Qlink increases QLD 717 services

[myshoutcaptain]

QLink are increasing (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/qantaslink-has-expanded-its-regional-queensland-network-to-cater-to-mining-towns/story-e6frg95x-1226148961722) B717 services in Queensland.

Any idea where the reduction or redeployment will come from?

:}

[Going Nowhere]

2 extra 717's are coming from O/S early next year.

Alliance charters for QF get the boot.

[rusty_fork]

Fingers crossed you're right Going Nowhere. Any idea on whether QF Link will be matching the DJ offering of J class into those ports currently getting the Fokkers? Wishful thinking maybe? :hmm:

[Captain Gidday]

DC-9s. Fokkers.
It's deja vu all over again!

[bubble.head]

I have a hunch that the reason why they are flying the B717s out of Brisbane is the fact that they are short on Captains (or upgradable FOs) to operate their Dash8s. I hope we give them a warm welcome in the crew room! :ok:

[Going Nowhere]

Won't be seen in the QLink crew room I'm betting, never seen the Unity guys/gals.

Doesn't make sense to charter an outside mobs jet when you're getting more of your own.

Talk is also of BNE-GLT for the 717 during the Mon AM and Fri PM peak runs.
Also talk of 2 just being the beginning, anywhere up to 5-6 frames over time as WA grows to require more 737's to replace the 717's.

5 more commands out in BNE this week, looks like they're going a fair way down the seniority list to fill them! :}

[Capn Bloggs]

DC-9s. Fokkers.
It's deja vu all over again!
"Yes, centre, we're passing the little F@kker now." :}

[bigbrother]

If Q/Link are short of Captains/(crew) perhaps they should get with the program and stop insulting pilots by charging them to sit the SHL on line testing process. I can't think of any industry in the world that charges to do thier interview. What a joke:ugh:

[DutyofCare]

I was interested that the " Curry Muncher " made the 71 NJet announcement whilst the Sunny pilot group is undergoing EBA negotiations !!!

Carl has been for many yrs now talking up the chances - to crews - to keep working hard, as we'll be operating jets soon !!!

What's that going to say to your northern pilot group after this public announcement in BN ???

Well you don't have to be Barry Jones to work out that this is just another kick-in-the-guts for the boys n girls at Sunnies.

Management might be thinking that the 71 will look better up against the ATR's about to start in competition.
Well this by & large was what the guys at VB thought about the Ejet up against the Q400 & it largely didn't work...

Outside of government travel, the Ozzy market is driven by price.

History has a funny way of repeating itself & crews: Stick to your guns, this is a good opportunity to up your currently outdated EBA as you won't be flying fly for a very long time to come.

PS: Could the reason NJet are after 60 additional flight crews...

[Capt Claret]

Back when not so young but still stary eyed, I joined Skywest Aviation, then a wholly owned subsidiary of ATI (Ansett Transport Industries). At the interview I was told, or it was suggested that progression to Ansett mainline was possible.

It didn't take long to realise that whilst it wasn't impossible, it was very improbable. Only the odd person here or there managed to get the nod. The most likely reason, training costs. If ANSETT took a pilot from Skywest, they had to train them on whatever jet/turbo prop AND ATI had to train a replacement at Skywest. Obviously it was much cheaper to employ someone from outside the ATI group.

As I understand it, there's never been too much movement from Sunnies/Eastern/Southern to QF Mainline. A little but not a lot.

Rightly or wrongly, as I see it, for Sunnies or Eastern to get jets, QF is going to have to train double the number of folks, as will be needed to operate the jets alone. The existing DH8 drivers will move to the jet, possibly decimating the experience level on the DH8, and then the ex DH8ers will all need to be replaced. This will more than double the training costs, because with all the training, services will still have to be crewed, somehow.

With QF's aim of offshoring to reduce costs, I can't see them increasing training costs to some extent. A shiny jet on the end of a stick, to replace/augment turbo props has long been dangled in front of pilots. Not often has it eventuated within an organisation, Kendell, Impulse, Network & Air North, the only ones that spring to mind over my 27 years in the industry. Only one of whom didn't go under or get bought out, yet.

