Is my QANTAS superannuation secure?

[indamiddle]

does anyone out there know if my super is secure if qantas goes t1t$ up? will it take 11 years to get most of it back like it did with ansett employees or is it separate from qantas if we are bankrupted. with the share price plunging and the gloom and doom from aj i am starting to fear for the future of qf and my super and should i transfer it to another industry fund that covers multiple businesses?
any advice would be greaty appreciated and investigated before acting on.

signed
very worried

[busboy330]

Qantas super had meetings month or so ago and that very question was asked. We were informed that Qantas super is a separate entity and that they have 110% of the super supplied by QF and us. If QF went under, we were assured that we'd get our full and proper entitlements. That is why they are able to self insure. Take all that for what it's worth.

[The Black Panther]

I think it is.

Only your annual leave and LSL is at risk.

Perhaps an ex Ansett employee could comment here but I believe Qantas Superannuation is a separate and exclusive entity where creditors are concerned.

[The Kelpie]

It may be a separate entity but if the super fund is investing heavily in QANTAS shares to provide a return for members then this is cause fir concern!

Of course you will get something (your full and proper entitlement) depending on the performance of the fund's chosen investments. The same as you would with any super fund!

Who are the trustees of the fund? It may be Joyce himself!!

Keep asking questions and obtain independent advice whether a move to a less risky investment profile is recommended.

Of course the company will try to discourage you from transferring your super elsewhere as they are probably using the super fund to finance it's cash-flow!

One of the reasons the QF/BA merger floundered was that BA owed it's employees pension find more than it could afford after using the pension fund as it's own bank for years!! A massive liability it could not and still cannot make good.

Food for thought
More to follow

The kelpie

[buggerme]

I believe the laws have changed since the Ansett crash and our super is guaranteed.

[Metro man]

All the administrators and insolvency specialists must be licking their lips at the possibility of what would be a once in a lifetime job. String things out for years and rake in millions. Whilst the vultures may not be circling yet I'm sure they're keeping a careful eye on the financial pages.

[Gas Bags]

The super fund is protected and you dont need to worry about your money, just as it was for Ansett.

I and everyone else received all their super when Ansett collapsed. It was the company owed moneys that we didnt get. holiday pay, LSL, redundancy etc.

I dont think QF is anywhere near the stage you guys should be worrying yet, but it is a pertinant question as you should never believe that it can't happen.

I hope you guys never have to go through what we did with the collapse. It is not much fun when the market is flooded with qualified people. Jobs become very thin on the ground. The hourly rate for a contractor in Singapore droppped 50% to around 39SGD per hour the day Ansett collapsed and there were more takers than jobs.

GB

[Skystar320]

No, your superannuation is not safe. As an ex Superannuation administrator, pretty much all your super is subject to companies going tits up / share market flux and international markets...

Depending on what Qantas 'Superannuation' is held you could be looking at something very bad.

Cash, bank / term deposit is one of the ways that you can guarantee a return. If I remember right, all bank deposits are covered by law? i.e if for some reason a bank goes belly up, you still have access to your money

[I]Of course my views are my own, you should however consult your own financial adviser

[ampclamp]

Mods I think this is a question for pro advisors, QF super and the employees. It will do no one any good to have any scare mongering or lay advice here.
If you are concerned consult QF super and get professional advice.

[fortuneferal]

Skystar320 do you have a financial licence to be able to say "The only safe solution is cash..."? Of course not. Being an ex-super administrator you should know better. Oh wait...maybe that's why your an ex-administrator...:rolleyes:

[arkmark]

No super fund is secure unless you run it yourself. SIMPLE.

Even if you run it yourself its still a waste of your money and time.

Superannuation is a scam top down and if you are asking this question you have already been conned. It was designed to make a thriving stock market, run by inexperienced graduates who care nothing about your money but lots about their Friday lunch.

Take your super out and run your own fund, a half decent accountant can set it up for less than a grand. Super funds can lend to business at 13.5 %. Thats a good return and businesses will jump at that.

Take charge of your own money my friend. Don't leave it to middle management buffoons.

[Skystar320]

That's not what I said fortuneferal. Just for that though, I've added that anyone should seek financial advise.

[HF3000]

Kelp, you are usually on the money but you obviously know nothing about Qantas Superannuation. Neither does Skystar, it appears.

