Professional Pilots Forum?

[offa]

PPRune's header proudly states:

"Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots"
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At the end of a horrendous week a complete crew of - yes - Professional Pilots - are murdered in their hotel and what does our "Professional Pilots Rumour Network" do?

Move it into "Freight Dogs" as quickly as possible as if it was no concern to the rest of the industry ….

If one of the AF or Turkish crew had broken a fingernail the discussion would have run and run ..... shame on you at PPrune and condolences to the family and friends.

P.S. The gutter press don’t even bother to report the demise of an entire crew so PP admin can at least place themself one from the bottom rung of the ladder.

Shame on you!

[TheiC]

I'm inclined to agree.

Solidarity in the face of adversity is a marker of a good man.

This will be my last post here.

[wanabee777]

Completely agree!

[Mr A Tis]

Agree ! Tucked away in Freight Dogs, hardly seems appropriate.

[tubby linton]

Perhaps the owners of this site might like to spend some of their advertising revenue on sending something to the families of the crews who have died in the last month. Without their blood they would not have received the traffic to this site.

[HeartyMeatballs]

Agreed. Thoughts are with the families of some lost. Cue posts from mods about how they owe us nothing and how we should be grateful for prune. Perhaps some gratitude to us users (who bring in the many thousands of $ in revenue) wouldn't go amiss.

I've posted on my Facebook about it. I doubt it will even get a single like. Funny how not one of my friends mention it whatsoever. I ferry people around for a living but it bothers me how cargo crews are treated as some lower form of life by other crews. Sickening.

[Cows getting bigger]

Well said. As a professional pilot who plies his wares even further down the food chain (sub 19 seat AOC and aerial work), it sometimes irks me how a go-around or a precautionary engine shut down attracts excessive attention whilst real issues get shuffled away.

Shame on the anonymous moderator who, with the flick of a key, demonstrated how the industry can be so fickle.

[HeartyMeatballs]

I'm sure I'll offend many. But I think we're all one and the same wether you're flying a beat up light twin, flyin 180 chavs off to Alicante or 615 pax on the behmoth or flying vital cargo which makes the world go round or delivering vital aid. No matter if your office is on s beat up turbo, an ageing Antonov or a brand new 'bus, we're just doing a job. Trying to keep keep safe and keep a roof above our heads. We've lost a half dozen colleagues this week and let's never forget that.

[FlyingStone]

The said truth is that much of the world (both in and out of the industry) doesn't care about air freight operations.

Just compare the amount of news coverage of AF447 and the UPS or Asiana 747 cargo crashes.

[tubby linton]

The official statememt from the airline including photographs of the dead crew. The moderator who removed it from R&N obviously didn't believe the death of these aviators was news worthy.
OFFICIAL STATEMENT BY VOLGA-DNEPR AIRLINES REGARDING THE TRAGEDY IN BAMAKO, MALI (http://www.volga-dnepr.com/en/press-center/news/3594/)

[Lonewolf_50]

The official statememt from the airline including photographs of the dead crew.Obviously the moderator who removed it from R&N obviously didn't believe the death of these aviators was news worthy.
OFFICIAL STATEMENT BY VOLGA-DNEPR AIRLINES REGARDING THE TRAGEDY IN BAMAKO, MALI (http://www.volga-dnepr.com/en/press-center/news/3594/)Cut and pasted and saved the photos of the faces of those men, lost for no good reason. :uhoh: Thanks for the link, tubby.

[HIALS]

I concur. The article about this should be brought back into the mainstream of PPRuNe.

The story is about aircrew who were caught up in, and some even killed by, a terrorist attack on a crew hotel during an out-port layover. It is not an occurrence that was restricted to 'freight dogs' - as other airline crew were involved as well. This issue is noteworthy and relevant to all aircrew that do out-port layovers, and is most certainly worthy of being 'front and centre' in PPRuNe.

The way this topic has been treated by PPRuNe sends a very distasteful message - namely that freight carrier aircrew are considered to be less important than passenger carrier aircrew. This apparent marginalisation of freighter crews, casts a real shadow over the standing of PPRuNe as a forum for professional pilots.

[CargoOne]

Shame on moving it Freight Dogs. Our colleagues, 3 of them flight crew, 1 loadie and 2 engineers lost their lives. How this can be not worth noting on the main forum?

