mimpe]

The video I saw from a dashboard cam, has it pretty much upside down at about 200 ft alt

[AlphaZuluRomeo]

Not "customs" related.
Plane & crew from CAE.
Pax personnel "under the Ministry of Defence".

[ATC Watcher]

apparently the flight was part of a French customs surveillance operation.

Sources in France are speaking about 3 French military and 2 civilians ,( the pilots of the leased a/c ) Ministry of defense confirmed the death of 3 of its personal.
Another source ( Ouest France ) indicate the a/c was leased from Luxembourg by the French Civil intelligence service DGSE and Military Intelligence DRM . Looking at the intended destination this does not sound like Customs surveillance.

[LGW Vulture]

I had not heard of CAE previously. So am basically interested how the government and military might be seemingly flouting EASA hire and reward regulations with an N reg'd aircraft.

Clearly the French were paying for this through a "lease" arrangement. I mean we either have rules, or we don't. Or am I jumping the gun a little?

[Hussar 54]

Very valid question....It will be interesting to see exactly what the leasing details were, assuming we ever find out.

[unworry]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTpdWQYCk2Q

footage of burning crash site and arrival of emergency vehicles, taken by a passenger onboard a flight waiting to depart

[212man]

I mean we either have rules, or we don't. Or am I jumping the gun a little?


Which 'rule(s)' are you referring to, specifically? Bear in mind, also, that this would constitute SPO and not CAT, so is not subject to the Third Country Operators Regulation.

[LGW Vulture]

If the aircraft is being paid for then it is hire and reward surely? If that is the case, aircraft should be EASA. It should not matter if this is special operations.

Again, if special operations can evade this requirement then fair enough. However, it should not. In my view of course.

[ATC Watcher]

LGW Vulture :
DRM ( French military intelligence service) recognized now they chartered the aircraft.
The company :
CAE-AVIATION - Airborne Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance Services - Army Technology (http://www.army-technology.com/contractors/data_management/cae-aviation/)

[sleeper]

Does the metroliner have a gustlock device?

[finfly1]

AviationDB - Aviation Database - Aircraft N577MX (http://www.aviationdb.com/Aviation/Aircraft/5/N577MX.shtm)

[krohmie]

Interesting question if you look at this old AD http://services.casa.gov.au/airworth/airwd/ADfiles/under/swsa226/SWSA226-052.pdf

[what next]

Does the metroliner have a gustlock device?

Yes, it does. But this accident can have many other causes as well. Asymmetric power at low speed, asymmetric flap retraction at low speed, load shift, trim runaway, ...

On a european register it would be fitted with FDR and CVR (at least the German registered one that I flew many years ago did have those) but I don't know if the FAA requires that for part 23 aircraft.

[t1grm]

What the aircraft was doing (or more specifically the passengers on it) is a potential problem for the Maltese government because Malta is supposed to be a neutral country. So if it was some covert intelligence or special forces mission by France in Libya then, if Malta knew about it, it's a local political scandal and if they didn't it's quite an awkward diplomatic incident between France and Malta.

[AN2 Driver]

I am no expert in the Metro or Merlin, but I seem to recall at least one similar accident where the airplane came down inverted after unequal engine power was applied during a go around in Ireland I believe it was. (Cork?)

It appears from the footage that the airplane came down inverted and out of control. If they did not carry an FDR or CVR it will be difficult to figure out what happened, as the degree of destruction certainly must be horriffic. Several things come to mind, but I reckon all we can do is wait for more facts.

[Metro man]

These aircraft have horrendous stalling characteristics and are fitted with a stick shaker and a stick pusher as part of its SAS (stall avoidance system). Most other 19 seat turboprops don't require this level of protection.

A Metroliner requires relatively skilled handling and isn't the most forgiving of aircraft when things go wrong.

[T28B]

@AN2Driver: Are you referring to this accident (http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/442308-crash-cork-airport.html)?

[tartare]

Jesus - used to fly on those as SLF with Air Nelson in NZ.
Fast, but always thought they were a little scary.
That's a horrific video.

[Una Due Tfc]

I am no expert in the Metro or Merlin, but I seem to recall at least one similar accident where the airplane came down inverted after unequal engine power was applied during a go around in Ireland I believe it was. (Cork?)

