EK and the Future

[Neptune Spear]

Today is the last day of the financial year and Emirates profit should be huge. The largest ever. I'm hoping for a profit share of around 14-15 weeks. The pay raise I'm not so confidant on.
The question I have before the house is does anyone think it is going to get better here? We are all hearing some bad rumors with regards to the bidding system and amount of hours we will have to fly each month. Those have not happened yet (luckily) but does anyone have information on when or if those will happen?
Pilots are leaving and Emirates is struggling to recruit qualified pilots. That statement in itself should bode well for future Quality of Life issues and compensation at Emirates. However most people and pilots I talk to doesn't seem to think so. Any thoughts?
Emirates isn't the airline I signed up for, I just hope it gets better here. To hedge the future job applications went out recently. As we all know but mangement doesn't fully comprehend yet there are plenty of other options out there and most are better options.

[jack schidt]

The accountants feed the greed of those higher up the food chain.

There is a multitude of pilots only 3 hours flying time away that would take a position in Emirates for half the money that is currently being offered. The big question is "what will the safety culture of the airline be should those pilots be hired" considering the number of bought licenses that are in operation.

Does Emirates protect its "Brand Name" and keep its current workforce in place (which it is struggling to do just now), or will the greed become so great that the wood cannot be seen because of the trees by management?

J

[SOPS]

I am told by many people to stop posting on here. However, I hope you get 15 weeks. My thoughts are they will hide it, and give the staff 3 to 4 weeks.

Good luck to all....I will watch with interest

[cerbus]

Stay engaged SOP. It will help the rest of us focus on getting out of here and with the info you give (sunsets w/ your dogs) it will drive us even harder to realize that there is a better world out there.

[thefoxandfirkin]

Until Fedex or UPS give me a job I'll stick around for a while. Neither of my buckets is full yet.

I reckon the profit share will be a whopper this year but that will be it for a few years as the global economies seem to have peaked as oil priced reached a low and are rising. Next year will be harder.

I'm not so optimistic about the pay rise though....

[SOPS]

Cerbus..I want to stay connected...but the hate Mail I'm getting is amazing. I'm just happy to be home, loving life, taking my dogs to the beach every day, sleeping with my wife every night, and I wake up knowing I never have to catch s flight back to Dubai ever again.

[BigGeordie]

SOPS, they are just jealous. I know I am. It's a free country (well actually Dubai isn't but you know what I mean) so if you want to post go right ahead. I'm just not sure why you would want to? Once I'm out of here I hope never to post here again. To the relief of many no doubt.

[Pilot_Recruit]

As a great poet once said SOP's, "Haters gonna hate". There are a lot of negative perspectives on this website and it's nice to see a positive one from someone who took the leap and is enjoying the proverbial grass is greener.

I really believe that with market forces finally dictating recruitment and attrition, along with a mega profit this year that we will actually get a huge profit share. Fingers crossed for everyone.

[junglie-driver]

Twenty weeks & 20%

Tell enough people and it will happen......

[Trader]

4 weeks, and 8% - with the productivity threshold removed so they can work us to the max hours. Cost neutral in their eyes. New computer system -- will get 8 GDOs per month with AD's to fill rest

[nolimitholdem]

SOPS,

I'm totally baffled why you would be getting hate mail. What kinds of things are they saying? Why on earth would anyone be angry you've made it over the wall? Bizarre.

Anyway, I hope you will continue to contribute. If anything, do it to be an irritant to the haters. As they say...the best revenge, is a life well lived! :ok:

[TransitCheck]

This company is at a crossroads. If they want to be successful they need to have the employees on their side. As of now, they do not which is evident by the number of people leaving. Some suggestions to fix the issues on the pilot end of things:

1. Remove the jealous engineer who is now in charge of pilots. Split his role and on the pilot side replace the engineer with a pilot who actually understands rostering issues and fatigue commensurate with the type of flying we are doing.

2. Bring the OT threshold down to 80 hours and reduce pilot scheduling to an average of 80 hours per month. The current threshold is unsustainable for long haul flying/back side of the clock flying.

3. Remove the manual insertion monkeys from rostering and actually train them to maximize our vacation and do the best they can for our quality of life......rather than the opposite that is happening now such as spitefully throwing on a turn around the day before vacation starts.

4. Remove ALL arbitrary non-regulatory rules from the bidding system including but not limited to:

-max 7 days off in a row
-maximum of 3 trips to the same destination in a month
-and many others too numerous to list.
-basically, if its legal, let us do it.....stop over-controlling everyone. People will be more happy to work if you allow them to go where they want.

ADD the following:

-ability to swap into productivity knowing that you will not be paid for it.
-4 day string of pre-assigned off days in a reserve month.
-If a trip is removed from your roster during a non-reserve month, by 6pm the night before the trip was originally to start, you must be either assigned a trip or OFF days for the rest of the footprint of the trip...no more reserve periods for non reserve months.
-Daily credit of 4 hours per vacation day
-Daily credit of 5 hours per day of ground duty.

[delorean79]

I wish that was our future, but can't stop thinking about the reaction of the managers after reading the last post:

http://blogs.plos.org/obesitypanacea/files/2014/11/laughter.jpg

[sheiken around]

Transit,

All Excellent suggestions !!

BUT...It'll never happen. It would cause them to lose face (which in this part of the world is a NO-NO)

And..EK is at a crossroad...you're absolutely correct !! However, watch the crossroad turn in to an absolute cluster F*ck as they continue to "manage" the crews that they have now...

