CX to take whitetail A380s?

[Kitsune]

Skymark Move Adds ?White Tails? to Airbus?s A380 Woes - Corporate Intelligence - WSJ (http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2014/07/29/skymark-move-adds-white-tails-to-airbuss-a380-woes/) :}

[Captain Dart]

Skymark had to cancel the order because of problems including a flawed business plan and a shortage of pilots...erm I mean, a shortage of experienced pilots willing to work for their poor terms and conditions.

This wouldn't happen to Cathay Pacific...would it?

[swh]

When a supplier cancels an order like this, it normally means the customer has not met their contractual obligations. Reading between the lines, Skymark did not make the required substantial progress payment in April with the first flight milestone.

[ACMS]

We won't buy A380's

Who will fly them? :D

[Yonosoy Marinero]

On the contrary. Buying the A380 (/748) would allow for growth on several markets without adding superfluous frequencies, and thus carry more revenue with less crews/crewing costs/crewing constraints/layover costs/industrial tensions/recruiting issues/etc.

That is, of course, provided all of these were actually issues, which, visibly, they are not...

[cxorcist]

The deal is done! 12 A380s total. The Skymark, Virgin, Kingfisher, and deferred deliveries from AF and LH. All 12 arriving in the next 36 months...

[Frogman1484]

Cxorcist...be careful you don't get struck by lightning! Tempting the aviation gods like that could get you in trouble! :ok::D

[cxorcist]

I wish I was kidding. My preference would, of course, be for Intercontinentals. I'm told the Amadeus order combined with cancelled / deferred deliveries has dropped lease rates so low that even CX could not say no. Supposedly, they'll be be used on the "double frequencies" to LHR, LAX, and JFK. That'll free up some 77Ws for growth markets and earlier retirement of older aircraft (to include the regional 777s).

Don't believe me? Check Airbus' A380 order book. There are 10 for an undisclosed customer and two more from Skymark. The 10 are cancellations from (ironically) Hong Kong Airlines. The Virgin, Transaero, and Air Austral orders are also in serious jeopardy.

[Frogman1484]

Cxorcist sounds possible. With Cx I will believe it when I see them in our colours!

[broadband circuit]

cxorcist, you seem quite confident about your sources.

Yet, you take about lease rates (implying we'll lease them), immediately followed by sales data of 10 to an "undisclosed customer". If that customer was a leasing company, then surely they wouldn't be remaining anonymous, as they need to tell potential customers they're getting the airframes.

So, while I don't doubt your sincerity, can you please ask your "source" if these alleged 12 are to be bought, or leased. And if leased, either directly from Airbus, or from which leasing company?

[swh]

He is "yank"ing your chain.

Emirates is paying Doric US$1,260,341 and £360,136 per month for the first 10 years, and then US$432,749 and £455,058 for years 11&12. Doric purchased the A380s for US$245 million each, with a valuation at the end of the lease of US$139 million.

The public prospectus for the Doris issue are on the internet for anyone to see. http://www.dnairtwo.com/investors/DoricProspectus.pdf . These lease rates are comparable to the Ascend published numbers.

You can lease 12-15 744s for the same money.

[cxorcist]

Hahaha, $139 million after twelve years. That's a good one. Is that pre-A380NEO or post-NEO. That number means F-all! I'd be surprised if a twelve year old A380 is worth half that much. Seriously. Take a look at resale values on the A340. There's your crystal ball... How much has Airbus lost on those A340 residual value guarantees? Right.

And please, stop comparing A380 to 744 (and A350-1000 to 77W for that matter). They are different generations of aircraft. I don't hear anyone comparing the 77X to the A340-600. Do you? Same difference.

[Ex Douglas Driver]

Don't get too excited Airbus boys.... wait for the popup at the top of the screen on that apparent FlightGlobal link.

[ACMS]

Yeah thought so.


Rubbish and crap mixed together :ok:

[swh]

Hahaha, $139 million after twelve years.

You know something that Doric valuers don't ? The valuation reports are on the internet.

Doric have A319, A320, A330, A340-600, A380, 777-200LR, and 777-300ERs on their books, all of those frames have updates coming. They even have 4 of the CX 777-300ERs on their books.

If you did the numbers, you would see that each 12 year lease to Emirates is worth around 370 million to Doric, on an asset purchased for 245 million.

