Would like to do an Instructors Rating but PPL/CPL expired.

[Stobart]

Hi Flying Instructors and Examiners Forum,

I obtained a Frozen ATPL donkey's years ago back in June 2008 but never worked as a pilot and returned to my original non aviation career.


At this stage I have no interest in flying big jets but want to get back in to flying with the view of doing a flying instructors rating.


Where do I stand on the following:

UK JAA CPL Expired June 2013

Last IR Renewal was November 2011



Before starting an instructor's rating I was wondering what's salvageable from prior training if anything:


Would I have to do the CPL again?

Would I have to do a PPL again?

Would I have to do the ATPL exams again?


Thanks.
Stobart.

[Mickey Kaye]

Dead easy training as required plus test to get your SEP rating current.

Send it off to the CAA and they will reissue your CPL (I'm assuming the 5 year expiry of the JAR licence was June 2013).

Before you can start the FI couse you need 5 hours on type in the preceding 6 months.

There been a fair exodus of instructors recently to the airlines. So if your not a cock you shouldn't have any difficulties picking up some work.

[Ex Oggie]

You will also need a valid class 1 medical to get the CPL re-issued.

XO

[macflea]

quick question once you have a valid Cpl license , in theory you are a commercial pilot available for hire.
if you are self employed could you write the sep rating, recurrent training, instructors rating off against any future gains you make from instructing.

[Genghis the Engineer]

quick question once you have a valid Cpl license , in theory you are a commercial pilot available for hire.
if you are self employed could you write the sep rating, recurrent training, instructors rating off against any future gains you make from instructing.

I certainly do!

G

[Whopity]

Would I have to do the ATPL exams again?
Your IR expired 5 years ago, it would pay you to renew it if only on a SEP, as after 7 years you would have to retake the IR exams to get it back again.

[TheOddOne]

I certainly do!

Ditto

TOO

[macflea]

To Whopity
by doing the single engine ir would get you another 7 years validity for the atpl
exams, but in my situation i have a valid cpl license but I never renewed my ir and i have passed the 7 year mark.if I had known it i would have done it. I rang the Iaa here in Ireland, I was told I would have to do all 14 exams and redo the ir course to pass a skill test if I was to go on to exercise the privileges of a frozen atpl despite having a valid cpl.

I have a UK license but live in ireland

I was told by just doing the ir exams , yes it will give me a valid ir, but I wouldn't be able to apply for an airline job because it's not a frozen atpl. I could use to fly a single pilot plane in Ir conditions.

I have emailed the UK caa twice to see would doing ir exams only and skills test renew my ir so I could apply for airlines, yet no reply.

I think the UK position under jar or jaa was the same as ireland but has it changed under Easa?

[Whopity]

Regulation 1178
FCL.625 IR — Validity, revalidation and renewal
(d) If the IR has not been revalidated or renewed within the preceding 7 years, the holder will be required to pass again the IR theoretical knowledge examination and skill test.
It is an ATO who will tell you what you have to do, not the IAA or CAA! They are all required to comply with the regulation. There is no such thing as a frozen ATPL!

(c) Renewal. If an IR has expired, in order to renew their privileges applicants shall: (1) go through refresher training at an ATO to reach the level of proficiency needed to pass the instrument element of the skill test in accordance with Appendix 9 to this Part; and (2) complete a proficiency check in accordance with Appendix 9 to this Part, in the relevant aircraft category.

[GipsyMagpie]

Regulation 1178

It is an ATO who will tell you what you have to do, not the IAA or CAA! They are all required to comply with the regulation. There is no such thing as a frozen ATPL!

But there is "frozen" ATPL theory credit which is what I think is being talked about here

[GipsyMagpie]

I certainly do!

G

The fees you pay the CAA for licences are also one for the SA tax form if "they are useful to your job". Remarkably loose definition.

[Whopity]

But there is "frozen" ATPL theory credit which is what I think is being talked about here Once upon a time it was a frozen credit, but then came the 7 year rule where the ice melts and the credit goes down the drain!

[Stobart]

Thanks for the replies.

For the EASA CPL application what's the best order to apply.

Should I apply for the EASA CPL before the single engine rating or first get the single engine rating revalidated and then apply for the EASA CPL.


Also, I spotted on the following site the below.

Renewal SEP(land) - single engine piston aeroplanes | Flight examiner ? re-validation, flight school, flight traiing (http://flight-examiner.com/renewal/easa-single-engine-aeroplanes)


When estabilishing the renewal flight training, the EASA flight school considers the following attributes:

class rating expired for more than three years: the applicant should have completed flight training again in the scope and duration, which is required for the first issue of the EASA SEP(land) class rating

What exactly does this mean. Does it mean doing the CPL Single Engine syllabus and test again or PPL Single Engine syllabus test again or something else.


Thanks.
Stobart

[Level Attitude]

What exactly does this mean. Does it mean doing the CPL Single Engine syllabus and test again or PPL Single Engine syllabus test again or something else.An EASA Licence does not expire, therefore there are no Renewal requirements.


class rating expired for more than three years...It does not matter what Licence (PPL/CPL/ATPL) the Rating will be attached to, the Renewal requirements would be the same.


Should I apply for the EASA CPL before the single engine rating or first get the single engine rating revalidated and then apply for the EASA CPL.I do not believe the CAA will issue an EASA Licence without at least one valid Class or Type Rating that can be attached to it - therefore pass the SEP Renewal LPC first.

[MrAverage]

I was told by an HM Inspector of Taxes, albeit many years ago, that you could only claim expenses involved with maintaining existing privileges.
He stated, in no uncertain terms, that claiming for expenses for the initial issue of a qualification was not allowed. If this is still the case the OP could not claim against tax for his proposed instructor rating expenses.


Any Inland Revenue pilots reading this care to comment?

[macflea]

I hope for the sake of the lads in a certain airline that the HM revenue inspector you mentioned doesn't find out that they are writing off their type rating against against expenses or else they are in serious trouble. what is the difference between an instructors rating and a type rating , you are adding both of these to your primary qualification which is the commercial License to enhance your employability. I suppose it depends on who you meet in revenue.

[Whopity]

He stated, in no uncertain terms, that claiming for expenses for the initial issue of a qualification was not allowed. I think this is correct, the big hole in it was the NVQ allowance, but when that ceased, it reverted back however; once you have a licence that allows commercial activity, then I think any additional expense is fair game as that is beyond "initial issue".