Applying to Air China?

[BRinChina]

Are you considering Air China? - beware there is a vase difference between what the contract company (and contract for that matter) state, and what Air China roster.

Find out from someone you know there, before you leave!.

[Arthole]

Very cryptic , please expand ?

[Outtahere]

Looks pretty clear to me. Don't believe Parc/ Rishworth etc when they talk of Syd/ Lhr/ Yvr bases. The guys get Beijing based with occasional short trips home. Shame really, it used to be a good job.

[oicur12.again]

Ahhh, actually they really are bases. Some bases such as yvr have u home 18 days per month. Mel the same.

Sorry to inject some facts into the debate.

[Outtahere]

Used too. Before domestic flying- enjoy.

777 iso 330 to Lhr from late 2011. Watch for it on Yvr as well.

[oicur12.again]

Domestic flying COULD possibly make for fewer trips away. Lets see how it pans out.

Still, doesnt alter the fact that the post regarding bases is utter horse hockey.

[Flying Phoenix]

Outtahere, oicur12.again;

You both are correct. Right now, there is not contract with any Chinese carrier that offers better time at home than Air China. Vancouver, Melbourne, Sydney are clear winners due to sector length. Even with simulator and 4 trips you will get 14 days off plus 3 (due to the early arrival times at ones home base). BUT. Will this last forever? Probably not. Will Air China force domestic flying down our throat? They will try. Are some pilots exempt? Yes, the Aussies for one, and anyone with a clause stating "No domestic or regional flying." My personal opinion is that the domestic flying issue will die once Air China realizes they are losing huge productivity from their foreign pilot group just so they can make some local Captains happy.

With all this said, Air China will make basing promises that they simply cannot meet. London, Frankfurt and Sydney are over-subscribed but Air China will still offer these bases to perspective employees. With the ever declining U.S dollar this job is not looking as near attractive as it did 24 months ago. Oh, and good luck passing the Chinese ATPL exam, medical and simulator assessments. By all means, come and take a look, but do not resign from your current job until you've jumped through the very last hoop.

[BRinChina]

There are fair points in each response..

Yes of course there are basings, but since there is no seniority on base as they continue to accept new pilots the international flying dilutes away from your base. You cannot operate to and from a LHR or FRA base any longer.
Do the original pilots on the base receive preference, no - so now they operate mainly W patterns to FCO or MAD.
What happens when the base is too full for even that?.

Whilst YVR, MEL and SYD don't have a problem at the moment, they could soon be in the same position as LHR and FRA with the addition of more pilots.

I'm not sure that Domestic will be seen as inefficient by CA - inefficient for the Foreign Capt's days off isn't really their concern.

There is no talk of a reduction of international flying, just the addition of Domestic.

Domestic and Regional flights will be operated by a Foreign Capt an F/O and a Co-Pilot (aka Radio Operator). Until now, an F/O many much like a CX cadet SO wasn't allowed to operate below FL100 on International Flights - instead only the Foreign Capt and Chinese Capt were in the front seats.
No instruction yet whether they can be PF.
Regional (Korea, Taiwan) are still international though no, only the tip of where logic is omitted in their decision making.

For the fairness of those considering joining.. this thread is simply to highlight the reality verses what you might be told during the selection process. It's not the worst job despite the post, but be sure to understand the conditions you and your base will expect.
But it will all change next roster..

[mototopo]

Hi!

How to apply directly with Air China? Their site has no career section as far as I saw..
Or did I miss something?

TKS:ok:

[Flying Phoenix]

In a nutshell....... you can't. You have to go through one of three brokers.

PARC Aviation
Brookfield Aviation
Topflight

There may be more now, but I can't tell you who they are.

[Flying Phoenix]

Actually, the number of domestic sectors may not be 2, but slightly lower. However, SOC (the rostering department) first salvo was to show most guys operating 4 long haul + 1 domestic flight = 95 hours. That won't fly (pardon the pun) for any one. Look like time to introduce the concept of CC to the company

[BRinChina]

A number of pilots roster this month is to operate flight for 8 consecutive days (since the inclusion of Domestic flights).

Rest requirements, ???.
Legal,according to Air China yes.

[Capt Toss Parker]

I know boats ....

[Flying Phoenix]

Air China management is about to find out how their foreign pilots deal with a company that blatantly ignores FTL's and legal rest requirements. :ok:

[heavy.airbourne]

Can s.o. please post a source for chinese duty and rest limits. thnx!

[Karunch]

Chinese Ftls- take the Faa original source, add a few translation errors then add a bit of interpretation and finally some intimidation. Thats how you come up with the Chinese Ftls.

[BRinChina]

The Chinese co-pilots have been saying this for months now... Air China denied it would happen.. now the facts.

PARC advises LHR base will close 1st Jan 2012 (replaced by 777) yet still no word from Air China directly to pilots.

FRA base is in jeopardy long term too to the 777.

[trevfly]

Anyone who has dealt with the Chinese know they will never address an issue directly, and prefer to use a middle man, preferably a gweilo, to do the dirty work.
Will the FRA base become a commuting base, until the 2 year contracts are up, then PARC will simply not renew or offer other bases?

Will AC become like Korean, a 2 week on 10 days off rotation? Surely PARc can't just cancel contracts will nilly?

I will never choose to work for an Asian carrier again, I just find the whole culture intolerable, unreasonable, and not worth the 13k.

[Flying Phoenix]

Trefly, the sad truth is Parc, or Air China can (and probably will at some point) cancel the contract when they no longer see a need to continue with the current arrangement. I've said this before: do not leave a real job for one in China. The money isn't there anymore and you just can't bank on the promise of a decent roster or permanent base any longer. What I've experienced in Hong Kong is now happening in China - we've lost that lovin' feeling. :{

[Karunch]

While the boss sits in his office scratching his head asking 'how to I get more foreign Captains?'.