Captain 'captain' Wales

[Sun Who]

Prince Harry Qualifies As Apache Commander (http://news.sky.com/story/1112124/prince-harry-qualifies-as-apache-commander)

Sun.

[smujsmith]

OK I'll bite,

Only in the respect that I'm curious about the young Sirs role. From what I've read in the press etc, I get the impression that Captain Wales is actually the Army equivalent of a "Wizzo" and doesn't actually fly the aircraft. Please don't get me wrong, I am not in any way trying to denigrate his obvious prowess in his chosen occupation. But does he fly it, or does he operate the systems ? It never seems clear, and, the latest report (above) seems to indicate greater responsibility for him, but still doesn't say if he is "hands on" piloting the beast. Perhaps one of our Army colleagues could help an old engineer out and explain it. I must say, a guess is probably better than anything that Sky News could claim as an accurate report !:oh:

Smudge

[500N]

My understanding is this.

The co pilot in the front main function is to handle the weapons
but he can fly the aircraft if needed. The pilot in the back is the
main pilot. Prince Harry can and does fly the aircraft.

Would be good if Harry kept going with his Army career.

[smujsmith]

Agreed 500N,

And thanks for that info. He strikes me as an excellent role model for youngsters these days. I tend to ignore the more salacious stuff the press get into a frenzy over. We were all young once! Thanks again.

Smudge

[500N]

Yes, in most cases he is a good role model and yes, we were all young once !

Nothing he has done that I have seen is out of what has occurred
by others, especially in Messes !!!


Not sure whether you like reading but I found a few of the books
on the Apache in Afghanistan quite interesting. The two Ed Macy books,
am currently getting a couple more, the one by "Charlotte" and a US
pilots book.

[smujsmith]

500N, thanks again, always on the lookout for a good read. I'm assuming Ed Macy ? Apache and Hellfire . Just got them ordered on Amazon. I may be able to answer my own question when I read them :rolleyes:

Smudge:ok:

[500N]

Yes, those two. Hopefully someone far more qualified will come
on and answer your question.


Re the books, you have to read between the lines sometimes ! but a good read anyhow.

I really want to read Charlotte's book as that will give another side
to Ed Macy's writings.

I can't remember the 4th boo I want.

[Clockwork Mouse]

He wears pilot's wings so yes, he can and does fly the beast.
The Army does not have Wizzos. Apaches carry two pilots. The one in the back normally flies it. The one in the front controls the target acquisition and weapon systems. However, both pilots are trained and qualified in both roles. They can also both do each others jobs from their own seat if required, but the guy in the back is the pilot, the one in the front is the gunner. Either can be the aircraft commander, provided he is qualified to that level, as the lad now is.
This is an extraordinary achievement. The lad has exceptional ability. The royal bashers who maintain that he only got where he is because of who he is are certifiable.

[Genstabler]

Amusing to hear that Sky News refers to his CO as a Lieutenant Commander.

[smujsmith]

Clockwork Mouse,

That explains it a bit better I think. Like you I believe that he is following a normal career progression. No sign of heirs and graces about him, a bloke I would happily have a beer with. It's a shame the press feel that it's their duty to build him up, and then no doubt, take the greatest pleasure in "bringing him down", when the mood takes them. I wish him all the best, he is obviously suited to his chosen path, as his commanders have commented, and all credit to a man who is prepared to put his @rse in the fire, when he could walk away and be another rich kid.

Smudge

[Tankertrashnav]

Well I learnt something from this thread. Never heard the term "wizzo" before!

So if I were 30-40 years younger I'd have been a "wizzo"?

Who'd have thunk it?!

By the way I picked up a load of old AAC 'O' and 'G' brevets when I was dealing in such stuff. Does the army still have observers and gunners?

[diginagain]

The Observer and Air Gunner training stream was supposed to be phased-out with the introduction of CREST (Crew RESTructuring) in the late 1980's, which would have ensured that all Army aircraft would be crewed by two pilots. A good number of them were still clinging-on into the 90s when I gave it all up.

[gr4techie]

The royal bashers who maintain that he only got where he is because of who he is are certifiable.

I wonder why him and his brother are pax in a helicopter flown by someone else and not a Typhoon pilot. cough cough.

[Q-RTF-X]

Some people need to get a life.

fancy dress party ... get it ? Insensitive perhaps, but no more.

who paid for that then? ... well do tell us, please.

[500N]

TT2

Q-RTF-X said it before me. Might not have been the wisest of fancy dress
but it was fancy dress.

He was on leave. Are you trying to say that no RAF Officer never partied like that on exchange or on a Red Flag exercise ?

Reading some of the threads on here - the drinking culture thread for one,
doesn't look to me like much different to what Harry was doing.

His one failing, or the failing of his body guard was allow photos to be taken.

[parabellum]

gr4techie - Oh what a sad little man we have here then! (or is he/she just pure troll?).

Prince William is the captain of the aircraft he flies, having recently qualified as such and commands the whole shebang on rescue missions.

Prince Harry has just qualified as captain of an Apache helicopter.

Both jobs are among the hardest you will find in the rotary world. In order to ensure that you, yes you get the best return for your money the princes were trained on helicopters at lesser cost as they will have considerable and ever increasing Royal duties to perform and this is considered more cost effective than spending millions on training them up to and keeping them at Typhoon standard.

[Kerosene Kraut]

Harry is a good guy. Actually both brothers are.

[Wholigan]

parabellum - as a mod I'm not allowed to "criticize" people for their opinions in here, but merely have to keep the whole shebang on the rails.

