Turkish Airlines [Archive]

B737NG

22nd Mar 2012, 20:04

Had the following Mail in my Mailbox today. What is that now? After they scared away alot of Guy´s and did not extend the contract of many others the eroding situation is forcing them to shop outside again. Too bad, hopefully the fellows are warned that they will do the same today again. Your Contract ends when they want ! Not when it is due.....

It is all still in a mess, not organised, all will come together one day but it can fall apart at the very next day as well. So do not go there to leave a secure job. If you are jobless then it is another piece on the plate but have a plan "B" in the sleeve, it will happen again that they scarp the people when the Expat phobia is suddenly kicking in one day.

Parc Aviation on behalf of Turkish Airlines is happy to announce we are now accepting applications for B737NG Captains.

The minimum requirements for this position is as follows;

Minimum Requirements:

6,000 hours total flying time (4,000 hours in multi-jet MTOW 27 tonnes or greater)
A minimum of 2,000 hours in command as Commander/Captain of B737-NG (some EFIS PIC may also be taken into consideration when accompanied with 1000 hours NG PIC time).
Class 1 medical
ICAO English minimum level 4
JAA Licence
Meet Age profile of 37-59 at commencement
Current Captain /Commander, First Officers, qualified as Cruise Captains, does not meet requirements.

Must be current and have flown the aircraft in the last 12 months

Base: Turkey
Contract: Direct with airline
Duration: Initial contract offer 1 year renewable

We are waiting on confirmation from THY if they will accept all other licence types outside of JAA, therefore we are happy to accept expressions of interest from Captains who are not JAA licensed. Please review the terms above and if you would like to be considered for the position, please complete the application form and send back to me directly as soon as possible.

niss

27th Mar 2012, 07:24

4 month of training in the Sun. :)

0074

1st Apr 2012, 10:21

Check the contract offer.

Duration one day less than one year so THY HR Department refuses to pay you earned vacation when you leave (or are terminated as many are after the initial one year).
ID ticket offer in the initial contract disappears after first year of employment.
If you extend after first year and then leave you are charged Training Cost worth approx 7000€ even after initial contract.
Pay is calculated in local currency and the Turkish Lira to EURO/USD rate is not attractive at the present.

Fredtheman

7th Apr 2012, 20:40

The latest from THY is that apparently they are not getting a good response to their recruitment drive.- but then is anyone surprised. It seems that they over did it when they decided not to renew contracts and now they are very short of pilots. This combined with the fact that there is an exodus of ex pats has caused a problem.
So the THY solution is to call all expats to a meeting and make dramatic promises of .permanent jobs, pay increases, etc etc. However my guess is that these promises will last until the summer is over and then ............??
Can anyone confirm that some or any of the supposed meeting is true?

Fluke

7th Apr 2012, 22:52

Fredtheman

I have also heard the rumours. Can't see how it would work though with many of us flying here on license validations. Surely we would need a Turkish license to take up a permanent job. Still it doesn't stop them from making an offer! The admirals mightnt be that happy either! :cool:

HamFan

8th Apr 2012, 10:45

And on top of all of the above bad news, you had to live... in Turkey!!!

Why not simply wave goodbye from a THY layover destination - the day after payday? Get off the airplane and forget to go back after your rest break. Don't forget a room party.

Thanks, guys, I was toying with the idea of a THY job but after reading those posts and hearing the exact same from most of the guys I know who went there, they can jam it.

flapshutter

8th Apr 2012, 18:49

Can the same be said of Sun Express, or is this a different kettle of fish?

Krueger

8th Apr 2012, 20:02

What don't you do what I did?
Tell the broker that you want 9000€ tax free, 5-on 3-off, 5-on 4-off, and flight to and from any THY destination on your days off.

Off course the answer was NO. But if everyone raises the bar, they won't have any other option.

Ah! I know that because I am currently flying, I can bargain.

Check Six, Krueger

B737NG

9th Apr 2012, 09:18

The way they are structured it may work even better 5/4, it is just a matter of time when they have to give in on that. Are you sure your message is passed on to the relevant Department or did the Agent took the buffer and just dropped it as they promised they can find Pilots for that crappy condition?.

Write to them directly and tell them, I am more then 100% on the side that eroding conditions should be stopped. Even when I was out of a Job I took not the first offer, was the lowest by the way, I took one who gave me more pleasure.

Fly safe and land happy

NG

Payscale

9th Apr 2012, 15:20

I cant wait to see the end of this story.... eventually they will have to leave aircraft on the ground. I dont work for them but have friends that does.
What the story on B748 or A380...

aircase

11th Apr 2012, 14:46

Any present B737 expat captain with THY is looking for “parachutes”, a back up system in case things turn foul for them.
The number of voluntary endings is still on the rise. Thy is hoping the positions will be taken by ill-informed newcomers?
The following information is posted:

Duration: 1 year renewable
Base: Istanbul, Turkey
Roster Pattern: 5 days on, 2 off / 6 days on, 1 off
Commencement Date: As soon as possible
Screening location: Istanbul, Turkey
Accommodation provided: During screening & for first 15 days after joining
Ground transportation provided throughout training
Reality is as follows:

Duration is to the liking of the company and not the employee. They might give you one week notice when they don’t extend. Even in the second year of contract THY charges the training costs to the pilots that are leaving. Many lawsuits are in place by pilots that have left to receive their correct final salary.
Base: Istanbul as base is defined by the company’s lawyers as both Atatürk and Sabhia Gökcen airports, which gives the company the right to have the pilots report at Sabhia( with a transfer to that airport in your own time and at own costs) and the right to finish your day at Sabhia (return in own time and at own costs!) The trip from Atatürk to Sabhia can take up to a few hours and a taxi will cost you substancially.
Roster pattern: The scheduling department forces their pilots to work outside the rules. In the labor agreement it is laid down that a pilot should be off duty 12 hours after his last flight before his day off starts. In real life the schedules have been stretched to end at midnight before the day off. The subtle pressure being used is the line: if you don’t fly we will take your salary…. Afraid of hassle (and or job) many just do it.
Commencement date: the sooner the better as they are running short on captains (many Turkish pilots have not passed the English language proficiency test).
Screening location: Of course Istanbul with a paid ticket by the company. Better to inform the new guys about the ID90 rights are only for the first year. The second year ZED fares are in force.

Accomodation: no remarks
Ground transportation: more precise information will learn that the only paid transportation is from the hotel to training center. Any other transportation to head office, police station, photo shop, hospital, clothing center etc., will not be reimbursed.

Think twice , learn Turkish as they hardly speak English and only join when you are desperate, otherwise you will become it just a bit later...
Long haul? Much better conditions. Commuting contract and housing arrangements.

0074

11th Apr 2012, 21:17

Just realized THY pays the ticket when you join the company :) thank you - but when your contrat is terminated or you resign they cancel your last PC and leave you in open space without renewed certificate and refuse to pay your return ticket to your homebase:=

ph-ets

12th Apr 2012, 09:35

Can the same be said of Sun Express, or is this a different kettle of fish?

