Here we go again, cockpit photos, good bye jumpseat

[SMOC]

https://www.google.com/url?rct=j&sa=t&url=http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1730829/hong-kong-flight-landing-filmed-passenger-cockpit-sparks-safety&ct=ga&cd=CAEYACoTNTk3NTAzNTgxNTEwMTcxNTg3MTIaYWMzY2IyMDE2NDVhOTk4M zpjb206ZW46VVM&usg=AFQjCNG0pExAhI6PH55AJzkjOsf8sEA3eA

Video has emerged of a Cathay Pacific flight landing at Hong Kong International airport said to have been filmed by a passenger from inside the cockpit.

The footage, which shows an onboard countdown before the plane lands, circulated online after it was posted along with six photos to the Weibo account of Ada Ng Tsz-yan, a young woman who said the pilot allowed her to sit in the cabin.

Ng said in a message dated March 3 that the flight was full and she was fortunate to have been allowed by the captain to sit behind him in the cockpit.

WATCH: Woman allowed by captain to sit in Cathay Pacific flight's cockpit



“Experiencing the take-off and landing inside the cockpit is very cool,” she said.

One photo, which shows a ticket bearing Ng’s name, suggested the trip was Cathay Pacific flight 465 from Taipei to Hong Kong on February 26, a route usually flown on a Boeing 777-300.

Other photos showed a view of what is believed to be a runway at Chek Lap Kok airport, lined with other planes to one side.

The South China Morning Post is this morning contacting Cathay Pacific and airport authorities for verification and comment.


Ng posted a photo of her ticket for flight CX465 from Taipei to Hong Kong. Photo: SCMP Pictures

Heightened security measures in the wake of the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks in the United States have meant greater restrictions on who is allowed to access the flight deck.

In February, a US congressman proposed a bill that would add a locked wire mesh gate between passenger cabins and cockpit doors to make it more difficult for passengers and potential hijackers to get into the cockpit.

The bill also points out that although Federal Aviation Administration rules say the reinforced cockpit doors must be closed, in reality pilots and flight attendants open them quite often for bathroom and meal breaks.

When this legislation was first introduced in 2013, airlines in the US did not support it, saying that secondary barriers were unnecessary, and that if airlines wanted to install them, it should be up to them and not the government, according to the Chicago Tribune.

Posters on question-and-answer site quora.com report that post-September 11, 2001 most captains will not allow passengers to enter the cockpit during a flight.


A pilot's eye view of the plane taken by the passenger. Photo: SCMP Pictures

Last March, photographs showed the co-pilot of missing Malaysia Airlines flight 370 entertaining and smoking with teenage tourists in the cockpit during a previous flight.

In 2011, Cathay Pacific sacked a pilot and a flight attendant after photos showed them engaging in a sex act inside the cockpit. Those images emerged a few days before the launch of a planned ad campaign, which would have featured flight attendants, pilots and other employees in informal poses with the slogan, “Meet the team who go the extra mile to make you feel special.”

The Post reported at the time that the pilot and flight attendant were a couple, and the pilot had complained that the photos were personal images downloaded from his laptop and distributed without his permission.




Standard bottom feeding news for the SCMP thanks to Lai Ying-kit and Alan Yu, clearly on the way to Pulitzer, poor chic probably just joined.

[broadband circuit]

I assume this silly young girl is either staff, or a dependent.

i.e. absolutely permitted to be on the jump seat.

Ok, she shouldn't be posting that on the net, but she was no doubt permitted to be there.

Good work by the bottom feeding journalists.

[oriental flyer]

Doing someone a favour and this is how they repay you. By stabbing you in the back
This is exactly why I no longer give jump seats to arbitrary people. It simply isn' t worth it
So well done to the stupid bi- itch for ruining the priveledge for numerous others

Judging by the photos they were probably serupticiously taken without the pilots consent
But this is a non story , it must have been a slow news day .

[sjm]

The ticket has jump seat on it!

[Trafalgar]

From now on, ONLY other pilots will be given JS. End of story.

[dribbler]

Unfortunately, she has showed that to be the only safe and sensible policy (in terms of career preservation) for future jump seat allocations....... I don't want to have to continually monitor jump seat pax to enforce the "no pics" rule. Have better things to do...l

[CokeZero]

Its hard to watch passengers in the JS from doing something like this. Your attention is diverted to the job at hand.

Hopefully management take her aside and explain the consequences of her action. Even though she might be staff, or she is a dependant (Hopefully she is), she needs to be informed that this affects not only her but the rest of the staff and that JS's in the future could be jeopardised by her actions.

[Kontract Killer]

I think the FAU would melt down if the company banned the use of the JS's for their commuting crews.