IIRC one side went into negative torque in low viz after the crew busted their minima.

[T28B]

For those seeking similarity, since someone brought it up, the final report on the Metroliner at Cork is here (http://www.aaiu.ie/sites/default/files/report-attachments/REPORT%202014-001_0.pdf).
That accident was during a different flight regime: on approach to landing, not departure.
The weather is significantly different (see the video already posted(from the car that caught a glimpse of the crash).
The below text is excerpted from the official report from the crash of the Metroliner at Cork: Descent of the aircraft was continued below DH. This was followed by a reduction in power and a significant roll to the left. Just below 100 ft radio altitude, a go-around was called by the PNF which was acknowledged by the PF.
Coincident with the application of go-around power by the PNF, control of the aircraft was lost. The aircraft rolled rapidly to the right beyond the
vertical which brought the right wingtip into contact with the runway surface. The aircraft continued to roll and impacted the runway inverted. {snip} The accident occurred in daylight, but under conditions of fog. From that, I will suggest that comparing the two accidents is of marginal value beyond the standard concerns of twin engine turboprops and their operations, and perhaps low speed handling qualities of Metroliners.

[Joe_K]

What the aircraft was doing (or more specifically the passengers on it) is a potential problem for the Maltese government because Malta is supposed to be a neutral country. So if it was some covert intelligence or special forces mission by France in Libya then, if Malta knew about it, it's a local political scandal and if they didn't it's quite an awkward diplomatic incident between France and Malta. It's hard to imagine the Maltese government not knowing about the activities of a company proudly displaying a NAMSA vendor ID and NATO CAGE number on their website, when you can find Blog entries dating back to February claiming French Special Forces (COS) had used N123LH out of Malta to infiltrate Libya. N123LH is also a Merlin III operated by CAE.

[LiveryMan]

Friend of mine type rated on the Metroliner suggested an accidental reversal of prop pitch on the No.2 engine would possibly explain why they were inverted so quickly after take off. Apparently it's easy to do by mistake. The lack of smoke from No.2 would seem to rule out an engine out scenario.

[Volume]

If a civil registered aircraft is operated by an "governmental" (miltary, itelligence, whatsoever...) organisation, will there be a civil (public) accident investigation? Will there ever be a public report?

[ATC Watcher]

This was not a military flight , nor a military aircraft, so the State in which the accident occurred is responsible for the investigation and , knowing Malta CAA , yes there will be a report.

[t1grm]

It's hard to imagine the Maltese government not knowing about the activities of a company proudly displaying a NAMSA vendor ID and NATO CAGE number on their website, when you can find Blog entries dating back to February claiming French Special Forces (COS) had used N123LH out of Malta to infiltrate Libya. N123LH is also a Merlin III operated by CAE.

Agreed. Which means the Maltese government will have some awkward questions to answer to the Maltese electorate if the flight turns out to be anything other than a civilian mission. Malta's neutrality (or lack of in some cases) is already quite a politically sensitive issue at the moment.

[t1grm]

This was not a military flight , nor a military aircraft, so the State in which the accident occurred is responsible for the investigation and , knowing Malta CAA , yes there will be a report.

Press is stating investigation will be done by French defence ministry lending weight to the possibility this was not a civilian flight:

French citizens killed in surveillance plane crash on Malta - BBC News (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37749817)

[wiggy]

lending weight to the possibility this was not a civilian flight:

Not sure there's much cloak and dagger here, The French have been openly reporting for nearly 24 hours that the individuals kiled were customs officials, involved in anti-people smuggling operations, and were en-route for a third world destination...

[Joe_K]

Not true, the French Customs authority (DGDDI) have pretty much immediately after the crash tweeted that none of their personnel were involved, and Le Monde is reporting the flight was conducted for the DGSE, which is the French external intelligence agency (similar to CIA or MI6). The Le Monde article also points out that the Maltese governement "thought" the flights being conducted over the last 5 months were customs flights, but that in fact the French Defence Minister had to admit that this was not the case...

Le crash de Malte lève un coin du voile sur les vols de la DGSE (http://www.lemonde.fr/international/article/2016/10/25/le-crash-de-malte-leve-un-coin-du-voile-sur-les-vols-de-la-dgse_5019859_3210.html)

[wiggy]

Ah well, maybe my mistake but from what I saw France 2 were definitely reporting French customs officials were involved on their yesterday lunchtime broadcast......now whether that was before or after the DGDDI tweet, whether they were getting info from the scene I dont know.

