Pia being escorted by typhoons from man to stn

[ukdean]

Just breaking now

[ukdean]

PIA stating for security reasons

[JackRalston]

7700'ed over North Sea, circled near GOLES FL160 then headed back, RAF fighter jets escorted it, just landed at STN

[ukdean]

Essex police state an "incident has occured" on the flight.

[Flightmech]

It just landed and taxied north side to the 500 stands. Them Typhoons are noisy:ok:

[ManaAdaSystem]

Incident on the plane, and 15 levels of officials have decided the best course of action was to escort the plane from MAN to the London area?

[luoto]

There are incidents and incidents, of course, and the choice of STN may have a relevance dependent on the initial information and its processing. A clearer picture will no doubt emerge, as to whether that was the correct course of action based on available information.

It wouldn't normally happen, for example, if a pissed Swede was singing a little too enthusiastically.

[shomas]

Stansted is the airport of choice for the UK government to divert aircraft to in the case of a disturbance or hijacking on board.
"This is because its design allows a hijacked airliner to be isolated well away from any terminal buildings or runways, allowing the airport to continue to operate while negotiations are carried out, or even while an assault or rescue mission is undertaken. Staff at the airport receive special training for dealing with hijacks."

London Stansted Airport - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Stansted_Airport#Incidents_and_accidents)

[surely not]

Stansted is the designated airport in the UK for such incidents and has regular training exercises for those on the ground who will/might be involved in resolving the crisis. They know every hiding place etc etc to ensure that they have a successful conclusion.

Bringing the plane to STN is better than having it divert to a less well known (to those from Hereford) airport

[Buster the Bear]

The red icon indicates it was wearing 7700

[luoto]

Reuters: BRITISH SECURITY SOURCE SAYS EARLY INDICATIONS ARE THE DIVERTED PAKISTANI PLANE IS NOT THE SUBJECT OF A TERROR ATTACK

(of course, things can change: just like the "electrical problems" on 7/7 and the "small plane" on 9/11 but one should not jump to any conclusions either way.

[ManaAdaSystem]

Stansted has been designated by the UK Government as its preferred airport for any hijacked planes requesting to land in the UK

He was already IN UK, so why drag him across the country into the London area? Why did they not do the same with the SAS flight who lost contact (a different tread in R&R)?

Unless the PIA flight is actually hijacked, that would certainly change the picture.

[Man frm the Ministry]

The red icon indicates it was wearing 7700 This covers a multitude of issues.

Wearing a 7500 would be far more significant IMO

[shomas]

He was already IN UK, so why drag him across the country into the London area? Why did they not do the same with the SAS flight who lost contact (a different tread in R&R)?

Unless the PIA flight is actually hijacked, that would certainly change the picture.

Because this isn't a lost comms issue, I have read on other sites that comms were in use at all times, the pilots were in contact with the typhoons and were told by them to divert to Stansted.

It's there because this is something more than normal, and Stansted is equipped with the best anti-incident staff/equipment for the whole UK, including an incident apron that is isolated from other buildings and aircraft.

I've just heard that on BBC this is regarding a, "threat", by individuals onboard. I would play safe than sorry if I was the government/MoD and immediately divert it to an isolated place than a busy Manchester airport that has no preparation for this.

[eglnyt]

He was already IN UK, so why drag him across the country into the London area?

As others have said there are designated places for these things. You are going to either Stansted or Prestwick if somebody decides you need to be escorted anywhere.

Why did they not do the same with the SAS flight who lost contact (a different tread in R&R)?

They did, Prestwick is the other place designated for such flights.

[ManaAdaSystem]

Didn't know that, thanks!

[romy]

Information received by BBC from an indviidual in Manchester caused this.

[Sir Herbert Gussett]

He was already IN UK, so why drag him across the country into the London area? Why did they not do the same with the SAS flight who lost contact (a different tread in R&R)?

Unless the PIA flight is actually hijacked, that would certainly change the picture.