Without ISD's strong demand, I'm sure the company would stop the policy, just to piss us off even further!

Denying JS's to CC, is not a very productive solution for anyone.

Don't persecute a whole demographic, for a few that probably didn't know any better. If she was crew, perhaps ISD should do a better job at educating their staff, on JS use and etiquette. Shouldn't think they even know what is in the OPS A, regarding photography.

No I'm not banging one :ugh::=

[VR-HFX]

The SCMP proves yet again that it is unworthy to be the wrapping for my prawn shells.

This stupid little girl hasn't got anything keeping her ears apart and proves yet again that the "One Team One Dream" has become a giant kindergarten.

She was issued a JMP boarding pass and I think it would be fair to assume she was travelling on an ID90 ticket or equivalent. If these people have no inbred or learned commonsense then it is necessary for the check-in and gate staff to get them to sign a 50 page agreement saying that they should shut up and keep their iphones switched off.

As others have alluded to, the goodwill in releasing the jumpseat has further shrunk and now falls into line with ground staff goodwill to flight crew travelling on ID tickets.

Welcome to Kitty Land....giving Disneyland a run for its money.

[SweepTheLeg]

What a b*ll**** article...

Trying desperately to make a sensationalist story over something completely routine and legal. Pathetic.

[Hellenic aviator]

If she was crew, perhaps ISD should do a better job at educating their staff, on JS use and etiquette. Shouldn't think they even know what is in the OPS A, regarding photography.


ISD is interested more in providing good customer service to the pax and less attention on educating cabin crews on JS etiquette. Most are familiar only with Vol.5, not OPS A.

The sad part is that instead of disciplining (or educating :hmm: ) the person(s) involved, everyone (staff eligible for JS, immediate Family) will now pay the consequence.

[anotherbusdriver]

I would think she is probably innocent of trying to cause harm. In fact, it looks as though she was excited and happy, and thought it was fantastic!!

It is probably just a lack of education from her family member as to photography not being allowed. And I would also suggest that her family member is most probably ground staff.
(Ground staff tend to be the ones who understand the whole jumpseat thing the least. Ground staff are also the ones who never say thanks, or never pass on a message that they got a seat and are on board).

The rules really ought to be published to jumpseat requesters by the company, like an electronic checklist, to tick and acknowledge the rules, before the request is submitted. Kind of like the plastic card they put in our hands at check-in explaining DG's and security requirements.

I think we should give the poor girl a break, she probably feels bad enough as it is.

[Shep69]

Ops-A is pretty clear in prohibiting in flight pictures on the flight deck except with express approval.

As it is in many other airlines and services. Since the invention of the airplane and the camera it has also been one of the most broken rules; usually without incident or fanfare by those having the judgment and wherewithal to do it correctly and safely. In fact, many useful snapshots for training and unusual/unique circumstances (for a good cause--to pass on to other pilots something valuable to know) are published in our own newsletters and official publications themselves which were taken in contravention to the 'technicality' side of the rule. But don't really present a problem.

Pilots and cameras can be a bad combination. The key here is if someone is going to take pictures they do it safely and with discretion and judgment. Filming a landing and posting it for the world to see does NOT fall into that category. It kind of sucks when the lowest common denominator bites everyone. Most of us would have the good sense to do the right thing and be discreet if someone had a lapse of judgment, but not everyone has good sense, nor does it appear the individual knew it wasn't allowed.

[SMOC]

The fact it's not allowed is the only reason this mole hill is now a mountain, a simple rule change, such as "when permitted by the captain" (with appropriate guidance in part A) would make this a non event as it would no longer be news worthy, the internet is flooded with cockpit photography usually done in a professional manner that normally never makes the news. :ugh:

The CAD should butt out and just say don't let it interfere with safety.

[Dan Winterland]

I tell my JS pax not to take photos or video, but unless you are going to distract yourself by turning around and watching them continuously, you don't know what they are doing.

[Dan Winterland]

I wouldn't rate Ada's chances of getting another JS.

[Yonosoy Marinero]

Hopefully management take her aside and explain the consequences of her action.

Wouldn't it be easier for them (and more satisfying) to just blame and discipline the pilots?

:}

[SloppyJoe]

Regardless of her intentions common manners would dictate that if she wanted to take pictures of someones workplace she should ask the person working there if it is OK. Especially in the workplace she was allowed into as a favor so as to facilitate her journey.

[RHEINHARD]

You forgot the refusal to hold a door open, not saying thank you for anything, :ugh: and blind obsession with money.
The cad will put the kibosh on jumpseats I reckon.

