Fly in Spain Jerez - personal review PPL training

[downsetgo]

Hello,

to everyone who is thinking about going for a PPL-licence at Fly-in-Spain (FIS) in Jerez, Spain I share my experience in a few words.

Having checked this forum for reviews on schools I decided to give it a try with FIS since this was the one where only one single negative review existed and which was also resolved in an open manner as far as I can tell. Also prices were reasonable.

So I (mid 30s, male) went to FIS between February and April this year to start the PPL from scratch. I haven`t had the time to read any books in advance and I had a time frame of max. two months to get everything done. I booked only one week in advance and it was no problem.

Organisation
School rooms are not the newest but absolutely do serve their purpose for getting theoretical knowledge into the brains, for planning flights and having a chat with others. The staff at FIS always was friendly to me. There is one secretary who takes care of organisational stuff such as the student`s flight accounts or room booking for in of two shared apartments (if needed). There is one person taking care of booking instructors to the student`s schedules as needed. Sometimes the owner is there, also friendly and interesting to talk to.

Getting the medical was no problem, but because at FIS one is applying for the EASA PPL issued by the British CAA the initial medical had to be done by a British doctor in Gibraltar (1,5 hr trip by car).

Training
Having mentioned the administrative part which is limited to a minimum in the background, there is the training staff at FIS who in my point of view contribute 95% to the whole thing being a success or not. I was flying with two different instructors and both gave me very valuable training and knowledge. Especially emergency situations (engine failure, emergency landings) were simulated and exercised intensively and down to the last meter before touching the ground. Yes, this is stress. But this is the way to learn to handle those situations and it gives a lot of important self-confidence.

All instructors I met at FIS at this time have a lot of experience and are CPL /ATPL holders. When I was there about 50% of the students at FIS trained for a commercial career. The chief instructor is a very kind person and experienced pilot.

A great advantage at Jerez is that one gets used to flying in CTRs and controlled airspace. Especially the CTR-experience is very valuable for me. I took around 60 hrs of flying before the final skills test. I´m not sure whether I could have done the skills test a bit earlier. Maybe. However, I never regretted any extra hours. My advice is to rather not set the goal on finishing within the minimum of 45 hrs but to rather take advantage of having access to good training. This is for life and for survival in the worst case.

Aircraft
The aircraft for training (C-172s) were really not the newest but did their job and are IR equipped. I can`t remember having had to wait for an aircraft which would have delayed my schedule. As I was told by the owner he plans to buy two brand new two seat trainig aircraft soon.

Result
I am now proud owner of a British EASA PPL and I think I have had really good training at Fly-in-Spain. I will definately come to FIS once in a while if I am around southern Spain, to refresh emergency skills with an instructor.

If was asked whether I can recommend this flight school:
Yes, I can, because I have had really good flight instructors there.

I am not frequently checking PPRUNE, but if anyone has questions I will try to answer them as directly as possible.

[Sam Rutherford]

Hi, I did my CPL A there - very happy (though the Siai Marchetti they use for the complex section has got to have the noisiest cabin I've ever known!).

Fly safe, Sam.

[acefly123456]

Are there many students at Fly in Spain?
How many instructors do they have?

Are the owner from Germany?

Kind regards

[Emkay]

How much did it cost you end to end?

[downsetgo]

Acefly123456,

Number of students:
at the time when I was there (Feb-April 2013) there were 3 other PPL students in continous training. But we were all in different progress in training. I would say half of all (including me) were there for full time training from scratch, the other half took it a bit easier and as far as I know planned to come back another time to continue.
Another one was there for two weeks only to get done as much as possible (theory exams and some flying).

For CPL there were pilots coming and going, also some of them staying for a longer time.

Number of instructors:
I can remember at least 5 instructors, some of them get booked as required.

Owner:
yes, he originally comes from Germany

Emkay,

I took 60 hours in total, alltogether with accomodation I would say I was 13.000 €. Rental car was cheap, around 4 €/day.

By far the highest cost factor is flying itself. Of course, flying less makes a difference to the wallet. But it also makes a difference in flying skills and practice.
I don`t regret the additional hours which I took extra to the 45 h which are mandatory. It`s just so much fun! On my first solos I was screaming loud and grinning from ear to ear because it`s the greatest feeling ever blasting through the sky by yourself! And then flying your calculated course, finding another airfield and just landing there to have a coffee. It`s so cool!

[acefly123456]

Thank you for the reply downsetgo

And congratulation to your PPL.

[chrisbl]

It is fair to say that the real star behind FIS, Brian is no longer there having returned back to the UK. He will be a difficult act to follow as his past students will agree, so things are bound to be different going forward.


They have had problems with the Seneca for quite some time. It went off line last December for an engine overall and I am not sure whether it is back yet.

[S-Works]

The Seneca is online.

I have been Head of Training for 2 years. Brian was CFI for us until a few weeks ago - I have had to take that role on as well while we find someone suitable to act in the capacity.

His RTF was used for PPL training, our ATO was used for training above that although we have now had to take over the PPL side as well.

None of his approvals are being used in Spain. He still holds training approvals for the UK which remain valid until such time as the forced conversion to ATO occurs then it remains to be seen what happens. However I think he is going to concentrate on RT and Ground stuff these days.

Brian will be much missed in Spain. His vast experience was a real asset to me and will be hard to replace. Fortunately being the gentlemen that he is he still provides help when I need it in the UK.

Punitz are still used for IR training as they do not require a CAA staff Examiner for initial skill test. Everything else is now done by us. It's been a transition that has taken a couple of years.

[piperboy84]

Well was down here in the Costa so thought I would give Fly in Spain in Jerez a crack, Showed up unannounced and got a plane and instructor with no bollocking about, had a great local flight, seems like a good school with nice folks, only thing that caught me unawares was upon walking up to the aircraft I was to fly I noticed it had a rather unfamiliar accessory , it had a small circular thing connected to what looked liked a enlarged nut cracker with some type of damper connecting the hinge, the whole thing was stuck out from the cowling near the front of the plane, it's primary purpose seemed to be to increase drag and weight and impede it's turning radius on the ground. Anyway it was a beautiful flight and Esther the FI originally from the Uk thankfully did not bollock my many airmanship deficiencies..

[Yp12]

Have really been considering this flight school for some time now. Have read quite a few reviews and they seem to be good.


downsetgo, did you complete a night rating as well as part of your course or was it all day flying? Also how was the accommodation and how far is it from the airport?

[downsetgo]

Yp12,

I have not done a night rating yet. However I am thinking about it. And I will propably go for it at Fly In Spain. Reason is that I know there are really good professional instructors (no resignated hobby instructors as I have experienced in another school).
The only thing to keep in mind is, Jerez Airport closes at 2200 or 2300 local time as far as I remember. So during summer there`s not a lot of time to fly between sunset and airport closing for night flying. Propably better during winter time.

Accomodation:
The owner of the school has 2 apartments he rents out. The apartment I was in the first week has 3 bedrooms, bathroom, kitchen and a living room, completely furnished and Wifi. I met cool people (CPL students and instructors) who also had a room in the apartment. It is not completely in the center of Jerez but also not far away (10-15 minutes walk to bars&clubs). It took me around 12 minutes with the car to get to the airport.

However, after one week or so I moved out and rented a whole flat in the center of Jerez for myself. Nicer location, nicer apartment (for myself), only 50 Euros more per month than the room in the shared apartment. I found the price for this one bedroom in the shared apartment from the school quite expensive in local comparison. On the other side it is uncomplicated and quickly available which is good for people who don`t speak spanish (spanish almost mandatory for finding a good & reasonably priced apartment in Spain) and don`t stay long anyway.

[cockney steve]

Bose-x is one of the good guys on this forum and he's been here a long time..... I'd certainly trust him and any establishment he worked for.


Never met him, never been to Spain, no agenda, no axe to grind....just an observation,as a regular here.

[keenpilot]

For night VFR, be aware that it is prohibited in Spain. For schools a special permit can be given, it takes about 2 weeks to get from application. When I did my PPL there a bit more than a year ago, they had forgotten that I booked to do the NIght rating so couldn't do it before I was leaving.

The school is perfect to speed things up, something between a club and full blood pro school, but like always, follow things up yourself and the success of course also depends on which instructor you have.

[M-ONGO]

Bose-x is one of the good guys on this forum and he's been here a long time.....

Really? He comes across as argumentative and very judgemental in my opinion. I don't see the relevance of duration of board membership.

[S-Works]

I am neither. I am a Yorkshireman however and a spade is a spade.....

Don't expect me to sugarcoat or pussyfoot.

:p

[Mahogany Fighter]

I have flown with Fly In Spain on many occasions in the past. Brian was exactly the kind of professional tempering of occasionally over authoritative German ownership that was required. I am afraid to say that Bose-X will fit in with the German model perfectly and is not a combination that I will be choosing to use again in Southern Spain.

