Trying to plan a trip from Dublin to Moscow

[MarcusH]

I am looking into setting up a trip in our club 172 from Dublin to Moscow, has anyone tried this in the past? I notice that Skydemon only goes as far as the former soviet states but it doesn't have Russia. It seems to be the challenge that a few of us are looking for. What would be required?

All your answers are hugely appreciated.

[Above The Clouds]

You could always give Mathius Rust a call :)

On a serious note not an easy task, but certainly not impossible, some points for consideration:

Routing, overflight and landing permissions, visa's, fuel, weather, VFR maps (I have up to date ones), brush up on your QFE procedures, below approx. 3000ft reference to altitude if is given as a height in meters, at certain airports QFE is given in millimetres, wind speeds from ATC are given in meters thats a simple conversion, whatever you are given in meters per second double it will equal knots, but if your not expecting it :ooh:

Depending what time of the year you are planning this keep in mind winter is on its way so refresh your winter ops and de-icing procedures, book hangarage in advance, it will be very expensive in the winter if available, also during the winter the wx can change quickly in Moscow, equally in the summer as well from VFR to thunder storms. Check well in advance that fuel is available, you also may not get 100LL but a lower Oct or even 130 Oct.

The routing side of things is the biggest issue because as a non Russian registered aircraft you will have to keep to what you declare to customs, equally you need to plan carefully because although there are many airports in Russia many are not available to non Russian registered aircraft so your range could be an issue, especially arriving into the Moscow area were sometimes you can expect to hold for anything up to 2 hours if Mr P decides to fly.

[The Ancient Geek]

There are specialist handling agents who will do all of the work for you, they are worth their fees.

Sorry, I have no idea who to suggest in europe but the guys I used in africa many years ago fixed everything including routing with alternates, visas, overflight and landing permissions, fuel etc and even hotels along the route.

It is possible to do it all yourself but there are too many traps for the unwary, these guys know the ropes because they do it every day for the bizjets.

[Above The Clouds]

And as much as some posters here will tell you the NDB approach is no longer used and should be confined to the dark ages. Make sure you are proficient as its a very common practice in Russia, nearly every airport has one and they use them very regularly.

[tdbristol]

3 Moscow airfields : Vnukovo, Sheremetyvo (sp?) and one other but only these 2 would accept GA.
Might be easier now with some GA in Russia such as Diamond DA40 Tundra. But I tried to fly my plane to Moscow 4 years ago, was too expensive in over flight fees then. There was no distinction for any plane smaller than 50 seats and the over flight fee alone was $1700.
No AVGAS in Moscow then and would have needed it shipped in or a ferry tank. I believe also VFR flights required a Russian speaker in the plane with you on the radio (I would have been IFR so not a problem for me but could be if you are going VFR).

I tried pulling some strings: at the time a pal of mine was CEO of an airline based at Sheremetyvo but even he couldn't get the rules changed to make it cost feasible.
So I flew to Berlin instead then commercial to Moscow.

Sorry to put a dampener on this; believe it is better now - Diamond are targeting the Russian GA market so it must be possible now - suggest you get in touch with Diamond and ask for their help.

[Above The Clouds]

Main published Moscow airports;
UUWW Vnukovo
UUDD Domodevo
UUEE Sheremtyevo
UUBW Ramenskoye
UUMO Ostafyevo

There are approx. another 10 airports but they are either military or civil for Russian users only and not displayed on western maps or charts. You would have to land initially at either UUWW, UUDD or UUEE for your customs clearance before you would be allowed to proceed to any other airport in the area.

[Jan Olieslagers]

On a very humble note because I am speaking neither from actual experience not even from profound study. Yet: something tells me Moscow is not the easiest destination, especially for a small plane. Big cities rarely are, after all.

If the goal is really to get to Moscow, then go for it, but prepare very thoroughly. If the goals is to have flown and landed in Russia, there are perhaps easier destinations. Sankt Peterburg might be one, that city has been open to the wider world since its creation.

[Romeo Tango]

My information is that Russia will not accept avgas aircraft unless you can show that you can get in and out on one tank or you have access to avgas in country.

Suggest you talk to these people for latest info:
Overflight flight clearance specialists (http://www.overflight.co.uk/)

[MarcusH]

It looks like St Petersburg might be the way to go. We are trying to set up an adventure for a few of us, bureaucracy is just a bore. We would go further into Russia if we were able to do so without too many problems. I will contact some agents and see if they can help. I'd anyone has a contact email or phone number I would contact Mathius and see what he could tell me.
Many thanks for the helpful replies

[Jan Olieslagers]

I think you missed a smiley... Mathias Rust (sic) was the chap who landed a C172 in Red Square, in the 1980's I think.

As for your project: couldn't you get in touch with flying clubs either in Finland or in the Baltics? But relations between the Baltic countries and Russia are rather stressed, lately.

[MarcusH]

The whole idea is to get a few of us to fly from west to east, we might then go for the northern most points of Europe the following year, we did Spain this summer, everyone had a blast.

Better still we might get a few aircraft to fly over together, it gives more pilots a chance to get to know one another.

As for Matius Rust (some people have great memories!). I wonder did he find a chart somewhere? I guess I missed the smiley:O

[Sam Rutherford]

We took seven private helicopters to Moscow last May.

It is possible but EXTREMELY difficult and very expensive.

Cheers, Sam.


PS lack of coverage on Sky Demon is absolutely the last of your worries! :ok:

[Victorian]

Why not consider going to Finland's wonderful Malmi (EFHF) airport instead. You can get a high speed train from Helsinki to St Petersburg! Malmi is threatened with closure due to land development and next year might be the last chance to go there. They need all the support they can get.

From Malmi, you can route to Tallinn and on through Latvia, Lithuania and Poland on your way home. This all works with no bureaucratic problems - I did it in a PA-28 from UK last month.

Edited to say that on that routing you get to fly around Russia - the Kaliningrad enclave - if not actually through it!

[WhiskeyPapa]

I live in Moscow. In fact, I started my training at airfields outside the city. Interestingly enough, my plane is now in Ireland & I'm considering moving it to Lithuania at the end of October (or possibly next spring). You will not have a problem landing at a Russian port of entry except for the cost (however, I am not sure on the availability of 100LL). Of course, you will need a visa.

I would recommend contacting AOPA Russia for advice. Their telephone is +7.495.926.7038. Email: [email protected]. PM me if you like.

BTW I agree that St. Petersburg might be your best bet for a first trip (a beautiful city to visit as well), given its proximity to the Baltics which are GA friendly.