Aircraft lease

[albain]

Hi All

I'm trying to find a company in the UK / Europe who will dry lease Cessna 185 & 206 amphibians.

does anyone have any ideas?

Cheers

[Genghis the Engineer]

I'd be amazed! Very niche, and not exactly an obvious business model for anybody.

If you need one, I think you need to buy or create one.

G

[9 lives]

Hi Albain,

As G has said, I'd be very surprised of such an amphibian could be leased anywhere, let alone the UK. I cannot speak for the UK, but you'd find that for the few amphibious Cessnas you can rent in Canada, the limitations on where the aircraft can fly, and who flies it to be so restrictive as to make the effort pointless. It's basically an insurance situation.

For your reference, I, with 600 hours of floatplane experience, and a further 500 hours of amphibian time, and owning a non Cessna amphibian, am insured on my friend's 182 amphib, and the insurance premium for that exceeds $10,000 per year. The insurers know that anywhere you land on the water is not an airport, and often away from aircraft support and infrastructure, so any problem is a big one, and, the risk of landing with the wheels selected to the wrong position is very high. The insurance premiums are set accordingly, and that pretty well makes renting them out impossible to insure. For your reference, that 182 amphib is based in Norway, and the operating cost is budgeted at E500 per hour.

In Canada, renting a floatplane is possible, though not common. Generally, there is a lot of "process" to go through to get to take the rental floatplane to another body of water. You do not just hop in it and go.

The best plan to use an amphibian is to purchase it, and then sell it when you're finished using it. In addition to a Cessna amphibian, also consider a Lake Amphibian. They are actually more safe, when flown by a well trained pilot, and less expensive to buy, though maintenance is not cheap on them.

[albain]

Thanks guys,

Does the Lake Amphibian have the same wave restrictions as float planes like the Cessna? also, is there a 6 seat version?

I've found a company that rents the 208 in the UK but nothing else Cessna Caravan - Aerodynamics (http://www.adl.aero/cessna-caravan.html)

Regards,
Alasdair

[9 lives]

Lake Amphibians and Renegades are not 6 seat planes. They will handle waves better than Cessna (185/206) floatplanes, however: If wave height is an operational concern, the waves are too big to go. You do not choose a GA seaplane based upon its ability to land in high waves, you choose the aircraft which will do the job on more calm water. Then you use your considerable experience to judge for each landing or takeoff, if the wave height will create a hazard, and carefully mitigate, if the wave height exceeds your or the aircraft capabilities.

This is one of the main reasons insurance can be very costly in seaplanes, the insurance company is betting upon the skill of a pilot to observe, judge and select a suitable water area every time. This is completely backward to an airport, where winds aside, anything which changes or affects the runway will probably be reported to the pilot. When I train in seaplanes like the Lake, or Cessna, I will train that more than 9" high waves should be making you rethink how badly you need to be on that water, knowing that the 50% judgement error that will be made thereafter, will hopefully keep the pilot away from the 12" waves, which are generally considered limiting for these aircraft. Many time too often, the new pilot has said "I can land on that", and I have told them that they cannot do it safely. Judging the difference between 9" and 15" high waves from 500 feet takes skill, and getting it wrong is bad. I was in a back seat of a 185 decades ago, in which the pilot got it wrong, and very costly damage resulted.

If there is a Caravan on floats available, it will be for hire (by which I mean with a pilot), not for rent for you to fly away on your own. You should expect that if you are hiring a Caravan pilot to take you to a body of water not familiar to them, they will express that operation as a "try" rather than assurance that they can get it before they see it. The Caravan will handle waves greater than 12" but not a lot more.

[Big Pistons Forever]

Cessna 206's on amphibian floats are not 6 place airplanes, they are barely 4 seat capable as the floats are so heavy.