[S-Works]

Wow, 3 posts in five years and coming out of the woodwork just to have a go at me. I am flattered.......

[TC_LTN]

Steve. You reap the crop you plant. Years of bullying and aggressive behaviour on the GA forums results in people drawing the conclusion that they probably wouldn't choose to fly with you.

I flew several times from Jerez with Brian and Hans who couldn't have been more welcoming and accommodating. Nobody ever seemed to have a bad word to say about Brian on the forums and indeed you have perpetuated this. That is very reassuring when contemplating stretching yourself to fly outside the UK in a very different environment.

Reputation is everything and yours precedes you which is why I think many long term forumites including some apparent uber-lurkers come out of the shadows to acknowledge they would no longer be comfortable taking the risk at FlyInSpain.

[S-Works]

It's their choice. The team are still in place in Spain and doing a great job. You can take or leave me, I won't lose any sleep over it.

Judging someone by an anonymous Internet forum is pretty narrow minded in anyone's book. If you can find someone who has trained or flown with me and can actually back up your assertion I would be a little more interested.

My job in Spain is to ensure that everything is done in accordance with our company approvals and operations manuals. I am satisfied this is done and that's something I am very happy with. I may not be the touchy feely person that Brian was but then this is not my day job so it does not need to be. I would much rather I still had Brian down there but he has moved back to the UK and there is nothing I can do about it.

FIS provide a great service with a good team and good aircraft. All are welcome to come and visit and make there mind up in person.

[Barcli]

As they say in Yorkshire - barge pole wouldn't touch it with

[RedKnight]

I'm utterly astonished by the bitter vitriol being directed against Steve here. I've had the incredible privilege of being trained by him in Jerez, and in the course of my interaction, I have been consistently impressed by the professionalism that he has demonstrated - not just in his management of the organisation (most notably when he chaperoned FIS through its periodical CAA audit in Q4 2013), but also in his ability to instruct and guide his students in a manner that keeps theme performing to the best of their abilities. If there's one takeaway from this thread, let it be this: whilst individuals are entirely entitled to express opinions of their own, let us work to ensure that these opinions are fair, responsible, and founded in material fact; we should resist engaging in an unfounded character assassination on a public forum of this nature. Steve is a competent pilot of the finest order, and above that, an extraordinary gentleman whom I have had the distinct honour of interacting with.

[FlyingOfficerKite]

RedKnight

Agreed.

I'm a Yorkshireman too and believe that there should be fair play here.

Perhaps the corespondents who are undermining bose-x may be taking the opportunity to deride his abilities due to a lack of their own?!

[worldpilot]

That's absolutely right!!:D

Keep the "Angle of Attack" in focus. That's what this forum is all about.:ok:

WP

[berlinxpress]

I’m an A320 pilot with a major european airline and recently renewed my MEP-VFR/IR rating at FIS on their Seneca. My instructor (Harry) had 20,000hrs including 7000 on the A320 and was one of the best instructors I have ever flown with. A lot of experience in the past and great tutoring skills. If you need ME-IR basic or refresher training I would strongly recommend FIS, as long as you can get this guy.

Best regards,

Berlinxpress

[Alimentesh]

The only problem with training in Spain, is that it takes cash away from the much needed small airfields in our own land.
There maybe a few reasons why some people may want to train in Spain ( that rhymes ) but let's not forget if we want to keep our airfields we must invest in them.

[MKA742]

Hi guys.

Im thinking of doing my FI rating there. Has anyone done this at FIS?

My main reason is the the quick 4 week completion time.

Though its still scary to spend all that money in a foreign land with people I dont know.

Thx

[S-Works]

We run FI courses on demand and use a very experienced UK FIE to run the courses. He is the former CFI of Leicester Aero Club and is a vastly experienced Instructor and Examiner.

[stickandrudderman]

I find it strange, really strange, that people who fly aeroplanes are so emotional. The cockpit is not a good place for emotion.
I've had some interactions with Bose X. Likeable? Not that I noticed. Professional? Yes, definitely. Reliable? Absolutely. Knowledgable? well, he knows a lot more than me so who am I to judge? Good bloke to spend time with on a night out with the boys? I've got no idea, I have my own mates for that.
I run a small business in a similar environment to aviation businesses that has its' own specialist forums.
I do not court business from those forums because the people who populate those forums are not the kind of customers I like to encourage.
I wonder if Bose feels the same?

[S-Works]

I don't court any business from these forums as generally they are populated by Walts and various other people with social disorders. It is also a sad fact that people are judged by what they write which is invariable a slant from the readers own personality.

However I will answer any questions directly if asked. It is up to the individual to decide if they want to train through the organisation.

Like you I have my own friends and social circles and I choose my friends carefully and they are generally not pilots.

[downsetgo]

Hello,

I have written my review in order to let those who are interested know about my (justified positive) experience at the school.

And to let others who have made personal experience with the school to leave detailed and justified reviews on a factual level.

I have not written a review to offer a platform for insultations and insinuations or topics that are not directly related to the training at the school I went to.

Personal issues can be and should to be treated non-publicly in direct 1-to-1 discussions (like real men do). Please let us show this minimum of respect towards ourselves and towards others.

The author

[GvonSprout]

I agree and for what it's worth, the vitriol (based on web activity) hasn't put me off considering what looks like a good set up. The original post here was very helpful. Thanks for taking the trouble to start the conversation.
Currently looking to do my PPL over the next month or so and FIS look like the best bet (weather, aircraft availability, track record etc). I'd considered US, NZ Western Australia but Spain ticks most of the boxes rather well (for me at least) I hope..
I'll perhaps post how I get along.

[downsetgo]

Hi GvonSprout,

I´ve also researched a lot in advance before going to Spain. I was close to going to the US for the EASA PPL (there were around two places or so, prices seemed attractive) or to other countries.

In the end Spain was the best choice for me. Independently from the training also because I like Spain, the people, the language, the food and life there.
In Spain I talked to a student who has started training in one of the schools in the US that offer EASA PPL and made rather negative experience there and switched to Spain to finish.

Independently from the country, it really helped me having to fly in the CTR / controlled airspace from the beginning. It even makes me feel more safe.

[Phoenix8341]

Thanks to Downsetgo (and to the others) for this review. I'm planning to join Fly-in-Spain soon and begin with a PPL, a distance learning ATPL and some hour building there :)

[Maxwingspan]

Sorry guys, but maybe just happened to me and I hope it does not happen any more, I had an engine failure with one of FIS planes and I am very afraid about it happens again. I was performing touch and go and on the runway, when I put full power the propeller stopped. I asked to FIS staff for explanations, but they said it was my fault because I did not leave carburettor heater on. The fact is that my instructor told me to do it and I remember in that moment was on. The owner did not want to speak about, but I was told that it happened just two month ago.

Someone could give an idea?

[downsetgo]

Hello Maxwingspan,

I was a student there. And have posted the experience I made.

Concerning the condition of the planes, yes they were far away from new when I was there. When I was there they were work horses and have been in use for decades. But this accounts for some other schools as well, where I have rented later in other countries. FIs at F.I.S. have told me that at other schools they worked at, planes were even worse. I personally have never experienced anything special.

I would suggest: if one doesn't get what agreed on, don't pay. The system, that normally some money has to be on the account before going flying makes this a bit more difficult, I can see that. And maybe that's the reason why it's handled this way, don't know. But there must be ways to to talk about these things directly and find agreements.

An engine failure is extremely bad! I cannot say anything about it, simply because I don't know the facts.
What happened exactly? In which phase did it quit? And could it be restarted directly afterwards? Which plane was it? I have not yet experienced how extreme the effect of carburettor icing could be in touch-and-go. So please, let all of us learn from your experience.

But if you feel you were in danger due to a technical malfunction and which could happen to others after you as well, take appropriate action.

Again, I am trying not to advertise for or against the school. All I can do and want to do is bring my own personal experience (which in my case was a positive one) to the keyboard.

[indyaachen]

An extremely helpful post from 'downsetgo' as I am considering Fly-in-Spain for LAPL.

Here in Germany, I have heard about the lessons getting cancelled because the weather, which makes Jerez a good option if you can spare the block of time. However, I am wondering if this is a good idea to flying in favorable conditions. Most likely, I would be renting an aircraft in Germany later in not so ideal conditions, and there won't be an instructor to guide me through. :confused:

Any thoughts?

[AlexUM]

Hi indyaachen,

if you're based in Aachen, I'm sure you're aware that there's a very good school in EDKA (Aachen-Merzbrück), Westflug with well maintained aircraft.

They can offer you a wide range of aircraft as well, from Katanas to M20Js. I don't remember his name, but apparently one of the FIs there is quite an institution flying Mooneys.

Don't bother too much about lessons getting cancelled due to weather. Yes, it will happen, however you will get used to the environment/weather/procedures you'll be flying in once you got your ticket.