I work for SunExpress for more than two years. General a good company to work for, but not a commuting job. If you like the sun and dont mind flying 1000hrs a year, go for it.

ph-ets

12th Apr 2012, 16:09

Sorry but my experience is different. Two times a month i have four off days in a row. That is enough for me to travel to my own country. Turkish people are very friendly and have much respect for us foreign pilots. But i know from other people that THY and other Turkish companies are different then SXS. But I can say I am very happy. If you are willing to relocate it is a good company to work for.

aozc

13th Apr 2012, 12:44

THYTHY I think that PH-ETS was refering to the question regarding SXS, where I think he/she is working.

ph-ets

14th Apr 2012, 09:35

I am not working for THY but SXS. My experience is different I love this country. Maybe the difference is I am single and don't have to worry about kids and education.
But it is still your choice to relocate, and they don't force you to sign the contract. I think you are a little bit disrespectful with you post to the country and its culture. It is a different way of living don't compare it to your own life. And if you want only that life stay where you are. Every country and culture has it own problems. Don't try to change it, it doesn't work but try to adopt to it. But as I said, I don't have experience with THY

fullforward

14th Apr 2012, 12:08

I understand English isn't your mother language, but I fail to capture your point.Would you mind to elaborate a bit more, please?

flapshutter

14th Apr 2012, 15:03

thanks PH-ETS, appreciate the info:)

fullforward

16th Apr 2012, 20:11

Now is much better than your previous post!
Thank you for the good info.:ok:

FF

HamFan

16th Apr 2012, 20:33

Hmmmm:

Turkish people are very welcoming and friendly

versus:

The Airline upper management and senior pilots are xenophobic

Everyone is friendly until they see their own personal meal ticket being threatened. Sounds like a bunch of a*s*holes, regardless of who it is.

fullforward

16th Apr 2012, 23:04

You got the perfect picture!
Albeit I'm not currently working for THY I understand perfectly what you mean.
Unfortunately the way they regard the expats in general won't change in the near future.

Payscale

17th Apr 2012, 05:34

My conclusion is that the job is only suitable for someone who has come out of retirement and could easily stop tomorrow....or was wise enough to save more than I have..!
For the rest of us that depend on salaries to keep the family running, its not an option. Wish it wasnt so.

B737NG

17th Apr 2012, 07:55

First the company and the suroundings are unique, well saight THYTHY.

The people I flew with where nice and warmhearted humans, they embraced you as you where one of theire own even during the assessment.

Then you have the one who are jealous when you deadhead from or to IST on a A320 or B737 and they think you block them from getting promoted to the"High Fleet Job" (A330/340 B777).

On the other side you have the quarter to quarter thinking people only in the higher level of administration and the ones who deal with the Government agencies about valdidation and visa. Not effective at all. There where cases that type ratet and expirienced pilots need about 10 to 12 months until they finished the conversion course, needless to say that many of them left in the meantime.

Now they see that the past was not any good for THY. Now they try something new, throw a new coin and hope for the best instead of taking the right people into the right key position to get things going. That of course could hurt the Buddy scheme, that would question the status quo for some and there you start to reach the starting point again: Find the corner where you start when you are in a circle !

Just to enlighten you a bit more: No hiring into the A330/340 and B777 fleet, advise from above. Sort out the problem in another way, back to square one.

Discipline requires also sacrifice your own benefit now and then, the way I have seen it is that many try to invent the wheel new. Achieve goals without any concessions who would be beneficial in the long term. Targets are set from quarter to quarter, who cares about a year or even for a decade?

The product that the passenger get in the Cabin is good, the food outstanding.

If you are ready to retire tomorrow like Payscale saight it maybe fit you, if you need to feed a family and pay the bills regularly then beware the step you might do: From slippery ground to iced surface. You could slide out tomorrow again as there will be a new excuse that the services of ExPats is not welcomed anymore and you are faster History then you think.

Enjoy the Blue Mosque, the Grand Basar, the Bospherus Cruise and the Evenings at the Taksin Place as long as you are there if you want to take the chance but be warned and prepared at the same time.

dignified

25th Apr 2012, 08:24

This is in layman's terms how I can describe SXS; Here are the facts:

1. Anadolu Jet had to close down as Pegasus filed suit about illegal competition practices, therefore giving birth to SunExpress expansion.
2. Last December 2011, several foreigner Captains at THY were unexpectedly called to discover the dream of SXS, which was nothing but a nightmare if U continue reading below. (THY sold Foreigner captain names to SXS without their consent) Both HR at THY & SXS work in tandem.
3. SXS is the creation of the infamous THY COO & Flt Ops Directorate to make foreigner pilots at THY occupy the new vacant slots with a pay cut. (-6700T.L/mo), and fly all domestic Anadolu Jet rosters, about 4 to 5 legs/day.
4. SXS max pay is designed to reduce 25% the domestic operating costs of THY, by hiring personnel who are non-typed, and chaps unemployed for past six months. (preferably Yabanci=non Turks).Cheap labor!
5. Some chaps were attracted to the idea of 50/50% funding THY/LH, but as most Germans did with Pegasus, they also decided to pull out recently from SXS, leaving this relatively new outfit 100% under THY funding, and used as the backyard of THY for domestic flights in replacement of Anadolu Jet.
6. THY is a monopoly in Turkey (Andolu Jet, Bora Jet & SunExpress all owned by THY);
7. Working patterns at SXS same or worse than THY (A320/B737NG) operations and based in places like ADA,ESB,SAW,AYT.
8. Employment agreement one page, conditions of service pretty much similar to those offered in Africa or Central America.
9. No union, no job protection, other that working at will.

One positive note: the Management of SXS is more crystal and transparent than that of THY. They seem to have been bred with LH(Lufthansa) HR policies & practices, they treat people better, they accommodate personal issues more humanely, and most important, they let foreigners participate with their former experience in the making of SoP's and other operational issues. Good luck!

dignified

25th Apr 2012, 09:58

THY is fairly new to dealing with foreigners, and civilian pilots to say the least. They only started recruiting about three years ago, after the AMS accident where EASA/JAA Netherlands auditing team discovered the pilot group had nothing but ex-military Turkish personnel, the type of individuals proud of bombing their Kurdish brothers towards the Iraqi border; THY was forced to accept Yabanci (Non-Turkish) pilots in order for them not to be banned into European airspace, as the AMS accident was not the first one in this airline.

Proud Turks voted NO at TALPA (Turkish THY Pilot Union) when told about THY management seeking foreigners to fill-in the vacancies for the anticipated expansion. They feared being accused of not complying with ICAO English level 4, and many other deficiencies that they sweep under the rug on the basis of protecting their ego. The result then is obvious, how many Turkish pilots do you know working away from Turkey? How many B777 fleet mangers have you met with (0) zero hours on type?

The schizophrenia mentioned by THYTHY is indeed clinical, but so is the case with other professionals there, such as doctors, lawyers and journalists. It is a cultural problem. They are simply not loved by their neighboring countries, and everyone wonders why?

One very sincere Turk (hard to find one:eek:), told me once: Captain, Turkey is not Europe, we are Middle East, please understand that our names and words in our language originate in this part of the world. The extreme case was vented out when I asked about the definition of a Turk?;

"A Sheep's Skin. A sheep never marauds, a sheep never deceives, a sheep is magnificently dumb and docile. With a sheep-skin on his back, a fox can pass right into the chicken coop."

The victims? All foreigners who dare to be nothing but staples of their own whims.

Despise the free lunch, you are joining a proud society where you maybe arrested for uttering remarks praising the Kurds or even knoding the Armenian genocide, the North-Cyprus occupation, Ergenekon, and other issues offending "Turkishness":E

For the record, THY owes a pay increase to all employees members of Hava-Is (HAVA- (http://www.havais.org.tr)) over 18 months of backdated pay. Is this the future venue you are seeking for you and family members?

[COLOR="DarkRed"]Professor Fevzi Yılmaz appointed mediator in THY dispute
Tuesday, 10 April 2012

Yesterday, in line with the provisions specified under The Collective Labour Agreement, Strike and Lock-Out Law (No. 2822), the competent authority, appointed Professor Fevzi Yılmaz as the mediator in the presence of both parties.

