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Genghis the Engineer
10th Aug 2016, 14:18
I've been working with a light aircraft pilot holding an NPPL(SSEA) who has bought himself a 3-axis microlight. He had no prior flying on UK microlights.

My understanding, and this seems to be what's said in the current CAP804 is that he needs training as required in the microlight, then to pass the microlight oral exam and skill test with a suitably qualified examiner. I can see nothing in the various books to contradict that view.

However, he's just been talking to the CFI of a microlight school at another airfield, who told him that differences training only is required.

I believe that the CFI is wrong (differences training for an EASA PPL or UK PPL, yes, but a skill test is required for an NPPL holder). However, I'm paranoid where anything to do with licencing rules are concerned.


Does anybody know of a rule / rule change anywhere that might make me wrong and the CFI correct?

G

BEagle
10th Aug 2016, 19:29
SECTION 4 CROSS-CREDITING LICENCES AND RATINGS TO NPPL (MICROLIGHT)
4.1 Pilots with valid licences and ratings

4.1.1 UK Licence with SEP or SSEA rating to NPPL(A) (Microlight)
The holder of a valid CAA-issued Pilot Licence (Aeroplanes) with SEP Class Rating or SSEA rating who wishes to obtain a Microlight Class Rating shall:

a) produce the CAA-issued Pilot Licence (Aeroplanes);
b) pass the Microlight Aeroplanes Type (Part 2) oral examination conducted by a Microlight flight examiner. The examination shall include pilot maintenance requirements and conditions of the Permit to Fly;
c) hold a valid NPPL Medical Declaration or Part-MED Class 1, 2 or LAPL medical certificate;
d) pass the NPPL(A) GST in a Microlight.

To fly Microlight Aeroplanes, an NPPL(SSEA) holder must meet the requirements listed above, then apply for the inclusion of a Microlight Class Rating in his/her NPPL.

This isn't the same for PPL holders - they may fly Microlights by simply taking the relevant differences training, provided that they hold a valid SEP Class Rating (or have valid LAPL SEP privileges).

The main advantage of holding an NPPL with both Microlight and SSEA Class Ratings is that such pilots may take advantage of consolidated revalidation criteria to maintain the validity of both Class Ratings.

Genghis the Engineer
11th Aug 2016, 08:51
Thanks BEagle - that's what I'd also found in CAP804 also; so basically, I was right.

I may have to have a private word with the microlight school CFI down the road.

G

ifitaintboeing
11th Aug 2016, 09:47
Class ratings within a NPPL(A) are mutually exclusive in terms of privileges. Therefore, the holder of a NPPL(A) with a SSEA class rating may not act as PIC of a microlight without a microlight class rating. See ANO Schedule 7 Part B Section 2:

Subject to paragraph (2) and to the conditions of the licence in which it is included, a SSEA class rating entitles the holder to act as pilot in command of any SSEA with a maximum take off weight authorised of not more than 2000kg excluding any such aeroplane which is a SLMG or a microlight aeroplane.

In order to act as PIC on microlights, the holder must complete training and test in accordance with the NPPL document quoted above, which is reproduced in CAP 804 Section 5 Part A Appendix 1.

ifitaint...

Genghis the Engineer
12th Aug 2016, 10:22
For the record, whilst I did believe you chaps (why shouldn't I, you were agreeing with me!), I also checked with the CEO of the BMAA. He also confirmed that this is the case, and says he's going to put a note around microlight instructors reminding them.

G

rkgpilot
11th Nov 2019, 21:49
To fly Microlight Aeroplanes, an NPPL(SSEA) holder must meet the requirements listed above, then apply for the inclusion of a Microlight Class Rating in his/her NPPL.

This isn't the same for PPL holders - they may fly Microlights by simply taking the relevant differences training, provided that they hold a valid SEP Class Rating (or have valid LAPL SEP privileges).

The main advantage of holding an NPPL with both Microlight and SSEA Class Ratings is that such pilots may take advantage of consolidated revalidation criteria to maintain the validity of both Class Ratings.

Iím a fairly new CRI(A) on an EASA PPL and have had microlight differences training. I also hold a UK PPL (post-JAR version). I do not yet have a NPPL.

I want to do a bit of CRI work at a flying school/club where the main aim is to give members differences training to add SSEA privileges. The club members are mainly NPPL(M) holders but some NPPL(SSEA) holders who want to convert the other way.

I thought I understood this, but Iíve severely confused myself 😐

1) Has the position in the quoted post changed in the last couple of years or do NPPL(SSEA) licence holders still need to do the microlight test with an examiner?