All the best,
Alex

[indyaachen]

Yes I know about EDKA. I have been there. However, I was not aware of any Flight Mooney. I am going to an open day there on 2nd Aug and will inquire further.

My preference of FIS, Jerez is partially based on my comfort level with English as opposed to German. In a lot of videos, I have noticed the instructors using common-day expressions to make the student pilot understand the concepts. Not sure yet, how comfortable I'd be with that if it were in German. At least this was the case during the 'Schnupperstunde' .

Thanks AlexUM for inputs anyway. :ok:

[downsetgo]

Hello Indyaachen,

concerning the weather, I had the same thoughts before making the decision for Spain. But then, in my case, I couldn`t fly some days in Spain due to bad weather. And some days it was at the limits. However, weatherwise this was an exceptionally bad period when I was there, which has happened once in 50 yrs.
Coming back to Germany to fly, I was very cautious concerning weather, thinking that it was going to be different. But things were not as bad as expected. Of course one should analyse weather before.
An idea might be to get an FI in Germany for one or two hours to experience flying in not so perfect weather conditions. Helps to become more confident with weather.

[Steve6443]

Just a cautionary note to those intending to learn to Fly-in-Spain.

They advertise that you can fly all year round - well, mostly you can, except for the period downsetgo was there :} - but what you should be aware of is that they appear to have a shortage of instructors and that if your instructor is off sick, you will not be doing any flying.

I recommended Fly In Spain to a friend based on forum reports but this friend has spent the past 3 days sitting around doing practically nothing because their instructor is off sick - initially, Fly-in-Spain said my friend would do a minimum of 2 hours flying plus other training per day, but including today and the past 2 days, my friend will have done 1 hour flying. My friend planned 5 weeks to pass the test but even the most adept student will NEVER pass in that time frame with this rate of hours.

Yes, sickness is one thing that can't be avoided but there should be plans in place to ensure that when one instructor is sick, their workload is spread around to ensure ALL students lose out on a little flying, not, as in my friend's case, lose practically all their flying.

Worse is the fact that you pay to fly to Spain, pay for accommodation, pay for transportation and you are still left standing around waiting - well, if you're going to be kept waiting around, why not stay in your own country and just wait for the weather???

[Rhino25782]

Re: your personal message and the posts here, a couple of things to add:

If you intend to complete the course within a few weeks, then it makes sense to pick a location with quite stable weather. As you've already researched yourself, Spain and the US spring to mind. When I did the calculation back in 2013, it made more sense financially to go to the US because I found FIS/Jerez quite expensive, to be honest.

If you don't neccessarily want an intensive course but you're generally apprehensive about many cancelled lessons due to weather hereabouts: In my view, it isn't actually so bad! I've taken some lessons here and there within the last 2 years and I'm obviously flying myself quite a lot and you really don't need to cancel that often!

There's obviously an advantage in learning in your "home" environment for later use (in terms of airspace, weather conditions, local regulations etc.). Yet there's also an advantage in learning in a different environment. It broadens your experience. Having learned in the US and studied UK theory and then flown out of Germany, I believe I was much more ready to venture out into other countries early on once I had the PPL than maybe some other pilots who've only flown within their own say 50 NM radius ever.

Regarding your language argument: Surely you must be able to find a FI here in Germany who is happy to teach you in English? There is not too much use for the German language in aviation anyway (apart from flying the circuit of some smaller airfields) and I usually stick to English for my radio calls and departure and emergency briefs etc.

[XanderFly]

Does anyone have recent experience with the FI(A)-course at FIS? What is the price of the course? Is the course done with couples or individual as well?

[nidnat]

hi,
How is the O-ATPL program in FIS Jerez. It says finish in 10 months, is it possible and is it worth the money to train there?

[Otto_nzr]

Hello,

I would really like comments about the question above..

Thanks

[Geodex]

I got in contact with Hans and he explained some few questions I had :ok:

I plan on starting there in summer for the Semi Integrated ATPL (Residential) course. You have any advise on the route for someone with 0 experience if not this one?

[roland23]

Hello, I did the IFR last year at Fly in Spain and you might be interested in my (bad) experience:

Location / Facility:
Direct at the airport, with 5 min. walking distance. It is a small school with a meeting room, 2-3 class rooms and two briefing pc. You need a rental car for Jerez or to a hotel, but the rental was very cheap.


They have also a FNTP II Simulator. Unfortunatley, it never worked properly (massive pitch control outages). Any requests to fix it has been promised but never performed (and the teachers told me that it was the case since many months).


The only restaurant in the area is in the airport. There is beverage machine at the school, but not always working.


Based on some troubles they caused at the end of my training (see below), it looks like that Fly in Spain is not an ATO as the official documents has been signed by a Punitz flight school in Austria.


Airplanes:
My training should have been on two fully IFR equipped C172. The aircrafts were quite old and not well maintained (valid for interior and equipment; outside was ok). There was never (during 3 months with a break) an aircraft available which had both, precious and non-precious, working nav. instruments on board. Any escalation from the teacher and me to the head of back office and to the CEO did not change it (again, the promised it, but it has not been fixed). This is definitely also an issue, when you have the IFR exam flight, with no ADF on board and the airport DME has an outage (my experience…)


Teachers / training:
I saw 4 teachers from Germany, Spain and England, one was an IFR examiner. The two I had, were nice and very competent.


I got a private ground and flight training, both with good inctructions leading to an early success / practial exam. Afterwards, I had to pass an IFR voice exam in Switerzland (also EASA) and realised that the short radio instruction with Jerez and Sevilla was never enough for general IFR flights. So, I had to pay a lot for an additional voice course in Switzerland.


Services:
Good news was that they accepted a testimonial of my german CATS theory (they use the UK one), but I had to pay a 3 figures ‘admin fee’. They were also very flexible with the immediate start date of my training.


You have to pay a part in advance and will get the same day a reminder from the CEO or teacher if you have a negative balance. So, you might consider first a bank transfer to avoid the credit card charges.


After I passed the exam, they did not send my documents to me or to the government. Several request to the head of back office and CEO were not answered. After two months and an additional escalation, the found the document at Punitz flight school in Austra. Afterwards, they sent it to a location in SWEDEN instead of Switzerland. Again, no response from the head of back office or from the CEO after my request to fix it . Finally, I got the documents after 3 months and 'of course', the document were not complete…..


Summary of my experience :
It might be a cheap training and you will get professional instructors. However, do not expect well maintained aircrafts or ground equipment and definitely not any services you would expect as an customer who just has spent 10'000 Euros.


Roland

[Sal007]

You said ....

[I took 60 hours in total, altogether with accommodation I would say I was 13.000 €. Rental car was cheap, around 4 €/day.]

Which is great ...

What About Food and the duration of the course ? any advise

[S-Works]

Nobody eats in the airport cafe, it's expensive and crap. There is a Spanish restaurant next to the airport called avenge that does a three course Spanish lunch for €8 including drinks. You can also get a swipe card from FTE next door to use their restaurant which does a fixed all you can eat menu for €5. I usually eat there as the food as great and it's 20yards from the school.

Duration of any course is down to the performance of the student.

The fleet is slowly being upgraded and there are two new glass cockpit 172 due for delivery shortly. The sim is now fixed.

With reference to Roland's comment about communications, it's the students responsibility to hold a minimum of ICAO level 4 aviation English. It is not the responsibility of the school to train you in this. When you do the theory exams you do a comma exam as well, when we do practical training you are expected to apply this. If you don't speak good enough English to understand the radio and apply the comms procedures you learnt as part of your theory then expect to do additional training.

[Rachell]

Hello - thinking of attempting to complete my PPL this spring by doing an intensive course at FIS. Currently holding just over 10 hours. I've got a few questions and would really appreciate the feedback!
1. I was advised by the school that if I focused on building my hours only, it would take up to 3 weeks to complete. However 35 hours over, say, 15 working days means as little as 2 and a bit hours of flying a day which doesn't seem very much? Would it be possible to shorten this to 2 weeks? Do you also do lessons at weekends?
2. If I book myself in for 35 hours, and full written 9 exams, but log more hours/ complete several exams before I go, do I still have to pay what I have/will not use?

Thanks a lot! R

[BobD]

Rachel, you may think that 2+ hours a day flight training is not much, but believe me, in a high stress situation such as aviation training, it is mentally very tiring. Put this together with the study time you would need for your exams, you will be amazed at how draining this can be. You are also assuming that you will have flying weather every day, and this certainly isn't guaranteed. The USA flight school I attended did claim to have one student complete the PPL in three weeks. I decided to do an extra week, and I'm glad I did, as I only just managed to complete my check flight the day before I left.