The above rambling shouldn't be interpreted as suggesting Sunnies or Eastern pilots are not deserving of a jet, or not capable of operating one. It's just my take on the likelihood of it eventuating in the foreseeable future.

[Normasars]

Touche CC.

The ONLY reason that the narrow body clause was inserted ito the Sunnies EBA was for competitive tension when differing pilot groups EBAs are up for renewal. The "jet carrot" will always be there to entice people to stay, but i would NOT be holding my breath if I was in EAA or SSA.

IMHO, alot of lessons would have been learned over the 50 seat CRJ Kendall experience and also the Virgin E170. These smaller types are totally inefficient when compared to the efficiencies of a Q400. Oz doesn't have the population or the route structure to warrant 70 seat jet routes(Airnorth excluded) I think jets the size of the E190 and B717 will be the smallest RPT operating equipment we see in this country. Especially with capacity restraints becoming more of an issue at major airports. The only way forward is for larger aircraft to move the forecast growth of pax numbers as there are no slots available during peak times now.

Just my 2 cents worth.

[Going Nowhere]

The only ones who still believe that Sunnies/Eastern will see a jet are the true dreamers. Most have seen the Jet clause for what it really is.

Not to mention that Mainline would be looking at the Stick Shaker fiasco and be 'a but nervous' about giving the 'Aero Club' a jet to play with. :E

*Flack jacket on*

[Xcel]

Oz doesn't have the population or the route structure to warrant 70 seat jet routes(Airnorth excluded) I think jets the size of the E190 and B717 will be the smallest RPT operating equipment we see in this country. Especially with capacity restraints becoming more of an issue at major airports. The only way forward is for larger aircraft to move the forecast growth of pax numbers as there are no slots available during peak times now.

interesting considering alliance have just bought f70's and air north the e170...

What about the bae146? F100? These aircraft are operating from regional ports bypassing the backlog of the major hubs...

Mind you if your talking leisure and business travellers... Then yeah I would agree. Mining and government etc. Then no... The smaller jets still have a place!

Network?

[Going Nowhere]

F70's were purchased for a specific run, East Coast to Telfer direct.

[IAW]

Plus, it is charter...not RPT.

[Fuel-Off]

Just had a gander at the NJS EBA 2007-2012 and no wonder QF want these contracts to continue! NJS FOs are getting paid around the same as a Q400 FO. Who's getting ripped off here? If that's the case, NJS can have the 717s!

It has been brought up on here before that the NJS drivers are seeking a 30% increase in wages...any further developments on that?

Fuel-Off :ok:

[Stationair8]

The mythical jet for the Eastern boys has always been that, a lot of hype, talk, expectation and dreams.

The Southern BAE-146 operation when it started certainly ruffled up the feathers in the big Q campsite and dented a few egos in Eastern and Sunnies, with lots of backstabbing and high hopes of failure.

[Normasars]

Xcel,

please reread what I said.

[Merlins Magic]

The only ones who still believe that Sunnies/Eastern will see a jet are the true dreamers. Most have seen the Jet clause for what it really is.

I do think that this is the general concensis amongst the drivers. The great belief is that in putting that clause in, the competition (national joke) were given the price they needed to beat to win the contract renewal - which I'm led to believe has just been renewed until 2015.

To add further insult to the sunnies drivers, there has been no notification or email to inform of this latest development. The only information is that which came from the news and from here.

Way to engage your staff.....:ugh:

[Icarus2001]

Not to mention that Mainline would be looking at the Stick Shaker fiasco and be 'a but nervous' about giving the 'Aero Club' a jet to play with

Ha. That is pretty funny given that the B717 has had their share,

[HappyBandit]

Icarus...

Too true mate....I think I have some photo's somewhere!!??? :)

[2020Balance]

Wont Cobham crew and operate any 717's that are based in Brisbane?