My condolences to relatives and Volga Dnepr

[Petercwelch]

Please put it back.

[UV]

Absolutely, there must be many others like me who missed this part of the massacre on the TV news, and who don't usually look in Freight Dogs, so would never have known... had it not been for this thread.

[ExSp33db1rd]

Agree with it all.

Once, in my local pub. I mentioned that I'd just got home after a freight trip. I was asked when I could expect "promotion" to flying passengers ? I explained that, subject to my bidding seniority, I actually chose to fly the freighters. Once one is away from home local clock time means nothing, one eats when one is hungry and sleeps when one is tired - hopefully - so the apparently unsocial hours of freighter schedules didn't matter, and as I was paid to fly the aeroplane, be it full of freight or self-loading freight made little difference to me, I flew the bit in front of the cockpit door, the rest just followed.

These were Professional Crew, and should be honoured as such.

[WillowRun 6-3]

Absolutely, there must be many others like me who missed this part of the massacre on the TV news, and who don't usually look in Freight Dogs, so would never have known... had it not been for this thread.


Exactly so.

[Lonewolf_50]

These were Professional Crew, and should be honoured as such.Yep. Now you can appreciate how we felt sometimes as rotary wing pilots on aircraft carriers amongst the jet folk. ;)

By the way, these were Professional Crew, and should be honoured as such is 100% agreed.

[RadarContactLost]

These were Professional Crew, and should be honoured as such.

Agree 100%. The owners of the site have no clue about aviation, They sit in an Internet Brand office in L.A. and count revenue dollars made that day.
Not an aviator but involved in aviation for many years, fueller, de icer, loadie, to running a flt school. Spent many years freezing m y balls off off on the cargo ramp.
This is news and pertains to all aviators and belongs in r&n.
Have had a few adult beverages...
I dont post much here a n ymore because IB is all about $$$

[Wizofoz]

PPRUNE as miles of form on this.

They moved a thread I started when a professional air-show pilot was killed to "Private pilots"- hugely insulting and insensitive.

They have a very narrow view of what makes someone a "Professional pilot".

[RadarContactLost]

Wizofoz. Exactly!! They only care about revenue

[de facto]

Absolutely disgusting!
Even the other thread was closed.
It was a sad sad day indeed.

[framer]

I do eight layover nights a month. Because my payload is pax, I never go to Freight Dogs. I would not have known about this had this thread not started.
Pprune is about 50/50 Professional Pilots now, it has been in steady decline for a few years. To the Pprune staff: The numbers might look good to you right now but if the Professional pilots stop visiting your site there will be no motivation for all the flight simmers, pax, media etc to visit, and you will become obsolete.

[lilflyboy262...2]

There was also a helicopter crash thread that was locked yesterday.
The pilot was well known among many fixed wing pilots with his time spent in various locations around the globe.
Was locked in favour for the thread that had been started in the rotorheads forum.
Many of us fixed wing guys don't go into the fling wing forums.

[Senior Pilot]

At the end of a horrendous week a complete crew of - yes - Professional Pilots - are murdered in their hotel and what does our "Professional Pilots Rumour Network" do?

Move it into "Freight Dogs" as quickly as possible as if it was no concern to the rest of the industry ….

The thread was moved, complete with a redirect that can be followed with the click of a mouse button, to the Forum that relates to the crew and their operation.

There was also a helicopter crash thread that was locked yesterday.
The pilot was well known among many fixed wing pilots with his time spent in various locations around the globe.
Was locked in favour for the thread that had been started in the rotorheads forum.
Many of us fixed wing guys don't go into the fling wing forums.

Again, redirected to a thread that was already running before the post in R & N, along with a post from me as to why plus a redirect. R & N is not the 'main forum' for many users of PPRuNe, believe it or not.

No threads have been deleted. No acknowledgement of these tragedies have been deleted nor modified. One was the loss of a helicopter and lives in the Rotorheads forum, the other was the loss of freight crews and resides in the Freight Dogs forum.

offa, you have arced up on two forums with duplicate posts, one has been deleted: by me. Quite why there is such indignation and free tickets on the outrage bus is a mystery; but it will remain a mystery because this thread will now be closed.

If you feel connected to the threads on the two topics then please add to them, on topic. Don't bother pretending that you can't visit another forum because it's not your preference; that's hardly the action of a professional pilot wishing to show concern over the loss of other pilots :=