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View Full Version : B777 - "Plan to land at the nearest suitable airport."


BlackWater01
1st Aug 2011, 19:26
B777 riders

what are the situations where the flight crew must land at the nearest suitable airport?

stilton
2nd Aug 2011, 02:20
Why would you ask the 'riders'




Surely they would be drinking their tea in the back ?

BlackWater01
2nd Aug 2011, 04:20
To avoid useless confusion and identity problem I should say Pilots ... so ...

When B777 Pilots must land at the nearest suitable airport?

Non Zero
2nd Aug 2011, 05:01
Sorry if it sounds smart-alecky but ... whenever the non-normal checklist tells you to land at the nearest suitable airport.

zerozero
2nd Aug 2011, 05:14
Sorry if it sounds smart-alecky but ... whenever the non-normal checklist tells you to land at the nearest suitable airport.

Or even when your better judgment tells you so.

You don't need a stupid manual to tell you when to put it on the deck.

Stay in COMMAND.

Graybeard
2nd Aug 2011, 06:08
Since you're in Kabul, I would reckon the nearest suitable airport to be Dubai...

Fire - presence of
Fuel - lack of

Non Zero
2nd Aug 2011, 06:30
You don't need a stupid manual to tell you when to put it on the deck. I think everybody agree with common sense and situational awareness!

What I was trying to underline is the first of four bullets of the Checklist Instructions Chapter (CI.2) of your QRH. Read it! It is interesting.

A manual will never substitute your best judgment. Lesson 101 on how to build the famous pilot super-ego with 4 testicles (without sexual discrimination)!
But on the other side, usually behind a 'stupid' manual there are a lot of 'stupid' people thinking how to make your life easier when your super-ego is that super anymore.

169west
2nd Aug 2011, 07:11
Since you're in Kabul, I would reckon the nearest suitable airport to be Dubai...
Probably Kandahar since for same airline is a suitable destination.


Back to the topic.

My question is ... what are the rules/conditions Mr Boeing evaluate in order to write on the QRH 'Plan to land at the nearest suitable airport' ...


... and by the way it is common sense only in one direction (when is not written) because if the checklist states you have to land, you have to land at the nearest airport no matter what your common sense tells you to do!

Wizofoz
2nd Aug 2011, 07:29
In a nut-shell, when you are on fire, almost out of fuel, or down to one of any vital system (Engine, Hydraulics, Electrical).

Interestingly, losing pressurisation USED to be Land ASAP, it is no longer.

Non Zero
2nd Aug 2011, 07:43
what are the rules/conditions Mr Boeing evaluate in order to write on the QRH 'Plan to land at the nearest suitable airport' That's a good question!

Those are the checklists that lead you to a 'Plan to land at the nearest suitable airport'

WINDOW DAMAGE
CABIN TEMPERATURE
PACK L+R
Eng Lim/Surge/Stall
Eng Svr Damage/Sep
ENG FAIL
ENG OIL FILTER
ENG OIL PRESS
ENG OIL TEMP
Vulcanic ash
FIRE APU
FIRE ENG
Smoke fire or fumes
FIRE CARGO
FIRE WHELL WELL
OVERHEAT ENG
SMOKE EQUIP COOLING
SMOKE REST UPR DR
FLIGHT CONTROLS
FUEL LEAK
FUEL QTY LOW
HYD PRESS SYS L+C
HYD PRESS SYS R+C
HYD QTY LOW L+C+R (any of the combination with C)
TAIL STRIKE

It isn't mention in a Dual Eng Fail but ... common sense!
From one point of view, it looks like the logic is fire or smoke, hydraulic, pressurization (only tail strike and both packs), fuel, partial loss of thrust! Nothing new since beginning!

Annex14
2nd Aug 2011, 07:54
Anyone ever spend an idea not to spread to widely knowledge about these items?
I admit I do! Location Kabul - B 777 and nothing else light up some red lights!
Yes I know all available in manual, etc, but it shouldn´t become to easy!!

Wizofoz
2nd Aug 2011, 10:22
Non Zero,

While the statement is in those checklists, it is conditional in a lot of them, E.G Limit/Surge/Stall-only if it leads to a shutdown, APU Fire-only if it doesn't extinguish etc.

BuzzLightyears
2nd Aug 2011, 15:22
Non Zero very good!

it is conditional in a lot of them
of course but the worse case scenario the checklist will tell you to land.

Since the audience seams very well prepared let see if you'll find the answer to this question ... EICAS message:

BLEED LEAK STRUT L, R

in the worse case you'll experience a partial loss thrust but the checklist doesn't tell you to land at the nearest suitable airport. Why?
Common sense you'll continue the flight!

fireflybob
2nd Aug 2011, 16:41
Always understood that "Plan to land at the nearest suitable airport." meant in terms of time wrt "nearest"

You might be 38,000 ft right overhead a suitable airport but there might be another one 80 miles away - would suggest that, all things being equal, the latter would be a better option as you need to descend anyway?

Non Zero
2nd Aug 2011, 17:03
Thanks Buzz

... I'll find hard to believe you'll continue the flight with one engine at idle thrust! But you are correct ... the checklist doesn't really tells you to land! That's interesting! There might be something behind this decision making process ...

bubbers44
2nd Aug 2011, 21:18
Sometimes the checklist will let you continue the flight and doesn't require landing at the nearest suitable airport. We had a B727 lose an engine over El Paso, Texas and continued to LAX. When they landed they found the #3 engine missing. Someone found it in a field in Texas. Oops.

Non Zero
3rd Aug 2011, 19:41
BLEED LEAK STRUT message stays shown:

Transponder mode selector . . . . . TA ONLY

Note: Run the engine at idle for the rest of the flight.

Landing using flaps 20:
GND PROX FLAP OVRD switch . . . . .OVRD

Note: Use flaps 20 and VREF 20 for landing and flaps 5 for go-around.


... it really look like they are letting you decide, but there aren't really a lot of options!

BlackWater01
3rd Aug 2011, 20:06
Thanks good I'm not in KAIA anymore ... and for the time I was there no 777 ... so relax!

I guess the conversation shifted to a bleed leak ... well I think you still have to plan land ASAP with an engine at idle ... also if the chkl doesn't tell you!
2 engine you don't really want to mess around to much!

Graybeard
4th Aug 2011, 04:03
Actually, Bubbers, I believe it was San Diego. After that some wag came up with an Engine Quantity Indicator to go in the panel of the 727: . . 0 1 2 3.