Legal representatives of Turkish Airlines affix an objection annotation maintaining that a mediator should be appointed by the court. This indicates that THY management aims to postpone the bargaining process and is behaving in bad faith. THY management can even open a court case against the appointment of Mr. Yılmaz as the mediator.

The term of duty of the official mediator shall start on the date on which the notice of the court is delivered to him.

niss

26th Apr 2012, 07:03

Latest rumors from THY:
THY are wondering why they do not have any applicants to the CPT. positions.
Yeeah WHY!!!!!!!

I´m wondering why they wonder :)

twentyyearstoolate

26th Apr 2012, 13:58

Not only that, but why would anyone want to join Turkish when they have dishonoured their current Captains.

We were all told we would get a 3 year contract after the first year, and when the time came we only get renewed for 1 year! That is not what I was promised, and if I knew I would be on a 1 year rolling contract that gives me no job security at all, I would never have joined.

THY seem to think they can do whatever they want with no repercussions at all. Pilots talk on here and I only hope this thread helps someone to make the right decision if they are considering this place.

Day to day the job is pleasant, but the second I get a more secure job I'm out of here in a flash.

samjetblaster

28th Apr 2012, 08:24

Stay away from this outfit.S.....:E

dignified

28th Apr 2012, 08:35

Latest result from in-house English level tests revealed Turkish Pilots average about level 2. The press in Turkey gave most corporate multinational business workers an "F", or the equivalent of level 1 perhaps.

This audit did not change the fate of high level managers whom today and in past administrations could simply not communicate with foreign Captains. The same thing with the cause of the accident in AMS back in 2009, which was hidden even to auditing CAA from Netherlands in Turkey. It is vox populi amongst THY pilots & management at the time, that the Turkish Captain of that flight had over 130hrs on the clock in the last 30 calendar days. They still blame Boeing for the faulty RA; It is hard to be humble, and that goes from the top.

South Prince

28th Apr 2012, 16:01

Thank you all for advice and suggestions, but is anyone out there with recent assessment experience to share?

many thanks

samjetblaster

8th May 2012, 09:04

Don't waste your time..:=

paokara

9th May 2012, 11:22

they need to offer more cash and a commuting contract or better days off patterns.

my thoughts

paokara

14th May 2012, 14:05

more money.....9000 euros plus housing for example for 80hrs and 20 on 10 off.....will be a start

250 short? whoaaaa

dignified

18th May 2012, 12:35

We got multiple emails recently expressing sadness about the young man who collapsed in front of his wife and two daughters while trying to peel some fruits from the kitchen. A stroke or sudden heart attack of a man under 40 is rather unusual, but when it hits, it hits harder than those up in age.
THY present management is experimenting with civilian rule using military vindictiveness strategies, and they seem happy controlling the subdued pilot group, at least the local one. The recent death of an Onur air pilot in Amman opening the L1 door, and this latest occurrence are hitherto indications of steering the ship in the wrong direction. MoT and DGCA in conjunction with THY are now redesigning new strategies of work that includes repression, and cost reduction, at the expense of innocent and hardworking employees who only desire to feed their nest specially in times of financial troubles.
But one thing is unacceptable, I was perplexed yesterday seeing the Snr V.P Ops or CP, whatever he wants to be called, sending emails to pilot comrads to feed the family of the besieged pilot; I consider this an affront to managerial strategies if not a disrespectful approach to the subject; Has he forgotten that the company he so proudly represents is 18 months in arrears of backdated pay for which they continue playing games with the union? This guy sits on a comfortable office room in a dumped building nearby the airport , flies maybe 10 hours a month, pretends he is Charles Lindberg and now wants to fill in the gaps of an infamous company at the expense of decent airmen? ARE THERE ANY ETHICS LEFT BEHIND IN THIS OUTFIT??:=:yuk:

johnnyringo42

18th May 2012, 19:41

You have made me one who won't venture there, thanks for the word.

capt.m

20th May 2012, 21:20

Heard Turkish diverted to NBO on fri due to
tailwind landing on runway 05 in Mogadishu.
Any truth to that or did they divert for another
reason?

marco737

24th May 2012, 16:23

Don't do the turkish airline assessment :
unless you need one week holiday don't go to this assessment. you arrive on sunday you don't receive a program, it's a day to day event first day document check, then you finished, the second day you have a sort of psychological test just for fun, and an internal english test you can't use it for the renew of your license.....
Then you go back to the hotel, then you receive an email when you're suppose to do your sim check, also for that you will need almost all the day to do 1 hour of test..... then ..... back to the hotel. then you have to monitor email to know if you're ok for the interview........
Maybe you will have it the last day and it will be your problem if you miss the flight.....
So if you need a week holiday in Istanbul ok, if you need a job..... better to say home )))))

Nick 1

25th May 2012, 08:47

What about SFI A320 job ?
Can some soul post info about ?
Tks

paokara

26th May 2012, 13:59

Supposely they increased the salary I was told by a 777 captain who flies for Turkish.

What is the new pay and schedule for a 737 captain?

Is it permanent now or still 1 year contract

0074

26th May 2012, 14:31

From what I have learned THY is still stalling legal union negotiations about the 2011 pay not to mention 2012 and now THY and the Turkish Goverment is working towards a total ban on strike possibility by the airlines pilots so I don't think the pay raise has been given. The offer through Sigma is still 1 year renewable without real commuting possibility unless 2 days home every month makes you happy.
They have to come up with 4 days + 2 traveling days, 6 days together, and some kind of International ID Tickets on own airline to make it attractive for a family with kids - but my info is about 2 weeks old.

Jetaim

28th May 2012, 09:52

At Marco737.. segato eh?

dignified

29th May 2012, 20:16

The airline has steadily been creating cabin crew jobs, pilot jobs and maintenance jobs through its fleet expansion in recent years. It has grown from 100 aircraft in 2006 to 153 in 2012, with that number expected to grow to 190 by the end of the year.

Mr Kotil said that he hoped to see passenger figures of 38 million for 2012, with revenues of $7.8 billion.

Interesting article, one would only wonder, where would they park those additional 37 aircraft, and who is going to fly them??

THY present management at the helm of this CEO play to peoples fantasies....
The truth is often avoided because it is ugly and unpleasant. (THY AMS accident); Never appeal to truth and reality unless you are prepared for the anger that comes from disenchantment. Life is so harsh and distressing that people who can manufacture romance or conjure up fantasy are like oases in the desert.

Today's resolve of THY Flight Attendants and Technical Engineers who voiced their support for democratic values to remain in Turkey is historical. Sadly enough the pilot group lacks this courage and enthusiasm for essential values of freedom of speech. :yuk:

Babylon

30th May 2012, 15:26

The struggle continues
Members of Hava-Is have announced a new wave of ‘resistance’ protests in a bid to see off legislation outlawing strike action in the aviation industry.
The workers have pledged to renew their protests at Ataturk International Airport, a key Turkish Airlines’ hub, from 17:00 on 30 May.
This latest action builds on a ‘mass sick leave’ protest, which disrupted aviation services on 29 May, the day the amendment introducing the strike ban across the aviation industry was to be presented to the parliament’s plenary session.
Atilay Ayçin, Hava-Is president, explained: “This will be an open-ended protest. For us this is a question of all or nothing. We will either win or be smashed. There is no other option as we have no intention of becoming a non-functioning union.”

niss

20th Jun 2012, 18:21

Any things change?

safelife

2nd Jul 2012, 08:53

Now different agencies are accepting applications again for virtually all fleets, captains and first officers.
The positions are advertised as "permanent" this time.

aozc

2nd Jul 2012, 10:04

Does anyone know if there are any other changes in the T&C?

safelife

2nd Jul 2012, 14:44

Allegedly they are unchanged, except for the contract duration.