[vigi-one]

2020

Correct. Cobham will crew the 717 and subsequent C series operations with mainline ( on regional award) and network however crewing wont be announced until after the Sunnies EBA has been signed off.

[Going Nowhere]

Like I said, not many in Eastern/Sunnies care who crews the jet. Can't see the Sunnies EBA discussions getting bogged down in 'The Jet Clause'

Those who want to fly the jet will continue to go elsewhere :ok:

[No Idea Either]

Just my two cents worth. Aren't Virgin starting the ATR runs in a few weeks. Competition for sunnies, maybe QF management are upgrading the services to fend off Virgin.

[JetA_OK]

Radical thought I know; but is it possible that the decision to relocate considerable resources to capitalise on the BHP expansion in Moranbah MAY be unrelated to the Sunstate EBA ?

[mig3]

Makes sense to me, handing over the jet services to National Jet/Cobham. The contract is signed until 2017 (?) I believe, so why not use that resource rather than paying Alliance for charters? That, as JetA points out, frees up aircraft for the money making mining routes.

It's all a result of short staffing though, mostly from poor management decisions.

Also, I agree that the Sunnies 'Jet Clause' has nothing to do with it. It was a vain attempt at a dangling carrot from the last EBA.

With regards to improving services to counter the ATRs introduction, I think the recent move back to Max Cruise on the Q400 fleet might have something to do with that... Who would've thought - when you fly faster you get there quicker!

[layingback]

Qlink's short staffing is not going to get any better soon. What they require for the chance to fly Dash on 57k a year is over the top. A few guys that they flicked over the last few weeks now have jet jobs. Go figure that one.:ugh:

[roger_ramjet]

Vigi-one - thanks for highlighting that, you're right!

There's all sorts of reasons not to put the next regional jet on the Sunstate or Eastern AOC, double training, decimation of Dash experience (which is getting pretty thin as it is), and last of all they don't need to. Could even go to a new start-up?

[Fuel-Off]

A few guys that they flicked over the last few weeks now have jet jobs

Well of course the Company rejected them! They treat the Dash (especially the 400) as if it's the f:mad:ing space shuttle! :ugh:They're not hiring turboprop drivers, they're hiring astronauts. Long haul to Cloncurry anyone? :E

Fuel-Off :ok:

[Bigdog01]

This has been the ultimate carrot for years in sunny Qld. Pretty much protected routes nil competition and a group of people who generally busted their asses to get it done.

What thanks do they get - notice big gap nothing!!!!!!!!!
NJS/Cobham operating the red tail originally 146 then 717 ( from impulse).
Impulse started with the puddle jumpers, grew up, bought out, AOC now Jetstar, aircraft released to NJS/Cobham. The farming out of inhouse business started long ago.

Once again pinned all hopes on an airframe in development - overgrown CRJ with whiz bang new geared fan engine (enclosed prop). Probably be like the Q400 engine only airframe in the world with it fitted.

So in reality if there is anybody in Sunnies or eastern who actually work for a living that believes jets are coming your way - then you need to be fitted for a straight jacket and booked into the padded room hotel.

Prepare for the shafting as the red tail gallah's don't bother warning you :*

[2020Balance]

Just got sent the latest Cobham EOI from a mate

• B717 Line First Officers – Brisbane Base
• B717 Line Captains – Brisbane Base
• B717 Check Captains – Brisbane Base
• Senior Base Pilot – Brisbane Base

Apparantly they are in final negotiations with Qantas.

[flyingfox]

Did your mate say "post it on the web?"

[neville_nobody]

They treat the Dash (especially the 400) as if it's the fing space shuttle! They're not hiring turboprop drivers, they're hiring astronauts. Long haul to Cloncurry anyone?

Unfortunately this kind of attitude is/has been rampant throughout pretty much all Australian regional airlines. :rolleyes: It has more to do with the small man syndrome of the owner/chief pilot/management than anything else. The rest of the world manages to fly around safely without treating each sector like mission to mars.

