21st Century Innovations for the Helicopter

[HeliStudent]

Could I ask helicopter pilots and engineers to offer their suggestions for something they would like to see improved about helicopters and which they think might be achievable with current levels of technology.

For instance, as a pilot or engineer what is the thing/s you would most like to see improved about the helicopter you fly and work on.

Even though I'm just a spectator I won't let myself off the hook and here's my idea for a safety item -

In the thread for the Brazilian TV helicopter (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/405234-tv-news-helicopter-crash-brazil-video.html) which crashed and also in the one for the crash in Siberia (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/519088-crash-siberia.html) the helicopters are badly damaged because of a loss of control and of course there are so many more like these all around the world.

My suggestion is for a "helicopter air bag" which can be activated in the event that the pilot has lost complete control and is certain he is going to crash land.

The air bags could be fitted to the underbelly of the heli and serve as floats in the event of having to land on the water but they should be maybe a bit bigger and maybe more of them so that they could cushion a hard landing as in an accident.

I know it sounds stupid and I am sure it won't work for lots of aerodynamic reasons that I don't yet understand but I just wanted to add my thoughts.

I am really interested to hear from professionals on what they think is the most important or useful thing that should be developed to improve helicopters or that you would like to see improved on helicopters.

[nomorehelosforme]

Interesting concept, looking forward to hearing what the professionals have to say!

[HeliStudent]

I'm not so interested in comments about my idea coz I know its rubbish but I am very interested to hear from those flying regularly or working regularly on helicopters (those with experience) to hear what they think is really needed or could be done in the future.

[HeliHenri]

.

Airbag, what an idea !

Nobody could have think of it ...

4 years ago, a small US agency called NASA :


http://nsa34.casimages.com/img/2013/07/20/130720014753395774.jpg (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=130720014753395774.jpg)

http://nsa34.casimages.com/img/2013/07/20/130720020820223730.jpg (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=130720020820223730.jpg)

.

[Fareastdriver]

I do not think that any airbags inflating under the helicopter will take off, as it were. The examples you show are of them not in full control. Flotation bags offshore expect the helicopter to be ditched correctly under full control otherwise it will not stay upright; the same would be expected on the ground.

Personally I would like to see full OEI performance at all weights and temperature altitudes. Should standard airline passengers be told that they was being bumped because it was too hot and there was not enough wind down the runway there would be an uproar and so it should be with passenger carrying helicopters.

[Camp Freddie]

Anything that improves the reliability of the MRGB, because as far as I can see that is the weakest point on the modern twin IFR aircraft, especially when operating over water. Unfortunately I have no idea what that new idea is 😟

[jim63]

Maybe they (Mfgs) could start with something easy,like in this letter:D

XXXXXXXXX RotorCraft, Inc.
El Cajon, Ca. 92020
August 21, 2000

"Dear Folks:
This is in Reference to your expensive 250C20 series engines. You are probably aware of the tendency of these engines to leak oil. Much of our maintenance effort is spent on trying to fix these never ending leaks.
I think I may have come upon a remedy for the above problem. For about fifty years I have operated lawn mowers. These mowers have a vertical shaft that drives a blade. This mechanism is immersed in oil. In spite of poor maintenance, sudden stoppage, over speeding (one turned so fast that it almost went into a hover), lack of oil, too much oil, and imbalance and out of track blades, etc. I have yet to see a drop of oil on the surface where the machines were parked. In light of the above I think you should either merge with Briggs & Stratton or hire one of their engineers.
Respectfully,
Bob XXXXXXXXXX

P.S. You might pass this on to MD Helicopters we have the same problem with their gear-boxes. I'm sure they would be grateful."
http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/statusicon/user_online.gif http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/buttons/report.gif (http://www.pprune.org/report.php?p=5586649) http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/misc/progress.gif

[ShyTorque]

I'd just like rear facing cameras so I can see what's falling off, leaking out, or on fire.

[Ian Corrigible]

This prior thread has some valuable inputs: Realm of the Possible - What Do We Need? (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/336785-realm-possible-what-do-we-need.html)

I/C

[pilot and apprentice]

Personally, I like simple, reliable, and simple.

I'd just like rear facing cameras so I can see what's falling off, leaking out, or on fire.

The mirrors on the 61 were brilliant! And no circuits to fail!

For myself, I want versatility. In the thread Ian references, guys ask for helicopters that have full Class 1 OEI performance fully loaded everywhere. I hear it said about the 225 (no, I'm not 225 bashing!) that all seats get filled, every time. I prefer an old 61. Lots of seats, lots of fuel tanks and lots of cargo space. I manage it.

I was able to accomplish a number of missions as long as I had the integrity and professionalism to trade one (fuel/cargo/people) for the other. I am saddened that the regulators and manufacturers no longer feel we are capable of managing the helicopter's capabilities ourselves.

I'd also put in a vote for NVG/EVS compatible cockpits as standard.