[Soul planet]

http://vpic.video.qq.com/4251706153/b0012uozl6u_ori_5.jpg

30 years old cx cabin crew, divorced, and has went on a China matchmaking show a year or two ago. Thats how she described hrself on the show, and now thanks to this funny fellow, we might say bye to jump seat now.

Disclaimer: her identity is all over hk news now

[Fly747]

Great comment in the SCMP online:

if this is ugly , fat lady, then it wont raise any problem,
since she is a pretty lady, it would raise a lot of concern about pilot attitude.
pilot is putting the lives of passenger in great danger.

Sadly the usual knee jerk reaction will affect us all.

[Soul planet]

Sorry she is not pretty to me :ugh:
Anyone who is not distinctively ugly can look decent.



The Aussie ladies in the Malaysian airline cockpit were ugly too (please Google pics). So I don't think that is the focus.

Ada Ng- She is only famous in mainland China for desperately finding a husband on TV.

You can easily find out about her divorce and stuff by googling her Chinese name. Or go on cx page on Facebook to see how everyone feels about her sabotaging the jump seat. :D

[Soul planet]

http://vimg.jstv.com/images/201304/20130416091528_small.jpg

A few years ago, her match making ad. Pretty??? :8

[wheels up]

Commenters on the website Chinanews.com suggested pilots could be distracted by the presence of a beautiful woman in the cockpit.


So does that mean no more pretty woman pilots??? :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Garbage reporting at its worse.

[Soul planet]

http://i57.tinypic.com/6pyols.jpg



And who could forget this beautiful man?

[Anotherday]

I thought it was pretty simple. You give them a brief when they first sit in the jumpseat. Either she didn't know, the flightcrew didn't brief her, they allowed it or she forgot. Won't be hard to figure out which.....

[Soul planet]

Brief what? She used to work for Cathay and has resigned. Will surprise me if she knows nothing about the rules or rather screaming for attention after uprising from a Chinese matchmaking show. Can't blame her ex husband for divorcing her. She posted the pictures and videos on her blog for more followers and attention, and had done that on a purpose.

[crwkunt roll]

So how did she get on the jumpseat? Maybe TPE groundstaff should be investigated (finally).

[Bangaluru]

She's not on the Jumpseat list for that flight now. J2 & J3 are allocated and neither of them have her name.

[ACMS]

The jump seat list is irrelevant and means nothing.

The fact is she holds a boarding pass with JUMP written on it issued by the ground staff.

[deptrai]

Yawn. Fragrant harbour is home to some of my favorite threads on pprune, like "a firm grasp of the non-essential", yet this here is just boring.

[Just Do It]

Deptrai, give it a chance its starting to get interesting!

[asianeagle]

The cad will put the kibosh on jumpseats I reckon.

not likely, seems the company need the jumpseats as much as we do to DT various staffers in and out for courses etc. when the flights are full.
Too tight to spring for a seat in the cabin :ugh:

[Bangaluru]

The fact that she's not on the jumpseat list makes her presence in the cockpit suspicious. Do questions need to be asked of the Taipei ground staff and the Captain? Last time the topic of jumpseats came up with groundstaff in Taipei, I was told in no uncertain terms that Hong Kong and Taipei do not entertain jumpseat requests at check in if your name is not on the list.

'round..... He's correct, they don't have manners. I don't see why acting rudely to other humans is acceptable no matter who's country you're in. BTW, it doesn't matter which country they're in, they don't suddenly learn manners when outside China.

[Captain Dart]

...plus they would be running scared of a backlash from the ground staff and cabin crew. They would't be too worried about the pilots though.

[Soul planet]

http://images.chinatopix.com/data/images/full/37218/ada-ngs-ticket.jpg?w=600


Showing off for attention has no limits. Thank god I'm not dating a HK girl. Stupidity has no limits either. :suspect:

[Soul planet]

http://www.wed114.cn/jiehun/uploads/allimg/130628/18_130628103500_3.jpg



First marriage. Red and prosperity.

[Progress Wanchai]

Not being a little too precious are we?

I see dumber crap than this in the cockpit most sectors these days.
And that's what the CAD should be interested in.

[wheels up]

It's only 15 years ago that any Tom, Dick or Hariette was allowed in the cockpit, with or without camera and boxcutters - how short our memories are.

I can think of plenty of issues with a real impact on safety, that make a jumpseater sneaking a video on her phone pale into insignificance (such as crewing a heavy jet with ridiculously inexperienced crew).

[Dan Winterland]

Or fatigued crew.