Payscale

3rd Jul 2012, 05:28

Last time around the contracts were also advertised as Permanent by the agencies... to lure the applicants to their agency.... more applicants is more bucks

twentyyearstoolate

3rd Jul 2012, 10:07

It will be a Permanent contract until they don't need you!! NO JOB SECURITY HERE!!

Would be nice if they gave their current expat pilots a permanent contract before advertising this outside :mad:

archer_737

3rd Jul 2012, 18:36

Hey guys.

I would like to introduce myself. I'm in what Emirates call "F/O pool" which means I passed the assessment but I'm waiting for course date.
We've been already advised that it may take up to January 2013 or so, and, as I'm currently unemployed I've decided to start looking for something else.

Obviously the perfect job could be a 6 months well paid contract but there's nothing out there.

So, I'm thinking seriously in Turkish. I've received an email from a broker and I've applied for the F/O on the 737. I'm above the minimums required by the airline (about 3000hrs on the 738) The problem is that I wonder what happens if I pass the assessment, I start working for Turkish let's say for 6 or 7 months and then I receive a DOJ for Emirates.
My intentions are clear, leave wherever I'll be. EK is my priority right now.

Does Turkish bond you?

I've heared from some colleagues working there that they did around 9 simulators when joining. Obviously they were already rated on the type Turkish operates but, as long as they did that big amount of sims, they had some point in the contract saying they need to stay for the whole year.

Is that true? If yes, what happens if you leave? Do they ask you for money?

That's it. I'm just looking for some job to make some money and hours while waiting for EK and wondering if going to Turkish could be a good idea or just a head-ache!

Thank you!

niss

4th Jul 2012, 06:14

Training will take 4 month.
Yes, they will claim money if u do not fulfill the contract.

CaptainProp

4th Jul 2012, 08:51

@ archer

Try this, 6 months contract....

(UPDATED) B737-EFIS TRI Captain and First Officer ? 6 Month Summer Contract - Europe - FD (436)-Latest Pilot Jobs-Latest Pilot Jobs (http://latestpilotjobs.com/jobs/view/id/519.html)

CP

archer_737

4th Jul 2012, 10:44

Thank you guys for the info.

niss

I've been looking in the conditions and there is nothing like bond. Is about local law which says a worker not complying with a temporal contract must pay for the remaining of it?
I guess then the amount of money to pay is X months left by basic salary each. Could be a lot of money then.

CaptainProp

I will re-apply but the first time they just forgot me.
I have to say that all my 3k hours on the 737 are in the NG. Seems like companies and recruiters like to much to make difference between NG and EFIS which in my opinion is stupid. My TR in my JAA ATPL license says B737-300/900. To pass from NG to CL and so you only need a difference course which usually means a couple of ground classes and 1 sim. Not a big deal but...

Thanks!!!

AKM

4th Jul 2012, 10:47

Dear All, I am new to this forum. Going for Turkish screening on 8th July. Can anyone has any idea what to expect for written and sims?

feeso

4th Jul 2012, 15:14

Hello,

may i ask you if you have any info. concerning the latest assessment carried out by THY for joining Fo's. I really appreciate any info.

Chiao

7th Jul 2012, 21:23

Hi guys,I'm a FO with A330 type rating,and just checked Parc Aviation jon review then found out the oppoutunity.Wondering anybody knows about the salary package and the environment in Turkish Airlines?

I appreciate

0074

23rd Jul 2012, 18:48

No need for a union ?

So the dear Mr Hamdi TOPÇU, Chairman Of The Board Of Directors, is going to cover the inflation so his employees have not lost any money over the last two years where he has not bothered about completing the 2011 negotiations and it looks like he is planning all by himself without any unionforce to give 30 days vacation to all like in most competing companies instead of only 20 days a year including monthly OFF Days as the THY pilots and Expats have it offered right now (not the first year of course, only after first year of employment) - does he not tell THY employees are better off than compeeting companies ? while working 1000 Blockhours a year in a chaotic schedule :ugh:

Noone can believe a man who needs his friends in the government to enforce a "No Strike Law" to run a company.

Payscale

23rd Jul 2012, 19:51

Does anyone understand that letter??

pd6

24th Jul 2012, 06:56

THYTHY ;) Yes you are so right, it is a bit of a challenge to be Expat and try to stay up-to-date with informations from the Management. Lucky that most operational information from THY Managers are distributed in both Turkish and English.
What you see above from the Chairman is a very good sample of what happens when notifications are brought only in native language and we are left with only Google-Copy/Paste-Translate to get an idea of what is going on. With a little luck you might get the idea though :-)

No doubt the Chairman wants all of us to be proud and happy to be part of THY and no doubt he is trying to express his life as manager would be much easier without a Union to represent his workforce in the ongoing pay and work condition negotiations - Just a shame he does not put the same effort in closing these negotiations and settle the pay dispute for 2011-2012 and the work condition issues that at the present allows 110 Blockhours monthly in an ever changing schedule. Stalling such negotiations have never had a positive effect on production.

FLY SAFE out there :-)

OXOGEKAS340

30th Jul 2012, 19:11

Any info concerning A340 DEC assessment would be appreciated !!!!!:ok:

Efe Cem Elci

31st Jul 2012, 08:31

yanbancypilot and every one else posting here:
I would suggest you read your posts twice before pressing submit.

It is one thing to criticize an airline and its management and quite another to post statements that also bring an entire country and people into disrepute.

Also, Google Translate on a letter tends to come out all wrong especially in Turkish. If you can relay the original text I will be glad to summarize if not completely translate it.

Ottoforce

1st Aug 2012, 07:55

Why waste the time ????
Lol
Otto

Payscale

1st Aug 2012, 15:54

Otto... why must you answer everything with such negativity. Surely you dont work for THY. Anyone who hates his employer with such passion as you (this is if you work for them) surely doesnt stay for more than a month or two. Assuming you are employable elsewhere...:ugh:

dignified

1st Aug 2012, 20:25

I seem to agree with "Payscale", the problem is not THY and it's brutally yours management; the problem lies in the quality of pilots working for THY. Let me give you an illustration that was rather frustrating, most recently coming from the Yabanci forum admin, and I quote:

"18. July some money just showed up on my Current Account in Yapi Kredi named "THYA-AVANS-ÖDEMESI" without any explanation.
A fair guess and with a little help from Google it looks like some kind of advance payment but for what and why.??
Have any of you heard any explanation ? Does it relate to normal pay and Ramadan or does it relate to the 23. Bargin negotiations ?

This guy runs the Yabanci pilot forum for THY, and naively want's to know why and how he got a "bone" thrown out in his bank account by THY?
Has this individual heard of COLA? (Cost of living adjustment?) has anyone seen inflation and devaluation affecting their pockets monthly? Is the thieve known to you as it is known to me?

Forget Ramadan, Allah or T.Kotil would not spare a dime on Scandinavian origin pilots, specially after "The Politiken" made it clear to Turks they ain't gonna be approved beyond English level 2.