I speak from experience, as someone who went to Florida to do my PPL. However, I did 5 hours training in the UK before I left, and I also completed about 75% of the exams beforehand (something I would recommend as almost essential). You should also consider additional training back in the UK, once you get your PPL (as I did), as you should consider the piece of paper as a license to continue learning as I am sure you will. The thing you miss out on with an intensive course is the incidental experiences you collect along the way of a more traditional approach of learning over months/years. You have to collect these after your PPL, rather than during, but they should not be under estimated (hence the continuation training or hour building flying I recommend)


Having said that, it is great fun to do an intensive training course away from home, a real adventure. I loved every minute of it, and consider it one of the great experiences of my life. I would thoroughly recommend it, as long as you go into it with your eyes open, and accept it for what it is. I did it this way as I couldn't afford to give my weekends up over months/years, and did it abroad so I would have a better chance of favourable weather in the short time available, than I would have in the UK.


I did a blog of my training, mainly for my family at home, but you might find some of it interesting and relevant to what you should expect.


Florida Blog (http://www.rjdawson.co.uk/flying/blog/)

[c.172]

I did my PPL at FIS in April - May 2015. I started from scratch and just completed in four weeks. It really was pushing it though, and I would have been much less stressed if I had given myself six weeks, but my window was really limited. I took my last skills test on the afternoon before my flight home.

Like others, there are times when you cannot fly even once a day because of the weather. These days are infrequent, but you only need two or three with a tight two flight a day schedule to get behind. Similarly, one instructor became ill for a couple of days and another went home for a short break which left the school very short.

When I went to the manager / coordinator and explained that I was falling well behind in hours they were very helpful and worked hard at getting me up as much as possible. I am not sure how many instructors they have now as some of the ones there during my time transferred to the FTE outfit.

You will not be charged for hours you don't use, although you have to keep your flying account in credit. They do fly on Saturdays and can train on Sundays as well if necessary.

When I came home with my licence, I undertook further training to gain confidence in the different conditions. R/T discipline is also tighter over here, but that shouldn't be a problem if you have been flying in the UK and have already taken the exam (I took mine immediately on my return home).

[map56233]

Rachel
I don't post here very often and have not done any training outside the UK.
I would suggest to you that you will find a PPL training course in any country demanding. If you can get the standard you want outside the UK, at a cost that you can afford, do so by all means.
But remember that you will be flying in the UK (I assume).
The weather is unique and flying in the south of England is also very challenging with interesting airspace to say the least.
You will need some sort of training when you return to the UK. I would hate for you to become a statistic.
I hope you enjoy the course, it will be hard work.
Mike

[indyaachen]

I agree with the view that one should also consider doing their training in the country they'd be flying. Weather puts off too many prospective students who tend to look at Spain and the US. The weather for flying could be restrictive even in Spain. There are factors that new students don't know or consider, e.g. wind, cloud ceiling, aircrafts' condition etc.

FIS seems to have good reputation. I'd only suggest to book your calendar only a few days in advance when you have some idea about the weather.

If possible, take all your exams before you start flying. It is not relaxing when you need to go home to the books after 2-3 hours flying.

[BobD]

Rachell, it sounds like FIS offer the same facility I enjoyed from my Florida school, so I recommend you take advantage of it, you'll be glad you did.
Best of luck with your training.

[lapdog]

I am looking at booking my ppl at FIS this March. I have been sent a booking form by the FIS team asking for around 16% holding deposit plus 5,000 euros to be paid on or before arrival. From what I have read else where this is not standard. A holding deposit of 10% is typical, from there I should only expect to keep a positive balance in a flying account. I am a bit put off by the 5,000 euro curve ball.

Any advice from others who have flown at FIS and thier payment structure would be very much appreciated.

[Bmarks930]

Just a quick question, does this school do the full theory training/exams as well as the flight time?

I don't learn well with distance learning and I'm looking for a PPL school that will do the theory side of things aswell to give myself the best chance of passing.


Tried speaking to FIS over e-mail but their replies were not consistent, sometimes had to send an e-mail a few times to get a response, and the english response wasn't easy to understand. Not their fault as I assume spanish PoC and English isn't their first language.

[Right Hand Thread]

lapdog.


Over the years many students have lost their funds when flying schools have gone under, a search of these forums will give tales of woe. The general concensus has always been to pay as you go with any up-front payments made by credit card (for your own protection).

[downsetgo]

Hello Bmarks930

when I had my training at FIS (2014) they offered the full theory ground training. It depended on the student how many hours ground training he wanted/needed.

But better get this confirmed by them directly, even if it takes some patience sometimes.

Concerning earlier posts whether to do training in the home country or somewhere else, here's my experience.

I trained in Spain, CTR-experience was good, I would not have gotten this experience at schools at smaller airfields.
When I came to my home country with my fresh license, I took several hours with a local FI. Things were a bit different, but not too different. Basically, getting used to short runways, grass fields, local language (and dialect ;-) on the radio.

[AirWaterloo]

Yesterday (12 APR 2017) I contacted FIS by e-mail for the first time. I am looking for flight training for a PPL (and then probably CPL) for my youngest and might want to train for a PPL myself. Every day that I am researching all this the 'might' gets closer to 'probably will' to a point where I started to do some planning.

I had contact with Hans at FIS by e-mail and got a very fast reply to my questions. I ordered the "Kit 1 - Flight Training" package to start intensive preparations for my youngest. At young age becomming a pilot might be a pipe-dream so I want to see effort and awareness that getting a PPL/CPL is about studying, passing exams, training, failing, perseverance, mastering English, being responsible etc and not just a pleasure ride (in which case a LAPL and flying ULM in clear weather conditions is more then sufficient IMO) before I spend 15K/25K Euro pp (all in) for a initial PPL knowing it will cost more behind that initial PPL later.

I received filled in order forms and clear instruction from Hans (FIS). My order was placed with FIS the same day. As the world of aviation is new to me I didn't know FIS and was under the impression that everybody at some stage went to the US. Apparently that is more so for the heavier work such as ATPL licenses.

However, I found this board an red all the comments. My main concern before ordering and providing credit card info was making sure FIS wasn't a scam. So I found them on Google Maps, in testimonials, checked out the phone numbers, certification claims, etc. So now I am at ease. Call me an internet paranoid :)

My incentive for looking at FIS was not so much the price, although further research showed me they have very competitive pricing. So here is my impression AS A NEWBIE after my internet research on the subject and reading all of the comments about FIS.

- Weather. Yes Spain will have bad weather too but I approach this statistically and not based one or more individual experiences. Nobody can deny that in the South of Spain your chances of good weather are much higher then in the channel region (South UK,North of France, Belgium, Netherlands, ..., etc). All, non aviation related, weather statistics show that. So I feel for those of you that had bad luck with the weather when at FIS but I cannot hold that against FIS, can I?

- Experience in bad weather conditions is needed. OK, I agree because even a newbie like me can understand that. But if one has a PPL what keeps that person from taking some extra flying lessons in those geographic ares where he will fly most or of which he wants to master the weather conditions better? First I want a GOOD PATH towards a PPL/CPL then we will deal with more specific needs because without PPL/CPL there isn't even any need to become more specific IMO. I am a first-things-first man.

- Instructors get sick and then you must wait because FIS hasn't sufficient instructors. Hmmm! FIS has a 4 weeks PPL program I saw, but nobody keeps you from spreading it over 6 or more weeks or cut it in multiple visits. Running a tight schedule will increase your risk of getting behind but it is an educated decision you that you make. Furthermore I never read about the student getting sick, I figure that happens too? Business people involved in project planning know you need to build in margins and I guess that is not different when you plan a training scheduled that includes a number of elements that are not under your control such as illness, whether and equipment availability. Maybe that is a to pragmatic approach in aviation I don't know but I am sure someone will point that out then.

- About other schools. The need for good instructors seems to be high and most schools have the same problem. Sick, late or even no show instructors, no replacements and students that needs a lot of patience is what I seem to understand. And there are for sure some excellent ones that anticipate everything that can go wrong but very often that comes at a price. In my case I would have to look from the North of France to the West of The Netherlands and in the end how do you really know where the good ones are. So a longer somewhat short stay in Spain sounds more practical then driving 200 km to and from a good aviation training school with a possible stressful training flight in between.

- The simulator at FIS doesn't work. OK that I have to accept because it was confirmed indirectly by a poster of FIS saying it was fixed. I figure that if these things are discussed online management of a flying school starts working at it because specifically in the FIS training offer, where people go to Spain, you cannot easily say come back next month. I also think that where there is technology there is failure, interruption for maintenance, repair contracts, etc. So expecting no failures is not realistic, yet expecting a decent repair time is, IMO although I have no idea how things go in the simulator repair business, a normal expectation.

- FIS has plains/at least one plain with motor failures. This generalisation was illustrated by ONE example and contested as being a pilot error. Hard to say but I figure that if this would really be an ongoing problem and given the fact that apparently quite some people pass at FIS this board would be filled with complains about that which it clearly isn't. So I am going to ignore that the more that FIS seems to have two new Cessna's now with glass cockpit (although I have no clue why the glass cockpit is important).