More autopilot modes and complicated features programmed in I don't need. I don't care if it will level off at 50' over the runway at the bottom of an ILS when it's only certified to Cat I. The only reason I'm there is because I screwed up or mother nature has decided to commit homicide.

I don't need a helicopter that thinks for me, but rather one that gives me capabilities to make a hard job look easy.

It would also be nice to see a manufacturer who aims at the utility market. Good load visibility, a rotor designed to lift, not go fast, and get rid of any weight that isn't lifting the load!

[nomorehelosforme]

Guys this thread is about air bags not rear view mirrors!

[HeliStudent]

Guys this thread is about air bags not rear view mirrors!

Please see post #3.

I/C that's a great thread, thanks! :ok:

There are some very interesting comments including this one by plaskon -

Fenestron tail rotor standard.
A parachute system good enough to make tail boom or main rotor separation survivable.
External airbags to cushion the hull on impact.

and another interesting comment about performance from IHL -

It is interesting that Russian Helicopters are equipped to fly in icing conditions, carry a big payload and have surplus power but are lacking in system redundancy.

Western countries have (mainly) helicopters that can't fly in ice and have limited power but have system redundancy.

To bad we can’t mix the best of both philosophies.

Some of the other items mentioned in that thread such as TCAS and synthetic vision now seem to be in operation.

[arismount]

A means of operating in known icing that can be used by light helicopters without a prohibitive weight penalty.

[HeliStudent]

Of the things mentioned so far,

* Full time single engine performance
* Problem free gearbox
* Camera to see the back of the helicopter
* Ability to fly in icing conditions

On the matter of the gearbox, it is not possible to simply over-engineer it?

[Harry the Hun]

I want a turn key solution. Just like in my car. I turn the key and the bloody thing starts up and is ready to fly. No need for hundreds of boring checks, all that could be automated in todays highly integrated systems, one should think.
If that could come together with a moderate diskloading so that one could hover without creating havoc to the world below and together with a cabin that is fairly level in the hover combined with a hight that alows a northern european to work in the cabin upright is all I ask for. Ready is your SAR bird, provided it can carry fuel for 5 hours.

[mickjoebill]

A head and blades that can't slice off the tail or cockpit, or a tail and cockpit that can deflect blades.


A capsule style composite cabin that separates from the frame in a major impact, rather than be integrated into the frame so it is crushed by the gearbox and engine.

A fuel bladder that is exterior to the frame so it too can fly off and roll away in a prang.

Nice but not possible; an ancillary independently powered device to correct a spin caused by loss of thrust from tail rotor.



Mickjoebill

[topendtorque]

I get the distinct impression that I have seen post 15 somewhere before with the same author. something jigging me. But I aint going looking.

Harry, you need to go to France, that is where Napoleon comes from. He was primarily a mathematician and inventor of the metric system which relates everything to one, because he was smart enough to work out he was dealing with the French who apparently cannot count much further than one. See how many things you have to do to start a French helicopter for example. In an American helicopters one is turning switches, taps and valves for half a blessed hour to get 'em going.

cheers tet

[Non-PC Plod]

I would like to see pilot seats which you can sit in for a couple of hours without needing a chiropractor afterwards. You can get a decent seat in a 10,000 Euro/pound car, so why cant anyone make a comfy helicopter seat?

[HeliStudent]

Non-PC Plod would you like something like this?

http://www.autobahnpower.com/images/Recaro%2007/Recaro%20Orthoped%20Facts%20WS.jpg

[chopjock]

We most likely would have more technically advanced helicopters if the regulator allowed an easier upgrade path.
For example, upgrade piston engines to electronic ignition, but the certification process is prohibitive cost wise.
If only we could throw out the regulator and get one in that is pro aviation...

[peterperfect]

Tail rotor and main rotor impact avoidance warning systems are being researched by a couple of manufacturers. Main rotor strike warning particularly useful for SAR aircraft and tail rotor system for all of us. Lets face it, what car doesn't come with a (lower tech) reversing warning option these days ?
pp.

[Camp Freddie]

I'd just like rear facing cameras so I can see what's falling off, leaking out, or on fire.

the aircraft I am flying right now have tail camera's that look forward, mostly we use them to see whats going on around us on the ground, with the baggage bay etc. but it's great to know that we actually have a good way to confirm a fire now if required.

[500e]

One that does not leak in slightest rain

[riff_raff]

Of the things mentioned so far,

* Full time single engine performance
* Problem free gearbox
* Camera to see the back of the helicopter
* Ability to fly in icing conditions

On the matter of the gearbox, it is not possible to simply over-engineer it? helistudent- I don't mean to sound trite, but the reality is that all rotorcraft engineers put huge effort into making their designs highly reliable and "problem-free". I have worked with many of these engineers and I've never met one that would ignore an unsafe condition or sign-off on a design that had obvious problems. They all take their work very seriously and do the best they can. Every single part design has at least a dozen engineers from various disciplines (chief & project engineers, stress, dynamics, M&P, thermal, manufacturing, reliability, QA, etc.) review and sign-off on it.