So charity starts at home, get educated or well informed. You are not going to conquer THY management by sucking "hortum" with naive and rather pathetic comments on your Yabanci forum. I vote for members "OUT", as this corner of little rats has become unbearable, at least to those of us dignified ones.:ok:

VaniosLenos

1st Aug 2012, 23:49

@yanbancypilot
I take it you are from the half occupied island my friend.. I have been to a screening in Istanbul, but you see my passport is from the free side of the island, and of course is not recognized, never mind if the rest of the world does..
So I was not hired but I guess they did me a favour, in all aspects:ok:
If the establishment has affected your life, and it has an impact on your everyday life, or you feel 'occupied' since 38 years ago, I can understand your thoughts 1000%.

Airbus_a321

2nd Aug 2012, 13:55

@yabancy #98

excellent ! You know exactly what you are talking about. Unfortuntely you must be an "insider" in Turkish aviation.
I couldn't write it better. I like to add, that all this we read heré is not a problem of just THY, not at all !
It's the same all over Turkey, with all Turkish operators. Intentionally I do not name them airlines.
It's all based in just their Turkish "culture" or at least what they believe their culture is.
Not to forget the heavy influence of all the Management guys with army-career which equals to Zero CRM in all divisions.
my 2 cents :bored:

safelife

2nd Aug 2012, 19:40

seventy six!!

zonak

23rd Aug 2012, 12:10

Finally! I've been expecting sometime, someone will make it official!

Contract is on top of the complaint list presented to CEO on the one-and-only meeting so far with expats. It was said, promised that contracts will become permanent in short due time! That's five months ago, before THY has started recruitment again. It's not happening, renewals are offered for one year only.

So, top company officer has publicly lied! :rolleyes:

dignified

26th Aug 2012, 12:53

The only permanent thing you can expect from this part of the world is the status quo; DO NOT COMMIT TO ANYONE.
It is the fool who always rushes to take sides. Do not commit to any side or cause but yourself. By maintaining your independence you become the master of others-playing people against each other, making them pursue you. There are tonnes of good jobs out there, be confident and patient, the last cry of the wolf was heard when they ran out of sheep:ok:

B737NG

2nd Sep 2012, 10:34

You need to be in the Kitchen, with that recipy you are the Star on every cooking Show.

100 % You hit the nail on the Head. Real wonder that they are in the Star Alliance, just Alliance, no Star.

Airbus_a321

2nd Sep 2012, 16:46

100%,but suggest you should call this unique receipe:

ALL TURKISH AIRLINES FRENZY

AVIATION REFUGEE

7th Sep 2012, 13:37

Those quys are something else! They pretend everything! The HR representative is an unf@c@ble "lady", with many inferiority complexes, and after the 6 !!!!!! hours CRM she pretends that she is interviewing....The sim assessment isn't bad, the pilots are ok, but the most important is the opinion of this , let's say..."lady".
From a team of 22 pilots on 320-330, no one was successful.
Is it just a coincidence?
Stay away from this crap.
Alliance, maybe, star? No way!
A bag full of s@it.
:mad:

OXOGEKAS340

7th Sep 2012, 18:39

REFUGEE, my man, don't you know what is being said about Turks?
"Beware of Turks, even if they are presenting gifts"!
Next time ask, what is going on here.....
A terrible mess!
You just escaped !!!
HR is getting the stick, pilots are under control!
Be happy!

archer_737

7th Sep 2012, 18:41

Well, from my group of around 20 we went in 16 so... Sorry to hear that you did not.

I have a doubt, you talk about the sim. As you know, to get to the sim you need to have the OK from the english test and the HTA (psychologist, 5 hours... pretty hard as you said). So, I assume that if you were kicked out of the procedure after the sim was because of the sim. Simple.

I have a close friend that failed this week after the HTA, he was not able to attend the sim as he was told to go home after the HTA. So, what is your point? You blame only the HR representative and the psychologist because of the HTA but apparently you did not pass the sim, which is another thing.

Just curious.

uchy

7th Sep 2012, 21:36

Are really so so bad the work conditions for a pilot on the 737?

AVIATION REFUGEE

7th Sep 2012, 21:36

Maybe your group was composed from extra Von Richthovens.....
C'mon , do you believe that all those fail in sim????::*:=

archer_737

7th Sep 2012, 22:47

No I don't, as I don't think that you all missed the HTA. You know, my opinion is that they found the good number of pilots and now they're just wasting peoples time.
But it makes sense to advise people that you can easily fail the HTA or the sim even if you feel you did it ok.
Good luck!

Airbus_a321

8th Sep 2012, 16:52

:{:{:{they found the good number of pilots :{:{:{

Payscale

9th Sep 2012, 17:33

Would you just stop moaning and tell us exactly how much payraise you just got and how far back dated is it....? What a sunshine story that is. Do tell....

uchy

17th Sep 2012, 11:30

somebody of you know how is the roster pattern for a first officer?
There is the chance to have every month some days off together for return home?

twentyyearstoolate

17th Sep 2012, 14:29

UCHY ..... Are you Yoda from Star Wars??

flyer79

17th Sep 2012, 14:53

Hi,

Can anyone give us some feedback about this HTA test they are conducting? Where to study? Can you find something similar on internet? (can you buy it)

Also the sim check. I am flying 737NG, so anyone who passed or not the screening, can please share feedback.

I haven't got any job, and would work for them, I've been in much ****ty place in the world. Believe me, it does exist.

Thanx

uchy

17th Sep 2012, 15:45

For twentyyearstoolate:
???????

dignified

18th Sep 2012, 03:50

Working groups of employees to share their problems, as well as conflict resolution, team work are carried out to improve production efficiency.:zzz::mad:

You may not have made it if you answered 'yes' to the following Q? :

1. Are you a professional pilot? yes
2. Is your English level 4 or more? yes
3. Days Off are to rest, they are not negotiable? yes
4. Do you like freedom of speech? yes
5. I never admired soldiers since I was a child? yes
6. Do you support Armenian genocide? yes
9. Do you believe in Cyprus occupation in 1974? yes

From a team of 22 pilots on 320-330, no one was successful.
Is it just a coincidence?
Stay away from this crap.
Alliance, maybe, star? No way!
A bag full of s@it. - Quoted from a brilliant candidate!:eek:

aozc

18th Sep 2012, 07:11

Dignified, why did you apply in the first place?

archer_737

18th Sep 2012, 12:44

dignified

Some around 14 posts and ALL talking about THY or Turkey.

None aviation related, technical or "constructing" info, just kicking Turkish asses.
Problem with them? Explain us, get over it and move to the next thing.
We all appreciated your info, we will refuse any THY employment offer and stay at home, sure the apartment and bills will be payed by themselves.

Thank you again.

flyer79

18th Sep 2012, 15:45

Well said Archer,

If I like it or not, it's my problem and opinion. As Archer said, bills won't pay themeselves. There are ****tier place in the world, believe me. If you expecting Emirates level of life, than that's not the place to apply for. I'm sorry that you failed the exercice, but get over it.

Thanx anyway guys for your feedback guys and wish you all, the best.

dignified

22nd Sep 2012, 12:19

""But it makes sense to advise people that you can easily fail the HTA or the sim even if you feel you did it ok.""
Good luck!

Ohh Archer_737, I do not not what to do with you, and your desperate need for a job,:( but hope my comment below help your self-esteem:

It sure does take a big toll in our lives to be outta of job. However, I think adversity is a way to examine our past, to an open door for opportunity.
My point with previous threads is simple: THY, and other Turkish airliners pilot recruitment need to concentrate not on HTA or SIM, but the cultural differences any foreigner will face here; They already know you have a bag of experience to have been called out on the first place, but want to ascertain you fit in the system, which is nothing but xenophobic.