SAS flight diverted to Prestwick which has same standing as Stansted. Both are preferred airports for UK "at risk" flights. Not sure why you are trying to argue this point?

[romy]

2 men arrested on suspicion of danger to an aircraft.

[G-GOLF]

Essex Police - Boarded aircraft, 2 Arrests on suspicion of endangerment of an aircraft

[Burnie5204]

From Sky News

Mashood Takwar, from Pakistan International Airlines, told Sky News that 25 minutes before landing Manchester air traffic control* contacted the pilot after apparently receiving some information from British security services.

[Jetblu]

More here.

BBC News - RAF Typhoons scrambled after Pakistan Airline incident (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22658979)



Fighter Jets Scrambled To Passenger Plane (http://news.sky.com/story/1095214/fighter-jets-scrambled-to-passenger-plane)

[mickjoebill]

Channel Four reporting that two men have been arrested on suspicion of endangerment of an aircraft.

Two arrested after RAF diverts Pakistan jet to Stansted - Channel 4 News (http://www.channel4.com/news/raf-jet-pakistan-plane-diverted-to-stansted)

[bacp]

Rather amusing that the ad under this thread is for "cheap flights to Pakistan". Mmmmm, maybe not!

[DaveReidUK]

Shouldn't laugh, I know, but the BBC News Channel has been showing a live feed from their helicopter over Stansted for the last 15 minutes, panning repeatedly across the airport and it has only just managed to home in on the aircraft's location.

[barry lloyd]

Shouldn't laugh, I know, but the BBC News Channel has been showing a live feed from their helicopter over Stansted for the last 15 minutes, panning repeatedly across the airport and it has only just managed to home in on the aircraft's location.

I'm watching Sky and they've only just managed to find it as well. Mind you the weather's not great, but there aren't too many 777s at Stansted!

[demomonkey]

for the last 15 minutes, panning repeatedly across the airport and it has only just managed to home in on the aircraft's location.

Probably pre-arranged protocol in case any pesky terrorists aboard are using their iPhones (other brands are available) to watch the SAS preparing to storm the aircraft. Surprise is everything... :)

[Ianp83]

Sky news also saying "source" claims two men tried to enter the flight deck

[Ianp83]

A witness speaking in Urdu to Pakistani station Geo TV, said that two men over 6 feet tall tried to enter the pilot's cabin.

Essex Police have confirmed that two men have been arrested on suspicion of endangerment of an aircraft after the plane landed safely at Stansted.

[Dak Man]

Maybe it was the crew trying to get back into the cockpit after a kip in J class..........

[Flightmech]

Looks like the RH gear went off road as it taxied into the stand too:E or a wide heavy vehicle.

[Piltdown Man]

Stansted is the airport of choice for the UK government to divert aircraft... ...because you don't want incidents like this buggering up BA and the like at Heathrow or Gatwick. Far better fouling up RYR and EZY operations.

[skydiver69]

A BBC reporter just said that the pilot 'hit the panic button.' I've now got a vision in my head of two big red buttons in the cockpit with the words PANIC and DON'T PANIC written on them.

[BOAC]

Surely it would be PANIC and CANCEL PANIC? Alternatively, just a PUSH TO PANIC (guarded) switch?

[angels]

Dak Man - :ok:

Piltdown, it's been explained that STN is the English airport of choice because ops can carry on and the staff there have been especially trained/briefed on what to do.

Do you really think the security services have decided to send potentially dodgy aircraft to STN just to bugger MoL off?

I think it's all rather sensible.

[Dak Man]

Semantics perhaps but shouldn't the crew have squawked 7500 and not 7700 as reported, or am I out of date on ICE codes?

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

7500 = hijack. 7700 = emergency.

So as far as can be ascertained, they used the correct one.

[Dak Man]

Semantics again but IIRC 7500 is Interference not hijack, (7600 Comms, 7700 Emergency).