- Flying in Spain isn't good for our own schools (in our countries). Sorry but the internet shops aren't good for our own stores and apparently, while this is economically a bigger problem, nobody seem to care. I actually say that the FIS formula keeps local schools from MILKING candidate pilots as they show it can be done way more economically elsewhere. In my book competition, if quality is maintained, is good.

- From all comments I can at least draw one conclusion based on an apparent consensus of posters on this board: FIS has excellent instructors.
And isn't it that what we all look for? So training for engine failure up to the wheels on the ground seems to me, again a newbie, what you would want to master as part of a basic PPL. You train for the problem situations not for leisure landscape watching. Assuming that you will always be able to restart the engine doesn't sound like a realistic expectations even while engine failures that are due to a defect are very rare (statistically) compared to engine failures that are due to bad mix regulation, forgetting to switch gas tanks, etc which are all pilot errors that you can correct if you are well trained (you see I did some newbie home work :). If you cannot restart the engine THEN, under stress, calculating your potential gliding distance, finding an airfield or a spot to land on, communicating, etc that is why I would want to train for and I understand that at FIS that is exactly what they do.

The above is a PERSONAL OPINION and I have NEVER set foot at FIS and never had any PL training. This below is how I (we - my youngest and probably me) plan to go about it. I'dd enjoy comments if someone has improvements or sees unrealistic approaches in what I planned.

- I ordered the "Kit 1 Pilot Training" from FIS (I expect it within 10 days as advertised) and I will use book # 7 (Communications) to prepare for the RT part of the EPL. We will practice with the questions from the applicable 9 FIS
test question books to prepare. (See below why I ordered the complete Kit).

- We will enlist in a local Aviation Club and get access to local teachers to dry run the above RT without having to go to Spain. Knowledge from a book is different from what people with experience tell you.

- Additionally lift the level of English. That will be less needed for me as I work in English daily but the English of students coming out of high school with English as the 3rd language (Belgium) can be improved. I will first take the EPL in a certified exam centre and will aim for level 6 and will then have an idea of the expectations. I had military radio procedure training when I was in military service so I figure getting used to the Aviation RT format and vocabulary, the accents and poor radio quality conditions in noisy cockpits shouldn't be a big problem. I will then adjust the English training of my youngest where needed. I know they record (video+sound) the EPL exam and it would be nice if one gets a copy :) to show how it works. I am aware of the certification needs of the exam centre in order to have a valid EPL certificate that can be transcribed on a PPL/CPL of any EASA member country.

- I will get a class 2 medical certificate (I would do PPL but not CPL) and my youngest a class 1 because if later a CPL is the goal then I want to be sure upfront we do not detect a major medical complication at that point. I want to know it UP-FRONT because without class 1 medical a CPL is not a possibility. If however a medical situation submerges later then that is an acceptable risk one needs to take. I do the medical in second place mainly to avoid surprises in the future and I do it after the English test because without that learning to fly, IMO, is to limited (maybe gliding).

- I will then start using the other books of the Kit 1 from FIS and their questions books to reach a decent level of knowledge, see some perseverance and continued interest and see if it becomes clear that flying isn't just sitting in a plane and looking at the landscape to impress your friends (young people will be young people) before I start really spending money.

- At the same time, and to prevent that the theory presented in a dry book form without any practice would cause a to high threshold, we will use x-plain version 11 with Cessna 172 to learn the instruments, basic vocabulary and PLAY TRAIN some and get a BEGINNING of an idea of what to expect when one steps into a Cessna 172 for the first time. Call it amatory familiarisation.

- Next, after the self-study and the x-plane simulator, I plan to schedule in the 100 Hours of required ground training at FIS and take all 9 theoretical exams if I see that the level of answering of the test questions in the FIS question books is sufficient. I am not a fan of PPL/CPL exams in the local language because all aviation manuals, the flight control language and other communication, books and internet information are all, at least, available in English. Even ATC in Belgium is in English and not accessible in the local language as I found out. So I see passing the written theoretical exam in English as an added value if one would go behind a PPL or in type ratings where I suppose air plain specific documentation and training would be mainly in English. It also keeps MUCH MORE future training options open if for instance some continuation in the US would be needed (e.g. certain type training for type ratings).

- Next the practical training. I believe in 'total submersion". Students have summer holidays and going to Spain for two mounts with the family (renting a house or apartment and going there by car) sounds like a plan that everyone will like. So we take flight training and the others have holidays and provide practical support (meals, shopping, etc). In about 60 days one should be able to complete at least 45 flying hours each and there would be room for some extra hours (ah, the weather in Spain, sick instructors, the others wanting to visit Cadiz and Seville, can we have a party dad, etc :). And we would take the 9 practical exams as well.

- Then, supposing we pass, I get the PPL, transcription of the EPL etc on the licences and then take some local lessons to fly in the channel region weather conditions (North Sea) and start building up some flying hours and experience.

- After that we plan for a CPL and for me only extra ratings as needed (e.g. NVRF, full IR-HPA, complex, Mountains, etc according to what I need when I need it or what I would like to do without needing it) which should allow me to fly non-commercial in most of Western-Europe. We'll see from there if we ever get there.


What you have read about are the conclusions a newbie came to when rationally evaluating all the information available on the internet and without being in the realm of pilots and aviation. One needs to start somewhere. Except for the fact that everyone knows that pilot licenses are not distributed in Santa packages and that it will take effort, will be hard and test ones character by moments, I wonder if the above plan makes sense or if it is completely idiotic given the way contemporary pilot training works.

Thank you all for reading.

[c.172]

Good luck to you both. I think you have covered everything!!!
With that approach, I would hope you will not be disappointed, and will achieve your goals.
I certainly did - and enjoyed my time with FIS

[kzinvogon]

I did my FAA PPL to EASA Conversion at FIS. Having gone through the mill at Vero Beach and experienced the organised rip off , i arrived at FIS being a little worried. To be honest i really liked my time at Jerez, the people are so helpful, understanding, patient and work damn hard.
In terms of money, FIS is totally transparent , they quoted as per the web site , they validated all my hours before i arrived and at no point did i get surprised. Given my experience at Vero Beach where i had to wear a uniform! Yes - 59 years old just trying to live my dream , surprise charges for all sorts of handbooks, over billing of training hours - you name it , I was totally satisfied in attending FIS . (Note i attended in March/ April 2015)
Funny some of the comments but i found the school to friendly , informal , easy to get on with everyone and yet totally organised as it should be .

[gildnn]

Hi
I just wanted to relate my overall good experience with FIS. Not having flown for 35 years on my FAA CPL I picked up flight training again in 2015, one yesr before my retirement at age 60. It was reactivated with a flight review in 2016.I attempted to convert it to an EASA PPL but needed some additional training which turned out sporadic mainly due to bad weather and aircraft being intensively booked. In spring this year I finally decided to give it a try with FIS hoping to get ready for the PPL skill test within a reasonable period. I must say it was a full success. I had given myself two weeks from arriving to departing Jerez and it was done within that time frame with intensive flight traing despite a few days of marginal weather. I can confirm an earlier report in this forum about the training emphasis on safety and emergency situations, stall recoveries and engine-out procedures. Staff were very helpful especially two gentlemen I must mention, one being Bredin Harding who did all the arrangements to make it work and the other one my instructor Nick Davies who is an intuitive teacher with just the right feeling to give you the confidence you need to make you a better pilot.
I might actually repeat the experience for my CBIR this year. If I do, stay tuned for another report.

[kveldur]

Just a quick throw in since I dont want to start another thread but does anybody have experience with one air flight school in Malaga, spain

[Finpilott]

Hey, did you still get into the 0 to ATPL program? i am actually thinking about it.is the 9-12months realistic?



I got in contact with Hans and he explained some few questions I had :ok:

I plan on starting there in summer for the Semi Integrated ATPL (Residential) course. You have any advise on the route for someone with 0 experience if not this one?

[nord121]

Hello all,

thought i would add to this thread instead of starting a new one. Has anyone recently done a PPL with fly in Spain- Jerez? I have contacted them a few times over email and have received no response and i can see from social media they do not allow a messaging function.

Can anyone tell me the price they charge for a PPL(A) including ground school?

Nord

[CHEASApilot]

Same here, its been a while since i sent mails or phoned, no replies at all. maybe they’re not into the business anymore ?!

[tango_kilo]

Same here, its been a while since i sent mails or phoned, no replies at all. maybe they’re not into the business anymore ?!
Did my PPL training there between feb and may 2018. Quite good experience. Very friendly people, professional instructors.

Unfortunately, the weather was fairly bad in march/april with quite a number of days of no flying which made it difficult for the office management to get everybody through in the scheduled time. Moreover, it seemed that they had a shortage of instructors during that time. I had to extend my stay by at least 2 weeks due to the weather situation.