Maybe an illustration may help: The foreign force at THY reached about 447 pilots as of May 2011. As of May/2012 the company lost 147 foreign pilots, more than 25% of the force. The CEO invited back in April/2012 a group of yabanci pilots to officially offer a series of concessions to anyone who had survived over three years of contractual employment; Shortly thereafter all Fleet Managers invited all foreigners to participate in inviting their colleagues to join THY despite their tarnished image worldwide as verified on this website. The turn out was minimal if not in absentia.

Some of this pilots came out of this meeting very happy, very optimistic, to find out this meeting chaired by the CEO & COO of the company was nothing but a charade of lies and deception. Those foreigners who worked at THY more than three years were taken away from the official seniority list, since year 2011 on a move from flight operations in retaliation for the comments made in a Danish newspaper. Over seven (7) Scandinavian pilots resigned from THY based on the poor or non existent level of English language, still pervading as mediocre among management and senior Turkish pilots who have gotten away with it for over 20 years of service. THY & DGCA imposed most recently English exams as a result of this scandal. The victims? Foreign pilots who are still here working their ass for a stable job, but who are lied to, while they need them. The fact of the matter is, THY without foreign pilots means the English Levels would revert to 2 or below. Turkish pilots are simply opportunist who use our abilities to enhance THY reputation. (See the thread on YouTube of a B777 flight from IST/NRT. -none of the pilots on that flight were of Turkish Nationality, they may have been an embarrassment to the "Globally yours concept")

End of May 2012, Foreign pilots were also caught in the middle of a battle between Ankara-THY and Hava-is, in which the only objective was to destroy the pilot union. THY is the only airline with a pilot union in Turkey, the other airliners forbid that right and you can be jailed or lose your employment permit if found guilty. Two courageous Captains dared to appear on local T.V supporting the Union claims, and they were served termination by SMS, without parole.:eek::oh: International Transport Workers' Federation: Reinstate the 305 at Turkish Airlines (http://www.reinstate305.org)
If this is the case with THY pilots, imagine the rest??:ugh:

So, if you so desire a job here, beware of the martial law, a life in solitude and confined to be a retarded soldier routine or else face the sack. If you fit this job description, go for it, just avoid farting in public, or showing your dick in a Turkish hamam; you may end being arrested for terrorism or demeaning Islam . :yuk:

archer_737

22nd Sep 2012, 13:58

dignified

Thank you very much again for your advise. I promise I'm calling right now the guys from THY and telling them that I am staying at home, promised!

Btw, would like to agree with you with my "desperate need for a job". Unfortunately I am from those who has to work for money, yes still some people like that in the world. Damn bastards!!

archer_737

22nd Sep 2012, 15:44

And, just to add.

It is funny to see a self called "dignified" (synonym of "honorable") kidding about the unemployment of a colleague.
Speaks volumes about your human touch. Maybe not only the Turkish must reflect on their behavior.

dignified

24th Sep 2012, 17:19

Archer, I presented you with the facts, it is now between your self-esteem and your quest for the right job. Good luck!:ok:

Jack-the-Skipper

26th Sep 2012, 00:52

Hi Guys,

Could any current THY FO preferably 737 and recently gone through the screening process please contact me via PM Thanks,

Jack.

Danishpilot80

28th Sep 2012, 19:22

Hi

I am also going for the screening. I am doing it Oct. 8th for a320 F/O.

Any good tips would be highly appreciated.

Thanks!

dignified

2nd Oct 2012, 10:04

Danishpilot80 & Jack-the-Skipper

Good luck in your careers chaps; now that THY offers permanent contracts, you will retire as a F/O's with as you will enter a foreign seniority list, and never progress into Command. After all it is a job and pay is always on time; One great benefit for F/O's in this country is that in Turkey they call you "Kaptain", except if you are the third wheel for which there is a box on the flight plan called "First Officer", after "Captain" and "Commander". Some of the former foreigner and local F/O's went for looking for jobs elsewhere with "Kaptain" credentials, and were offered direct entry Captain position.:}:ok:
A local university graduate is picked by THY to join as First Officer after they pay his training for two years to make him a pilot with total time of 240hrs. They call this blokes "Captain" this and that, and sometimes addressed by cleaners and technicians as "Hojam", meaning "master", so feel free to ask any questions on your interview, and make no mistake, you will be "Kaptains" from day one!:D

Elifant

8th Oct 2012, 11:06

Hi There,

Just been to an assessment with THY. We been about 14 guy, all freom europen Airlines among the candidates TRI and TRE etc.
We all failed! Jet it is not really clear to us why? But the whole selection process seemed very strange.
In particular that psychiatrist seemed to be very spezial to say the least.

We do not understand what she was looking for? It all seemed very strange. I mean you would expect that just one of us is normal an would fit into THY. But no, no one passed. Having said that, bare in mind that all the guys had more then ten year of flying under their belt and some of them in senior training positions!

I would think twice before going for THY.

flydog

12th Oct 2012, 01:33

been away for a while,,, can ayone tell me who or how to apply to THY or do we still have to go thru pesky agencies who never reply?

Only respectful and positive replies please

kwaiyai

14th Oct 2012, 04:23

Not sure if you can apply direct FlyDog but yes the agencies seem to be on the
lookout. seeing the replies above better go in and act like a loon:bored:

FBW390

14th Oct 2012, 05:31

Flydog. you have to mail Sigma Aviation and they reply for sure. Don't Know what happened with that psy That day but many are happy with THY.

flyer79

17th Oct 2012, 17:16

Hi all,

Just quick question about the recruitment procedure. I passed or was given the verbal "pass" at my assessment last week with THY. Of 12 guys, we were only 2 remaining. But mostly people failed at the sim, not the Psychological or english test.

Anyway, I emailed Parc, today, and they said that the final decison would be taken by THY board of directors before sending me an offer letter.
This means, that even if you pass all the assessment, you're still pending to the board's decision.
Has anyone been through this thing before? Is it possible that they might not hire you after all this selection process, even if you were successful?

If anyone has some info or feedback, feel free to shoot.

Thanks and good luck to all waiting for assessments

South Prince

17th Oct 2012, 18:26

Hi flyer79, not to discourage you, but screening in THY seem all too very strange and unpredictable. Best of luck.:ok:

airlineguy1980

18th Oct 2012, 04:15

I know mostly pilots are pissed here. Let me give you an idea of a non pilot exp but work closely with pilots. For English exams which Turkish civil aviation requested recently, a guy who can't speak a word of it able to get the min mark required by civil aviation. I can't figure out how that's possible.

The best part at the start of the exam all instructions were given in Turkish in which they are testing your English.this **** is the best I ever seen in any part of the world.

They really beat the world set a mark whereby everyone passes which beat the purpose.

TangoUniform

20th Oct 2012, 10:21

As to all the pilots failing the psych., exam....perhaps the psychologist has it right. You must be a little "crazy" to want to come fly with THY. Saving you from yourself. Hey only kidding, I think.

South Prince

20th Oct 2012, 10:43

Lots of Pilots still applying to THY, screening failure rate at and over 90%, why are Pilots still applying to Turkish airlines when time could be used in a more usefull manner with other airlines?

archer_737

20th Oct 2012, 10:50

Because some of them get the job :ok:

Ghost_Rider737

20th Oct 2012, 10:57

Pilots with JAR licenses are still applying cause they are desperate. Job outlook worldwide is still bleak !

Also Istanbul is close to most major European hubs so commuting within the EU is easy. That's another reason why people apply. THY has a good PR department with lots of cash spent on publicity , makes them look like a decent outfit.

Well THY is probably a decent outfit. it just sucks when you're treated unfairly because you're a foreigner.