2) Can I conduct the training for such folk using my EASA PPL and then recommend them to the examiner? Or must a FI do such training?

3) For LAPL(A) and PPL(A) licence holders wanting to fly microlights, I understand that I can conduct microlight differences training and the licence holder doesnít need anything more than my signature in his/her log book?

4) If I want a NPPL(M) myself, is it correct that I'll need to do a test?

5) For the NPPL(M) holders, is differences training to add SSEA sufficient without test and can I do it?

6) Anything else I should know before I get asked to sign a log book?

Thanks in advance for bringing clarity to my mind 😀

Genghis the Engineer
12th Nov 2019, 09:17
I’m a fairly new CRI(A) on an EASA PPL and have had microlight differences training. I also hold a UK PPL (post-JAR version). I do not yet have a NPPL.

I want to do a bit of CRI work at a flying school/club where the main aim is to give members differences training to add SSEA privileges. The club members are mainly NPPL(M) holders but some NPPL(SSEA) holders who want to convert the other way.

I thought I understood this, but I’ve severely confused myself ��

1) Has the position in the quoted post changed in the last couple of years or do NPPL(SSEA) licence holders still need to do the microlight test with an examiner?
Not so far as I know.

2) Can I conduct the training for such folk using my EASA PPL and then recommend them to the examiner? Or must a FI do such training?
So far as I'm aware with an EASA PPL + differences + CRI you can do this instruction.

3) For LAPL(A) and PPL(A) licence holders wanting to fly microlights, I understand that I can conduct microlight differences training and the licence holder doesn’t need anything more than my signature in his/her log book?
That is also my understanding.

4) If I want a NPPL(M) myself, is it correct that I'll need to do a test?
No idea, but why would you want one? If you want a national licence, just do the form and £42 (or whatever it currently is) payment to CAA to get a UK PPL (not the same as an NPPL) which gives you a non EASA but ICAO compliant PPL.

5) For the NPPL(M) holders, is differences training to add SSEA sufficient without test and can I do it?
No, they need an exam and a skill test. The training also needs to have been within a training organisation, under whose auspices you need to have issued a certificate of completion of training.

6) Anything else I should know before I get asked to sign a log book?

Yes - make sure you're fully familiar with the BMAA instructor and examiner guide, including the standard microlight check mnemonics; also the contents of Brian Cosgrove's "Microlight pilots handbook", as that pretty much defines the level of knowledge microlight pilots, trained only as microlight pilots should have.

Also get on the BMAA's list of instructors teaching on microlights. The emails tell you when anybody is looking for instructors, and any updates on the regulations - plus the BMAA's annual instructor seminar is about ten times as useful, for about a tenth the cost of anything I've ever attended in the SEP/"group A" world. Aaron Bliss at the BMAA HQ in Deddington is the chap to talk to about that.

G

rkgpilot
12th Nov 2019, 13:16
Thanks Genghis. Much appreciated.

I do already have a UK PPL (new version) but was thinking of a NPPL so that I can add SLMG which I believe means differences training. A couple of years ago, I called the CAA and emailed them as to whether I can add SLMG privileges to the UK PPL through differences training only and they didn’t seem to have a clue. If I go for TMG on my EASA licence, I know I’ll need a skills test.

Whopity
12th Nov 2019, 15:09
so that I can add SLMG which I believe means differences training. No, is a seperate class so you need a General Skill Test in order to add the SLMG class rating.

rkgpilot
12th Nov 2019, 17:31
Thanks Whopity, but perhaps I wasn't too clear. I intend obtaining NPPL SSEA on the basis of my PPL(A), then adding SLMG through differences. My source was a well known motorgliding school website which says this: NPPL SSEA to SLMGThis is an easy conversion, and all you need to do is complete ‘differences training’ and then get signed off (no skills test required!)

Whopity
12th Nov 2019, 18:25
ANO Schedule 8 Chapter 3
(1) The holder of a National Private Pilotís Licence (Aeroplanes) is entitledó
(a) in accordance with the remainder of this paragraph, to fly for the purposes of noncommercial
operations as pilot in command of any SSEA, microlight aeroplane or SLMG
for which a class rating is included in the licence provided that the total number of
persons carried (including the pilot) does not exceed four, unless prohibited by paragraph
(2);
How does a sign off get a rating placed in the licence?
General Skill Test and application for the rating.

rkgpilot
12th Nov 2019, 19:35
Thanks for your replies.