Most of the a/c are C172. One of them was with glasscockpit. Two or three C150, one Archer, one Cherokee arrow, and a Seneca for ME.

I paid 196 Euro/h for an hour with a C172 with instructor. Landing fee at Jerez is 12,50 Euro which would make TnG's a quite expensive thing, especially if you need more training on that. Consequently, the school also makes use of a smaller uncontrolled field in the vinicity of Jerez for landing training.

Groundschool can be done online (CATS 3.0 WBT). I did all theory exams incl. RT and LPE down there in Jerez and finally ended up with an UK EASA licence.
I don't know which impact Brexit might have for them as an UK ATO but as far as I know they have an Austrian ATO registration as well.
More detailed information via PM

[Jan Olieslagers]

the school also makes use of a smaller uncontrolled field in the vinicity of Jerez

care to tell us which one or where that is?

[CHEASApilot]

Did my PPL training there between feb and may 2018. Quite good experience. Very friendly people, professional instructors.

Unfortunately, the weather was fairly bad in march/april with quite a number of days of no flying which made it difficult for the office management to get everybody through in the scheduled time. Moreover, it seemed that they had a shortage of instructors during that time. I had to extend my stay by at least 2 weeks due to the weather situation.

Most of the a/c are C172. One of them was with glasscockpit. Two or three C150, one Archer, one Cherokee arrow, and a Seneca for ME.

I paid 196 Euro/h for an hour with a C172 with instructor. Landing fee at Jerez is 12,50 Euro which would make TnG's a quite expensive thing, especially if you need more training on that. Consequently, the school also makes use of a smaller uncontrolled field in the vinicity of Jerez for landing training.

Groundschool can be done online (CATS 3.0 WBT). I did all theory exams incl. RT and LPE down there in Jerez and finally ended up with an UK EASA licence.
I don't know which impact Brexit might have for them as an UK ATO but as far as I know they have an Austrian ATO registration as well.
More detailed information via PM

I got in contact with one of the guy. They’re closed till 8th Jan. Without any doubt, they’re one of the best in the business around that area of the world or Europe. They’re cost friendly, amazing instructors and can work on tight schedules. I was considering USA, but after reading reviews abt the 2 main ATO’s who can get that done, i ... Yes, i heard they’re having problems with instructors. From a post, they’re reviewing FIs packages to make them go career wise and even looking forward to sponsor instructors.( I would love to do this, engineering graduate waitering tables :ugh: ) But on the other side, curious me started looking up in Eastern Europe. You have ATO’s who you know ... but some are looking forward to build up a name. I narrowed down to two: Pan Aero(Croatia) and Rivair(Hungary). Both of them have good reviews online and mostly the attitude, cost and environment there are considerable. So far, they’re top notch on communication and they seem keen to teach you. To be sure, this summer i’m heading out to meet them. I will be looking at the accomodations that can be rented out, the transport to and from school, and thus have an idea in reality how much you need to budget to head for a PPL there. I guess everybody needs a fair chance but at the current moment without any doubt FIS has an untouchable reputation for flight training.

[tango_kilo]

care to tell us which one or where that is?
Sorry, it is Tebujena (LETJ)

[Jan Olieslagers]

Dankuwel! :)

[fly744]

Any advice abour accommodation in Jerez? My friend is starting training in July planning to stay for 2 months hopefully enough time to complete his PPL.

[tango_kilo]

Any advice abour accommodation in Jerez? My friend is starting training in July planning to stay for 2 months hopefully enough time to complete his PPL.
He may ask for a room in the apartment of the flight school. Rooms are basic but it has a fully equipped kitchen with a washing machine. Rent was around 100 Euro/week as far as I can remember They also have an arrangement with a local Ibis Hotel that will give a discount if the booking has been done via the flight school. I have stayed there for one week. Standard rooms, very clean.The hotel is a few miles outside the centre. In this case a car will be a must. If he stays in the centre he can take train or bus to the airfield.
July is high season there (Costa de la Luz) which means that room rentals and especially car hires could be quite expensive at that time.

[fly744]

Thanks for the reply TK.One more question,what did FIS charge for the PPL 9 theory exams?

[tango_kilo]

Thanks for the reply TK.One more question,what did FIS charge for the PPL 9 theory exams?

Written exams 65 Euro each
Skills test 300 Euro + a/c rent
R/T with LPE 100 Euro

[fly744]

Thanks for your reply TK.

[Pilotser]

Hi there, I'm interested in the school too, I would like to know if someone had a different experience from the PPL, like IR or MEP?
thanks.

[torvalds]

hiya;

Could anyone pls help me.
I started my PPL training in the UK, however due to this "unfortunate" summer weather things become very slow and I decided to complete the rest of the training in Spain.

Is it possible to transfer my hours already flown (~10) and the ground exams I already completed (9) to the new training organization?

ta

[CHEASApilot]

hiya;

Could anyone pls help me.
I started my PPL training in the UK, however due to this "unfortunate" summer weather things become very slow and I decided to complete the rest of the training in Spain.

Is it possible to transfer my hours already flown (~10) and the ground exams I already completed (9) to the new training organization?

ta

If someone within EU tells you not possible to transfer the theory credit then throw him through the propeller ! [Joke]

Totally doable, if else EASA is useless. I did it personally in Hungary so i know what am talking about. However your ten hours i doubt they will let you forward it. The best game they can play with you is tell you yes and later on telling you this and that is not good enough and we need to work on it. I've been in the cave, i know the game. By the way i won a 100CHF bet from a guy i met in HU who is a Romanian living in Ireland, same story and i predicted the outcome.

Some schools can be upfront and tell you they want you to buy 10 hours solo with them if you already hold 10 hours of instruction from britain. But schools are ran by businessmen, and some of them are pitiless morrons, my advice to you would to restart the training in whole with them and finish it quicker you can.

And yeah, hungary was a bad option in my p.o.v, so stick to that side of the world where you're heading.

i hope my failures can be useful experiences to learn from for you.

Regards,

Jason.

[torvalds]

If someone within EU tells you not possible to transfer the theory credit then throw him through the propeller ! [Joke]

Totally doable, if else EASA is useless. I did it personally in Hungary so i know what am talking about. However your ten hours i doubt they will let you forward it. The best game they can play with you is tell you yes and later on telling you this and that is not good enough and we need to work on it. I've been in the cave, i know the game. By the way i won a 100CHF bet from a guy i met in HU who is a Romanian living in Ireland, same story and i predicted the outcome.

Some schools can be upfront and tell you they want you to buy 10 hours solo with them if you already hold 10 hours of instruction from britain. But schools are ran by businessmen, and some of them are pitiless morrons, my advice to you would to restart the training in whole with them and finish it quicker you can.

And yeah, hungary was a bad option in my p.o.v, so stick to that side of the world where you're heading.

i hope my failures can be useful experiences to learn from for you.

Regards,

Jason.

Hi Jason;

Thanks for sharing your experiences. Great to hear, that at least my ground exams will be accepted, so I can dedicate my time to fly.
Tbh, I am not that worried about the hours I already completed and I wouldn't really mind buying "extra" solo hours in exchange. If possible, I would like to avoid some of those "effect of controls", or "straight and level" lessons though, but I'll take your advice and just start from fresh and get it done.

Sorry to hear about your mishaps in Hungary, may I ask what went wrong?

cheers

[CHEASApilot]

Hi Jason;

Thanks for sharing your experiences. Great to hear, that at least my ground exams will be accepted, so I can dedicate my time to fly.
Tbh, I am not that worried about the hours I already completed and I wouldn't really mind buying "extra" solo hours in exchange. If possible, I would like to avoid some of those "effect of controls", or "straight and level" lessons though, but I'll take your advice and just start from fresh and get it done.

Sorry to hear about your mishaps in Hungary, may I ask what went wrong?

cheers

Start the training freshly with them. Saying you want this and that makes of you the over-smart guy. Flight training is a totally different kind of education. You're a basically at the mercy of ATOs and changing of ATOs can be a delicate thing to deal with which everyone wants to avoid. So make sure you're giving the correct impression enough for you to get what you want.

When i landed in HU for the second time and getting to know what the country is really about i felt like being in an invaded by Russia country(technically this true).

Now understand that to train there you will need summer and in summer ATOs are full of turks who are ready to pay 600 EUR for a room per month, competition forces you to live in below the standard places unless you can really pay well.

You will be flying 1-2 hours daily and like me since you have no theory for the rest of the day you will be left wandering around with no absolute distractions; never under-estimate this. In a foreign country with long summer days and loneliness, emotional breakdowns can be really harsh.

Schools hate turks but like their money and let them run the same mistakes until they're overriding budget and start freaking out, i'm sure you know how to qualify them. When desperate i'm sure they won't care if you're Turk or EU they will simply smash your bank account.