The_eagle737

21st Oct 2012, 11:55

Any positive advise for my interview next month, please? I need some more motivation for NG Captain's position with THY......:*

flyer79

23rd Oct 2012, 12:16

Hi eagle 737,

From your location, I'm betting you must be coming from Jet Airways. Am I wrong? lol
I've seen many of your colleagues down there when I did my assessment. Some had already started others still on waiting list.

There's not much I can tell you that would help you. I asked the same questions on that forum and other nice guys (they will recokgnize themselves) came to rescue me by feedbacking me in PM.

Day 1: psycho. Be assertive, and do not hesitate to speak up your ideas. There will be camera recording you.
Try to work with the group during the exercice. Because you're a captain, they might also be looking for leadership. At the end just be yourself. All these psycho tests (and i have done many in my career) are all strange, unoredictable and even probably inaccurate, because they don't show you in real life situation. So if they wanna pass you, they will, otherwise....nothing you can do about.

Day2: English. Just read on the screen and also explain situation, after being shown a picture. Not very tough, althoug, on british lady in my group failed it.....!!!!! Strange.

Day3: Sim. For the 737, it's ISTANBULbut study also ANKARA (never know). 2 engines raw data, followed by ILS raw data, strong crosswind and Go Around.

Then N-1, with FD, but no QRH actions to read and complete.
Single engine manual circuit. (I found that one hard).

I must say that the sim has terminated many guy's hope in the group. This is where they sacked half of the guys.

Good luck to you.

archer_737

23rd Oct 2012, 12:44

I must add that sim profile won't be the same always and for everyone. Mine was more or less as our colleague said before, but all the session was performed in raw data.
Climb straight to 5000', then left descending... etc etc etc You end up in a final vector for the ILS raw data procedure (same rwy you took off before in IST).
Be careful, if they want you to go around they won't tell you Go Around, as if they were ATC. For me, they putted a f:mad: 747 in the rwy. Yes, a Jumbo is a big guy but flying down to minimums, going out of clouds and having a **** of visual in the sim... it is hard to see it. Pay attention to the strobe lights, will really help.

And thats it. Nothing more to add.

Do you need positive feedback to be sure to join the airline? Don't know much about Captain position conditions but for FOs salary is probably the highest available in the market now (not talking about EK, EY, QR...) and I remark AVAILABLE.
Don't come here guys and tell me that BA or AF guys are having much better salaries because these companies aren't hiring, right?

Good luck!

Any more info needed just send me PM. I'm joining the company soon, will be able to give you more accurate feedback in a couple of weeks.

Ottoforce

5th Nov 2012, 08:48

Informations for all ,
ICAO Licenses are not going to be accepted by the GCAA in future and all whare currently in THY will not have their validations renewed as of now, first leaving early December, this will afect almost 100 forein pilots curently working for them.
Management in chaos, nothing new you say, we'll its easily solved.

cadets and Kabin Pursers CAPT😂KAPTAN and Kabin Chiefs to Kaptan and fly the rest 150 hours a month and cancel all days off and leave for Forein pilots.
Cancel all simulator training doesn't exist anyhow.

LOL
Otto

archer_737

5th Nov 2012, 21:19

Could you please translate your post?

Cheers!

Payscale

6th Nov 2012, 06:31

Otto..
What level of English do YOU have on your license?

I think the real news is the cooperation between Lufthansa and Turkish. Not some administrative clerk bulletin regards licensing.

niss

6th Nov 2012, 12:07

So nothing has changed

Airbus_a321

6th Nov 2012, 12:26

Turkey is JAA and therefore will become EASA.....are you really shure ???
I have my doubts that there will be an automatic changeover from JAA to EASA membership.
Turkey - GodThanks - afaik is not EASA yet.

aozc

6th Nov 2012, 12:28

In Turkey 1000hrs a year is legal for instance. I have a Swedish license, will it automatically become an EASA license next time i renew it?

Rudyard K

6th Nov 2012, 15:18

Turkey is a JAA state and will not automatically become an EASA state. To do so would require adoption of EASA Flight Time Limitations and all the other regulations, which would not necessarily be welcome by the THY management. There may be advantages for insurance costs, but some of the present working practices would have to change. At present some EASA states no longer accept the JAA medical from Turkey. This all begs the question, if Turkey does not adopt EASA regulations, will all Turkish JAA licences revert to just ICAO licences? Interesting times.

fightthepower

8th Nov 2012, 08:00

Gentlemen, anybody who is there can give us an update how it is working for the FOs there?

They have "updated" the T&Cs for FOs and the money is decent enough and you are employed directly by the airline.

Does anybody know if there are chances for FOs to upgrade within the airline or even switching to another type if you stay long enough as an expat?

Fly Dego

10th Nov 2012, 06:36

Is there any (expat) FO that is employed by THY at present time and want to provide me with some in-depth info? Pm me please.

uchy

10th Nov 2012, 11:28

Is there an agency better than the others to apply?

Never Down

10th Nov 2012, 15:15

Can anyone please give me how is the retirement program provided by THY? tks

rghods

12th Nov 2012, 17:29

What's a up grade time there ?
Any promise to up grade ?
Some agency's are saying 5 years verses the other ones saying no promise , any expat FO's has ever been ever up graded Yet?
Thanks :ok:

archer_737

12th Nov 2012, 17:49

No expats has been upgraded yet, so I won't believe the agencies in this matter.
Regarding agencies, Storm worked good for me.

If you guys have any doubt can PM me, but bear in mind that I've recently joined so my knowledge of the company isn't that good.

FBW390

24th Nov 2012, 07:00

Upgrade FO to Captain: no. Whatever agencies say.:=
Upgrade to another type: i don't think so.

Fbw390;)

AirBizz

24th Nov 2012, 08:49

Turkish DGCA wrote to all companies that the amount of foreign pilots must be reduced to protect national pilots. Companies are not allowed to have more then 25 % of there FO's to be foreigners by june 2013 and 10% by the end of 2013. No validations or work permits will be given to companies who exceed these figures.

Son yıllarda ülkemizde hava taşımacılık sektörünün büyümesine paralel olarak pilot ihtiyacı artmakta ve artan bu ihtiyaca paralel olarak yabancı pilot istihdamında artış yaşanmaktadır. Ancak, son yıllarda uçuş okullarının kapasitelerinde de artışlar yaşanmıştır. Bakanlığımız tarafından ruhsatlandırılmış işletmelerde Türk Vatandaşı pilotların istihdam edilmesi esas olup, yabancı uyruklu pilot temini ancak zorunlu ve istisnai şartlarda kullanılmalıdır. Bu nedenle yabancı uyruklu pilot istihdamı konusunda bu düzenlemenin yapılması ihtiyacı ortaya çıkmıştır."

SHGM, belirtilen tarihlerde gereklilikleri yerine getiremeyen işletmelere 2920 sayılı Türk Sivil Havacılık Kanunu'nun 143'üncü Maddesi kapsamında işlem yapacak. Belirtilen tarihlerden sonra belirlenen oranın dışında yabancı uyruklu ikinci pilotlara Genel Müdürlük tarafından validasyon/çalışma izin belgesi düzenlenmeyecek.

Kamuoyuna Saygıyla Duyurulur….

Payscale

24th Nov 2012, 10:54

So what about the 500 German FOs rumoured to be coming down as a sort of cooperation between Lufthansa and THY?

aozc

24th Nov 2012, 14:55

Payscale, "Burasi Türkiye", means this is Turkey. Wich translates into that rules, laws, common sense and constitutions are only guidelines. :E

Payscale

25th Nov 2012, 04:29

Doesnt really answer the question though...