[Basil]

What is it with these cnuts? We'd an incident on the approach to Kuwait when a passenger started standing up and shouting abuse at other pax. CC managed to get him seated before landing and I asked for police to meet us and arrest the guy whom, at that time, I guessed was an ethnically European Christian having a go at the locals.

By and by I suggested to the Chief of Police that a night in the cooler to teach him some manners might be in order but the Chief was reluctant to comply. Due mainly to curiosity I asked to see the man's passport. the Chief passed it to me and it was British but with an Arabic name; clearly an Islamic convert. Now that all was clear I just asked the Chief to hang onto him long enough for my crew to leave the airport which he obligingly did.

Upon our return for departure, our Kuwaiti agent said: "You know why they wouldn't arrest that man? He is Muslim convert."
NSS!

[jackieofalltrades]

Semantics again but IIRC 7500 is Interference not hijack, (7600 Comms, 7700 Emergency).

Actually 7500 by definition is Hi-Jacking.

See Section 2.6 (http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/eadbasic/pamslight-EF5BAD66AA19CCFB82CACB73584B83EA/7FE5QZZF3FXUS/EN/AIP/ENR/EG_ENR_1_6_en_2013-05-02.pdf) of ENR 1.6

[MarkJJ]

75 taken alive, 76 in a fix, 77 going to heaven. Some one told me this wickedness.. made it easy to remember :)

[5711N0205W]

Yes don't put squawk codes here this is a special place, instead invest 2 seconds for a quick google and they're everywhere....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transponder_(aviation)

[xcitation]

I know facts are thin on the ground however I find it frustrating that passengers can try it on at will and then if unsuccessful they could be dismissed as "sorry I thought it was the loo door and i was desperate to get in" with a slap on the wrist.
Most likely this was a genuine false alarm however it is all too easy to trigger a full emergency response and incurr huge costs and distress. I really hope there is some point of law that can be brought against these kind of nutters and set an example. There has to be some dis-incentive or else we will end with every other flight going through a anti terrorism exercise.

[McTall]

7500 is unlawful interference (hijacking is given as an example) and the pic from Dak Man looks more like An F15 from lakenheath.

[Basil]

7500 is Interference not hijack, (7600 Comms, 7700 Emergency).
That's all been changed because too many people knew those codes.
I can't tell you the new ones or I'd have to kill you ;)

[Basil]

Ww/W, I'm a seaman and airman of many years experience and I can assure you that scale and distance are/is very deceptive. Eyes, camera, recollection all lie.

[Blind Squirrel]

...who proceeded to talk themselves into an arrest, per the London Evening Standard:-

It is believed a passenger on the flight allegedly threatened to blow up the plane after other passengers tried to intervene in a row he was embroiled in. Murtaza Ali Shah, a journalist, said he had spoken to a friend on board the plane, Fakhir Iqbal, a political activist, who was sitting behind the man who made the threat. Mr Shah said his friend told him: "Two guys started a row with a girl and lots of other people. Some people tried to calm them and asked them not to be rowdy and abusive. Fakhir told them to calm down. They said 'don't bloody speak to us or we will blow up the plane'. The crew came and spoke to them and they were openly threatening the staff. Fakhir went to other crew members and told them they were making threats."


Two men quizzed on mid-air 'fight' | London Evening Standard (http://www.standard.co.uk/panewsfeeds/two-men-quizzed-on-midair-fight-8631326.html)

[CargoOne]

A silly question - what is the purpose of scrambling fighters if the comms were normal? Or let me re-phrase it: what is the chain of decision making in UK to shoot down an airliner?

[Sunnyjohn]

Stansted is the airport of choice for the UK government to divert aircraft... because geographically it is near the East coast in an area of low population compared to Manchester or Heathrow and also because with a prevailing wind across the UK of West to East, any incident which might involve toxicity, such as chemical or nuclear, will likely result in dangerous substances being blown out to sea, rather than over areas of dense population.

[garpal gumnut]

All in all, a good result.

