Personal callsign vs aircraft registration

[nellycopter]

I,m after a bit of help,
How would you register for a personal callsign ? (uk) to use instead of the full aircraft registration ?

These seem to be used more often now days but cant fing any information on how to apply..

Nelly01 ........ Ha ha

[SilsoeSid]

http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=56&pagetype=70&gid=118&faqid=337

How do I obtain a radio telephony callsign?
Contact [email protected] for further information or see AIC 97/2008 (yellow 278)on the NATS AIC website.

[SilsoeSid]

http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/eadbasic/pamslight-6C1F25B149F7224C4DE256EF6E37C951/7FE5QZZF3FXUS/EN/AIC/Y/097-2008/EG_Circ_2008_Y_097_en_2008-12-04.pdf

4 Telephony Designators
4.1 With the exception of State aircraft, ICAO Telephony Designators will normally only be assigned to AOC holders. Normally, no
more than one Telephony Designator will be registered for each aircraft operating agency, aeronautical authority or service.
4.2 Exceptionally, Telephony Designators may be assigned to non-AOC holders at the discretion of DAP. In such cases, the
assigned Telephony Designator may be used for flights operated in accordance with aircraft and pilot licensing requirements.
Telephony Designators will not under any circumstances be assigned to individuals for personal use.
4.3 Telephony Designators may be used as part of the radiotelephony callsign in accordance with ICAO Radiotelephony Procedures
(Annex 10, Volume 2) and CAP 413 Radiotelephony Manual. Telephony Designators should resemble as far as possible the name of
the aircraft operating agency or its function. Ideally, there should be a correlation between the three-letter designator, the Telephony
Designator and the name of the aircraft operating agency or its function.
4.4 In order to reduce the length of R/T transmissions, Telephony Designators should be brief and comprise if possible one word of
two or three syllables. It should not exceed two words. The Telephony Designator should be easily and phonetically pronounceable.
4.5 The use by aircraft operators of Telephony Designators relating to an Air Traffic Service Unit is not recommended and should be
avoided.

Application form on AIC :ok:

[SASless]

Huey 509......

[parasite drag]

I've never quite understood this..

I hear pilots calling "Rinky-Dink zero four" etc.and not giving the reg. of the one of several different helicopters they may be flying..

Is the a/c - reg. not actually relevant to RT ?

[nellycopter]

Dinky-dink zero four.... Mint......

Anyways, the relevant forms and info listed above goes on about having an AOC etc, but in some cases may be granted without..
Me not having an AOC will probably be a no then, so I will let you know the outcome....

Nelly-copter zero one.....

[sycamore]

As above ..4.2,last line...

[topendtorque]

Over here its only handy for prioritising during military excercises etc. airmed 1, 2, 3 or 4 or etc, don't know but I guess the medevac helicopter would be equally treated, Careflight 1, or 2. of course that designation goes with the aircraft designation so the people in the glass tower know who it is.

Otherwise if you are big enough and smart enough to be (speedbird one) or (Qantas 527) (flight number) then we just act like the peons that we are.

Bit like cow cockies in the Territory; they must have a three letter brand registered for their cattle before they get an applied for symbol brand to go with it, which they would use for sale animals only, usually.

Back in the good old days we were all on first name terms with all the Flight Service Unit gentlemen, (which they were) one only had to cough and it didn't matter whether it was malfunction in Kununurra or Tom in Alice they would call you straight away, you OK there mate (first name).

They used to call up sometimes and say, can you listen out for us for a while I've got a message to run, ??? * ?? Just sitting there waiting for one of the ta taa Fockers to call up and give them a bit of lip, yessir, bloody ingorant sods. Reg's boys were good and extremely helpful by compaison.

[Savoia]

When my godfather took over from PPRuNer Paco flying the Towers LongRanger (the 206L belonging to Alton Towers) we applied for a service number and were allocated "ALTON 01".

Because we didn't have an AOC the entire process was handled by Air Hanson.

To be honest the "zero one" designation was a pain, it didn't really fit smoothly into the RT comms. You would be better off with a two or three digit number or the name followed by a letter.