[TransitCheck]

I know.....they would rather watch the ship sink than actually take advice from the soldiers on the front line.

The sad thing is that most suggestions, other than the 80 hour threshold, would be nearly cost neutral so there is really no excuse.

The eject button is armed already

[SOPS]

Excellent post Transit. Especially the comment about them over controlling people. That's the worst part IMHO, the constant micro managing of your life.

[jack schidt]

To ERR is human, to BLAME OTHERS for your mistakes is Management strategy!

[FcU]

"Inventories can be managed, but people must be led", Ross Perot. We have a lot of managers but very few Leaders. Its clear how they view the hardworking staff of this airline. Morale has never been lower and our "managers" have lost the goodwill of their inventory. Well done:D:D:D.

[Schnowzer]

Transit, if they just dust off the FOM from before TCK came along they can save on printing costs!

[fatbus]

I hope everyone ready this realizes EK does not care about its employees all they care about is money. There is no going back. You can be replaced. Don't , for a sec, think you can make a difference by pressing 2 or leaving. They will never admit to parking A/C. If required, increase the training buget and outsource if required.

[sluggums]

What, the outsource training that's costing us millions of wasted dollars because there's nobody to fill the courses, and quite rightly the training centres are not refunding this bunch of mis-managers at the last minute for the unused slots...?

Row harder minions...

[paokara]

Support the 3 Lagacies if you want to have a bright future back home

Or

Fight the 3 back home if you want to stay there


Your choice



Join ALPA PAC, then raise your voice to ALPA as well, about preferential Interview etc

Siting back and expecting others to fight on your behalf is not an option

[Emma Royds]

sluggums

I had also heard that we have very recently cancelled some third party training but I had no idea that the cost was into the millions? It is not that expensive for a type rating course or maybe you know something that I don't? ;)

One can only suspect that it is due to the fact that we can't recruit in the numbers required.

[Flyboy_SG]

92 hrs a month is crazy. Whereas 70-75 hrs with neighbours.

[SOPS]

92 hours a month, every month, for years was one of my reasons for leaving. I decided it was going to seriously affect my health if I did not stop. And funnily enough, my EK doctor agreed with me.

[Flyboy_SG]

Crazy ! Cant imagine doing it months together back to back.:ugh:

[SOPS]

Try years back to back.

[icarux]

Transitcheck sums up perfectly the improvements needed at EK , there is two things going against us, first, they don't care about improvement of our quality of life, second ,with the staffing shortage coming soon the last solution on their board is lowering productivity. This next bonus might be a good one, but it will be like using a plastic bandage over an axe wound.

[paokara]

So how much a third year 777 first officer makes at Emirates that flies
92 hrs per month ? I want to know cash in your pocket and how much they put in your provident fund

[donpizmeov]

More than you would have made at COPA as a Capt I would think. Let it go...you fly shorthaul with a "lagacy" (too much spoiler perhaps?) now. Try and be happy with that.

[Mrs Mangels]

6% more than a 1st year.

:rolleyes:

[paokara]

92 hrs at Copa left seat is around 120k.... .....Not much but if you hop to China is 19.5k per month after you get 1000 pic... Friends done that
They provide housing and 2 extra monthly payments per year ... So 8 weeks extra ( Copa)
You may want to look into it. Close to US

And 7 year wide body 76 and up FO is 159 per hr plus 4.50 override so for 92hrs (rig of course , flying 78-80) is 15042 per month plus 16 percent retirement plus PS 7 k that's low but it is what it is in the States

Per
Airlinepilotcentral.com rates plus 6percent since they are not updated

Now can you answer the question? What's so hard DPZMOV




I am asking because someone told me 3-4 year Fos on the 777 make close to 200k per year ,,,

[donpizmeov]

I would think a third year FO would make less than a Capt in China, and less than a 7th year FOs pre tax salary on the 767 in United. I am not sure what you are trying to work out?
I don't think FOs are flying 92hrs here. I will wait for them to correct me here, but they seem to be flying around the 75 to 85 hour mark. That may only be the fleet I am on though. Capts are certainly cranking out the hours.
Perhaps you should compare after tax 1st year salaries?

[go46ball]

Don I would have to disagree. I'm approaching my 4th year now. For the last 6 months I've been maxed out. 97.5 last month. Called 2 times on days off to cover flying which I was happy to say no too! I know of a few others that are the same as me. So it may not be all fo's but it is quite a few for sure.

[paokara]

Thank you Don

[jidder]

:(

For nearly a year FOs are pushing out max hours and getting called on days off. Hence the new roster will be giving minimum legal days off so they can work you on AD and ruin the rest of your roster month. :ugh:

Exit plan on the horizon.

J:E

[donpizmeov]

So there you go. Seems everyone is at max hours now. What a well oiled machine. What could possibly go wrong?

[TCU LUX]

91hrs plus plus this month.

Same last month.

Over 92 hours in a month not long before that.

This has been the norm for almost a year now!

So yes, FO's are flying 92hrs a month.

Can't get leave, can't swap flights & the rosters suck = health starting to suffer

Not on 330 by the way.

EK Rosters = :yuk:

[Fear_of_heights]

380 FOs fly 75-90
777 FOs fly 92+
Captains 93+ in all fleets.

That amount (after tax)is about right if you take in consideration accommodation allowance, provident fund, school allowance for 2 kids and that doesn't include the 12+ weeks bonus that we will get this year !!!😈

[alwayzinit]

back to the future of EK.

The Ad on the this site asks "Where could you be Tomorrow?"

A very good question indeed for many here in the Pit .................................:D