EASA PPL EXAMINATIONS ISSUE

[justmaybe]

Has anyone received these yet from the Belgrano?

[BigGrecian]

No and I sent the form back 22nd February.

I emailed M.D yesterday as well asking what is going on....

Did keep aside a few copies of Edition 39 of the map though.

Also does anyone know about the PPL exam sittings :

In Section 1 Part D Page 1 of CAP804 states :
Applicants for the Part-FCL LAPL or PPL licences shall make application and undertake the theoretical knowledge examinations at an Approved Training organisation (ATO). Examinations for nonprofessional licences conducted at ATOs are scheduled at the discretion of the ATO.

Part-FCL states :

FCL.025 : If an applicant has failed to pass one of the examination papers within 4 attempts, or has failed to pass all papers within either 6 sittings or the period mentioned in paragraph (2), he/she shall re-take the complete set of examination papers.

EASA FCL AMC states :
AMC1 FCL.025 Theoretical knowledge examinations for the issue of licences
TERMINOLOGY
The meaning of the following terms used in FCL.025 should be as follows:
(a) ‘Entire set of examinations’: an examination in all subjects required by the licence level.
(b) ‘Examination’: the demonstration of knowledge in one or more examination papers.
(c) ‘Examination paper’: a set of questions to be answered by a candidate for
examination.
(d) ‘Attempt’: a try to pass a specific paper.
(e) ‘Sitting’: a period of time established by the competent authority within which a candidate can take an examination. This period should not exceed 10 consecutive days. Only one attempt at each examination paper is allowed in one sitting.



A sitting is determined by the authority - and they can only have 6 sittings to take a total of 9 exams.

Does anyone know how long a sitting is given the fact that a day would be too short and 10 days would be too long, a week seems reasonable like the ATPL exams - as I can't find any information on what the CAA define as a sitting for the PPL exams....

[BEagle]

IAOPA Europe will be raising this topic at the next Part-FCL Implementation Forum in Dublin immediately after Easter.

The current (not the new ones still to be released) CAA PPL exams include 205 questions, which is 71% more than the EASA requirement. Other Member States have suggested as few as 2 exams, with a total of 120 questions.

Some people prefer the idea of FAA-style 'learn the answer' computer-based single exams - although others are vehemently opposed to the idea.

It would be interesting to hear your opinions.

[S-Works]

Single FAA style learn the answers. It's all they do now and a lot of the content is irrelevant. Would make my life easier administering them as well.

[justmaybe]

Unfortunately, the content and value of both the Professional and Private examinations is largely irrelevant. The professional exams have for some time been based on 'learn the answers' and to that extent are no better or worse than the US FAA model - except far more expensive. The PPL syllabus needs a massive realistic overhaul, as does the examinations and how they are administered. It's very hard to know where to start, but a fresh and innovative approach is surely needed. The EASA contribution is impractical, unfit for purpose and pretty much meaningless (probably a good description of EASA generally) I wish Bose X and Beagle well in their endeavours.:rolleyes:

[BillieBob]

Does anyone know how long a sitting is given the fact that a day would be too short and 10 days would be too long, a week seems reasonable like the ATPL exams At present, according to Standards Document 11, the CAA definition of a sitting is "The attendance at an examination centre for the purpose of taking or writing a single or set of examinations in one day. Only one attempt at each paper may be made in any one sitting."

[Whopity]

Maybe if EASA collected all the questions from all the EU States they could find 120 relevant questions however; I doubt they employ anyone who could identify a relevant question if they saw one!

[Mickey Kaye]

“Single FAA style learn the answers. It's all they do now and a lot of the content is irrelevant. Would make my life easier administering them as well”

I could not agree more

[dobbin1]

Letter from Ray Elgy (head of licensing & training standards at the CAA) in Pilot magazine last month.

A sitting will be defined as "a maximum of three consecutive days" and the number of questions will be 16 or 20 per paper x nine papers. Yet to see anything "official".

[BillieBob]

Once again the CAA has to do a u-turn on published policy. This (http://caa-complaints.co.uk) has potential.

[Whopity]

Letter from Ray Elgy (head of licensing & training standards at the CAA) in Pilot magazine last month.Perhaps he should learn how to communicate with, and supervise his own staff, rather than adding to the mess by issuing his own communication to a rather limited press!

[BigGrecian]

So does anyone actually receive the new exams?.....

[high wing harry]

Just spoken with the CAA.

EASA say and exam sitting is a period of 10 consecutive days. The CAA had originally said that it was one day.

They have now adjusted this - they now define a sitting as 3 consecutive days.

Not sure how this overcomes the fact that they are not allowed to change EASA's acceptable means of compliance (AMC) without getting a new AMC agreed but at least they're moving in the right direction...

[BillieBob]

EASA does not say that a sitting is a period of 10 days. AMC1 FCL.025 states that a sitting is a period of time established by the competent authority that should not exceed 10 consecutive days. Neither one day nor three days exceeds 10 days and both periods are, therefore, compliant with the AMC.

[dobbin1]

Can anyone explain what the reasoning is behind this "6 sittings" nonsense?

Is it just to make it harder to pass the exams as part of a campaign to kill off private flying in Europe, or is there some logic to it?

Will PPLs that pass under this system be safer pilots than those that did them one at a time under the old system, or even those that just did one exam under the FAA system?

[S-Works]

No, its a complete crock. Its another one of the drafting errors that the people who made then are to proud to stick their hands up and say sorry they got it wrong.

There is no safety case whatsoever for applying this rule.

[Mickey Kaye]

Isn't this an interpretation error rather than a drafting error.

"AMC1 FCL.215; FCL.235
THEORETICAL KNOWLEDGE EXAMINATION AND SKILL TEST FOR THE PPL
(a) Theoretical knowledge examination
(1) The examinations should comprise a total of 120 multiple-choice questions covering all the subjects"


So if we had one paper of 120 questions covering all the subjects. Then would not six sittings would seem perfectly appropriate?

Whereas we have 9 exams covering all the subjects but they still have to be passed in six sittings. Which obviously doesn't work so rather than admitting we have made a mistake we have defined a sittings as 10 days.

A crock it is

[Level Attitude]

Can anyone explain what the reasoning is behind this "6 sittings" nonsense?

EASA (I believe) discussed, planned and then set the "rules" for Commercial
Aviation - and, to ensure a certain depth of knowledge, I think it a good idea
to prevent ATPL candidates studying for, and then taking, their 14 exams
one at a time.

The problem for PPL students is that EASA (as in many other areas) then
applied the same rules to all aviation - not considering the requirements,
needs, or practicalities, for the Leisure/Private Pilot.