I think 35 Sqn use "Ascot" followed by three letters and the RHF (when HM is aboard) "Rainbow 1 Romeo".

I love the RAF call-signs though .. "Vortex"

[Agaricus bisporus]

PD, the callsign is only a unique name to identify you against all the other aircraft out there, the reg does that as well as anything else but there's no "need" to use it.

I suspect that company callsigns aren't always crafted by the poor pilots who have to use them, Many - most are fine but there are some excruciating ones out there...
The poor buggers that have to call themselves Specsaver must cringe every time they hit the mic switch, there's an American bizjet called - really, I'm not kidding, Batman and I think there's a Gotham out there too. The sheer cheek of some european carrier calling itself B line (the old BEA callsign) - no bloody respect, is there? Virgin Express(EI) used to be Green Isle which didn't exactly trip off the tongue and is just plain silly but Go was spot-on. Speedbird is just perfect too. There's a clever one too, I can't recall the first word but it's Risky Business - something business anyway and a pun on the first word. Made us smile when we heard it anyway.

Company callsigns don't always work, years ago the cantankerous old git who ran Headcorn would simply refuse to communicate with you if you used one, you had to revert to using your reg if you wanted to get in or out of there but that sort of thing was what gave Headcorn its character. I doubt it was legal though.
Personal callsigns are a boon sometimes as controllers get to know you as an individual and it does often open doors, or rather zones when others are routing around as they know you are reliable and won't give them headaches.

Frankly in a light aircraft or an R22 it is faintly ridiculous, pretentious, a bit like PPLs or club instructors wearing gold bars.

HM iirc is Kittyhawk, Rainbow is Phil the Greek but I stand to be corrected on that. Charls is or was Golden Eagle wasn't he, and Andrew has one too but senility has erased that one. Maybe that's changed.

Navy call themselves Navy and Army are Army, so why are the crabs poncing about with Ascots and Vortices then? Ha! As if I have to ask. Still, the USAF heavies use the rather baffling Reach. Why?? Is it an Air Force thing?

;)

[Savoia]

You are a funny man Agaricus .. thoroughly enjoyed that post! :D

I think Rainbow has always been associated with the regal rotorcraft and Kittyhawk the planks but 'suffixed' with different numbers (or letters) signifying who's who.

[Dave Gittins]

I do find it faintly ridiculous such as last Saturday morning at Redhill when a helo called up as "Redhill Tower good morning; Callsign 04"

and the response was "Good morning 04, which aeroplane are you flying today"

Respnse " .. oh its G-AAAA".

Didn't really shorten anything.

[nigelh]

I have tried with and without a company callsign and have come to the conclusion that it DOES help . Flying through Manchester and Birmingham zones i get told to route around 9 times out of 10 when using the aircraft reg but when using company callsign i go straight through 9 times out of 10 .
I think , rightly or wrongly , the ATC guys think you are going to be less trouble if a company pilot . ( and judging by some of the long winded waffle that some pilots come out with im not altogether surprised !!)

[902Jon]

I have done both personal call signs in the past (Dollar 08 then latterly Dollar 22) and aircraft call signs now. Bristow have call signs for each aircraft. Can be a right pain first thing in the morning if you have been flying one aircraft for a number of days, and then you get something different.

More amusingly is when the military used to have fun :-

"Skin formation check in"

"One Skin"
"Two Skin"
"Three Skin"
"Four .........."

Or for the older amongst us..

"Banana formation check in"

"One Banana"
"Two Banana"
"Three Banana"
"Four"

[Canute]

Oi Agaricus!


As a former user of the "Specsavers" callsign I'll have you know that there was no cringe whatsoever.

"Specsavers 2 4 1" as invented by one of the Specs FO's is still one of my favourite callsigns, and used to get a laugh occasionally from ATC and other users.

I did enjoy some of the Royal Navy ones.

"Havoc" and "Menace" were suitably warlike, and Tiger and Claymore were nice.

"speedbird" is just so gauche..;)

[ralphmalph]

902jon,

Bit of a urban myth nowadays. Check ins are always:

"skin"
"2"
"3"
"skin 4"
"Benson App, Skin, 4 merlin....."