Fog of war, etc/diseinformation etc, don't you love it???

[ATC Watcher]

t1grm
Press is stating investigation will be done by French defence ministry lending weight to the possibility this was not a civilian flight
The flight was a civilian one , the aircraft a civil one ( N-registered) , owned and operated by a civilian company (CAE) . so Annex 13 applies.
The French Defence ministry investigation is the normal administrative investigation done after any loss of life of one of its staff. This is not the one to be done according Annex13 by the Maltese State.

Wiggy :
but from what I saw France 2
France 2 TV was probably using info coming from Malta , in the meantime the Ministry of defense has confirmed it was their staff on a mission for DRM ( not DGSE as Le Monde is reporting, but possibly DGSE chartered the aircrfat long term and DRM was using it . DRM is the military intelligence unit.. .( Direction du Renseignement Militaire)

[wiggy]

France 2 TV was probably using info coming from Malta

Given the timings you're probably right, thanks for the clarification.....

[recceguy]

That's the problem - chartering civilian aircraft fro governmental missions.
It has been done many, many times in the past - by the French Secret Service, but also the US of course.
Fine when everything goes smoothly (why do we need more regulations ?)
Everybody running for cover in case of a crash....

As for the CAE, see the Seychelles :
Reportage (exclusif) avec les avions "luxembourgeois" d'Atalanta aux Seychelles - bruxelles2 Europe de la Défense (http://bruxelles2.over-blog.com/article-reportage-exclusif-avec-les-avions-luxembourgeois-d-atalanta-42046380.html) - open source (in french, as the French crew..)

Also used by the RNLAF for para training (Casa 212 in a private airport in France) and many, many others ... including Mali and Niger :

CAE Aviation « Feral Jundi (http://feraljundi.com/tag/cae-aviation/)

Governments have their reasons for doing that. Obviously it was not Customs (they have their own aircraft in France) ... who would believe that ?

In any case, respect and salute to the great crew involved - many of them coming from the french Reconnaissance ....

[LLuCCiFeR]

Let's see; a US registered aircraft, painted completely grey, flying for a Luxembourgish company, in Malta, with 2 French pilots an 3 French passengers on board, working on a 5 month contract for the French army.

That all looks pretty kosher to me! :hmm:

Here's a story from the Luxembourgish press for those that speak German: L'essentiel Online - Fünf Franzosen bei Flugzeugabsturz getötet - Luxemburg (http://www.lessentiel.lu/de/luxemburg/story/18811946)

Laut der maltesischen Regierung handelt es sich bei den Toten um französische Staatsangehörige.(According to the Maltese Government, the dead are French citizens.)

Wie das französische Verteidigungsministerium mitteilte, saßen drei Mitarbeiter der Behörde im Todesflieger.(As the French ministry of defense communicated, three of their employees were on board.)

Laut Angaben der maltesischen Regierung setzte Frankreich das CAE-Flugzeug seit fünf Monaten im Rahmen einer Überwachungsmission ein. Die Operation habe zum Ziel gehabt, Schlepper- und Drogenhändlerrouten im Mittelmeer zu verfolgen.(According to the Maltese government, the CAE aircraft was deployed for 5 months on a monitoring mission. The mission's target was tracking human smuggling and drug dealer routes in the Mediterranean.)

Translations are mine.

[LLuCCiFeR]

Media are reporting that all five people on board were employees of the French DGSE, the secret service.

More news from Luxemburg: L'essentiel Online - Fünf Spione bei Flugzeugabsturz getötet? - Luxemburg (http://www.lessentiel.lu/de/luxemburg/story/Fuenf-Spione-bei-Flugzeugabsturz-getoetet--11287743)

Translation: "Five spies killed by plane crash?"

And here is Le Point: Crash d'un avion à Malte : la DGSE perd cinq hommes - Le Point (http://www.lepoint.fr/editos-du-point/jean-guisnel/crash-d-un-avion-a-malte-la-dgse-perd-cinq-hommes-24-10-2016-2078242_53.php)