Passengers and machine safe.

A good Action by RAF, which will assist in training.

I really fail to see what all the kerfuffle is about.

Nutters or drunks will be charged.

PIA continues it's good case as an Airline of choice :eek:

[Admiral346]

A silly question - what is the purpose of scrambling fighters if the comms were normal? Or let me re-phrase it: what is the chain of decision making in UK to shoot down an airliner?

Not so silly, me thinks.

I would think hard on who to tell what in sn incident like this. Depending on the country you are over, maybe nothing,just declare emergency and land.
There are those itchy trigger fingers...

[pull-up-terrain]

I'm assuming there weren't any Air Marshals on board, but in a scenario like this, surely they would have intervened? I'm kind of surprised there weren't any Air Marshals on board especially from a higher risk country like Pakistan...

[tonker]

Yesterday i asked why the moderators are they allowing the discussion of sensitive transponder codes, but the mere mention of a certain middle east airline and your immediately censored.

I am aware this information is available if you dig enough, but don't believe that it should be broadcast on a forum open to the public.

Safety first my arse.

[Lon More]

Could it have been being escorted out of a different European Airspace to the UK, Belgium or Holland maybe, don't they have F-16s?
Seems to have happened near GOLES so would have come via MUAC Delta Sectors. SOP there is F16s

[25F]

Why are they "sensitive transponder codes"? If there is anything secret about ATC procedures not covered somewhere in these 700 pages:
http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Order/ATC.pdf,
do you really think that it would be hard for the Bad Guys to find out?

[overthewing]

The transponder codes are publicly available from many sites - just Google 'transponder codes UK' and nearly half a million results come up. Pprune is not the first result in the search. We're certainly not giving highly secret information away.

[PPRuNe Radar]

Seems to have happened near GOLES so would have come via MUAC Delta Sectors. SOP there is F16s

There was no incident notified prior to reaching UK airspace, so although your reasoning is logical and sound, it's all simply down to the Daily Fail getting it wrong and publishing a photo from a totally different event.

We can put that part of this topic discussion to bed now.

Thanks

PR

[Daermon ATC]

Post 33 made me chucle but instead of a DON'T PANIC button better make that a towel :ok:

[Sable Knight]

Basil i find our story VERY hard to believe. If you ask people who have lived and worked in the middle east you will find there are two sets of rules. one set for GCC and the other for non-GCC. If you are non-GCC they are far from lenient.

[Basil]

Basil i find our story VERY hard to believe. If you ask people who have lived and worked in the middle east you will find there are two sets of rules. one set for GCC and the other for non-GCC. If you are non-GCC they are far from lenient.
Did you mean "your story".
If so, don't listen to your friends; speak to someone who's been there, done it, got the T-shirt.
Bas - GF 4yrs living in Manama, frequent trips to DXB whilst working for CX, trips to Persian Gulf whilst working for BA.

[reynoldsno1]

I'm kind of surprised there weren't any Air Marshals on board especially from a higher risk country like Pakistan...
Great, I'm sure there would be a long list of Taliban applicants for that job ....:uhoh:

[ShotOne]

Well said. I'm astonished the air marshal argument is trotted out whenever something like this happens. Their case is massively flawed; surely the risks of having an armed potential rogue must approximate to that of a hijacker?

[sitigeltfel]

The two goons have gone on trial....

BBC News - Stansted emergency landing: Pair 'threatened to blow up plane' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-24915855)

The trial is expected to last five weeks. :ugh:

[Piltdown Man]

I'm missing something here. A five week trial? Our legal system is out of touch with the real world, the world that pays its wages. Threaten aircraft = get arrested, go to court, have hearing (two hours?). Guilty = get sentence, innocent = walk. Done!

[dtaylor1984]

Well, need to allow plenty of time for the melodrama:


[Prosecutor Brian O'Neill QC] said: "That day Pakistan Airlines flight PK709 took off from Lahore heading for Manchester. It never arrived at its intended destination."