[fortuneferal]

HF3000 I agree, I was actually going to say much the same thing, you beat me too it. Arkmark - your first 2 sentences contradict each other. And no super is not a scam except some SMSF's which are - I know, I work in the industry and have done so for over 20 years. In fact, most of your post is nonsense and totally contradictory. :=

[arkmark]

Spoken like a true believer my friend, perpetuating the super myth. A true salesman.

I have been operating my super fund for more than 10 years now. It has returned year in and year out more than 10% with no loss, fees etc. It was set up for less than $ 1K and annual audit fees are also in that range.

Still the money is useless, returning a fraction of that of my business and personal investments.

People should have total control of all their money, and not have 10% of it locked up by the government to be spent unwisely by so called experts who have never managed to do more than work for other people all their lives.

I have mates who are so called financial planners and investment advisors. They sell bank products and make money. That's all. One is a great strategic thinker, but that's not what he makes his money from.

Typically you refute my argument without justification. So like a person who is a true believer in the super religion.

So please, go ahead, point by point tell me what it is that you think I said is incorrect.

[HF3000]

Arkmark, you might have an amazing SMSF but that is not really relevant to the thread, is it? And besides, most pilots are not good investment planners. So to recommend they all go do SMSF's is a little reckless isn't it?

The thread question was "Is QF super safe?"

The answer is yes, it is. It is fully funded, it is not overweighted in QF shares, AJ cannot get his hands on it, and no, he doesn't control the QF Super board of trustees.

I ask any of the above doomsday sayers to back up their allegations to refute any of this.

[Gas Bags]

In the context of the OP's original question "Is my Qantas super safe" then yes it is as I posted before.

Ansetts was safe in this context as well.

Arkmark and others are being a little misleading bearing this in mind.

Qantas can not access your accumulated super moneys to prop up their company. Once it is paid into the fund it is then protected from them by law.

I and thousands of others asked this same question when things started going pear shaped at Ansett, and it was a small consolation to know the kiwis couldnt get their hands on our money. We were all pretty sure they would have if they could and done it without conscience.

So indamiddle, Yes your money is safe...

Arkmark, the sky could fall on our heads as well...

Kelpie, your false conspiracy theories are not assisting the OP...This subject can be dealt with in fact unlike most of the stuff you post about...

GB

[629bus]

Go to VB while you can!

[Stalins ugly Brother]

629bus,

Put the bottle of wine down and step away from the keyboard.

You have made a goose of yourself on two threads now, well done. :ugh:

[Stalins ugly Brother]

Super in Australia is not guaranteed, seek financial advice from your accountant or financial advisor.

[bonvol]

What about the defined benefit scheme?

[Stalins ugly Brother]

bonvol,

Make an appointment with your accountant or financial advisor, it will cost you less in the long run than taking or seeking advice on pprune. This is not the place you want to be taking advice on financial matters from (no offense to anyone intended!).
Good luck with it.

[bonvol]

Hey, I'm not even in it but as I recall the TAA defined benefit scheme was unfunded and when the you know what hit the fan in 89 the TAA pilots had some nervous moments till the government stumped up the loot. Teresa Green will probably know the facts.

[maui]

Bonvol

The TAA / Australian scheme was fully funded. All participants were paid their due. It is rumoured that after all the resigners had been paid out, the unmentionables that remained got to split up the residual as the fund was wound up. If they didn't get it the company would have. Either way it didn't go to those who had contributed the bulk of the accumulation.

The concern that you heard of was in all probability, the concern that pollies such as that worm Holding, were calling for the government to confiscate our entitlements and permanently revoke our pilot licences. Nice lot, eh.

Maui

[The Black Panther]

You may recall Qantas making capital deposit to top up the defined benefit account in times of low market returns. In a defined benefit scheme the company absorbs the risk. In your member and company accounts your absorb the risk by receiving whatever the credited interest rate return is the period.

When companies suffer financial distress they do prioritise their debt obligations and while a legal debt maybe outstanding when that debt is met can be a 'how long is a piece of string' just as Ansett employees discovered, as stated these were entitlements not superannuation.

As many here have said seek an independent professional opinion however all be an outstanding legal obligation if there's no money in the pot, there's no money in the pot.

[B772]

Leading up to 30/06/09 the actuary of the QF defined benefit fund recommended QF top the fund up. I understand a figure of $66M was mentioned.