As for the notion of "over-engineering" a gearbox to make it more reliable, I would simply point out that rotorcraft transmission components are already some of the most highly engineered parts in the world. They are designed and analyzed using the most advanced software tools, the highest quality materials are used, the manufacturing processes are very tightly controlled, and the entire design/manufacturing process is highly regulated by government agencies.

In reality, gearbox failures are rare. But when they do occur they can be catastrophic events. The reason is that there is only a single drive path from the engine input stage to the rotor, which can be disabled with certain types of failures. Normally this problem would be resolved by designing the aircraft with redundant and independent drivetrains and rotor systems, but this is not practical. If you or anyone else knows of a solution to this issue I'm sure the OEM's would love to hear about it.

[lelebebbel]

I want a turn key solution. Just like in my car. I turn the key and the bloody thing starts up and is ready to fly. No need for hundreds of boring checks, all that could be automated in todays highly integrated systems, one should think.

Well FADEC is certainly a step in the right direction, but the reality is that in 20 years, most of us will probably still be flying machines that require 35 switches and buttons to be pressed in the right order just to get them going, and that burn down if you accidentally press them in the wrong order. And after that we'll all be replaced by drones anyhow...

[Aluminium Mallard]

How about a modern piston engine for light machines.

When you look at how efficiency in automotive engines has come along in the last 50 years I am sure we could have more efficient designs without sacrificing reliability.

[Spunk]

I would be happy with a helicopter that has sufficient power to get airborne with:

full tanks (range of at least 4 hours)
every seat occupied (6 Pax)
decent baggage compartment seize
some reasonable baggage for the 6 passengers

[500guy]

"A capsule style composite cabin that separates from the frame in a major impact, rather than be integrated into the frame so it is crushed by the gearbox and engine."

Hughes solved this one with the A-frame and Engine relocated to the rear rather than overhead.
It is the main reason the 500 is so darn crashworthy.

[HeliStudent]

riff raff - all I meant was that if there is such desire to see gearbox issues addressed is it not possible to go a little bit over the top in their design in an attempt to deliver what people want? It was just a question but I am sure gearbox technology is something which, like all engineering, is constantly progressing.

One of my first questions on the forum was about gearboxes and how all the helicopter loading is transmitted through them and how the helciopter's fuselage basically hangs from them. They are obviously at the heart of a helicopter's dynamic systems taking in power, converting it to thrust and bearing much of the weight of the helicopter.

I would be very interested to hear anything you have to say about gearbox advancement over the years such as some of the major advances which have taken place and what you think needs to happen next. If anything.

[Gemini Twin]

More ceramics in turbine engines and all composites in structures and oil less gearboxes. Come on young engineers and scientists stop spending so much time on consumers electronics and do something useful for a change.

[Grenville Fortescue]

Come on young engineers and scientists stop spending so much time on consumer electronics and do something useful for a change.

Couldn't agree more. :D

Many moons ago Bell were toying with the idea of mercury-filled gearboxes. Quite what benefit this would have brought about I'm not sure.

Let's hope that Cameron's backing of Reaction Engines (http://www.reactionengines.co.uk/) "Reaction Engines Ltd. can announce today the biggest breakthrough in aerospace propulsion technology since the invention of the jet engine" isn't just a load of heat-exchanged air!

UK Government Invests £60M in Spaceplane Engine > ENGINEERING.com (http://www.engineering.com/DesignerEdge/DesignerEdgeArticles/ArticleID/6023/UK-Government-Invests-60M-in-Spaceplane-Engine.aspx)

[lelebebbel]

I would be happy with a helicopter that has sufficient power to get airborne with:
full tanks (range of at least 4 hours)
every seat occupied (6 Pax)
decent baggage compartment seize
some reasonable baggage for the 6 passengers

That's easy - just take any 8 or 10 place helicopter and remove a few seats

[500e]

lelebebbel
written like a designer :E:ok:

[RotaryWingB2]

Helistudent-

It is possible to make a indestructible MRGB with current technology. In fact they could make near enough indestructible helicopters if they so chose to.

The problem is, they'd be so damn heavy, they wouldn't be able to fly. Which would make them safer, for sure. ;)

[Rigidhead]

Heli-Student,

Of interest (perhaps to some anyway), the BO 105 Main Gearbox was designed so that it does not carry any flight loads. The Mast and Mast Bearing take these loads and they are carried through the rather beefy titanium upper flange and transmitted by the A-Frame Struts to the fuselage.

On another note regarding Piston Engines; while I agree that there is potential for many inprovements re electronic ignition/FADEC etc., the
over-all idea that automotive technology is far superior always leaves out two
very important real world issues. Weight and power requirements. The average high end sports car has a very impressive power plant. Now run it
at max revs. for 2,000 odd hours and then add up the repair bills AFTER
it has failed and left you at the side of the road.

All the best,

Rigidhead