Take a look at resale values on the A340.

What do you think the resale value is on an A340 ?

I am surprised some Nigerian friend has not cleaned you out, you come across as one of these gullible idiots that believe everything they read on the internet.

BTW Ascend have the A340-300 about the same as the 777-200ER, and 747-400 less than the A340-600. Airbus just placed the A340-600s that came off lease with Virgin to another carrier.

And please, stop comparing A380 to 744 (and A350-1000 to 77W for that matter). They are different generations of aircraft. I don't hear anyone comparing the 77X to the A340-600. Do you? Same difference.

Nice one pot, who is it that keeps comparing the 787 to the A330 ?

Singapore and British Airways compared the 744 to the A380, CX compared the A350-1000 to the 777-300ER, and I am sure of there is an airline replacing the A340-600 with 777X, they will have also made the comparison.

Its official!!!!!

You missed your true calling in life, well played !!! :ok::ok:

[PanZa-Lead]

It's all over the papers in London so I think it's true. The London papers say 380 to LHR. I look forward to my 380 conversion and then back to LHR woohoo

[Threethirty]

Link? Or more bollox.

[PanZa-Lead]

I do enjoy fishing...any takers haha

[Baywatcher]

Thank goodness 4bars only has year to go, he'll miss it!

[main_dog]

Forget hook line and sinker, you'll need a trawler to bring all these guys in...

:}

[AQIS Boigu]

results are out soon..maybe we see an announcement then...

[Iver]

If true that is great news! Are fleet transfers allowed or are you assigned to only one fleet at CX? Could you see senior chaps jumping from the T7 or 748 to the A350/80?

[Fly747]

If CX should get the 380 then Airbus is very likely to strongly suggest that only current 'Bus pilots go on it to start with. BA did this initially and later when they started training -400 pilots onto the 380 had a few failures.
If CX don't get the 380 now they never will, it must be as cheap as chips with the Skymark cancellation.

[betpump5]

Didn't Qantas pilots have to do a couple of years on the A330 in preparation for the 380 before it was delivered?

[A3301FD]

Great...now they will retrofit that Sham Shui Po **** EFB into another aircraft, take out the HUDs (if it came with any...don't know)...and ask Haeco to get some camp beds for the crew rest, yank out/disable all the inflight internet and it will become another CX aircraft...minus brake cooling fans.

[BillytheKid]

Some of you didn't read who the author of the article was: P.I. Staker:}

[cxorcist]

I've got an idea for all those wishing to fly the A380...

You can go to management and see how much they require from your contract for the honor of flying the "Superjumbo!" That way, maybe the aircraft can become truly efficient for CX.

Eyes on the prize guys :ugh:

[Frogman1484]

The more I think about the A380 article, the more I think it is bollocks!:{

Think about the timetable of 6 months (end of the year). How long does it take us to introduce a new type like the A350 (2-3 years). Do you thin that we could introduce the A380 in 6 months? :=

I now come to realize that whoever wrote that article was smoking something just before he sat down!:}

No A380 coming our ways:{

[BuzzBox]

...the more I think it is bollocks!

OMG, don't tell me someone made it all up!:eek:

[Just Do It]

Yep...I took the bait and went deep under the boat!

On my side now being reeled in.

Take my hat off to the deep sea long liner:D

[scavengepump]

How can some of you lot be so damn gullible?? :ugh: breathtaking!

No wonder we're in the position we find ourselves in.......you'd believe anything!

[Frogman1484]

Yep...I think we have more hope in getting a pay rise than the A380.:{

Considering that the pay rise is a long shot...the A380 is a dream.:\

[boocs]

Bigger isn't better: Why the Airbus A380 superjumbo is struggling to take off (http://www.theage.com.au/travel/travel-planning/travel-news/bigger-isnt-better-why-the-airbus-a380-superjumbo-is-struggling-to-take-off-20140811-3dihz.html#poll)

b.

[Sam Ting Wong]

Reports that say there's -- that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things that we know that we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we know.

Donald Rumsfeld

[Fly747]

So is the 8i a known unknown? Boeing must be offering it as cheap as chips.
Who will fly it?

[Some How I'm Tired]

Pilots?!...

Its not rocket surgery....