[Lowkoon]

“An observation that people who live permanently in an adoptive country tend to progressively generalize the bad and particularize the good, that is, attribute the bad traits in people they encounter to the national trait of the natives, and the good things to the individual.
This holds equally well for French people living in the U.S. as it does for Americans living in France.”
― Nassim Nicholas Taleb

[go43andrti]

"Not being a little too precious are we?

I see dumber crap than this in the cockpit most sectors these days.
And that's what the CAD should be interested in."

I guess you didn't realize that everyone here in infallible. We are allowed to make mistakes (even though we are in fact infallible), but no one else. :=

We won't lose our jumpseats. FA's won't lose their jumpseats. Everybody take a deep breath, relax and get over it.

And especially for the tool that said "end of story" get over yourself most importantly.

[Soul planet]

http://www.wolaver.org/animals/ostrich.jpg

Why no official statement or response from company yet?

[wongsuzie]

This is not a simple story.

[SMOC]

To the HKCAD, look I really think you should look at banning Qantas from flying to HK, I mean look how many "cannots" they recently did, I mean there were people standing in the cockpit, videos in the cockpit, cockpit crew hanging out the hatch, people actually on the airfield watching while the plane landed in front of them, they even had kids on their shoulders :eek: even fire trucks were spraying actual water!

http://www.abc.net.au/news/image/6289174-3x2-700x467.jpg

Qantas retires its oldest aircraft, the City of Canberra 747-400, to Wollongong aviation museum - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-03-08/qantas-jumbo-arrives-at-wollongong/6288748)

And please don't search you tube for cockpit videos as all your precious rules being deliberately broken by all these foreign airlines might make your heads explode at being unable to comprehend actual aviation.

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/middle/0/6/0/2603060.jpg

[Cafe City]

:D:D:D:D:D

Soul planet
Thou doth protest too much, methinks.

What, are you the Ex???

Talk about molehills and mountains.

[VR-HFX]

Soul and Suzie

As you say there is more to this than meets the eye. I see Cantonese Opera writ large and loud.

Whether it is anyone's business is another matter, but how did the Fish Wrapper Daily get the story?

The lady (no matter how retarded) had a legitimate boarding pass and that should be the end of it....but somehow I do not see that happening.:rolleyes:

[superfrozo]

Completely off topic, but when quoting Nassim Nicholas Taleb, as if he's some sort of intellectual giant, it's worth remembering this opening pearler from his book "The Bed of Procustes":

"Pharmaceutical companies are better at inventing diseases that match existing drugs, rather than inventing drugs to match existing diseases."

Pretty much shreds any semblance of his credibility right there (Yeah, that's right, "big Pharma" invents diseases). How someone so scientifically illiterate becomes a poster child for logic and reasoning I'll never know.

[Lowkoon]

Superfrozo, I think you might find the 'pharma' quote refers to their exceptional abilities to market what they already have on the shelf, and their less than remarkable ability to can products that they have invested significant sums in that don't actually deliver, ie their substantially well documented lack of ethics in the case of failed drug trials. But we digress. Regardless of your opinion of the author, or my opinion for that matter, Taleb's observation used in the quote above was in my humble opinion an accurate reflection of the stereotyping we were reading in this thread.

[sb_sfo]

If I was going to argue his point, I might open with "restless leg syndrome" and leave it there.

[LongTimeInCX]

It is always possible in this case, that the JS usage was as a result of a request by the dispatching TPE groundstaff. It may be that if as an ex CX crew, she was travelling on a retired staff ticket, that with a full flight it was simply thought that staff ticket can use a JS if the Captain agrees to release.

Personally, having heard of a number of these cases at outports where when you returning to HK with a full flt, Captains are asked if they can release the JS to Joe Bloggs, only to find in the cruise that Joe Bloggs isn't of the category that the groundstaff said, and is therefore ineligible to be granted the JS.

Consequently, and especially in the current environment where any toe over the line can be a D&G on Monday, (and packing bags by Fiday!), unless I know the staff personally and can be certain they are Kosha, I only release JS's to staff that have applied online, to ensure they have met those eligibility requirements.

[SloppyJoe]

Pilot invited attractive Chinese passenger to sit next to him in the cockpit | Daily Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2982931/Pilot-lands-hot-water-inviting-attractive-Chinese-passenger-cockpit-flight-Cathay-Pacific-plane-full.html)


Defamation of character lawsuit anyone?

Am sure the captain invited her onto the flight deck because she was attractive.:rolleyes:

If you were the captain of said flight, leak your name to the Daily Mail to make the court case easier to win.

[ACMS]

Apparently x crew with a staff parent. Hence on staff travel and entitled to request a JS.

Still a silly goose for taking then posting the photos...

[RHEINHARD]

Goose. Nicely put.