[QF717BOY]

:D Qantaslink - Cobham Boeing 717 contract renewed for another 7+years untill 2018 new aircraft joining the fleet and new Brisbane base . Is this the way of the future at QF to subcontract the flying.

[Going Nowhere]

Correct, QF don't want any 1 pilot group to control too much of the 'Groups' flying.

Divide and conquer! :suspect:

[QF717BOY]

The oldest B717 VH-NXI which was Impulse Airlines VH-IMP is over 10 years old now. We mite see QF replace the B717 with a new Regional Jet during the life of the new contract

[airdualbleedfault]

We mite see QF replace the B717 with a new Regional Jet during the life of the new contract

Or a new operator, as the guys/gals of Mackay, Rocky, Canberra and the original Bris Vegas base can attest to. Contract or no, AA/QF always have had and always will have the option to sustitute other a/c on a route they deem to be no longer suitable for 717 ( or in the old days, 146 ) , IMO thats why QF/NJS have lasted so long, they love the flexibility. I would be very wary of upping stumps from the security of PER or DRW to move to BNE.

Foot note : 717 being sent to replace alliance F100s, QF now own an F100 operator that at the moment does'nt have the capacity, at the moment......

[Going Nowhere]

Nor do they have apparently RPT on their AOC, yet...

[2020Balance]

Do you think they will add more 717,s to QLD as time goes on?

Heard the other day a Canberra base could also be on the cards for

a 717 base.

[R.Cruizo]

The 2 new B717's arriving were 2 of 6 inspected by QF, so it's possible.

Those hoping that Network will somehow take over the Cobham Qlink 717 flying will probably see Green tail F100's on the east coast but not in an RPT capacity, purely FIFO contracts.

[QF717BOY]

History repeating it self it would be the 4th time Qantaslink would open a
Canberra Base if it happens.

NJS-Qantaslink BAE 146 open then closed
NJS-Qantaslink Bae 146 open then closed
Sunstate-Qantaslink Q400 Open then closed

Cobham NJS- Qantaslink B717 ???????? :rolleyes:

[boocs]

that would be shocking if they do.... I know personally of several people who have been burnt severely from the closing CBR base... twice at the time!!

b.

[vigi-one]

I wonder if the Pilots Sub Council (EAA & SSA) still believe they will be getting jets now. 2018 a long time to wait, with C series due around 2015 i dont think so. Oh thats right, they will be but at other operators.

[2020Balance]

Anyone heard when the first two 717s turn up in Brisbane?

Have all the positions for aircrew been filled, external and internal?

Heard some of the older guys turned it down and some of the younger guys have taken it up

Will there be more 717's going to brisbane and or a second round of
recruiting in the future

[chewi]

Had an interview last week and was told the brisbane base is now full. They are looking for Darwin or Perth i think.

[jarden]

QantasLink will launch Boeing 717 services to Rockhampton and Gladstone on 15 March and Mackay on 26 March 2012 following the addition of the B717 aircraft into its fleet.
QantasLink was recently voted the world’s best regional airline by prestigious aviation journal Air Transport World.
QantasLink Executive Manager Narendra Kumar said he was very pleased to announce that QantasLink would be jetting off to three booming Queensland destinations.
“The introduction of QantasLink’s two new B717 aircraft in Queensland will deliver an increase of over 200,000 seats per year in Queensland,” Mr Kumar said.
“QantasLink’s new 115-seat B717 services will offer customers faster flight times and more seats at peak times by complementing existing aircraft on these routes.”
By mid year, the QantasLink B717 services will result in:
- 1,674 additional seats per week to Gladstone which will see QantasLink provide more than 9,100 seats per week on the route.
- 806 additional seats on QantasLink services increasing seats offered by the Qantas Group between Brisbane and Mackay to 13,884 per week (operated by both Jetstar and QantasLink).
- 598 additional seats to Rockhampton, offering over 8,400 seats per week.
About Qantas - Media Room - Media Releases (http://www.qantas.com.au/regions/dyn/au/publicaffairs/details?ArticleID=2012/jan12/5357)

[mcgrath50]

Is this operated by Qantaslink or some other operator?