So it's really useful to see posts such as yours above where I can then just go :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

;)

[P6 Driver]

Unfortunately, PPRuNe has a few people who post without much knowledge of what they comment upon, in the same way that other sites have those who claim to have "done P Company" or been awarded parachute wings.

My personal opinion is that anyone who seriously believes that the British military would certify a pilot as an aircraft Captain/Commander just for show may benefit from doing some research beyond what they consider to be their field of expertise.

Well done to both Princes for what they have done so far in their military careers.

[Gerontocrat]

Well done to both Royal aircraft captains doing, as stated above, two of the hardest jobs in the rotary world.

Those who say that the two of them have achieved this because of their Royal status are clearly talking bolleaux and know nothing of how the military works. Imagine the results of a BoI should a serious incident occur while one of them was driving and his lack of skills was found to be a factor. I suspect whoever signed off his quals would come in for a pretty rough ride.

As for the oft-repeated statement: "Can you imagine any instructor failing them". Nonsense.

I know of at least one member of the Royal family who was categorically told "I don't give a s**t who your mother-in-law is, there is no way you are going to pass your promotion exam, so you'd better get out while the going is good."

As I understand it, the above is slightly bowdlerised from the original.

[CoffmanStarter]

TTN ...

Just for completeness ...

Weapon System Officer = WSO (pronounced 'Wizzo')

Weapon System Operator = WSOp (pronounced 'Wizzop')

WSO are commissioned officers and WSOps are non-commissioned officers (NCO).

:ok:

[The Oberon]

Quite agree with what has been said about the Princes' ability, after all it's not all that long ago that one of their uncles found out he would not get an easy passage through bootneck training.

[Haraka]

Regardless, I'm quite sure that Harry's father is very proud of him.

[Tankertrashnav]

Thanks for the info diginagain and coffman starter.

gr4techie


I wonder why him and his brother are pax in a helicopter flown by someone else and not a Typhoon pilot. cough cough.


Why would this helicopter be flown by a Typhoon pilot :confused:

Regardless, I'm quite sure that Harry's father is very proud of him.

Prince Charles has stated that he is very proud of both his sons on many occasions.

[Milo Minderbinder]

FWIW
Harry was in the front seat of the display Apache at Cosford, and according to the announcer he and his colleague "make up this years Army Apache display team"
I assume that selection is based on ability?

[The Oberon]

Haraka, take a look at his maternal uncle, that's where he gets his looks.

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

Never heard of HM Forces display crews being picked on anything other than ability. Doubt very much if Harry would take the job otherwise, even if offered.

*and after Vegas, he certainly seems to have the correct attitude for the after-show parties :E

[teeteringhead]

Haraka, take a look at his maternal uncle, that's where he gets his looks. ... and/or get yourself a calendar! The timings are way out for the outdated, disregarded sleaze which I assume you are nudge-nudge wink-winking about .......

[Tankertrashnav]

I think it is just convention that members of the royal family don't take legal action, but I dont actually think there is any law against it.

I'm not suggesting that most of the tedious "nudge nudge wink wink" (as teeteringhead puts it) comments we get on here are libellous, but I have certainly seen some which would definitely lead to damages should any of the aggrieved parties decide to sue.

Wouldn't it be just great if Harry decided to sue and put an end to this rubbish once and for all. I doubt if he ever would (but Hewitt might!)

[Howabout]

I don't have much time for the Royals, being Australian and a republican; however, this young bloke strikes me as the 'real deal.'

He was out there with his mates putting his on the line the same way they do. Like his mates, he shows courage and character.

And yes, my understanding is that he's fully qualified to fly the machine - the crews are cross-trained on the Apache.

Facetious comments regarding his father being proud make me want to puke.

Stick your ass in a gunship in combat, you cynical w*anker, and tell me you'd perform half as well.

Otherwise Cobber, bugger off!

[Arfur Dent]

Ahh - that woderful phenomenon - a balanced Australian! :ok:

[500N]

Looking at those who pushed the Republican cause last time,
I doubt any of them could hold a candle to Harry.

[Howabout]

Arf, the bloke is doing his bit; and I admire his courage and that of his mates. That's all I wanted to say.

500N - a totally irrelvant comment in the context of my previous post.

Stick mind in gear, and stay on target, before pushing the transmit button.

BTW Arf, we ain't the total bunch of bastards that we are sometimes painted across your way.

We just had a phenomenal series against the British and Irish Lions. Two really close games and then your boys totally waxed us in the third.

They were awesome and deserved the win. Even our journos said that in the press - no excuses.

Cricket coming up!

[Genstabler]

Howabout
Arf was pulling your leg mate. You Aussies pull ours enough! And we don't paint you as a total bunch of bastards. Like many Brits, I admire and respect you lot down under enormously and can't think of any country I would rather have in our corner in a scrap. Except Canada. Oh, and New Zealand.
But I can't think of any country I am happier to beat at any sport! Mainly because it doesn't happen very often!

[ratpackgreenslug]

TTN

Wouldn't it be just great if Harry decided to sue and put an end to this rubbish once and for all. I doubt if he ever would (but Hewitt might!)

Wouldn't it be just great if these unfounded and scurrilous rumours were put to bed once and for all by Harry taking a simple paternity blood test - but I doubt if he ever would.

Just a suggestion. Hope I don't get sued.

[Clockwork Mouse]

Knock it off chaps. Whichever camp you are in, you are discussing the private and personal life of a serving officer in the armed forces to which many of you belong or have belonged. Show some respect.