NQ for FAA IR?

[felixflyer]

Hi

Do I need a JAR night qualification before I can get an FAA IR? My FAA PPL is based on my JAR one.

Regards

[HighFlyer75]

As you don't have a stand-alone FAA PPL, the short answer to your question is yes. In order to add an IR to your 61.75 piggyback FAA licence, you need to meet all the aeronautical requirements for the issue of an IR (61.65 of the FAR) and you also need to meet all the aeronautical requirements for the issue of an FAA PPL (61.109 of the FAR).

As the issue of an FAA PPL requires that you have completed 10 take offs and landings at night and a night cross country, you must complete these in order to then be eligible to add the IR to your licence. To be able to do these night flights you will require a night qualification on your JAA licence.

However, my advice would be to take some time to first get a stand-alone FAA PPL prior to doing the IR. If you already meet all the requirements other than the night flights, this really shouldn't take you too long and will be much better in the long run.

Regards,
HF

[Cusco]

No you don't: I got my FAA IR in 2002 based on a 61.75 FAA PPL.

Just had to make sure my flight test was conducted by day................

I didn't get my CAAPPL/NQ till 2008.

[HighFlyer75]

I can't argue with Cusco conclusively (that is, I can't provide specific references to FAA regulations on the subject).

All I can say is that when I did my IR last year (at the time I was on a 61.75) I was told that in order to meet the IR requirement...

"A person who applies for an instrument rating must hold at least a private pilot certificate.."

...I must have met the requirements for an FAA PPL as this was technically what I was adding the IR to - not my JAA licence. On the day of the test the examiner also checked my logbook to make sure that this was the case.

The following link makes reference to a similar check so I am not the only one that has come across this. Hopefully somebody can provide a conclusive answer one way or another;
How to get an FAA Instrument Rating (http://www.golfhotelwhiskey.com/how-to-get-an-faa-instrument-rating/)

[peterh337]

That article on the FAA IR is an interesting read :)

These US checkrides are potentially much more intense than UK IR ones, but they are quite doable because you live out there, fly 2x a day, and the checkride is the day after your last 2 flights so you are very very current.

I do think you need the NQ to get the FAA IR if putting the FAA IR onto a 61.75 US PPL - unless somebody has made a mistake and overlooked it, which is quite possible. That is just plain ICAO...

[AdamFrisch]

Felix - take this opportunity to do your stand alone FAA PPL by doing the night work. After that and maybe some minor basic manoeuvres in daytime, you should be ready for an FAA checkride. That way you're adding an IR to a real license and not a house of cards. Remember, just a simple address change in the UK renders the whole FAA 61.75 invalid.

[peterh337]

Couldn't agree more.

[Cusco]

If I had my time again I would have gone for the standalone FAA/PPL to avoid the undoubted hassle I've had over the years getting the 61.75 updated/plasticated/BFRd etc.

As it stands I'm getting too old for all this 61.75 faff and when we're forced to get EASA PPLs in 2 years time I'll just let the FAA/PPL/IR slide as I've now got a JAAPPL/IR and don't see myself flogging over to USA to rent any more.

Cusco

[peterh337]

Well at least you are not chucking in flying totally, like many others are, under the EASA threat. A colleague has just put a TB21GT for sale and he's chucking the lot in.

[englishal]

You DO NOT need a JAA NQ to get the FAA IR on the back of a JAA PPL. What you DO need to do is "meet all the requirements for the issue of a FAA PPL". This includes some night training.

I fell foul of this when I did my IR check ride. No night in my logbook. So I had to do the extra 3 hrs at night before I could do my IR.

I still don't have a NQ to this day....but have flown quite a bit at night.

[peterh337]

Yes that must be correct.

But meeting the night requirements of an FAA PPL involves more night flying than getting a NQ :)

It's an interesting point though... somebody who got a 61.75 PPL on the back of a UK PPL + NQ and then did the FAA IR without meeting the FAA PPL night requirement... how does that work?

[Clearedils]

You do not need a JAA NQ to add a FAA IR to your FAA PPL based on a JAR PPL. You do need one to fly a N-reg aircraft at night on your FAA PPL based on your JAR PPL:

I divided the regulations into two sections to clarify:
1: applying for the rating
2: the privileges of the license issued afterwards.

Firstly: you can add an IR to your FAA PPL based on your JAA PPL by meeting all requirements of FAR 61.65 or by complying with FAR 61.75(d) if you already hold an ICAO IR. If you were issued a FAA PPL without IR based on your UK PPL the FAA has concluded you met their requirements, right? This is where confusion starts, as the FAA issues the license and leaves it to the foreign pilot to know it's limitations (in this case no night flying allowed without JAA NQ) This is why Cusco needed to do his checkride during the day as acting PIC. When looked at again, different judgement is used (experiences as described by HighFlyer75 and Englishal) and the FAA PPL night time requirements are enforced before taking the IR. Cusco was able to avoid this somehow.

You do need a JAA NQ however if you want to fly at night in a N-reg aircraft when using the FAA PPL based on your JAA PPL. This is covered by FAR 61.75(e)(3): Is subject to the limitations and restrictions on the person's U.S. certificate and foreign pilot license when exercising the privileges of that U.S. pilot certificate in an aircraft of U.S. registry operating within or outside the United States;

When asked I always recommend people to get the full PPL, as this is only one of many disadvantages the "piggyback" has as already pointed out by Cusco.