Worse still is the use of "Skin formation" mil call signs are there to indicate that you are a formation......just the call sign should be used.

Not good when ATC controllers mishear "Demon" for "Seaman"......worse still when they ask "does your call sign have two a's in it or two e's" ;-)

[obnoxio f*ckwit]

NATO Trigraphs:

M9N95, not a single ATC agency, mil or civil, got that right first time for an entire day!

And I think 230 had Klingon, which caused a few pauses on the R/T. "Klingon is going on route", "Roger, Klingon, live long and prosper!", "Actually that's Vulcan formation, but thanks for joining in!"...

[Agaricus bisporus]

Canute.

Salut!

:)

And I've heard it said that there is a SID in the States where the reporting points are ITAW, DITAW, APUD an DETAT. Probably a wind-up but too beautiful if true.

,,,if in doubt, go on, read it back....

:)

[Gordy]

Probably a wind-up but too beautiful if true.

Nope tis true...Here is the RNAV RWY 16 at Portsmouth...KPSM

Here it is (http://www.reportingpoints.info/PDF/00678R16.PDF)

Here is a bunch of other funnies:

Intersection and approach names (http://www.funnyairlinestories.com/pilot_stuff/intersections.asp)

[ShyTorque]

Once flew in a military formation of helicopters around the Salisbury Plain area. As part of the training task we had to carry out a landing at Wroughton military hospital (on the helipad on the disused airfield). One of our staff had to be admitted for a "minor surgical operation in the men's plumbing department".

We chose an appropriate formation call-sign from our allocated list.

We put the incumbent on intercom so he could listen out.

First call he heard on the radio was: "SNIPPET Formation - check in!" :E

[Brilliant Stuff]

I have seen in the past a website on the web which lists all the callsigns, but I lost it and I can't find it again. Anyone know it?:O:O

[Genghis the Engineer]

I found one a while ago, but it was full of errors.

I did my CPL (plank) at EGTC, and now do a bit of instruction there. Personal callsigns are the norm, with type declared at initial contact. The format is straightforward - organization name (one word), followed by a 2 digit instructor's identifier, then if it's a solo student, a '1'.

It seems to work, the tower have a clear idea of who they're dealing with, and can cut those who need or warrant it a bit of slack.

I think that it works slightly better in that environment than registrations only, but only slightly better.

G

[md 600 driver]

Fixed Callsign Details Index (http://home.btconnect.com/egkb/Callsigns.htm)

[topendtorque]

Then there are the base stations that enjoy different callsign status, 'Bulldog’ base being the tag for many years of the Helimuster operation at Victoria River Downs. Made famous for its collection of '47's and top line drivers – he he - during the big cattle clean up campaigns. I have heard ex slaves argue with each other as to who was the ‘top slave’ back in '82 or ‘84 or whenever. One such ex HM driver a kiwi bloke, called up bulldog base a few years ago to say g'day as he was going over on a commercial and no one even responded even though they still use the freq. Talk about a letdown. I just happened to hear him from some distance away and was able to say g’day.

Another is “Moonraker” base, its name origin not well known.

It's close by one of our main defence bases at where the newbie WAAF traffickers are inducted early each year which is during the tail end of the wet season. Made me smile somewhat when one of them with her sweet little dulcet voice asked me if I was inbound for 'Moonraker' a couple of years back, when I was having serious divert problems with low cloud and very heavy monsoon wx.

Legend has it the tag comes from a lady of some talent, reputed to have 'lit up' twenty road train drivers in one night. The connection being that the road trains owner also owned the block of land where the base now is.

[Brilliant Stuff]

Thanks for the list.

[Sir Niall Dementia]

I bimble around under a company allocated C/S. Controllers get to know it and either trust you or treat you as a dangerous loon! I was very shocked recently to find that it was the most used C/S at a certain Southern England LARs unit, that tells me ops have me flying far too much:{

SND

[caistorboy]

Heard on good authority from an ATC friend of mine who used to work up at Carlisle airport some years ago that he was advised that 2 RAF Jaguars would be low flying on his patch- callsign "Prescott" and they were/did !