I was basically in the best school of Hungary which is Fly...., the rest of them don't even consider. I was being trained by a guy there, P... G.. he has a very good english but he shouldn't be instructing, in fact he himself told me he was desperate for that airline job. He was swearing at me very often in the cockpit for not being able to do low passes on the second day of training. He was an absolute morron but useless to whine about now since i'm well set.

On the third day he did the same and in the midst of the flight i told him to land. Right after i reminded him i come from Western Europe, and when i give you my money i want a proper instruction in return. Not your frustration because on monday you failed your Wizzair interview.

I talked with a few previous stud and even his colleagues told me the business of the school. They give you a PPL for €7-8(k). They know people are always weary about cheap deals, so at the beginning of the year they train 2-3 guys and use them as ref to attract us on their cheap deals. By summer they're full that's why they want you to land on the very second day itself. For that price standard is even lower than a puppy mill, they don't want to lose another €7k because you're not picking up the skills quickly enough. Infact it was a guy on pprune here who recomended them to me, after that experience sorry to be generalizing, but never again in Eastern Europe for flight training unless i want to go and get dental treatment for cheap there.

Look at their websites and the way they market their schools itself shows you how artificial the campaigns are. Some i think even use fake ref. You could go there for american rates in EU, but they're intelligent, they rent their fleet only to those having done their license with them. Few will rent out to you unless you lose time by doing an FI rating with them.

I heard when times are bad then they start welcoming the Turks happily again, these guys are their escape goats. Again shows you their way of doing business.

Now understand this is my experience which might differ for you with them, its an individual thing. But PPRuNE is here for we aviators to share our experience and i will make sure to point it out.

Aviation is expensive and it takes us all a lot of passion to hand over our hard earned money to ATOs, but i hate doing business with poor mentality people. 'They only know how to take but never gives anything back' - Robert Kyosaki.

Regards,

Jason.

[torvalds]

Start the training freshly with them. Saying you want this and that makes of you the over-smart guy. Flight training is a totally different kind of education. You're a basically at the mercy of ATOs and changing of ATOs can be a delicate thing to deal with which everyone wants to avoid. So make sure you're giving the correct impression enough for you to get what you want.

When i landed in HU for the second time and getting to know what the country is really about i felt like being in an invaded by Russia country(technically this true).

Now understand that to train there you will need summer and in summer ATOs are full of turks who are ready to pay 600 EUR for a room per month, competition forces you to live in below the standard places unless you can really pay well.

You will be flying 1-2 hours daily and like me since you have no theory for the rest of the day you will be left wandering around with no absolute distractions; never under-estimate this. In a foreign country with long summer days and loneliness, emotional breakdowns can be really harsh.

Schools hate turks but like their money and let them run the same mistakes until they're overriding budget and start freaking out, i'm sure you know how to qualify them. When desperate i'm sure they won't care if you're Turk or EU they will simply smash your bank account.

I was basically in the best school of Hungary which is Fly...., the rest of them don't even consider. I was being trained by a guy there, P... G.. he has a very good english but he shouldn't be instructing, in fact he himself told me he was desperate for that airline job. He was swearing at me very often in the cockpit for not being able to do low passes on the second day of training. He was an absolute morron but useless to whine about now since i'm well set.

On the third day he did the same and in the midst of the flight i told him to land. Right after i reminded him i come from Western Europe, and when i give you my money i want a proper instruction in return. Not your frustration because on monday you failed your Wizzair interview.

I talked with a few previous stud and even his colleagues told me the business of the school. They give you a PPL for €7-8(k). They know people are always weary about cheap deals, so at the beginning of the year they train 2-3 guys and use them as ref to attract us on their cheap deals. By summer they're full that's why they want you to land on the very second day itself. For that price standard is even lower than a puppy mill, they don't want to lose another €7k because you're not picking up the skills quickly enough. Infact it was a guy on pprune here who recomended them to me, after that experience sorry to be generalizing, but never again in Eastern Europe for flight training unless i want to go and get dental treatment for cheap there.

Look at their websites and the way they market their schools itself shows you how artificial the campaigns are. Some i think even use fake ref. You could go there for american rates in EU, but they're intelligent, they rent their fleet only to those having done their license with them. Few will rent out to you unless you lose time by doing an FI rating with them.

I heard when times are bad then they start welcoming the Turks happily again, these guys are their escape goats. Again shows you their way of doing business.

Now understand this is my experience which might differ for you with them, its an individual thing. But PPRuNE is here for we aviators to share our experience and i will make sure to point it out.

Aviation is expensive and it takes us all a lot of passion to hand over our hard earned money to ATOs, but i hate doing business with poor mentality people. 'They only know how to take but never gives anything back' - Robert Kyosaki.

Regards,

Jason.

Hiya

Thanks again Jason for your advice, I believe you are absolutely spot on. I think it is the best to start it from scratch again in Spain. I do appreciate your help!

I didn't want to complete my training in E/EU, or anywhere else, because of I "came up with this idea" and tried to support my local airfield with my training fees. But the weather just didn't allow me to have a well planned training.

Even if, for the sake of argument, you've been simply unlucky in Hungary, I still believe, that there is no place in aviation for an instructor (or pilot), with that sort of attitude. I am not surprised, that he failed his interview with Wizzair. It seems Wizzair's implemented a very efficient filtering technique ;)
I hope the school in Spain run by professionals and provide a quality training for my cash.

cheers

[CHEASApilot]

Hiya

Thanks again Jason for your advice, I believe you are absolutely spot on. I think it is the best to start it from scratch again in Spain. I do appreciate your help!

I didn't want to complete my training in E/EU, or anywhere else, because of I "came up with this idea" and tried to support my local airfield with my training fees. But the weather just didn't allow me to have a well planned training.

Even if, for the sake of argument, you've been simply unlucky in Hungary, I still believe, that there is no place in aviation for an instructor (or pilot), with that sort of attitude. I am not surprised, that he failed his interview with Wizzair. It seems Wizzair's implemented a very efficient filtering technique ;)
I hope the school in Spain run by professionals and provide a quality training for my cash.

cheers


You can always support your local AD by H&F once you have your license. Wizzair tries to filter them all down, they go from zero to a fATPL in Europe for only €34k, once they have the jet hours most ditch you for western salaries where locals are paying €150k for the same license.

Europe's biggest enemy is Europe itself.

I won't promote Spain, but in this business can only wish you good luck.

Jason.

[Piniata]

Hi,

I tried to enter in contact with them in January this year, but I didn't have any answer from my mail, but I wasn't the only one, is it possible to enter in contact with them now?
I really want to do my training there but it's impossible to have all the informations I want without contact.

[torvalds]

Hi,

I tried to enter in contact with them in January this year, but I didn't have any answer from my mail, but I wasn't the only one, is it possible to enter in contact with them now?
I really want to do my training there but it's impossible to have all the informations I want without contact.

Hiya

Yep, they were kind and very responsive. Sent over patiently all the informations I asked for.
How did you try to contact them?

[Piniata]

Hiya

Yep, they were kind and very responsive. Sent over patiently all the informations I asked for.
How did you try to contact them?

Thank you for this quick answer

I tried via their email, maybe it’s my gmail that did something back and sent their answer in the spams because I got nothing, I tried in January, February and March. I did it again this morning, let’s see what’s gonna happen now

[torvalds]

Thank you for this quick answer

I tried via their email, maybe it’s my gmail that did something back and sent their answer in the spams because I got nothing, I tried in January, February and March. I did it again this morning, let’s see what’s gonna happen now



They can be fully booked up in advance for months and that might delay things...

Good luck and I am sure they'll get back to you in a day or two.

[c.172]

Have you tried: [email protected]?
That was the email for the Admin person 4 or so years ago when I trained there.
I have the following contact numbers also:
office: +34 956 953741
mobile: +34 677 038059
fax: +34 956 185712

[Piniata]

Thank you guys for the answers. I tried again, but not with a Gmail adress this time, I imagine that this one was considered like a spam or ... I don't know

For those who were there, how bumpy is the sky in Jerez? Is it quiete and smooth?

[c.172]

Usual thing in high temps - bumpy at lower altitudes and smoother at higher. Tend to spend a lot of time high as the sky is clear - unlike UK!

[Piniata]

Usual thing in high temps - bumpy at lower altitudes and smoother at higher. Tend to spend a lot of time high as the sky is clear - unlike UK!

Thank you :)

It's good to know, I was used to fly in Belgium, where I never go higher than 2500 ft and it is bumpy all way around, I'm looking in Spain to have a smoother air because I was too quickly air sick here and it was hard to stay motivated when all my flight (around 15) were impossible to enjoy because I was all the time thinking about getting sick

[Maoraigh1]

Does that drug have any side-effects which are undesirable for the Pilot Flying?

[ced0802]

Hello everyone.

Hope you are doing well.

I would like to know if some of you have done their PPL training over there. I would love to get your feedbacks.
What did you think of the quality of the training/instructors, the cost of it, how long did it take you?

thanks a lot.