Payscale

25th Nov 2012, 19:33

Now that makes sense ;)

istikbalgoklerdedir

25th Nov 2012, 21:10

No way until Turkish FO's can work under EU countries without restriction

tanikagal

6th Dec 2012, 18:03

You are absolutely correct and highly agree with you mate!

OXOGEKAS340

8th Dec 2012, 21:29

A lot of work to be done, till reach EU standards....
It is a ME airliner, ruled by ME mentality.
A lot of incidents and accidents.
Always worrying when occupying a seat as pax.

Onlinebene

17th Dec 2012, 11:52

hi there,

any THY (320?) expat pilot around here? would like to clear some questions before signing ...

thanks!

daidegas

15th Jan 2013, 19:46

How come anyone could really answer how the screening process is held or any tips or advise,but just few?
I'm really interested.
cheers

FBW390

27th Jan 2013, 15:39

English test, psycho, sim: strictly nothing to worry if you're a good professional. Know your pro.abn sops memory items and Limitations. No trap.;) good luck::)

easysurfer.zg

8th Feb 2013, 08:54

Any info about time to upgrade for foreign F/O on A320?

safelife

8th Feb 2013, 13:56

No upgrade. You do not join the THY seniority list.

easysurfer.zg

8th Feb 2013, 21:26

Can you explain, please?

FBW390

10th Feb 2013, 10:49

I don'̀t think THY has plans for upgrade FO to Captain. Maybe in the far future?

TypeIV

10th Feb 2013, 11:40

Depends on the supply and demand. If they have no other choice, they will do it obviously. If they do not have to do it, they for sure will not.

Ottoforce

13th Feb 2013, 16:34

They are doing the Ottoman style forward back back forward back back, the standards are falling again crisis management head n sand but deeper and deeper the next disaster is coming soon I am reliably informationed.
"IYI Ucuslar" all will be well in the Squadron.
Despite NO CRM ,NO TRAINING , NO PILOTING SKILL, NO SITUATION AWARE.NO RADAR , NO DEICING , NO UNDERSTANDING OF SYSTEMS OR EFFECTS OF DOWNGRADE.AND GREAT FATIGUE AS BAD ROSTER.
MAY GOD BE WITH YOU :\:mad::mad::mad:

archer_737

13th Feb 2013, 17:27

I would be so interested in a translation for the last post. :ok:

Cheers!

tayyareci

13th Feb 2013, 20:58

last post is probably written by a Turkish person, who grew up in Germany.

he probably failed to get a job with Turkish airlines and blaming that on military background pilots.

and his English sucks.

tayyareci

14th Feb 2013, 13:50

Yabancipilot

I understand your point but you need to see the situation from the Turkish national pilots point of view also. I would like to explain it with a very realistic example scenerio.

Lets say Air France started to expand rapidly and they are desperate for new pilots to join. I can assure you that the first requirement to join will be that you are European citizen and you are fluent in French.

I don't think that it is necessary to be fluent in any language other than English to be able to fly in an airline. So the first 2 requirements will straight away block the employment chance of about 99.9% of Turkish Pilots. This example is valid for (Lufthansa, Klm, Swiss, etc). If this is not a discrimination what is?

Lets say even after that they cannot find enough pilots with the above requirements. Then I can assure you that the agencies will start recruiting for them with an unclear career progression and with the knowledge that as soon as you are not needed you will be out.

Turkish airlines is not Emirates or Qatar airways.

There are enough Turkish pilots for the needs of Turkish airlines. These Turkish Pilots have no chance of recruitment in Europe or USA or Australia. THY needs foreign pilots only until the adequate number of Turkish pilots are trained. You have to agree with me that a flag career has to give priority to their the national pilots.

On the other hand I do agree with you that in case of Turkish airlines the existence of foreign pilots - at least for temporarily - is a good thing for CRM. If THY wants to be a global airline than they have think globally.

Thanks

captain320200

14th Feb 2013, 17:57

Hi guys,

Recently I passed the recruitment in THY i can say it was tough but if you are a profesinal it will be no problems .The pass rate is very low out of 13 we made it 3 of us.
Just waiting for confirmation which can be as long as three weeks from my friends experience.

archer_737

14th Feb 2013, 19:36

Easy point here.

How many turkish pilots do you know in Air France? Actually, how many spanish or british guys do you know in Air France?
And how many italians in Lufthansa? And how many expats in KLM? Alitalia? British? etc etc etc

This is a flag carrier that, as someone mentioned above, belongs to a "big" country who will soon or later meet the requirements with the locals.

My advise, come here knowing that this isn't the place to progress as a young guy. Come here as an FO to grow your hours and do some money.
If you're a captain and you're close to the retirement age, come here to spend a nice time in a nice place and do a good money and that's it.

Good news for the 320 or 737 guys. Some of them already moved from right hand seat in the "small" planes to the 330 and 777 which means having a nice 3 weeks on 1 week off (often 10 consecutive days off a month) with a nice salary and just 2 or 3 hours away from home.
But... only few cases known, let's see if they really upgrade some few more guys or if we see finally some expat FO upgrading to CPT position.

Good luck to all.

captain.weird

14th Feb 2013, 22:29

How does the future look for Turkish nationals who live in Europe with a fATPL? THY has it's own cadet pilot programme but it's hard for someone who lives in Europe to get in this cpp.

archer_737

15th Feb 2013, 12:00

None of majors in Europe will ever employ a guy who is not proficient in their language. You may be not italian native but your mother or father is so you speak perfect italian and you get hired by Alitalia in a screening. Yes, possible.
Same for AirFrance etc... you can speak french but if you go to the interview and you have a medium-high level with some strange accent on it... forget about the job. Same in BA... and so.

Look, you mentioned EK and I don't think any Turkish pilot wants THY to become the next EK, EY or QR. They want to be what they are, a big flag carrier like BA, AF etc... and that includes having ALL native turk speakers, etc.

Take it or leave it, but don't bitch on it in every single post.
I do work for THY, they offered me a good salary and to fly brand new planes and that is it.
They offered or actually said they were giving a permanent contract and they didn't at the end. Yes this sucks and this is the main reason why I'll leave from here as soon as some reasonable offer comes. But I still think that this was the only "good" or "acceptable" offer a part of the ones in the Middle East.

The only thing you need to know when coming here is that this won't be your career place as it could be in EK for example. Accept it, understand it and then take the job.
Otherwise, if you don't want to accept that in a MAJOR you will always be a YABANCI you have a problem.

The only companies to take expats and make of them a "normal" and a "in seniority list" guy are these companies in the Middle East where they have basically no locals to fly their planes.

Or, if you're spanish like me you can always go and work for Iberia :ugh::ugh::ugh:

Btw, as I said they already moved some expats from FO 737 to FO 777. Some other, in the other hand, were told not to move because they'll need to sign a bond of 3 years in the new fleet and they were expecting them to upgrade to 737 CPT before this 3 year period.

archer_737

15th Feb 2013, 15:45

Well that is a totally personal opinion based on personal wishes.
Flag carriers are and will be there. Some doing fine, some doing not that fine.
And yes, they do have enough locals. Plenty of british, french, german guys out there with experience. And plenty of them coming out from private schools all over the globe.
The only reason for needing pilots in THY is the "non normal" growth which is leading in a desperate need of pilots. But that will be corrected soon or late.
I hope for our own interest (mine at least) that they'll keep this needs for the next 5-10 years which maybe leads in a career progression for Yabanci FOs like me. If I can leave here after some years with few more hours and € in my pocket that will be ok. If I can do it having some hours on the left hand seat this will be more than welcomed!