Ex UK Mil pilot hoping for a US FAA Licence

[Flare_Level_Cushion]

Hi all,

I've been out of the aviation game for a while after some fairly major career moves but am keen to get back into the sky and was hoping for some advice if possible. Please could those of you in the know share your thoughts?

I am in the UK and am a doctor now, having left the British Army with 780 hrs rotary and 50 hrs fixed wing. Last flight was August 2007. Having finished training, I am keen to get a PPL (A) so I can fly in the US as I am hoping to start work there in a couple of months.

The issue is this: how can I get the US/FAA to accept my UK military flying hours? The current answer seems to be that I need to complete a UK PPL (A) and then convert that into a US PPC (A). I am keen to avoid that as I may not be in the UK long enough to complete the PPL (2.5 months left) and once I get it, the US licence would need it to remain current so I may need to fly back to the UK every year or two for a check ride etc.

Factor in that the US PPC has night flying included and it seems more sensible for me to take some time, go over there and do whatever needed to get a US licence.

Essentially, is there a way that the FAA will recognise my UK flying hours (48 in a T67 Mk I) without me actually having a UK PPL?

I am almost resigned to having to pay the US instructors and start from scratch but I was hoping to save a couple of $1000 seeing as a lot of it is refresher rather than ab initio. I reckon I would need another 25 hours to get me to check ride status rather than the 40 they require for an ab initio. At $150/hr, that's a big chunk of flying and money.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!

Mark

[piperboy84]

It may seem like a pain in the rear and it's going to cost you a bit more but starting from scratch on a US PPL once you land stateside probably isn't a bad thing. Flying skills and knowledge are perishable and after 10 years of not flying the approximately 45 hours you'll take to get your US PPL will be a worthwhile investment and productive way to get current, safe and proficient in FAA land, and you won't have the ongoing hassle of it being a piggyback license if you ever decide to add an IFR ticket. The positives are your existing hours should help you get your new PPL quickly and judging by how much I have to fork over for medical treatment here in the US compared to the UK I'd assume you're going have a bit more disposal income to pay for the training

Good luck

[RatherBeFlying]

There are a number of flight schools in the US that train to EASA standards. If EASA rules allow credit for your UK military time, that might be the way to go;)

[n5296s]

My reading of 61.109a is that you probably need 30 hours of instruction. The other 10 hours you can take from your prior experience, assuming you have logbooks.

Honestly it would be better to ask this in a US forum. 61.109 doesn't say that the 30 hours of training must be in the US or with an FAA instructor, but maybe that is considered implicit.

It might be worth contacting the FAA about this.

[S-Works]

The easiest route is to do a NPPL and the convert it to an EASA PPL and the stick a 61.75 certificate on for flying in the USA.

Drop me a PM as we do these all the time.

[patowalker]

It is FAR 61.41 that applies to your case.


61.41 Flight training received from flight instructors not certificated by the FAA.

(a) A person may credit flight training toward the requirements of a pilot certificate or rating issued under this part, if that person received the training from:

(1) A flight instructor of an Armed Force in a program for training military pilots of either—

(i) The United States; or

(ii) A foreign contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation.

(2) A flight instructor who is authorized to give such training by the licensing authority of a foreign contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation, and the flight training is given outside the United States.

(b) A flight instructor described in paragraph (a) of this section is only authorized to give endorsements to show training given.

eCFR ? Code of Federal Regulations (http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=40760189a03dfea0b501608f33820a45&rgn=div5&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.1.2&idno=14#se14.2.61_141)

[n5296s]

A flight instructor who is authorized to give such training by the licensing authority of a foreign contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation
I THINK this mumbo-jumbo means a CFI in any ICAO signatory country, in which case you're covered (unless you trained in, I don't know, North Korea maybe). Though I wouldn't bet my certificate on it without a quick phone call to Oklahoma City.

[patowalker]

It is simpler than that:


(a) A person may credit flight training toward the requirements of a pilot certificate or rating issued under this part, if that person received the training from:

(1) A flight instructor of an Armed Force in a program for training military pilots of either—

(i) The United States; or

(ii) A foreign contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation.

[A and C]

I would get into contact with one of the RAF flying clubs as they have to deal with this sort of thing all the time.

The club at RAF Benson would be the number one choice as they have a large number of military rotary pilots who are getting or have got PPL's.

As an ex-serviceman you are entitled to join the club and it is operated on a non Proffit basis so the flying is inexpensive.

[Silvaire1]

Assuming you are moving to the US, I'd wait until you're here and fly with an instructor until ready for the check ride. All your military hours are will be credited if you have them logged. It shouldn't take long and you'll benefit from learning the local airspace and etc. It's not worth messing around with it in the UK.

I'd guess your 25 hr estimate is close. Good luck.

[B2N2]

All of your aeronautical experience counts in the US under FAA rules.
However, considering the amount of time you have not flown 25-30 hrs is not out of the question.

[LTCTerry]

How do you maximize what Mark has and the money he will need to spend? To use a 90s buzzword, how do you leverage his experience and his need(s)?


Mark is moving to the US to work. A "real" FAA certificate is better than one based on a UK license he'd have to keep current.


He should look at Part 61's aeronautical experience requirements for Private and for Commercial. He probably meets or exceeds most of them.


I am assuming British Army helicopter pilots are trained for instrument flight.


He can find an experienced CFII and work out a plan to train private, IFR, and commercial pretty much at the same time.


There's a significant overlap in the material for the written tests for private, instrument, and commercial. Studying for all three is not much more work than studying for one.


A private is required to take the commercial. So is an instrument rating. There is no requirement the aeronautical experience for the commercial certificate take place after the private check ride.


Mark can do all the training in a "complex" airplane so he's very familiar with it by checkride time. The incremental cost of "complex" over a 172 might well be absorbed by not having to train in one airplane then get a checkout/minimum hours in a second airplane.


If he desired, Mark could do the private and instrument check rides on one day and the commercial one the next. Imagining doing that with the same examiner? A lot of credibility is gained the first day.


He has single engine time. He knows how to fly/land. He can fly to the practice area with his instructor under the hood, practice commercial maneuvers, put the hood back on and fly an approach. Repeat.


If he pursues the NPPL/LAPL/PPL(A)/etc. route he's paying for something that would only serve as the foundation for an "on the basis of" private certificate which would need to be kept valid. This training would cost money, at UK rates and with UK weather. When he gets to the US he'd still have to do a flight review.


When I was young officer an old, retired NCO told me "Plan your work, and work your plan." If Mark gets a good CFII and plans his training and flies the plan, I think he could have all this done in 20-25 hours.


It all starts with identifying the gaps in his Part 61 Aeronautical Experience. Fill the gaps. (Mind the gaps?) Train to proficiency. Pass the writtens. Pass the check rides. Maximum gain for minimum pain.


Terry