[Capt Claret]

QantasLink.

Check the bod red title on the fuse, when the 71s arrive.

[rmcdonal]

Is this operated by Qantaslink or some other operator?
It is operated by QantasLink, however QantasLink is made up of:
Sunstate (Operating Dash8s in QLD)
Eastern (Operating Dash 8s in NSW, Vic, SA and now WA)
Network (Operating a few different types flying charter only in WA)
and Cobham who have the 717 Contract. (Operating in WA, NT? and now QLD)

QantasLink as an airline is just a shell for the above 4 operations.

[Capt Claret]

and Cobham who have the 717 Contract. (Operating in WA, NT? and now QLD)

Been operating in Qld for some 20 years, and NT for over 15, also Cairns base for over 15 years.

[Icarus2001]

Is this operated by Qantaslink or some other operator? On boarding passes does it still say "Operated by NJS" and on the fuselage next to 1L?

It is getting ridiculous nowadays. I can buy a ticket on Webjet or other similar sites to fly to London with British Airways but I get on Qantas aircraft in Australia. Next thing will be transferred to an asian crewed Onestar aircraft I suppose.

[newsensation]

Sunstate and Eastern are owned by Qantas and trade as Qantaslink, another Qantas company, Airlink contracts out to Cobham to operate Qantaslink services. Network also owned by Qantas does not operate any Qantaslink services.
Cobham pilots crew the 717 services.

[megle2]

And are they "new" as in brand new or just new to Qld as in old??

[vigi-one]

“QantasLink’s new 115-seat B717 services will offer customers faster flight times and more seats at peak times by complementing existing aircraft on these routes.”

What happened to "jet like speeds"?

[Capt Claret]

megle2

The last two new 717s wee delivered on May 23rd, 2006, so unless some eccentric has hangared a few, unflown, for 6 years they'll be pre loved. ;)

Boeing: Commercial Airplanes - 717 - About the 717 (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/717/) refers.

vigi-one,

The jet-like speeds are still there but 360 kts isn't quite the 460+ of the Douglas/Boeing 717/MD95/DC9. :ok:

[IAW]

megle2, the 717 is no longer manufactured so they are new to Qantaslink but old to the world.

[Icarus2001]

“QantasLink’s new 115-seat B717 services will offer...
The SERVICES are NEW not the aircraft.

Subject, object, verb anyone?

No IFE, not even audio. Still they are CHEAP. Hah hah:p

[patienceboy]

If you don't carry music and movies with you on your mobile phone you're well behind the times :p

[Icarus2001]

BYO music and video is great. AFTER transition on the way up, longer if turbulence keeps the belt sign on but BEFORE top of descent. You have just lost a good 30 minutes of IFE time. One whole episode of something or other.:p

[atlas12]

Vigi,

Lol. Just imagine the look on the pax faces when they hop on a dash again after a few months/years on the 717. Just like when the F100 runs to Mackay stopped. Priceless :ok:

[five dogs]

Whispers via the venerated Townsville refueller combining EFA and b717 in the same sentence! :\

[teggun]

Hi,

What's EFA?

[TexanPilot]

Express Freighters Australia

[ANCPER]

Sorry, I don't agree with you. The predicate is always a verb (services) the subject is always a noun/pronoun, so, therefore the subject is the B717, the predicate is the "services" and "new" as an adjective is describing the B717 as , well, new!!

If they wish to describe the services as new and not the a/c they went about it the wrong way.

[IAW]

In the press release the noun is "B717 services". Services in this context is a noun, not a verb.

[ANCPER]

I suppose you can argue that, but usually the subject is first and most who didn't know better (i.e. that it's not a new a/c) would not see it the way it was meant.

[Capn Bloggs]

I've heard and seen some tangential thread-drifts, but this one takes the cake. :D

[Tidbinbilla]

Indeed, Bloggs. *salutes*

click.