[marianapaugusto]

Hello everyone.

Hope you are doing well.

I would like to know if some of you have done their PPL training over there. I would love to get your feedbacks.
What did you think of the quality of the training/instructors, the cost of it, how long did it take you?

thanks a lot.


I would like to know that too! I would love to do my PPL with them because it’s not that far from where I live (Lisbon) and here it’s almost impossible have a PPL done... but before I go, I’d love to get feedback from those who were there!

[Sam Rutherford]

Did my EASA CPL with them, very happy...

[marianapaugusto]

Did my EASA CPL with them, very happy...

and what do you think about the school and instructors?

I‘ve been trying to talk with them for 2 weeks now. They replied me only one time and it took like 1,5 week and 3 emails, plus 5 calls...
how did you talk with them?

[Sam Rutherford]

Email - and yes, was a little sporadic in advance. Once there, though, all good.

Please don't expect Harvard, budgets are always tight (wherever you go).

[juanpablocap]

and what do you think about the school and instructors?

I‘ve been trying to talk with them for 2 weeks now. They replied me only one time and it took like 1,5 week and 3 emails, plus 5 calls...
how did you talk with them?
That happen to me too! 5 mails 10 call to get a short reply, Im doing distance learning ATPL and ll be great if I can talk with my instructor. any other tips to do it?
Thanks!

[marianapaugusto]

That happen to me too! 5 mails 10 call to get a short reply, Im doing distance learning ATPL and ll be great if I can talk with my instructor. any other tips to do it?
Thanks!

Honestly I don’t know, I’m about to start my PPL (e-learning) in 8th January . And I told them that I want to visit the school first. Probably I’ll go in the beginning of the year. And one thing I’m gonna tell them is that I want attention from their part... I don’t wanna be in a school that doesn’t reply me at all or only reply me if I send 10 emails and call 15 times.

How’s your ATPL so far? And how did you managed to talk to them and start the course? Have you ever been there?

[Pedro Sousa]

I'm from Portugal and I'm also interested in knowing more about Fly In Spain Jerez but there is not that much online to trust. Is there anyone that is going to study there interested to contact me in order to share reliable info? I'm considering starting it after this Summer.

[SBwing]

I've been emailing this school since last week and not had a reply either. Shame as it makes me want to look elsewhere.

[S-Works]

I've been emailing this school since last week and not had a reply either. Shame as it makes me want to look elsewhere.

The school only reopened from Christmas break and Spanish religious holiday last Wednesday. They are now working through over 1800 emails with inquiries just like yours. The problem with email and the always on internet world is people forget how to show a little patience..... Please feel free to drop me a PM and I will help you.

[SBwing]

The school only reopened from Christmas break and Spanish religious holiday last Wednesday. They are now working through over 1800 emails with inquiries just like yours. The problem with email and the always on internet world is people forget how to show a little patience..... Please feel free to drop me a PM and I will help you.
Hi, and thank you,

I know we are all impatient these days, but that's the whole point of email or I could just put a letter in the post. Although I wouldn't trust the Spanish post either!

I live and work in Spain and part of what I have to do is answer emails for a company. I answer emails 7 days a week from 8am until about 10.30pm at night, even on Christmas Day. I even answer emails when I am out of the country on holiday. If I cannot answer emails in detail then I am expected to send a quick reply acknowledging the email and saying I will get back to them as soon as I can. It's basic customer service.

I accept there are holidays here - Monday 6th of January was a holiday yes - but I work holidays. I also accept that people are fully entitled to have holidays off, and because of all this I will wait maybe two days, three if I'm in a good mood :D But when it becomes five days with no response, it doesn't look good.

If I am looking to spend €10k with a company (I don't know the exact price because I haven't had a reply - and that is all I wanted to know) then yes, I expect a quicker response.

I went to their FB page to try and contact them that way, or see if they had prices on there (I didn't see any), and I saw someone else complaining about a lack of response a year ago so things don't seem to have changed. Then on here I read the same kind of thing from others.

I hope they can reply to me soon because I would still like to do my PPL with them.

Do you know them, or fly / work with them?

[S-Works]

Hi, and thank you,

I know we are all impatient these days, but that's the whole point of email or I could just put a letter in the post. Although I wouldn't trust the Spanish post either!

I live and work in Spain and part of what I have to do is answer emails for a company. I answer emails 7 days a week from 8am until about 10.30pm at night, even on Christmas Day. I even answer emails when I am out of the country on holiday. If I cannot answer emails in detail then I am expected to send a quick reply acknowledging the email and saying I will get back to them as soon as I can. It's basic customer service.

I accept there are holidays here - Monday 6th of January was a holiday yes - but I work holidays. I also accept that people are fully entitled to have holidays off, and because of all this I will wait maybe two days, three if I'm in a good mood :D But when it becomes five days with no response, it doesn't look good.

If I am looking to spend €10k with a company (I don't know the exact price because I haven't had a reply - and that is all I wanted to know) then yes, I expect a quicker response.

I went to their FB page to try and contact them that way, or see if they had prices on there (I didn't see any), and I saw someone else complaining about a lack of response a year ago so things don't seem to have changed. Then on here I read the same kind of thing from others.

I hope they can reply to me soon because I would still like to do my PPL with them.

Do you know them, or fly / work with them?

I am the Head of Training. I don't deal with responses to emails for courses. However when I went into the admin staff on Wednesday and asked why they had not responded to my email about something I was shown the outstanding queue of emails that had come in over Christmas while the school was closed that stood at over 1200 unread messages.

Whilst I find your dedication to your work highly laudable and in fact even admirable, I and the school do not expect the admin staff to be so dedicated as you and neither does Spanish law permit us to expect that level of dedication. I have offered to personally intervene and assist you out of hours and outside MY job description. Please feel free to avail your self of that offer or wait for the school to respond. If that level of response does not suit you then I am happy to recommend other schools that may be able to respond faster.

Your budget is pretty much bang on for a PPL(A). Please free to PM me if you want to talk further.

[Jan Olieslagers]

I will wait maybe two days, three if I'm in a good mood

Welcome to the world of private flying! My civil aviation administration now has an average queue of SEVEN weeks for a simple licence renewal - I do not mail them because it will only keep those poor understaffed people away from their real job, so I cannot say how long they take to respond. But both your expectations and your own claimed work intensity seem very excessive to me.

Most of all: do not even think of ever taking up learning to fly in such a hurried state of mind, you will only land yourself in the trees. The thing requires a relaxed approach.

[SBwing]

Welcome to the world of private flying! My civil aviation administration now has an average queue of SEVEN weeks for a simple licence renewal - I do not mail them because it will only keep those poor understaffed people away from their real job, so I cannot say how long they take to respond. But both your expectations and your own claimed work intensity seem very excessive to me.

Most of all: do not even think of ever taking up learning to fly in such a hurried state of mind, you will only land yourself in the trees. The thing requires a relaxed approach.

I don't think expecting to get a response to a sales enquiry (from any company) within a week is unreasonable. If we kept our customers waiting that long they would likely book elsewhere (we do holiday lettings). My work intensity isn't excessive. I answer emails when they come in. I don't have thousands to deal with but the mailbox is monitored 7 days a week and keeping on top of things means they don't build up for us. Just our way of doing things.

Maybe for impatience you could read excitement and enthusiasm :)

This is not just my experience / opinion, as others have also had communication issues with them going back a year.

Anyway I have kindly taken up the head trainer's offer to PM him so maybe I can get some information that way.

[William Brett]

Hi,

Does anyone have any experience of ATPL residential training and/or CPL flight training at FIS?

Thanks!

[Sam Rutherford]

I did my EASA FW CPL there...

Very happy...

[William Brett]

I did my EASA FW CPL there...

Very happy...

Would you recommend over an integrated course? I’ve been emailing them back and forth and they told me they don’t offer integrated courses anymore.

[S-Works]

Would you recommend over an integrated course? I’ve been emailing them back and forth and they told me they don’t offer integrated courses anymore.

The way our courses are structured is it allows you to set your own pace. We run them as an integrated flow but with greater flexibility and the ability to pay as you go per module. It is obviously significantly cheaper to do it this was as well. Its a more relaxed atmosphere without uniforms and airline type rostering for you training schedule. What you get at the end is the same CPL/ME/IR with ATPL exam pass but in a more flexible arrangement.

[Banana Joe]

How long does it take on average to get a reply from them after an enquire? Are they officially operating these days?
And are their PA-28's IFR equipped?

[S-Works]

How long does it take on average to get a reply from them after an enquire? Are they officially operating these days?
And are their PA-28's IFR equipped?
The school officially reopened on Monday. The staff are now working through a massive backlog of inquiries so please bear with them. Its been a VERY long 3 months and there is a lot to do.

[Banana Joe]

Thanks for your reply, I will be waiting.